"We Tried So Hard, and (Haven't) Got so Far, But in the End, It Doesn't Even Matter" Trade Thread

[JediMasterRevan]

Its fairly commonly known that they've been intentionally keeping him on a minutes restriction due to his injuries. They've also stated that they'll generally increase these as the season goes on.

We will see, It has been 15 months since the injury. Still not playing many minutes.

It's been posted many times that he has an arterial condition that can cause cramping with fatigue. It is something that should be able to be surgically remedied down the road but for now Brad has to be careful because they want to slowly increase his minutes peaking at the playoffs. We'd all, including Brad I'm sure, love to see more Timelord minutes but it's something that we'll have to be patient about. GL with that around here.

He should be playing more.

Since 2021
15:50
14:33
9:52
13:13
18:29
8:29
18:57
15:24
10:01
12:34
DNP
DNP
10:31
20:02
19:03
16:27
21:07
14:05
14:25
22:02
17:32
21:41
23:04
16:33
19:15

I would call that ramping up minutes at all, and even if preserving him for later in the season to ramp him up he is missing out on growth in the meantime. If he is only getting 15-18 minutes a game do you really want him jacked up to 30 minutes a game in the playoffs? or expect it?

[sully00]

Its fairly commonly known that they've been intentionally keeping him on a minutes restriction due to his injuries. They've also stated that they'll generally increase these as the season goes on.

We will see, It has been 15 months since the injury. Still not playing many minutes.

It’s something that will always have to be managed. But he should still be playing more than he has.

I think some of it was managing his minutes he also has missed time throughout his career with different injuries but the last few weeks it is definitely about keeping Theis and Thompson looking like starting bigs going into the trade deadline. That said it looks like Smart's return to the line up is going to force one of them to the bench anyhow so maybe Brad will make both moves as Theis and Thompson aren't a bad pairing.

Brad has talked about the plan being to get Williams past the All Star break and then look to expand his minutes. As it is he has already played as many games (31 vs 32) and significantly more mins (504 vs 388) than he has the past two seasons and we aren't really at the half way mark. The second half is going to be brutal.

[Bad-Thoma]

The only way I am including Smart in a Collins trade is if Rondo is coming back too, he's a downgrade but it would ease the pain.

[fallguy]

I worry a lot about dealing Smart. I really miss the nasty, physical, arrogant Celtics teams that the rest of the league hates. Right now, I don't think we scare anybody.

I would bet Danny is more concerned about this than we've discussed.

[JediMasterRevan]

Its fairly commonly known that they've been intentionally keeping him on a minutes restriction due to his injuries. They've also stated that they'll generally increase these as the season goes on.

We will see, It has been 15 months since the injury. Still not playing many minutes.

It's been posted many times that he has an arterial condition that can cause cramping with fatigue. It is something that should be able to be surgically remedied down the road but for now Brad has to be careful because they want to slowly increase his minutes peaking at the playoffs. We'd all, including Brad I'm sure, love to see more Timelord minutes but it's something that we'll have to be patient about. GL with that around here.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/boston-celtics-rookie-robert-williams-has-artery-condition-in-both-of-his-legs/#:~:text=Boston%20Celtics%20rookie%20Robert%20Williams%20has%20artery%20condition%20in%20both%20of%20his%20legs,-By%20Colin%20Ward&text=Popliteal%20artery%20entrapment%20syndrome%20(PAES,found%20most%20often%20in%20athletes.

The minutes restriction has been stated because of his hip, not his lower legs

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2021/02/21/brad-stevens-celtics-robert-williams-minutes-restriction

“The hip is not bothering him, but we’re just trying to manage it over the course of the long season so that he’s available more often than not, and then able to peak in minutes late,” Stevens said. “So I guess it’s more of a just be alert to it. Obviously, he had the two games that he sat out because it was bothering him, but we’re just alert to it.”

[djFan71]

How much would you give up for OG? You're gonna have to overpay, but.... I'd rather overpay for him than Barnes.

TOR: Grant, Nesmith, BOS 21 & 23 1sts, Biyombo, 2 CHA 2nds for OG, Baynes, McCaw
BOS: OG, Baynes, McCaw for Theis, Grant, Nesmith, BOS 21 & 23 1sts
CHA: Theis for Biyombo, 2 2nds.

That's a pretty decent haul for TOR, but they still may not be interested.

Smart, Jaylen, OG, Tatum, Timelord. (Daaaammmnnnnn.....)
Kemba, PP, Romeo, Semi, TT.
Baynes for some beef when needed.
McCaw for title luck after a year off.

