Julius Randle IS a 'cornerstone' player

[3toheadmelo]

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[Richard4444]

So 20 out of 24 stars were taken by teams who didn’t make the playoffs. My point exactly.

Check the history books...

Jordan- 3rd
Kareem- 1st
Lebron- 1st
Shaq- 1st
Duncan- 1st
Dream- 1st
Wilt- 1st
Russell- 2nd
Magic- 1st
Kobe- 13th (high school)
Bird- 6th
Oscar- 1st
DRob- 1st
Isiah- 2nd
McHale- 3rd
Dirk- 9th
Scottie- 5th
Curry- 7th
West- 2nd
Garnett- 5th
Durant- 2nd
Wade- 5th
Cp3- 4th
Kidd- 2nd
Payton- 2nd
Frazier- 5th
Ewing- 1st
Mailman- 13th
Barkley- 5th
Dr J- 12th
Drexler- 14th
Baylor- 1st
Iverson- 1st
Vince- 5th
Dominique- 3rd
Worthy- 1st
Barry- 2nd
Hondo- 7th
Pierce- 10th
Webber- 1st
Allen- 5th
Penny- 3rd
Amare- 9th
Dwight- 1st
McGrady- 9th
Melo- 3rd
KJ- 7th
GHill- 3rd
Sheed- 4th
Pau- 3rd
Reggie- 11th
Klay- 11th

I don't like to use examples from players drafted ages ago. The style of BBall played was different. The level of information about the draft players was different.

Today, only the Top3 pick you can say have greater odds to become a true NBA star. Maybe if the draft is loaded, you can up to the Top 5 (like 2018 draft).

From the 4th to the 15th pick, the odds to become a star are usually about the same.

Nothing about the point is different tho. The style of play being different means nothing either. I’m not sure how you can argue the facts. Information about players were different how? They had workouts and scouting the same as we do now. I don’t get it. Seems you’re just trying to dismiss the facts.

Sorry. But you are trying to dismiss the facts. In the last decade, we have a lot of stars in the Top 3 pick. But the other picks from 4 to 15 give us almost the same quality of players.

We can speculate the reasons.

We can argue if a decade would be a small sample size. I don't think so.

Maybe the explication is because of the changes in the game. Back then, physical attributes used to be much more important. It was easier to anticipate if the player would going to be a star. Today, shooting skills and Basketball IQ are almost so important as physical attributes. It is harder to anticipate who is going to be great.

Maybe it's because of the quantity of information that confounds scouts. Too many youtube videos, media and agents hyping and overthinking. Moreover, International draftees play all over the world in different levels of competition and different styles of basketball and we don't have a great basis for comparation.

Maybe the NBA development guys got pretty good teaching skills and improving the athleticism of the players. And some players are very fast becoming totally different players than they were in the draft.

[3toheadmelo]

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[nedleeds]

The timing is actually horrible, but I still hope Leon has that talk to Thibs and they play the kids more ....

The timing sucks... but you have to remember that we’re pretty much winning games cause our youth is developing under Thibs. So how upset can you really be? It is what it is at this point. At least we’re developing players for once. When was the last time you can say that lol

People are always gonna feel the timing sucks. Except for maybe last year. Personally this draft is kind of overrated to me it terms of how deep people are claiming it is with FRANCHISE level talent. I see MAYBE 2 or 3 personally and a lot of very good players maybe all stars but not franchise talents. Is it really worth tanking for the minimal odds at those 2 or 3 players over developing the youth we already have and trying to win games?

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

[nedleeds]

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Is this a positive or negative thing for Randle? If he goes to another coach will he just be fat and doing spin moves to no where again?

[Deeeez Knicks]

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Always hard to say what is going on behind the scenes, but he def seems like a great pickup and making a big impact. Even with Obi looking meh so far, maybe there is still hope he can develop into something over time.

