Official Trade Thread -- Part XL

[doclinkin]

Agreed... When I said "Figure it out", I meant more broadly. They have Russ & Beal...so they need to figure out a way to use Rui, Deni, Bryant, Bonga, Mathews, Bertans, and a Top 7 pick.

Currently #5 in the lotto standings... but yeah any time I check the simulator we fall to #7 most often.

[Ruzious]

Agreed... When I said "Figure it out", I meant more broadly. They have Russ & Beal...so they need to figure out a way to use Rui, Deni, Bryant, Bonga, Mathews, Bertans, and a Top 7 pick.

Currently #5 in the lotto standings... but yeah any time I check the simulator we fall to #7 most often.

I just played, and #2 and #7 came up the most for me, fwiw. No worries - Ujiri will know what to do with our pick.

[Dat2U]

Bonga has a +4.0 on/off differential, good for 4th best on the team behind Wagner, Bertans, Avdija. The wizards defensive rating is 16.0 points LOWER with Bonga on the court. The next best differential is Ish Smith at 9.4 points lower.

Pretty clear to me, Bonga should be in the rotation and has won that “other wing” spot over Robinson&Brown. They obviously need help at the C spot, so Brown&Wagner are on the chopping block.

If I have to make a silly win now trade, I’m calling Sacramento. Richaun Holmes is a game changer. There’s been rumors reported everywhere regarding potential interest from the wizards.

Holmes leads the kings in on/off by a MILE. +11.0. Absolute game changer. His offense has caught up to his defense now.

Westbrook (34) Neto (14)
Beal (36) Mathews (12)
Bonga (20) Avdija (24) Mathews (4)
Hachimura (20) Bertans (24) Bonga (4)
Holmes (32) Hachimura (8) Len (8)

Still shipping out Lopez for a 2nd.

Bonga needs Bertans to balance out his limitations in terms of spacing.

Holmes isn't a game changer. He's an upgrade tho and probably would make a difference.

I'm good on the upgrades for now but I expect one at C. No way their serious about the playoffs running Lopez/Len/Wagner out there every night. .

[pcbothwel]

Agreed... When I said "Figure it out", I meant more broadly. They have Russ & Beal...so they need to figure out a way to use Rui, Deni, Bryant, Bonga, Mathews, Bertans, and a Top 7 pick.

Currently #5 in the lotto standings... but yeah any time I check the simulator we fall to #7 most often.

I just played, and #2 and #7 came up the most for me, fwiw. No worries - Ujiri will know what to do with our pick.

2/3 - Mobley (or Suggs I guess, but Mobley is plug and play).

6/7 - Trade down for more picks and/or big(Wood, Turner, JJJ). Grab Wagner/Springer/Moody/Butler.
... Or stay put and simply take Wagner or Springer

My "Win now" dream assuming we dont hit on lotto.
- Trade Bertans by deadline for expirings and top 35 pick.
- Trade 7 + Brown to Houston for 22 + Wood
- Draft Duarte/Butler at 22 and Giddey/Dosunmu/Queta with out pick from Bertans
- Resign Winston, Mathews, and Bonga
- Sign Otto with Full MLE

Russ / Butler / Winston
Beal / Mathews
Rui / Deni / Bonga
Otto / Deni / Bonga
Wood / Bryant / Queta

Ok... Ill wake up now.

[WallToWall]

Bonga has a +4.0 on/off differential, good for 4th best on the team behind Wagner, Bertans, Avdija. The wizards defensive rating is 16.0 points LOWER with Bonga on the court. The next best differential is Ish Smith at 9.4 points lower.

Pretty clear to me, Bonga should be in the rotation and has won that “other wing” spot over Robinson&Brown. They obviously need help at the C spot, so Brown&Wagner are on the chopping block.

If I have to make a silly win now trade, I’m calling Sacramento. Richaun Holmes is a game changer. There’s been rumors reported everywhere regarding potential interest from the wizards.

Holmes leads the kings in on/off by a MILE. +11.0. Absolute game changer. His offense has caught up to his defense now.

Westbrook (34) Neto (14)
Beal (36) Mathews (12)
Bonga (20) Avdija (24) Mathews (4)
Hachimura (20) Bertans (24) Bonga (4)
Holmes (32) Hachimura (8) Len (8)

Still shipping out Lopez for a 2nd.

If there is one position of need, it would be C.
Holmes + Bagley FOR Ish + TBJr + Robinson works in trade checker. We can see if Bagley works as a reclamation project.
I would still see if Drummond can be picked up.
I have no clue if this can work with our cap situation, etc. Probably, long term, this is just a pipe dream.

