Ryan Saunders Has Been Fired - Chris Finch Hired!!!

[UnFadeable21]

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[winforlose]

Mercgold is steaming.

A lot of homers are upset and that is entirely to be expected.

I reject his premise that we owe Ryan anything. Ryan was an example of a toxic dynamic whereby more qualified people were denied opportunities in favor of a less qualified better connected individual. To make matters worse, Ryan failed in every aspect of his job and the team and fans paid the price. Ryan deserves one thing and one thing only, a bad reputation in the NBA and every other basketball organization around the world. He jumped the line and proved he wasn’t ready or worthy.

[Dewey]

FInch is a good move IMO ... there is no good way to make this change ... some will like it and some will not.

Finch will need to accomplish 3 things:
1.) Offensive Efficiency ... Ball Movement vs. Shot Selection
2.) Show Game Management Capabilities ... TO's, Rotations, Situations, Adjustments
3.) Play to Stay ... He's gotta breed player accountability when it comes to game plan execution

It's a players game, but the coach must keep the team between the white lines when it comes to playing team basketball. Their has to be an expectation to execute on both ends of the floor. It's disheartening for teammates to watch another not being held accountable for effort and executon. It all needs to be tightened up.

[Folklore]

During the first scrimmage with the players.

Chris: HUDDLE UP...ALRIGHT, who here can tell me if 3 is greater than 2?

..everyone? okay, lets take these damn stickers off the court what is this preschool? AND PUT THOSE DAMN TOYS IN THE GARBAGE.

[Calinks]

I went back to this classic thread which is worth a read as there is some Finch talk in there.

Anyway, I came upon a post of mine that does confirm what I was thinking back when Ryan was hired. I stepped away from this theory after some time but now, seeing how things worked out, I'm buying into it again.

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=1834314

I feel like the power that be strongly wanted Ryan to get the job and Rosas' hands were tied. He probably wants his own coach appointed but didn't want to ruffle feathers right away. My guess is he will take Ryan on and if things go poorly, Ryan is out there door with a short leash. That way Rosas can say "Hey, we tried it your way." to Glenn and and the players while still bringing in his own guy within the first 18 months of his new job.

The biggest downside to this is that we could spend another season with a coach that isn't right for us and we will have to bring in yet another coach for guys like KAT who have had a carousel already. It is what it is.

I think Rosas was shrewd in this situation and also may have set Ryan up to fail a bit. Now a lot of this is horrible luck too, the injuries, Covid. But I don't think Ryan had the best roster to work with and I think he was mandated a lot of the questionable on-the-floor stuff. Going small, Okogie having to take 3 pointers, super young players, etc.

I would not be surprised at all if Rosas lets his new coach be a lot more flexible. No more Okogie threes, playing bigger players at the 4, bringing in some new players to help balance the team, etc. Ryan may have gotten a bit sandbagged where Fin ch will get every avenue possible to look good.

Kind of messed up if that is the case but the good news for wolves fans is we may finally start to see some damn light at the end of this tunnel. Better things are on the way because if not, Rosas is dead, he has no more excuses.

[packforfreedom]

FInch is a good move IMO ... there is no good way to make this change ... some will like it and some will not.

Finch will need to accomplish 3 things:
1.) Offensive Efficiency ... Ball Movement vs. Shot Selection
2.) Show Game Management Capabilities ... TO's, Rotations, Situations, Adjustments
3.) Play to Stay ... He's gotta breed player accountability when it comes to game plan execution

It's a players game, but the coach must keep the team between the white lines when it comes to playing team basketball. Their has to be an expectation to execute on both ends of the floor. It's disheartening for teammates to watch another not being held accountable for effort and executon. It all needs to be tightened up.

+ maximizing KAT. He's one of the best offensive players in the game and no coach has unlocked his full potential yet.

[winforlose]

I went back to this classic thread which is worth a read as there is some Finch talk in there.

Anyway, I came upon a post of mine that does confirm what I was thinking back when Ryan was hired. I stepped away from this theory after some time but now, seeing how things worked out, I'm buying into it again.

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=1834314

I feel like the power that be strongly wanted Ryan to get the job and Rosas' hands were tied. He probably wants his own coach appointed but didn't want to ruffle feathers right away. My guess is he will take Ryan on and if things go poorly, Ryan is out there door with a short leash. That way Rosas can say "Hey, we tried it your way." to Glenn and and the players while still bringing in his own guy within the first 18 months of his new job.

The biggest downside to this is that we could spend another season with a coach that isn't right for us and we will have to bring in yet another coach for guys like KAT who have had a carousel already. It is what it is.

I think Rosas was shrewd in this situation and also may have set Ryan up to fail a bit. Now a lot of this is horrible luck too, the injuries, Covid. But I don't think Ryan had the best roster to work with and I think he was mandated a lot of the questionable on-the-floor stuff. Going small, Okogie having to take 3 pointers, super young players, etc.

