Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go

[darylbe]

I'm reflecting on this **** storm. We have no more assets. That's the ballgame. We aren't getting anything meaningful unless brown smart or tatum is traded (and I'm gunna say smart is the most important player on this team. He would have knocked someone's head off two weeks ago from this nonsense). And the idiot at the helm didn't have an accurate pulse on what was happening, so we lost horford Irving and Gordon for nothing.

Pray kemba shows some consistency, hides his glass knees for a couple of weeks, and trade him at the first opportunity.

Boston doesn't attract free agents. And we don't and wont have the assets to add anyone worth a damn.

Just pointing out, golden state worked thru it and got a top pick. Sucks at Thompson got injured again, but hey, superstar led team got a top pick...

[Bleeding Green]

Yeah and they wasted it on James Wiseman.

Celtics don't attract free agents except for Horford, Hayward, Walker.

[soxfan2003]

What experiment? They are a couple months removed from the ECF and have two of the best under-25 players in the NBA locked up for the next 4+ years.

Who the hell will remember ECF as if that was a great victory. 0 for 3 is what's remembered. Because Danny refused to go all in on putting together an actual championship team. One title is worth more than a ton of losses in the ECF. The league is title or bust. Falling short each time, while so close, is pretty damn demoralizing. Especially when you see how many picks Danny refuses to give up to fix the roster.

Players rule the league, if they Jays both get disgruntled then they have extreme power.

Ainge actually DID go "all in" when he traded for Kyrie and signed Hayward. The problem is how he chose to go all in and who with. Kyrie was a malcontent with an injury history he never should have gone after. It wouldn't have worked even if Hayward hadn't have been injured. That combined with bad drafting and trading draft picks away is what has led us to this point.

I never considered when Ainge traded for Kyrie and signed Hayward as "all in" since the Celtics still had all of their picks and swaps. And even had a first rounder from another team if I remember correctly. The problem with the Kyrie move is Ainge had no serious desire to actually take the next step even when it appeared as though Hayward was healthy enough. If Kyrie stayed around the same player he was in Cleveland, trading for him was going to be a bad move from a risk/reward perspective. But I saw some logic to the deal with the hope under Stevens that he could mature and grow as a player. It didn't happen. There are moves Ainge makes that I wouldn't have made that I won't blast Ainge for. Kyrie trade is one of them.

I never felt the Celtics went all in the post PP rebuild. Those moves you cite were closer to "let's take advantage" of our youth on reasonable deals by signing/trading for some good vets. Ainge was positioning the Celtics to be 3rd or 4th best team in the NBA and within striking distance of any team not named the Warriors but he never pulled the all in trigger.

An all in move, may in fact have included trading Tatum, Smart or Brown. Or trading a bunch of future picks.

The Celtics appear to be prioritizing 50+ win regular season seasons and usually winning a playoff series over less consistency but a much higher chance at another championship.

[cl2117]

I think one big aspect people are forgetting when they're bemoaning our lack of assets is how many other teams have traded their futures away already. Literally half the league is frozen out from trading their future picks or at least most of them. And a large portion of the league that do still have their picks are crap and not realistically in the mix for a disgruntled star (unless they're locked up long-term).

We've certainly spent the majority of our assets chest that was easily used for trades, but we still have room to make changes. The flexibility of owning our own future gives us options.

Additionally, I know it's painful to have to watch, but the lack of veteran rotation players is giving us a chance to actually develop some of the recent picks that normally languish at the back-end of our rotations. Timelord is establishing great value, PP had been a diamond in the rough, Nesmith is starting to come along and Romeo should be back after the all-star break (although I'm not counting on him breaking into the rotation given how odd of a season it's been).

Grant is the only true dud at the moment and even he has some value on his rookie scale deal.

I'm not gonna pretend like our assets haven't been mismanaged in the last couple years, but we're not in as dire a spot as some make out. There will eventually be opportunities to cash in and we'll be in the mix. We might get outbid, but we're at least not already out of the conversation before it even starts.

[Bleeding Green]

Oh no, the only assets he has are Tatum and Brown on two great, long-term contracts.

[CelticsLV]

Oh no, the only assets he has are Tatum and Brown on two great, long-term contracts.

Stop being obtuse. Everyone understands Brown and Tatum are valuable. People are talking about assets outside of those 2. Assets which could be used for upgrades. That chest seems rather empty right now.

[Ernest]

Oh no, the only assets he has are Tatum and Brown on two great, long-term contracts.