[Ruzious]

Really, what it all comes down to after we find we have the 6th pick, we gotta figure a way to move up to 2 or 3 to get Mobley - and do it (Cunningham is almost sure to be #1). As interesting as both Queta and Bassey are - and I like them both, Mobley is the one player who can change every dynamic for the Wiz for the better. The trade should be somewhat similar to how Dallas moved up to get Doncic.

[nate33]

Really, what it all comes down to after we find we have the 6th pick, we gotta figure a way to move up to 2 or 3 to get Mobley - and do it (Cunningham is almost sure to be #1). As interesting as both Queta and Bassey are - and I like them both, Mobley is the one player who can change every dynamic for the Wiz for the better. The trade should be somewhat similar to how Dallas moved up to get Doncic.

It's tough with our 2023 pick being so encumbered. We'd have to trade our #6 pick plus our 2022 unprotected pick, and the team we trade with would have to give us a late 2022 1st back so we comply with the Stepien Rule. So the trade could really only be made with a team who had the #2 or #3 pick in the 2021 draft and who also had a late 2022 1st leftover from some other trade with a good team.

It looks like only Houston or OKC would be a suitable partner. But would they trade their #2 pick and a future late 1st to get the #6 and an unprotected 2022 pick? Probably not.

Would another team trade the #2/#3 pick for the #6 pick and Avdija? Probably not.

[gambitx777]

I would rather trade back then up. This is a deeper draft.

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[Ruzious]

Really, what it all comes down to after we find we have the 6th pick, we gotta figure a way to move up to 2 or 3 to get Mobley - and do it (Cunningham is almost sure to be #1). As interesting as both Queta and Bassey are - and I like them both, Mobley is the one player who can change every dynamic for the Wiz for the better. The trade should be somewhat similar to how Dallas moved up to get Doncic.

It's tough with our 2023 pick being so encumbered. We'd have to trade our #6 pick plus our 2022 unprotected pick, and the team we trade with would have to give us a late 2022 1st back so we comply with the Stepien Rule. So the trade could really only be made with a team who had the #2 or #3 pick in the 2021 draft and who also had a late 2022 1st leftover from some other trade with a good team.

It looks like only Houston or OKC would be a suitable partner. But would they trade their #2 pick and a future late 1st to get the #6 and an unprotected 2022 pick? Probably not.

Would another team trade the #2/#3 pick for the #6 pick and Avdija? Probably not.

I'd rather trade Rui than Avdija, and that might do it - I think Rui has more trade value than Avdija. If not, add a pick exchange for somewhere out in the future.

[nate33]

I'd rather trade Rui than Avdija

Yeah, I figured you would.

and that might do it - I think Rui has more trade value than Avdija. If not, add a pick exchange for somewhere out in the future.

I agree that Rui has more value. I think it's possible that Rui plus the #6 gets us up to #2. I'm not sure I'd do it though. I like Rui's upside more than you do.

[Ruzious]

I would rather trade back then up. This is a deeper draft.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using RealGM mobile app

It's somewhat deep, but there's such an enormous drop after 4.

[Ruzious]

I'd rather trade Rui than Avdija

Yeah, I figured you would.

and that might do it - I think Rui has more trade value than Avdija. If not, add a pick exchange for somewhere out in the future.

I agree that Rui has more value. I think it's possible that Rui plus the #6 gets us up to #2. I'm not sure I'd do it though. I like Rui's upside more than you do.

That's fine - I like Rui. I just think he's easily replacable.

[payitforward]

Currently #5 in the lotto standings... but yeah any time I check the simulator we fall to #7 most often.

I just played, and #2 and #7 came up the most for me, fwiw. No worries - Ujiri will know what to do with our pick.

2/3 - Mobley (or Suggs I guess, but Mobley is plug and play).

6/7 - Trade down for more picks and/or big(Wood, Turner, JJJ). Grab Wagner/Springer/Moody/Butler.
... Or stay put and simply take Wagner or Springer

My "Win now" dream assuming we dont hit on lotto.
- Trade Bertans by deadline for expirings and top 35 pick.
- Trade 7 + Brown to Houston for 22 + Wood
- Draft Duarte/Butler at 22 and Giddey/Dosunmu/Queta with out pick from Bertans
- Resign Winston, Mathews, and Bonga
- Sign Otto with Full MLE

Russ / Butler / Winston
Beal / Mathews
Rui / Deni / Bonga
Otto / Deni / Bonga
Wood / Bryant / Queta

Ok... Ill wake up now.

No, please don't...

I have no idea whether these moves would be possible, but if so they are terrific. My concerns are...

1. Bertans: The best offer we got for Davis last year seems to have been from the Celtics -- either the #26 or #30 pick. You're looking for the same kind of deal, but this year we'll take the #35 instead of that #26.