I would not be surprised at all if Rosas lets his new coach be a lot more flexible. No more Okogie threes, playing bigger players at the 4, bringing in some new players to help balance the team, etc. Ryan may have gotten a bit sandbagged where Fin ch will get every avenue possible to look good.

Kind of messed up if that is the case but the good news for wolves fans is we may finally start to see some damn light at the end of this tunnel. Better things are on the way because if not, Rosas is dead, he has no more excuses.

I agree, but the following is all still true.

1. Small ball is a Rosas priority, and small ball is a losing formula.
2. Glen could still sell the team at any time which would endanger or end the Rosas tenure with the team.
3. Rosas has been in the POBO spot for 2 failed seasons thus far. At most he will get 2 more. Rosas might have maneuvered to dump Ryan, but if he did he also brought his own feet right to the edge of the fire.

[Merc_Porto]

Mercgold is steaming.

A lot of homers are upset and that is entirely to be expected.

I reject his premise that we owe Ryan anything. Ryan was an example of a toxic dynamic whereby more qualified people were denied opportunities in favor of a less qualified better connected individual. To make matters worse, Ryan failed in every aspect of his job and the team and fans paid the price. Ryan deserves one thing and one thing only, a bad reputation in the NBA and every other basketball organization around the world. He jumped the line and proved he wasn’t ready or worthy.

Is not only about about Ryan in specific. Is about being classy in this situation...
Forget the fact we did all of this after a loss against a Thibs team (Imagine the hapiness of Thibs looking at this situation), forget that we were in the first game of the 4 road games we have coming up.

The simple fact we made all of this moves in less that 12 hours is not normal. And doesnt look good at all.

With Ryan or Popovich. And Nurse confirmed that all this were made in the last 36 hours.

If that so, you fire Ryan on friday, no need to flight him to New York unless he wanted to get a free trip to the big apple.

[TheZachAttack]

The players will come around as long as we start winning games. Finch has a history of creating a number of different offenses, both big and guard centric (though mostly big centric), that maximize the output of the teams best players and put them in positions to succeed. That is, he doesn't seem to have an offense and try and jam players into it. That, along with the fact that he's maximized a lot of other bigs and unlocked both their individual games but built offenses around them is good news to me. I also like that he likes to pace and space.

The Wolves can control a few things that they refuse to control. 1) They can maximize the output and touches that their best players get 2) They can maximize the efficiency of their shots (i.e. corner 3's) and 3) They can control the tempo that they play at (fast break points) 4) (Less this one) Limit turnovers. The Wolves do none of these things and that's partially why it's maddening.

My hope is that Finch allows us to do those 3 things at a minimum and fixes the basics on defense. For example, there is no reason (despite any defensive limitations) that we cannot be a much better transition defense team. Those changes alone would make us a much better team right away. These things are as much about effort, communication, coaching, and coaching philosophy as anything.

This is what I'm looking for during the rest of the year. I expect more growth and more complex offensive schemes with a fully healthy offseason for Towns/D Lo others and some actual time to practice together as a unit.

[winforlose]

Mercgold is steaming.

A lot of homers are upset and that is entirely to be expected.

I reject his premise that we owe Ryan anything. Ryan was an example of a toxic dynamic whereby more qualified people were denied opportunities in favor of a less qualified better connected individual. To make matters worse, Ryan failed in every aspect of his job and the team and fans paid the price. Ryan deserves one thing and one thing only, a bad reputation in the NBA and every other basketball organization around the world. He jumped the line and proved he wasn’t ready or worthy.

Is not only about about Ryan in specific. Is about being classy in this situation...
Forget the fact we did all of this after a loss against a Thibs team (Imagine the hapiness of Thibs looking at this situation), forget that we were in the first game of the 4 road games we have coming up.

The simple fact we made all of this moves in less that 12 hours is not normal. And doesnt look good at all.

With Ryan or Popovich. And Nurse confirmed that all this were made in the last 36 hours.

If that so, you fire Ryan on friday, no need to flight him to New York unless he wanted to get a free trip to the big apple.

I hear you I just 100% disagree. Of course you fly him to NY. He is the HC until he isn’t. The only thing you really object to is that we hired someone outside the organization instead of naming an interim from within. Why would you put DV in interim HC role for 1 or 2 games while you finish the paperwork on Finch? Rosas wanted Finch and had negotiated with Taylor to get who he wanted. Who cares about the optics anyway, we are already the league joke. GSW pulled the same mess with Durant that we pulled with Joe Smith. The big difference is they won multiple titles and we lost multiple first round draft picks. The league is BS in a lot of respects, who cares if someone in the press or another owner thinks we were disrespectful to Ryan. Ryan is on the top 10 worst winning percentages list all time for NBA head coaches.

[m2002brian]

A lot of speculation with no actual facts to go on.


For all we know Ryan knew for a while that he might/would be replaced.
It’s not like he could have thought he was going to stay anyway with the job he was doing.

This move only looks “classless” “shady” from an outsiders perspective.
Internally, with Rosas being all about “family” everything may have been extremely well communicated and worked out fluidly.
We may never know.

