Masai and Bobby are Asleep at the Wheel

[Rapsfan07]

OP has a point. I don't think missing out in Damian Jones is the problem. It's the lack of direction this team shown the entire year, I can't tell if we are buyers or sellers. I understand the covid situation and all, but should definitely be sellers at this point. What's the point keeping Lowry to compete for the 8th seed or even play-in? Powell should be sell high, obviously the team have no intention to keep him long term otherwise an extension should be done already. IF we are still trying to compete, we should be aggressive and try to acquire players that can elevate the team. The fact that Masai still have yet to sign that contract, it looks like he is giving up. I hope I am wrong, but man this is frustrating.

I think this may be the biggest issue. If you're this unsure on what your future holds what incentive is there for you to make significant moves either way? We have barely heard a peep from Masai. Bobby has signed an extension, but Masai's situation looms over everything.

I mean yes, I agree with you. But I'm of the school of thought that as long as you occupy the position, it is your job to operate in the best interest of the team. So yeah.

[ItsDanger]

On Dec 8, 2020, OKC signed Moses Brown to a 2 way contract. Last night, 20 pts, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks.

Watch on YouTube

Doesn't shoot 3s though.

These are the kind of players you miss out when you are asleep at the wheel.

[Dalek]

Sorry, didn't want to go off, but this team is strangely constructed and has been that way since the championship. What you pointed out about the drop-off is concerning because each year is getting worse from a talent perspective.

The coach is defensive-minded and the core players are excellent two-way players. The reason Toronto won a championship was based on their defense (and Kawhi carrying the team). Bobby 's MO since the title has been scouring the league for reclamation projects. Only Boucher has panned out. They need to be better with talent acquisition because the core are not transcendental talents like Kawhi, so the guys around them have to be solid.

On the flipside, if Toronto tanks and gets a lotto player, they might be able to get very good quickly. You get a Cade or Suggs this team can become very good again.

Part of the price of trading firsts to add good players en route to a championship. Hitting on a bunch of late picks and undrafted players has been relatively unique to the Raptors, although lately more teams are starting to score off undrafted players. I think people are sore at the losing, but they're essentially trying to turn this over on the fly. It may not look like how you think it should look.

I get that you have to trade away firsts to get a championship, but it is how Toronto has tackled its transition period. Post-Championship you would think that Toronto is not going to be loaded with youth or inexperience, but I think you might be surprised that according to one metric Toronto is 21st ranked in terms of NBA experience, despite being an average age of 26 years.
https://en.hispanosnba.com/teams/comparison

Toronto has not built a deep or young team of prospects. It is kind of in a poor place from a talent perspective. Three guys on their rookie deals plus 6 guys who are not NBA level players. Maybe you can make a case for Johnson.

Johnson
McCaw
Bembry
Yuta
Watson
Thomas
Flynn (r)
Harris (r)
Davis (r)

The issue is Bobby is trying to be too cute with all of these projects. It has to be hard for the veteran core to play with a G-League type of roster.

[DelAbbot]

On Dec 8, 2020, OKC signed Moses Brown to a 2 way contract. Last night, 20 pts, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks.

Watch on YouTube

Doesn't shoot 3s though.

These are the kind of players you miss out when you are asleep at the wheel.

Looks like Nerlens Noel. Not sure if that is a long term piece. Probably can be acquired off the scrap heap each offseason like RHJ and Bembry.

[Pooh_Jeter]

OP has a point. I don't think missing out in Damian Jones is the problem. It's the lack of direction this team shown the entire year, I can't tell if we are buyers or sellers. I understand the covid situation and all, but should definitely be sellers at this point. What's the point keeping Lowry to compete for the 8th seed or even play-in? Powell should be sell high, obviously the team have no intention to keep him long term otherwise an extension should be done already. IF we are still trying to compete, we should be aggressive and try to acquire players that can elevate the team. The fact that Masai still have yet to sign that contract, it looks like he is giving up. I hope I am wrong, but man this is frustrating.

I think this may be the biggest issue. If you're this unsure on what your future holds what incentive is there for you to make significant moves either way? We have barely heard a peep from Masai. Bobby has signed an extension, but Masai's situation looms over everything.