Stop being obtuse. Everyone understands Brown and Tatum are valuable. People are talking about assets outside of those 2. Assets which could be used for upgrades. That chest seems rather empty right now.

???
more assets: all our own picks, Smart, Romeo, Nesmith, Theis, PP, Williams, Kemba. Basically everyone on the team is an asset to some degree. The only thing we don't have anymore is top picks owed by another team because we used them to get the allstars we have now. It's a classic cake and eat it too situation.

[Ernest]

Maybe Ainge can trade himself to the kings for Joe Kleine to be our new GM.

[bbd24]

My issue with the ECF appearances is with Danny. 0-3 in the ECF is not something to throw around as a great success. Danny had the assets to improve the team and chose to stand pat. Doing so last year was unforgivable really as that was our best chance. Now we have to deal with a loaded BKN and a better assembled and coached PHI in addition to whatever MIL does in the playoffs. Soon Tatum will be maxed and our options are slimmer.

It's clear that Danny could have used our assets to put a solid player alongside them that isn't at the end of their peak.

How Danny uses the big TPE will determine whether or not he's a capable GM anymore.

No way. You can’t use the TPE as a mark on whether Ainge can or can’t get the job done. He’s a darn good GM regardless of the TPE.

It’s a combination of things right now. Defense and ball movement stand out to me. Close to last in assists.....How do you change it ? I think he has to do a little addition by subtraction.

Personally, I’d move Brown. Tatum and Brown are redundant. Both stop ball movement although both exceptional talents.

But for what ? That’s what Ainge gets paid for. Defense and shooting. It’s not a great market right now so fans won’t like being patient. Unfortunately, that’s how you have to play it. No rush. The right move is better than a reaction move.

It's understood that he overplayed his hand with Indiana so if the TPE yields worse than Turner, McDermott and a first rounder then he botched it. People keep claiming that Indiana never would have raised their offer to match CHA. But people ignore the fact that Haywards agent knew that IND wasn't willing to meet Ainge's demands. So there was no point wasting time trying to get a counter when Hayward was ready to move on.

If IND and BOS had a deal in place before FA hit then it would have been a completely different narrative and IND would have been able to have a chance to counter.

Why would Turner/McDermott be a benchmark ? The idea is to get players who are better than what you have. McDermott gets Nesmith-like minutes on a team like this, if he’s lucky. Turner gets some minutes but ultimately shares time with the BiGs. Both aren’t upgrades by any stretch.

I think he made the right call there.

All in all, you need Tatum/Brown to play better, and Smart/Walker to get healthy. That’s a Conference Finals type team, and has been consistently proven the past years.

The goal with the TPE is to find a player who is better than what you have. That’s a tough find considering the roster. I’m not sure that player is even available at this point. Must be patient and not just make deals to appease the fan base.

[BK_2020]

Maybe Ainge can trade himself to the kings for Joe Kleine to be our new GM.

God what I wouldn’t give to be the Kings....

[Bleeding Green]

Oh no, the only assets he has are Tatum and Brown on two great, long-term contracts.

Stop being obtuse. Everyone understands Brown and Tatum are valuable. People are talking about assets outside of those 2. Assets which could be used for upgrades. That chest seems rather empty right now.

So like all the players on the roster who are on cheap contracts?

[BostonCouchGM]

Yeah and they wasted it on James Wiseman.

Celtics don't attract free agents except for Horford, Hayward, Walker.

imagine thinking Wiseman is bad. Yikes

[CelticsLV]

Yeah and they wasted it on James Wiseman.

Celtics don't attract free agents except for Horford, Hayward, Walker.

imagine thinking Wiseman is bad. Yikes

I mean, the guy said that Nets ain't **** and Celtics will finish easily 1st/2nd seed ahead of them. He's trying to set a new record for bad takes.

[SMTBSI]

***

Belated welcome back from the dead!

[Bleeding Green]

Yeah and they wasted it on James Wiseman.

Celtics don't attract free agents except for Horford, Hayward, Walker.

imagine thinking Wiseman is bad. Yikes

I mean, the guy said that Nets ain't **** and Celtics will finish easily 1st/2nd seed ahead of them. He's trying to set a new record for bad takes.

And then they traded for Harden and the season is hardly over.

James Wiseman is a poor use of a #2 pick.