[Calinks]

I think we will see the end of a small ball or at least the end of it being as strictly adhered to. This gives Rosas a chance to mix things up too and reset. I think he will listen to his coach and if Finch thinks small ball isn't right for us and something else is, Rosas will let him do that.

I think a lot of our restrictions will be gone. I expect trades between now and next season. If this team is still a mess after next season, it's probably over. Taylor will more aggressively shop the team, new owners will come in and Rosas is toast. I also fully expect Towns to be gone if things don't turn around by the end of next season. It will be 7 years of futility and he will move on, team will go full rebuild.

This is our last shot to make something with Towns in my mind.

[Mcfale313]

I'm more than happy to see Saunders go. He is a good guy, bonds well with our players and his family is connected to the franchise, hire him as a player commutation staff or something, just not letting him run any basketball related on court decisions

He is running poor plays after poor plays for the games I watched this season. He always goes with the cold handed guys for the next play and if someone caught fire with shooting, he'd bench him for no reason.

He is also somehow deeply emotionally connected to Josh Okogie, as if that's his son because no matter how useless he is offensively, he keeps getting minutes that should be going to McDaniels.

We are not the Lakers or Nets that can just have a random guy coaching because all the plays you run would be "give the ball to LeBron/Durant and let him decide"......we need plays, need someone that knows some offensive strategies, and unfortunately Saunders lacks talent in that.

He has to go. I don't know about Finch, but he cannot be any worse than Saunders imo....if he can commit to develop McDaniels and give our team a winning mentality instead of the usual 4th quarter collapse im happy

Also please don't play Okogie, I beg you Finch, don't play Okogie a single minute

[_AIJ_]

Im confused. Why are people upset over the firing of Ryan? He is a good person for sure but he cannot coach at all. He needs like 5+ years of experience in the g league.

[Klomp]

It’s clear Taylor forced Saunders on Rosas. The interviews were a sham. Rosas knows his job is on the clock, especially with Taylor looking to sell. So, makes sense for him to want to get the coach he wanted to hire all along in as soon as possible.

That might be a little aggressive. I don't know if Taylor forced "Saunders" on Rosas, but he for sure knew that Saunders was the guy Taylor wanted and that carries a pressure of it's own. Truth is, this actually might buy Rosas a little more time. If Rosas had picked his own guy first, it would have been much harder to scapegoat the coach.

Krawczynski actually wondered aloud if Towns was more the reason for keeping Saunders initially than Taylor was. I think that's an interesting perspective. Rosas knew he had to keep his star happy early on. Now that Towns has the coach he wanted (and his friend at PG), the wins aren't coming and Towns is probably a little more accepting of another new voice.

[Calinks]

Im confused. Why are people upset over the firing of Ryan? He is a good person for sure but he cannot coach at all. He needs like 5+ years of experience in the g league.

Cant speak for others but I'm not upset that he is fired. I am bummed out for him and for the team for yet again resetting with a coach but I get it. I just think its interesting how this has played out and I think he kinda got shafted by Rosas but I could be wrong there too. At the end of the day he did get an opportunity, not an optimal one but he got two years and wasn't able to hang to the job.

[wolves_89]

One thing I'll be interested to see is whether Finch takes away some shot selection freedom. It seemed like Saunders gave pretty much everyone a green light to shoot, even when they were taking shots that were clearly low percentage looks. Ideally, cutting back Edwards jump shots off the dribble, Okogie jumpers, and Culver 3s (at least when his confidence is obviously low) would help make the team more efficient.

[Jedzz]

I would be stunned if this had anything to do with losing last night. I think they pulled the trigger because the deal with Finch was completed sometime before or during the game. They want Finch to have as much time as possible to start teaching good schemes and habits heading into next season. My guess is the decision was made toward the end of January to fire him and the beginning of February was planning the transition. Then all that was left was to interview on the DL and negotiate terms.

And this is supposed to be acceptable? Anyone wondering why the team is losing? Behind the back of the coach leading it is the PoBo/GM undercutting his future finding a replacement, and at the same time telling the coach what he wants to see done. This isn't really any different than the behind the scenes undercutting of Thibs ability to win and get things done here until he was replaced. This kind of management uses the team losing to make the changes for them so they don't look like the guy who did it. So they set the stage for losing as much as anyone, it's their goal. The instant Finch hire tells you all you need to know.

It's not too often that I agree with Jedzz, but this is one of those occasions. Between the roster Rosas gave Saunders and his style of play he forced Saunders had an uphill battle, but then add in the KAT injuries/illness and that hill turned into a mountain.

get off my side you bum

[jscott]

I’m good with this move. Suits wasn’t a good coach and clearly had to go. I have no real opinion/knowledge on Finch v Vanderpool.

Bottom line is that we need to right the ship and I think Finch is as good as candidate (if not better) than Vanderpool since we don’t have many plus defenders.

[iamworthy]

Per Darren Wolfson, Russell and coach Saunders did not see eye to eye.