Only adds $4M, but you need to use $15M of the TPE since OG has the extension poison pill.

A Kemba/Lonzo based 3 team would be the icing on top.

Toronto has the best GM in the NBA. He is not going to give OG away for that package. On the flip side, Danny doesn't give up 2 1sts in this deal either.

Yeah, longshot for TOR for sure like I mentioned. I'd absolutely do it if I'm Danny.

[Bad-Thoma]

We will see, It has been 15 months since the injury. Still not playing many minutes.

It's been posted many times that he has an arterial condition that can cause cramping with fatigue. It is something that should be able to be surgically remedied down the road but for now Brad has to be careful because they want to slowly increase his minutes peaking at the playoffs. We'd all, including Brad I'm sure, love to see more Timelord minutes but it's something that we'll have to be patient about. GL with that around here.

He should be playing more.

Since 2021
15:50
14:33
9:52
13:13
18:29
8:29
18:57
15:24
10:01
12:34
DNP
DNP
10:31
20:02
19:03
16:27
21:07
14:05
14:25
22:02
17:32
21:41
23:04
16:33
19:15

I would call that ramping up minutes at all, and even if preserving him for later in the season to ramp him up he is missing out on growth in the meantime. If he is only getting 15-18 minutes a game do you really want him jacked up to 30 minutes a game in the playoffs? or expect it?

I'm sorry, are the playoffs tomorrow now? Last I heard we still had a few games left first. Patience, grasshopper.

[Duke4life831]

I could see the Celtics offering something like Theis, Nesmith, Pritchard, 2021 1st, 2022 1st swap, 2023 1st, 2 2nd round picks to Atlanta for Collins and Snell if they were really interested.

Doubt the Celtics offer Smart but who knows.

The thing is, youre going to have to offer something of considerable value to get Collins. That package is a lot of okay values, but no single thing that has considerable value.

So looking from the Hawks point of view. Theis would be coming off the bench (Gallo/Capella) starting frontcourt. Nesmith wont be getting minutes (especially with Hunter returning soon). Pritchard also wouldnt get consistent minutes. The Hawks are looking to make the playoffs this year, so they will be looking for more than just Theis as an immediate return for Collins.

Smart is just that. Plus Smart fills a hole that the Hawks have needed for some time now, a legit guard defender. If you want a legit shot in the arm for this roster, youre going to have to give up some legit value in return.

I personally don't think losing Smart and adding Collins moves the needle much at all so I would pass. The offer I presented gives the Hawks two young players, 2 first round picks, 2 second round picks, 1 swap of a 1st round pick and much needed salary cap breathing room. If that isn't enough then pass.

I totally get that. The angle Im going at is, Collins on this roster vs Smart brings a very different dynamic to the roster. Collins is a good volume/high efficiency scorer that doesn't require the ball and can score from all 3 areas at high efficiency.

Again I think you make this move with the idea of this roster being stale and needing a new dynamic. A Tatum/Brown/Collins offense becomes a pretty hard offense to consistently stop.

[Celts17Pride]

I don’t like Collins because he has a weird body. Kevin McHale and Phil Jackson would poke fun of him if they were all changing in a locker room together. Lol

Seriously though - this might mean the end of the Marcus Smart era if this is true. I don’t see anyway that the Hawks would ship him out with Marcus coming back. And this makes me very, very sad.

Shipping out Smart and adding Collins probably adds a couple wins maybe and the right to overpay Collins. No thank you.

[Bad-Thoma]

The thing is, youre going to have to offer something of considerable value to get Collins. That package is a lot of okay values, but no single thing that has considerable value.

So looking from the Hawks point of view. Theis would be coming off the bench (Gallo/Capella) starting frontcourt. Nesmith wont be getting minutes (especially with Hunter returning soon). Pritchard also wouldnt get consistent minutes. The Hawks are looking to make the playoffs this year, so they will be looking for more than just Theis as an immediate return for Collins.

Smart is just that. Plus Smart fills a hole that the Hawks have needed for some time now, a legit guard defender. If you want a legit shot in the arm for this roster, youre going to have to give up some legit value in return.

I personally don't think losing Smart and adding Collins moves the needle much at all so I would pass. The offer I presented gives the Hawks two young players, 2 first round picks, 2 second round picks, 1 swap of a 1st round pick and much needed salary cap breathing room. If that isn't enough then pass.

I totally get that. The angle Im going at is, Collins on this roster vs Smart brings a very different dynamic to the roster. Collins is a good volume/high efficiency scorer that doesn't require the ball and can score from all 3 areas at high efficiency.