[DaGawd]

The timing sucks... but you have to remember that we’re pretty much winning games cause our youth is developing under Thibs. So how upset can you really be? It is what it is at this point. At least we’re developing players for once. When was the last time you can say that lol

People are always gonna feel the timing sucks. Except for maybe last year. Personally this draft is kind of overrated to me it terms of how deep people are claiming it is with FRANCHISE level talent. I see MAYBE 2 or 3 personally and a lot of very good players maybe all stars but not franchise talents. Is it really worth tanking for the minimal odds at those 2 or 3 players over developing the youth we already have and trying to win games?

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

[nedleeds]

People are always gonna feel the timing sucks. Except for maybe last year. Personally this draft is kind of overrated to me it terms of how deep people are claiming it is with FRANCHISE level talent. I see MAYBE 2 or 3 personally and a lot of very good players maybe all stars but not franchise talents. Is it really worth tanking for the minimal odds at those 2 or 3 players over developing the youth we already have and trying to win games?

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

We're bad. We have a bad record. We have no all-NBA level talent. We aren't getting all-NBA talent in free agency, certainly not in the next two years anyway. Randle is having a great year and might have trade value. We should trade him. We should tank and get a good pick. The rah rah stories about the Knicks "turning it around" are mostly an illusion. Thibs moved the effort level and organization of our defense from complete joke to competent. Our offense is still of the 6 worst in the league.

[Dave DaButcher]

Julius makes The Ringer’s All-Star team.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/2/19/22290769/nba-all-star-reserves-picks-starters

Spoiler:

Heading into the season, hardly anybody would’ve considered Randle that sort of foundational piece. The bruising lefty put up big scoring and rebounding numbers during his first season in New York, but struggled mightily in his first attempt to establish himself as a legitimate no. 1 option and cornerstone; just a few short months ago, your average Knicks fan would’ve been perfectly content shipping out Randle for a couple of middling prospects and some future draft picks. But on the strength of a rigorous offseason program and with the unflinching faith of new head coach Tom Thibodeau, the 26-year-old has completely rewritten the story of his career.

The addition of a reliable shot—48.3 percent from midrange, 40.7 percent from beyond the arc, 80.2 percent from the free throw line, all career highs—has totally unlocked Randle’s game. Play off of him, and he can stick the J; play up on him, and he can bull-rush to the cup; play him for the shot, and he can use his always underrated handle and advancing court vision to spray the ball out to shooters. The result has been a stunning evolution, and even more stunning production: 23.2 points, 10.9 rebounds, and 5.5 assists per game on .589 true shooting, all while leading the league in minutes and playing physical defense for a team that, in one of the biggest surprises in the league, has leapt from 22nd in points allowed per possession last season to third this season.

It’s not an exaggeration to say that Randle’s been the difference between New York being a playoff-caliber team and being one of the league’s worst; as promising as R.J. Barrett and Immanuel Quickley have looked, he doesn’t have another legit difference-maker to help shoulder the burden. In spite of all that, Randle has given the Knicks a real shot at the franchise’s first playoff berth in eight years. That’s more than shocking; it’s really damn impressive, and it earns him his first All-Star appearance.

[3toheadmelo]

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Is this a positive or negative thing for Randle? If he goes to another coach will he just be fat and doing spin moves to no where again?

Since when was Randle fat..? He has the reputation of being a hard worker and always came into camp in top notch shape. He just needed a coach to hold him accountable and push him harder... in other words the opposite of Fizdale.

[3toheadmelo]

People are always gonna feel the timing sucks. Except for maybe last year. Personally this draft is kind of overrated to me it terms of how deep people are claiming it is with FRANCHISE level talent. I see MAYBE 2 or 3 personally and a lot of very good players maybe all stars but not franchise talents. Is it really worth tanking for the minimal odds at those 2 or 3 players over developing the youth we already have and trying to win games?

