Is Giannis Antetokounmpo the best player in basketball?

[BK_2020]

If you switch out Lebron for Giannis the last three years Bucks have 3 finals appearances. It's pretty simple.

[kuclas]

I don’t care much about Giannis 3 pointer shot. But his free throws percentage has sucked the last couple of years.

A superstar player shooting less than 70% free throws is a liability end of the game. And in the playoffs. Every point matters.

[KGtabake]

There is no reason to believe that KD is better player than Giannis at this point.

KD is a very good defender and a pretty good passer. Scoring wise there's no comparison.
It's a matter of preference i guess. For me KD is the best in the world since 2017.

KD is nothing special as a defender and rebounder. It's a myth that's being repeated time and time again.

What's Durant's case over LeBron? That his teams were notably morw talented?

I didn't say that KD is special in D or rebounding. I said that he is pretty good.
When he's more focused in D for any reason (team needs, special individual matchup) he is very good. That's not a myth, it's the reality.

Like the reality is that KD has been a significantly better defender than LeBron in the last 5 years. That's not a myth either.

His case is that he is better than LeBron as a player in the last 5 years. Overall career it's LeBron and will it remain like this.

[turnaroundJ]

I’d argue he isn’t even top 5. But I’m biased towards skills rather than athleticism.

[Sign5]

Giannis is now underrated. Sure his game is flawed but what he's good at he's completely dominant at. The Bucks roster just isn't good enough to challenge the real contenders. I will take Giannis shooting woes over Steph Currys defense any day

Give him Harden and Towns like Heat LeBron had Wade and Bosh and that's the favourite for the title.

Lol giving a top 5 player another top 5 player and a top 20 player makes them favorites. Groundbreaking take.

[ForeverTFC]

Lebron, Durant, Harden and Kawhi are all better. You could make an argument for Curry. Outside of Harden, not sure even Bucks fans would argue this.

[ForeverTFC]

The realgm general board is a parallel universe in which defense doesn't matter.

And in that parallel universe, Giannis, who is basically Gobert + some other stuff, still gets a mention as best player in the world. Just for the other stuff.

That, ladies and gentlemen, is really **** impressive if you think about it.

Defense is important, but team defense has much more value than individual defense. Whereas an individual could take over offensively by himself. So there is more weight to O than D. I think it makes objective sense.

[Packbuckman]

There is no reason to believe that KD is better player than Giannis at this point.

KD is a very good defender and a pretty good passer. Scoring wise there's no comparison.
It's a matter of preference i guess. For me KD is the best in the world since 2017.

The only difference is that wilt and shaq never shot 77% from line which Giannis has on multiple seasons. His body has changed so much he had to adjust his shot but now his shot looks way smoother and fluid again. If he continues on that mid 70’s from free throw line it changes everything for him and this team.And I would take Giannis over Durant in a heartbeat better rebounder and defender is Durant a better shooter yes overall Giannis is better if you factor in defense and how much a defense keys on him.

IF... that's a big "if". And i know he's in the mid70s for his career but we're talking about the playoffs here.
Game on the line i would prefer the entire bucks roster to shoot free throws instead of Giannis.
As for the comparison with KD see above. It's a matter of preference, i get it.

As a bucks fan it’s sure nice to see him shooting better he hit 80% the other nite going like 19-23 so there is hope with Giannis not like shaq or wilt there was no hope js

[Packbuckman]

Lebron, Durant, Harden and Kawhi are all better. You could make an argument for Curry. Outside of Harden, not sure even Bucks fans would argue this.

well this bucks fan doesn’t agree and there’s not a player I would rather have on this team. You put Giannis on the nets instead of Durant nobody beats that team period.

[MINDKCUF]

no, still lebron.. thing is, lebron can turn it on.

durant is a better shooter, lebron is a better playmaker. when lebron plays defense, he's better than durant's defense. if we are talking best player in basketball accounting for all aspects of the game, it's lebron when he feels like it.

its no longer when lebron "feels like it", its when he can... cause hes getting old and tired for first time ive ever seen recently.
the stats wont tell you that but watch last few games and its visible.

[SF_Warriors]

Hes kinda like shaq, pair him up with another great perimeter player and it will be unfair. Love middleton and jrue but give giannis a guy like dame or luka and its lights out.

[ForeverTFC]

Lebron, Durant, Harden and Kawhi are all better. You could make an argument for Curry. Outside of Harden, not sure even Bucks fans would argue this.

well this bucks fan doesn’t agree and there’s not a player I would rather have on this team. You put Giannis on the nets instead of Durant nobody beats that team period.

You're telling me you don't trade Giannis for KD THIS SEASON (forget long term prospects, likelihood to stay with the team, etc.)?

Any GM that would take Giannis over KD for one season is incompetent. Same with Lebron. Same with Kawhi.

[Packbuckman]

Lebron, Durant, Harden and Kawhi are all better. You could make an argument for Curry. Outside of Harden, not sure even Bucks fans would argue this.

well this bucks fan doesn’t agree and there’s not a player I would rather have on this team. You put Giannis on the nets instead of Durant nobody beats that team period.