Again I think you make this move with the idea of this roster being stale and needing a new dynamic. A Tatum/Brown/Collins offense becomes a pretty hard offense to consistently stop.

I feel that but part of the problem with that exchange is Smart is the best distributor on our poor ball movement team and Collins isn't helping that dynamic.

[Curmudgeon]

I could see the Celtics offering something like Theis, Nesmith, Pritchard, 2021 1st, 2022 1st swap, 2023 1st, 2 2nd round picks to Atlanta for Collins and Snell if they were really interested.

Doubt the Celtics offer Smart but who knows.

If we trade him its cuz Ainge knows hes gone next summer. Wouldnt shock me.

As far as starting point guard for the Boston Celtics my personal belief is,

Marcus Smart at $25 million per year >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kemba Walker at $37 million per year

If it was up to me I would do anything it took to move Kemba and give the full time starting point guard job to Smart. That includes giving up two first round picks to move Kemba.

Kemba and a lottery protected first for LMA. Then move Theis and filler for a young wing.

[chrisab123]

Something tells me that Thompson and a couple of 2nd rounders won't do it for Collins.

[Duke4life831]

I personally don't think losing Smart and adding Collins moves the needle much at all so I would pass. The offer I presented gives the Hawks two young players, 2 first round picks, 2 second round picks, 1 swap of a 1st round pick and much needed salary cap breathing room. If that isn't enough then pass.

I totally get that. The angle Im going at is, Collins on this roster vs Smart brings a very different dynamic to the roster. Collins is a good volume/high efficiency scorer that doesn't require the ball and can score from all 3 areas at high efficiency.

Again I think you make this move with the idea of this roster being stale and needing a new dynamic. A Tatum/Brown/Collins offense becomes a pretty hard offense to consistently stop.

I feel that but part of the problem with that exchange is Smart is the best distributor on our poor ball movement team and Collins isn't helping that dynamic.

I agree 100% with this. This is why I did say if this deal happens, Kemba getting moved in the offseason has to pretty much be a done deal. For cap purposes and just for fit purposes. From there, with the amount of offense that Tatum/Brown/Collins will give you, all you really need from that PG spot is a good facilitator. Someone smart with the ball and a good assist/TO ratio guy.

[BostonCouchGM]

I dont think BArnes is in the equation at all anymore. And with Brad talking about being "Smaller" I think the upgrades come to the bench.

Harrison Barnes is actually pretty small due to his subpar wingspan. He will absolutely make us smaller.

he has a 6'11" wingspan lol

[BK_2020]

I dont think BArnes is in the equation at all anymore. And with Brad talking about being "Smaller" I think the upgrades come to the bench.

Harrison Barnes is actually pretty small due to his subpar wingspan. He will absolutely make us smaller.

he has a 6'11" wingspan lol

6'11 isn't good for a 6'7 PF. And his standing reach was measured at 8'6, which is 2.5 inches shorter than Grant Williams.

[MagicBagley18]

I’m not high on Collins as other- his defense has improved this season and last season was the beginning of that but I’d be worried if it stays trending that direction post big pay day. Again that’s just my opinion nothing else.

I wouldn’t trade Jaylen for him and if we did get him for smart/theis/ picks etc While it’s a good young core to build around I’m not sure it’s still enough- I’d rather hold out and see what happens in other situations like beal or someone else 1st

[JediMasterRevan]

Kemba and Edwards to the Pelicans
Bledsoe and Grant Williams to Atlanta

Romeo, thompson and pick(s) to Sacramento

Reddick, hart, Gallinari, Barnes and Whiteside to Boston

Smart/Pritchard/Teague
Brown/Reddick/Green
Barnes/Hart/Nesmith
Tatum/Gallinari/Semi
Theis/Timelord/Whiteside

[BK_2020]

KAT's gonna get tired of watching Anthony Edwards shoot 25 times a game and ask out. That's when Ainge needs to strike.

[chrisab123]

I don’t like Collins because he has a weird body. Kevin McHale and Phil Jackson would poke fun of him if they were all changing in a locker room together. Lol

Seriously though - this might mean the end of the Marcus Smart era if this is true. I don’t see anyway that the Hawks would ship him out with Marcus coming back. And this makes me very, very sad.

Shipping out Smart and adding Collins probably adds a couple wins maybe and the right to overpay Collins. No thank you.

We all have a better chance of suiting up for the Celtics this season than Danny does trading Marcus Smart. Danny doesn't trade positive assets for positive assets unless he's ripping off the other GM. If its a top 10 player being offered they probably trade Smart.

[JediMasterRevan]

Something tells me that Thompson and a couple of 2nd rounders won't do it for Collins.

That something is called logic