I mean yes, I agree with you. But I'm of the school of thought that as long as you occupy the position, it is your job to operate in the best interest of the team. So yeah.

Absolutely, and it isn't as though there is intentional sabotage going on. That being said, over the last two years Masai has basically just re-signed the Raptors own free agents and done nothing else of note. This is also the same time period in which the smoke about him leaving has started to intensify and he has refused to sign an extension.

[ATLTimekeeper]

I get that you have to trade away firsts to get a championship, but it is how Toronto has tackled its transition period. Post-Championship you would think that Toronto is not going to be loaded with youth or inexperience, but I think you might be surprised that according to one metric Toronto is 21st ranked in terms of NBA experience, despite being an average age of 26 years.
https://en.hispanosnba.com/teams/comparison

Toronto has not built a deep or young team of prospects. It is kind of in a poor place from a talent perspective. Three guys on their rookie deals plus 6 guys who are not NBA level players. Maybe you can make a case for Johnson.

Johnson
McCaw
Bembry
Yuta
Watson
Thomas
Flynn (r)
Harris (r)
Davis (r)

The issue is Bobby is trying to be too cute with all of these projects. It has to be hard for the veteran core to play with a G-League type of roster.

I think the issue is a lack of picks. Was it hard last year? They arguably had their most successful season ever in terms of outperforming expectation. The ambition was to roll that exact team back, but they struck out 2X in FA. In response, they added a veteran (Baynes) and two younger guys with some NBA experience (Len/Bembry). And that's what they've done from the outset, pretty much. Len/Bembry was no different than Biyombo/Hansbrough/Auston Daye/James Johnson and I'm sure I could find others. Just taking some fliers on young guys with some reps that they like. I think Bembry was playing pretty well with a full roster, but obviously struggled with an empty one. I don't think it's getting cute, it's making really small commitments to preserve flexibility. And then occasionally one breaks through.

[Pointgod]

Raptors need to be sellers at the deadline

Far more likely they'll be buyers. They don't "need" to be anything at the deadline. Your asst/TO ratio is heading in the wrong direction.

They should be trading Norm and Kyle(if he wants out) for picks and young players on rookie contracts, even if it means taking on longer contracts. Otherwise if we end up resigning them we’re going to be a mediocre team for the foreseeable future because we aren’t winning jack **** with Siakim as our best player

[pr0gr4m]

Powell hasn't really ever been streaky.

He performed well as a starter and then got replaced in the line up or forced to move to SF.

The Raptors cater for guys like Fred and DeMar when Powell has more tools and shows a higher degree of talent.

Powell is going to be an elite scorer for the next 5 years depending on where he finds the opportunity.

If in Powell I sign a 3 year deal and find a guaranteed starting role somewhere. If he's on a lottery team he'll output 25-29 points a game over a season.

I'm feeling confident about that.

[bballsparkin]

Seems like a thread that would have better been served once the trade deadline has passed. Personally, add me to the camp that is happy the FO is not making hurried and rash decisions. Depth was lost due to the title run and needs to be collected again. Serge and Gasol were a great combo but are on the wrong side of 30. So lets see what the team has. Clearly there is a glaring need at centre that needs to be addressed. I'm in no rush to see the Raptors give out draft picks to address that. So only if a trade makes sense should be the path. The last thing I would want to see is some sort of short sighted win now trade.

[fbalmeida]

I totally get the idea that the trade deadline promises to reveal exactly what their plan is.

But my shtick here is that whatever their macro plan is, they shouldn't have waited very long after Len's waiving to add a Center to the team.

[Yeezus_]

On Dec 8, 2020, OKC signed Moses Brown to a 2 way contract. Last night, 20 pts, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks.

Watch on YouTube

Doesn't shoot 3s though.

These are the kind of players you miss out when you are asleep at the wheel.

Yes, lets judge a player by the 3 games he played well. Your logic also implies 29 other teams are "asleep at the wheel"

[fbalmeida]

On Dec 8, 2020, OKC signed Moses Brown to a 2 way contract. Last night, 20 pts, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks.

Watch on YouTube

Doesn't shoot 3s though.

These are the kind of players you miss out when you are asleep at the wheel.