You're telling me you don't trade Giannis for KD THIS SEASON (forget long term prospects, likelihood to stay with the team, etc.)?

Any GM that would take Giannis over KD for one season is incompetent. Same with Lebron. Same with Kawhi.

Hell no I don’t Giannis is more durable for one plays better D and rebounds the ball way better. Can Durant shoot but the bucks would be worse with him. And the nets would be unstoppable with Giannis

[Pachinko_]

Defense is important, but team defense has much more value than individual defense. Whereas an individual could take over offensively by himself. So there is more weight to O than D. I think it makes objective sense.

Yeah sure, but teams usually structure their defense around a big, and the Bucks D was based on funneling people into Giannis and Lopez, and it was the best D in the NBA when Lopez could still move. Which is the main reason why the Bucks were winning games, which is why Giannis won DPOY, and these two things were the main reason he won B2B MVPs.

Basically, Giannis would still be an All Star if he was scoring 8-10 points a game. Not sure how much that is understood around here. He would be an All Star just for the steals, blocks, rebounds, and the havoc he creates when he pushes the ball up court. Think of him as something between Shaq and Rodman but with a handle. These are the main things that make Giannis what he is, everything else he does is gravy on top.

And yes gravy is important, we should definitely talk about the gravy, but you guys are missing the whole steak and potatoes here LOL

[fansinceforever]

No, he isn't the best player in Basketball. Giannis can only prove that in the playoffs at this point.

The problem is that even if Giannis is awesome in the playoffs, the roster just isn't good enough right now to win it all. I'm not sure opinions about him will change until he does though.

[Indomitable]

If you switch out Lebron for Giannis the last three years Bucks have 3 finals appearances. It's pretty simple.

Lebron on that team is not winning. Giannis carries a far greater load then Bron. Bron is not, prime defender, rebounder, scorer, and offense initiator.

Bron was to tired to beat the Wizards after rest.

Give Giannis AD and you have 3 strIght championships.

Bron first season without pet Robin saw him the Lottery.

[Pachinko_]

This whole prove it in the playoffs is such BS all due respect LOL

So if a couple of top players have a religious epiphany and decide they want to spend their best years in Milwaukee, which results in Giannis winning a couple of rings while being exactly the same player he was before, does this mean he has proven something?

No, in that scenario we must rely on the general board to issue a ruling if those titles were mainly because of Giannis or because of the supporting cast, and let us know if the supporting cast was better or worse than Lebron's supporting cast.
**** this

And then you complain why top players band together to win rings, it's because of that BS attitude you're letting yourselves get sucked into

[ForeverTFC]

well this bucks fan doesn’t agree and there’s not a player I would rather have on this team. You put Giannis on the nets instead of Durant nobody beats that team period.

You're telling me you don't trade Giannis for KD THIS SEASON (forget long term prospects, likelihood to stay with the team, etc.)?

Any GM that would take Giannis over KD for one season is incompetent. Same with Lebron. Same with Kawhi.

Hell no I don’t Giannis is more durable for one plays better D and rebounds the ball way better. Can Durant shoot but the bucks would be worse with him. And the nets would be unstoppable with Giannis

I'm sorry but there is no way KD isn't better than Giannis. This is no slight to Giannis, KD will likely go down as one of the top 10 players to ever play the game.

[PhilBlackson]

Lol no.

Personally don't even have him top 5.

[ForeverTFC]

Defense is important, but team defense has much more value than individual defense. Whereas an individual could take over offensively by himself. So there is more weight to O than D. I think it makes objective sense.

Yeah sure, but teams usually structure their defense around a big, and the Bucks D was based on funneling people into Giannis and Lopez, and it was the best D in the NBA when Lopez could still move. Which is the main reason why the Bucks were winning games, which is why Giannis won DPOY, and these two things were the main reason he won B2B MVPs.

Basically, Giannis would still be an All Star if he was scoring 8-10 points a game. Not sure how much that is understood around here. He would be an All Star just for the steals, blocks, rebounds, and the havoc he creates when he pushes the ball up court. Think of him as something between Shaq and Rodman but with a handle. These are the main things that make Giannis what he is, everything else he does is gravy on top.

And yes gravy is important, we should definitely talk about the gravy, but you guys are missing the whole steak and potatoes here LOL

I'm not doubting that. I'm a Raptors fan and I see the value of strong defenders with Siakam and OG, and also see it being continuously discounted when rating the player. At the same time, point stands that defense is team based.

Giannis has the Bucks 10th on DRTG; they were 1st last year and a couple role players left and even with Giannis there, it slipped.
Harden had the Rockets 6th on ORTG last year; he left and they have fallen all the way down to 26th. If he was there and a bunch of role players left, he'd still be around 6th.

Individual players and especially stars have a larger impact on offense than on defense. So offense will get valued higher.