[TouchPassDario]

Brown and Tatum have no power. What players aged 22 and 24 with 4 and 5 years of contractual obligation have any control? KAT is a million times the player in a much worse position and even he has no power. Who cares about 30 games of some covid season when the best player on the team got covid, the starting point has played like **** and been injured, the second point guard is out with a calf tear, etc? Probably just some dumbass fans. No, the end-goal isn't just to make the ECF, but how many players have played more playoff minutes than Jayson Tatum since he entered the league? LeBron, Draymond, Curry. If he is such a pud that he requires more than that at age 22, he is going to have a miserable life.

KAT is better than Tatum and Brown. He’s too bad on defense at the 5 to be anything more than slightly better than either, though.

[Bleeding Green]

HIs footwork is brutal, but he's adequate defensively. It's not like Brown is a good defender now anyway. Rolls out of bed post-COVID with a 50/40/90 season so far. Gonna be the greatest shooting big of all time, just getting started. And now Ryan Saunders is gone.

[FrodoFraggins]

No way. You can’t use the TPE as a mark on whether Ainge can or can’t get the job done. He’s a darn good GM regardless of the TPE.

It’s a combination of things right now. Defense and ball movement stand out to me. Close to last in assists.....How do you change it ? I think he has to do a little addition by subtraction.

Personally, I’d move Brown. Tatum and Brown are redundant. Both stop ball movement although both exceptional talents.

But for what ? That’s what Ainge gets paid for. Defense and shooting. It’s not a great market right now so fans won’t like being patient. Unfortunately, that’s how you have to play it. No rush. The right move is better than a reaction move.

It's understood that he overplayed his hand with Indiana so if the TPE yields worse than Turner, McDermott and a first rounder then he botched it. People keep claiming that Indiana never would have raised their offer to match CHA. But people ignore the fact that Haywards agent knew that IND wasn't willing to meet Ainge's demands. So there was no point wasting time trying to get a counter when Hayward was ready to move on.

If IND and BOS had a deal in place before FA hit then it would have been a completely different narrative and IND would have been able to have a chance to counter.

Why would Turner/McDermott be a benchmark ? The idea is to get players who are better than what you have. McDermott gets Nesmith-like minutes on a team like this, if he’s lucky. Turner gets some minutes but ultimately shares time with the BiGs. Both aren’t upgrades by any stretch.

I think he made the right call there.

All in all, you need Tatum/Brown to play better, and Smart/Walker to get healthy. That’s a Conference Finals type team, and has been consistently proven the past years.

The goal with the TPE is to find a player who is better than what you have. That’s a tough find considering the roster. I’m not sure that player is even available at this point. Must be patient and not just make deals to appease the fan base.

It's the benchmark because it was most certainly doable. If ainge overplayed his hand with IND, then yes that is the benchmark for the TPE. The pick and players could be flipped with draft picks to improve the team.

He's now announced that he's likely to wait for the offseason to make use of the TPE, something that often doesn't even work out at all. Teams will know in the offseason that he has a limited amount of time to make use of it and will make it hurt. If he gets nothing or close to nothing out of the TPE, then it looks even worse when you consider what could of happened with IND.

So yes, the botched negotiations with IND should and will be held against him. If he fails to make good use of the TPE I'm all for letting him go. Because he's either incompetent or other GM's really don't like working with him. In either case we need someone new that doesn't carry Danny's baggage. Let him advise from the background if he wants, but don't let him hurt our chances of making trades.

[GoGreen]

All these Ainge defenders tell you is "The Jays!" and "ECF 3 out of 4 years!"

Wow. Didn't know we're trying to be the Philly Eagles of the early 2000s? Besides, the east has been weak sauce for years. I don't wanna hear how impressive it was to beat the lowly Wizards or the Raptors. If this team had been in the west lol, good luck!

This team is not competing for a title as currently constituted, and the sad thing is, the crap Danny has drafted and guys he's signed will not put this team over the top even if they do develop. Meaning all the assets he's had and players he's had the opportunity to hold onto, or acquire, he's completely botched. Bad decisions left and right.

TPE is all he has left and a bunch of mid round picks. Don't tell me about freaking Grant Williams or PP. These guys are not on anyone's radar other than MAYBE Rob.

Danny has had his chances and has done a poor job constructing a roster to compete for a title. Defending this bad roster leaves Danny free from accountability, and only ensures what will likely be more bad decisions from him down the line.

[bbd24]

Maybe Ainge can trade himself to the kings for Joe Kleine to be our new GM.

I attended a Kings game at the Golden 1 center 2 years back. Somebody had a sign that read, ‘Please trade us Ainge again’.

They’ve been needing a quality GM for quite some time.