Yes, lets judge a player by the 3 games he played well. Your logic also implies 29 other teams are "asleep at the wheel"

Quality aside, not all teams have positional imbalances as salient as ours. Take the Magic for instance with their PG situation.

Fultz got injured.
Anthony Cole got injured.
Michael Carter Williams got injured.

So they signed Frank Mason and Chasson Randle to two-way contracts and gave both of them a shot a solid minutes at PG.

They did something.

[ItsDanger]

On Dec 8, 2020, OKC signed Moses Brown to a 2 way contract. Last night, 20 pts, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks.

Watch on YouTube

Doesn't shoot 3s though.

These are the kind of players you miss out when you are asleep at the wheel.

Yes, lets judge a player by the 3 games he played well. Your logic also implies 29 other teams are "asleep at the wheel"

My point is that this should be a transition season. If we're discussing realism that is which is a major assumption here. Shaping the roster for 21/22 should be our goal. Instead we're desperately just trying to be .500. Matching with Sixers & Nets in the playoffs doesn't look promising. And no, 29 other teams didn't have glaring holes at the 5. We did.

[Pooh_Jeter]

The Heat were just able to acquire some wing depth for a guy who is toxic right now and was going to be cut. All they had to do was include a 2027 2nd rounder.

[Danny1616]

The Heat were just able to acquire some wing depth for a guy who is toxic right now and was going to be cut. All they had to do was include a 2027 2nd rounder.

So they traded a 2nd for a 35 year old guard who hasn't been relevant in a while...your point?

Are you saying we should trade draft picks for aging vets on the last legs of their career to compete? Doesn't that go against your theory?

Are you saying that Ariza is Miami's missing piece to be a true contender?

[Pooh_Jeter]

The Heat were just able to acquire some wing depth for a guy who is toxic right now and was going to be cut. All they had to do was include a 2027 2nd rounder.

So they traded a 2nd for a 35 year old guard who hasn't been relevant in a while...your point?

Are you saying we should trade draft picks for aging vets on the last legs of their career to compete? Doesn't that go against your theory?

Are you saying that Ariza is Miami's missing piece to be a true contender?

He actually played quite well when Portland acquired him last year. It makes sense for the Heat because they are obviously competing and Harkless/Bradley have been misses.

The point is that the Raptors haven't been active addressing their needs nor selling assets and the trade market has started to move again.

[Johnny Bball]

This forum has gone to trash. If you're questioning (unreal really) why Ujiri would still do his job, maybe you need to understand what it is to have a good work ethic, which if you're questioning it, you can't possibly have.

And I guess Webster who's signed for 4 years has decided just to go along the same way, even though it's a completely different situation.

[Basketball_Jones]

On Dec 8, 2020, OKC signed Moses Brown to a 2 way contract. Last night, 20 pts, 16 rebounds, 5 blocks.

Watch on YouTube

Doesn't shoot 3s though.

These are the kind of players you miss out when you are asleep at the wheel.

Baynes can shoot 3's though. Stay the course...

[Danny1616]

The Heat were just able to acquire some wing depth for a guy who is toxic right now and was going to be cut. All they had to do was include a 2027 2nd rounder.

So they traded a 2nd for a 35 year old guard who hasn't been relevant in a while...your point?

Are you saying we should trade draft picks for aging vets on the last legs of their career to compete? Doesn't that go against your theory?

Are you saying that Ariza is Miami's missing piece to be a true contender?

He actually played quite well when Portland acquired him last year. It makes sense for the Heat because they are obviously competing and Harkless/Bradley have been misses.

The point is that the Raptors haven't been active addressing their needs nor selling assets and the trade market has started to move again.

Heat are 22-18. They have an abysmal record without Butler, who will be 32 and is injury prone.

You really think this is "addressing their needs."

Clearly they aren't a true contender, so according to your theory they should sell their assets for value.

You can't just apply one standard for us and one standard for Miami, lol.

This is baffling to me. So when it comes to Miami you are an anti-tanker but when it comes to us you are a pro-tanker. You need to apply the same standard to every team in the league, or your theory has zero validity.

[Vampirate]

If there wasn't a shortsighted move the raptors could make that was available, they'd do it.

OP wants them to make a move for the sake of making a move.

This season is a wash regardless of what they do.