Knicks winning games and developing our youth got some people talking crazy now

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

[3toheadmelo]

People are always gonna feel the timing sucks. Except for maybe last year. Personally this draft is kind of overrated to me it terms of how deep people are claiming it is with FRANCHISE level talent. I see MAYBE 2 or 3 personally and a lot of very good players maybe all stars but not franchise talents. Is it really worth tanking for the minimal odds at those 2 or 3 players over developing the youth we already have and trying to win games?

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Knicks winning games and developing our youth got some people talking crazy now

[god shammgod]

the knicks are a game and a half away from home court in the 1st round right now. it's not a great conference and the record is mediocre but it doesn't matter. you can't expect them to tank at this position, it's not realistic.

[DaGawd]

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Knicks winning games and developing our youth got some people talking crazy now

Facts. Dudes is triggered

[Zenzibar]

That was two weeks ago. Like 4 games ago and it sounds like after Orlando he is about to go back

Actually Payton has had ALOT to do with our position as a current playoff team, same with Bullock. Bullock's defense is reknown and Payton has been taking his game to a new level.

It's just the haters are just going to continue to hate blindly.

[Zenzibar]

People are always gonna feel the timing sucks. Except for maybe last year. Personally this draft is kind of overrated to me it terms of how deep people are claiming it is with FRANCHISE level talent. I see MAYBE 2 or 3 personally and a lot of very good players maybe all stars but not franchise talents. Is it really worth tanking for the minimal odds at those 2 or 3 players over developing the youth we already have and trying to win games?

But we aren't winning games. We have the same record as the Bulls and are as many games from last as we are from first. This is the issue I have with not going full developmental. We're fake winning in a putrid conference, in a fluke season where Boston can randomly not have their best player because Covid. The Knicks haven't lost a game to Covid, and kudos to the training staff, the coaches and most of all the players for being professionals, but that's a massive advantage. The Nets, Celts and other teams have gotten **** by the protocols.

What you’ve just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

My Dude went full Mercy on your soul, oh sht.

[3toheadmelo]

Actually Payton has had ALOT to do with our position as a current playoff team, same with Bullock. Bullock's defense is reknown and Payton has been taking his game to a new level.

It's just the haters are just going to continue to hate blindly.

[Zenzibar]

Read on Twitter

Is this a positive or negative thing for Randle? If he goes to another coach will he just be fat and doing spin moves to no where again?

Since when was Randle fat..? He has the reputation of being a hard worker and always came into camp in top notch shape. He just needed a coach to hold him accountable and push him harder... in other words the opposite of Fizdale.

Can we just do this to homeboy's keyboard?

[spree8]

I don't like to use examples from players drafted ages ago. The style of BBall played was different. The level of information about the draft players was different.

Today, only the Top3 pick you can say have greater odds to become a true NBA star. Maybe if the draft is loaded, you can up to the Top 5 (like 2018 draft).

From the 4th to the 15th pick, the odds to become a star are usually about the same.

Nothing about the point is different tho. The style of play being different means nothing either. I’m not sure how you can argue the facts. Information about players were different how? They had workouts and scouting the same as we do now. I don’t get it. Seems you’re just trying to dismiss the facts.

Sorry. But you are trying to dismiss the facts. In the last decade, we have a lot of stars in the Top 3 pick. But the other picks from 4 to 15 give us almost the same quality of players.

We can speculate the reasons.

We can argue if a decade would be a small sample size. I don't think so.

Maybe the explication is because of the changes in the game. Back then, physical attributes used to be much more important. It was easier to anticipate if the player would going to be a star. Today, shooting skills and Basketball IQ are almost so important as physical attributes. It is harder to anticipate who is going to be great.

Maybe it's because of the quantity of information that confounds scouts. Too many youtube videos, media and agents hyping and overthinking. Moreover, International draftees play all over the world in different levels of competition and different styles of basketball and we don't have a great basis for comparation.

Maybe the NBA development guys got pretty good teaching skills and improving the athleticism of the players. And some players are very fast becoming totally different players than they were in the draft.

I dunno man. Not really seeing the point you’re trying to make against the evidence provided. It’s pretty cut n dry.

[Zenzibar]