Better passer Jokic or Bird

shakes0 · Post #41 » by **shakes0** » Sat Mar 6, 2021 10:12 pm

Trick question, the answer is obviously Fred Van Vleet.

_Game7_ · Post #42 » by **_Game7_** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 12:02 am

The Rebel wrote:
Ballerhogger wrote:
HollowEarth wrote:Bird. There's nobody in the NBA atm ahead of him in passing. Something I like about the comparison is both guys use(d) a lot of touch passes whete they're passing and catching in one motion.

Lebron

Lebron cannot pass like Bird or Jokic.

Agree, he is quite better. Clearly better than Jokic, better by a hair to Bird.
No one draws attention like James headed to the rim, agreed? Who can put a pass right on the money, In rhythm like Lebron. Fastbreak, ISO, fancy passes, at the very least he is in the same room as these guys, saying other wise is just blind hate and disrespect IMO.

BostonCouchGM · Post #43 » by **BostonCouchGM** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 1:43 am

Bird. Only Magic and Kidd rival him as a passer. Jokic is in the next tier along with Lebron and others.

Peregrine01 · Post #44 » by **Peregrine01** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 2:07 am

Really hard to pick here. These are GOAT passers we're talking about here.

Incidentally, I always felt like Bird was a better passer than Magic even but he didn't have the on-ball prowess that Magic had which limited his passing opportunities.

Infinite Llamas · Post #45 » by **Infinite Llamas** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 2:50 am

This is a thread about Bird and Jokic.

Why tf people bringing Lebron into this???

mikejames23 · Post #46 » by **mikejames23** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 2:56 am

Don't know about this... Jokic doesn't touch Bird's career as a passer IMO. Bird was simply the far better player, the legend, the immortal.

Jokic isn't one of them.

This has to be Bird every time.

Fencer reregistered · Post #47 » by **Fencer reregistered** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 3:20 am

_Game7_ wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
Ballerhogger wrote:Lebron

Lebron cannot pass like Bird or Jokic.

Agree, he is quite better. Clearly better than Jokic, better by a hair to Bird.
No one draws attention like James headed to the rim, agreed? Who can put a pass right on the money, In rhythm like Lebron. Fastbreak, ISO, fancy passes, at the very least he is in the same room as these guys, saying other wise is just blind hate and disrespect IMO.

Bird and Jokic are superior to LeBron at "big man passing". LeBron is superior to them at "PG passing". I think the former is more impressive.

Fencer reregistered · Post #48 » by **Fencer reregistered** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 3:22 am

SNPA wrote:
Ballerhogger wrote:

Watch on YouTube

I love it when people do this.

I watched the first two minutes. Some really good passes. But throwing lobs to AD, dive and kick to where the double comes from and long outlets while you are unguarded and facing forward (even on point) aren’t in the realm of Bird. It’s just not. It’s mistaking high quality and quantity for genius. James sees the floor really well, especially later in his career, but he simply doesn’t have the same chip in his brain as Bird. LeBron learned to be a great passer, Larry was born a legend at it.

Right. Many of those passes wouldn't make the cut for a Bird video.

Son Goku 25 · Post #49 » by **Son Goku 25** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 3:28 am

Creativity and awareness with that kinda size and skill? It's really hard to come up with a big list. Of course there are bigs that can pass like Duncan, Gasol brothers, KG, Sabonis etc but the awkward and out of this world kinda passes that you only think of sitting on the couch and Jokic makes regularly lol not many like him tbh

Son Goku 25 · Post #50 » by **Son Goku 25** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 3:30 am

Also.. Jason Kidd is not getting enough love. I know we're talking about big men but I saw ppl mentioning Nash who is great but Kidd and his IQ is top in terms of bball iq. He was always a couple of steps ahead of the othet players on the floor, I haven't seen many like him.

DrCoach · Post #51 » by **DrCoach** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 5:15 am

ibraheim718 · Post #52 » by **ibraheim718** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 5:37 am

Magic and Kidd at the top.

Bird half a click back.

Jokic and Sabonis half a click back of that.

Lloyd Daniels a better pass than all of them but I guess we can't count him.

Jazztop · Post #53 » by **Jazztop** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 10:05 am

I’m saying Bird. He had amazing quick instincts with his passing.

Stribor · Post #54 » by **Stribor** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 10:53 am

_Game7_ wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
Ballerhogger wrote:Lebron

Lebron cannot pass like Bird or Jokic.

Agree, he is quite better. Clearly better than Jokic, better by a hair to Bird.
No one draws attention like James headed to the rim, agreed? Who can put a pass right on the money, In rhythm like Lebron. Fastbreak, ISO, fancy passes, at the very least he is in the same room as these guys, saying other wise is just blind hate and disrespect IMO.

No it isn't. LBJ is better player than both of them and the only that can legitimately enter in the goat conversation with MJ, but his strengths are unique athelticism and supereltie passing, elite ball handling and verygood shooting while strengths of Bird and Jokic are unique passing first and foremost. And Bird is still infront of Jokic as a player because of his shooting that was also superelite, while Jokic is just elite. So overall LBJ is better, but in pure passing Bird and Jokic > LBJ.

Pg81 · Post #55 » by **Pg81** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 11:18 am

_Game7_ wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
Ballerhogger wrote:Lebron

Lebron cannot pass like Bird or Jokic.

Agree, he is quite better. Clearly better than Jokic, better by a hair to Bird.
No one draws attention like James headed to the rim, agreed? Who can put a pass right on the money, In rhythm like Lebron. Fastbreak, ISO, fancy passes, at the very least he is in the same room as these guys, saying other wise is just blind hate and disrespect IMO.

No.

Muha_i_samolet · Post #56 » by **Muha_i_samolet** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 11:20 am

Jokic by a huge margin.

Fencer reregistered · Post #57 » by **Fencer reregistered** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 11:58 am

Not the best Bird passing video, but it has a lot of his backwards passes, a lot of more routine small-window post entry passes, and a few Kidd-like touch passes on the fast break. Plus a small number of other kinds, such a full-court outlet pass to one of the GB's favorite guys to discuss.

Watch on YouTube

70sFan · Post #58 » by **70sFan** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 12:41 pm

Muha_i_samolet wrote:Jokic by a huge margin.

That's absolutely baseless statement...

Post #59 » by **NO-KG-AI** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 12:51 pm

Don’t have numbers for it, but I feel like Jokic has more volume of directing and being the passing hub... now that doesn’t necessarily mean he’s better, but I have to count it for something. Right?

I’m glad he’s getting love and appreciation here. Everyone knows the dude is a great passer, but I honestly feels he’s Magic/Bird tier, and it doesn’t get enough chatter about just how elite his vision and passing is in an all time sense

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Jables · Post #60 » by **Jables** » Sun Mar 7, 2021 1:05 pm

Lalouie wrote:bird, and he's better than lebron too. 1 less apg and he wasn't even directing the floor

it takes a special player to make the true no-look touch pass. it brings court awareness to an almost metaphysical level. to instinctively be 3steps ahead of the pass itself

imagine this,,,being aware of the floor with such clarity that when an instantaneous moment occurs for that brief millisecond touch pass, bird's mind has ALREADY done it. and he does it in moments of chaos, when there is no structure to the play

Watch on YouTube

I feel like this sums it up, Jokic is being compared to someone that wasn't even a floor general, imagine if Bird got the "point forward" treatment of today, his stats would be crazy.