Obviously, the drop in the pick recognizes that Davis's trade value isn't what it was. I wonder whether you're realistic in thinking a drop of 9 spots in the pick being offered really suffices to address the fact that 1) Davis isn't playing as well as he did last year (he's closer than his overall stats would indicate, but still...), 2) he now comes with a big price tag attached to him over the next several years, & 3) by taking on that salary, a team is also saving us a ton of money.

In any case, he may not even be on the market. We'll find out soon enough.

2. #7 & Brown <> #22 & Wood: simple question -- if you were Houston's new GM, would you do this deal?

[gambitx777]

Yeah but that gets into the age old where did kawi, klay, and Gianis get taken debate and I would rather have more darts to toss than a slightly bigger target to hit.

I would rather trade back then up. This is a deeper draft.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using RealGM mobile app

It's somewhat deep, but there's such an enormous drop after 4.

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using RealGM mobile app

[payitforward]

I'd rather trade Rui than Avdija

Yeah, I figured you would.

and that might do it - I think Rui has more trade value than Avdija. If not, add a pick exchange for somewhere out in the future.

I agree that Rui has more value. I think it's possible that Rui plus the #6 gets us up to #2. I'm not sure I'd do it though. I like Rui's upside more than you do.

I take it this means that you think Rui -- where he is now, how far he's come in 1.5 years, his age (23), & his "upside" -- has more potential than Deni -- where he is now, how far he's come in 1/2 year, his age (20), & his "upside?" Is that right?

Or, alternatively, is it that you think Rui has a better chance to reach his potential than Deni does -- even though you think Deni may actually have more potential?

Obviously, no one can be sure of any of these variables -- or either of these guys -- but I'm curious if this question has an answer for you.

[nate33]

I'd rather trade Rui than Avdija

Yeah, I figured you would.

and that might do it - I think Rui has more trade value than Avdija. If not, add a pick exchange for somewhere out in the future.

I agree that Rui has more value. I think it's possible that Rui plus the #6 gets us up to #2. I'm not sure I'd do it though. I like Rui's upside more than you do.

I take it this means that you think Rui -- where he is now, how far he's come in 1.5 years, his age (23), & his "upside" -- has more potential than Deni -- where he is now, how far he's come in 1/2 year, his age (20), & his "upside?" Is that right?

Yes.

[pcbothwel]

1. Bertans: The best offer we got for Davis last year seems to have been from the Celtics -- either the #26 or #30 pick. You're looking for the same kind of deal, but this year we'll take the #35 instead of that #26.

Obviously, the drop in the pick recognizes that Davis's trade value isn't what it was. I wonder whether you're realistic in thinking a drop of 9 spots in the pick being offered really suffices to address the fact that 1) Davis isn't playing as well as he did last year (he's closer than his overall stats would indicate, but still...), 2) he now comes with a big price tag attached to him over the next several years, & 3) by taking on that salary, a team is also saving us a ton of money.

In any case, he may not even be on the market. We'll find out soon enough.

2. #7 & Brown <> #22 & Wood: simple question -- if you were Houston's new GM, would you do this deal?

Bertans: I have zero idea about what his market is or was. Im not saying that he is less valuable this year, but that if you look at the teams picking 22-30 you have 8 teams (Rockets have 2 pick). We can rule the rockets out as they are rebuilding.
The Clippers, Lakers, Jazz, and Nets cant trade their 2021 pick as they have already traded their 2022 pick.
That leaves the Suns, Nuggets, and 76ers.
- The Suns have Saric, Bridges, Crowder, and Cam Johnson all wing shooters throwing up 20 3PA/game and hitting them at 39%. Dont think Bertans is a good fit.
- The 76ers will probably make a move for a legit PG (Lowry)
- The Nuggets have MPJ as their 3/4 3 point specialist

2) Yes, If im the Rockets I would certainly make that trade. The Rockets are in a full rebuild and Wood is signed for 2 years after this one. He doesnt fit their timeline. As to the value, it would take a pick i the late lotto 11-13 to move up from 22 to 7. Is there a team that would provide better value to the Rockets than pick 12 and expirings for Wood? Maybe, but I dont see the teams in that range doing so.
*** I would be open to making it the Bucks pick (25) instead of the Portland pick (22), but I may want a future 2nd for that. Brown is worth an early-mid 2nd (~40) and isnt simply filler. That said, it financially doesnt work so I would have to rethink it.

[gambitx777]

I'm also not trading rui . I think he's a legit starting 3 in this league. And could absolutly be the 3ed option on a winning team and a damn good defender in time. You could talk me into trading deni but I like him too if he can develop in to a real 4 you can play rui more at the 3 where he really belongs.

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[gambitx777]

I was very much expecting to trade Bertans . Him being hurt on top of the bad start makes that extra unlikely .

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[payitforward]

1. Bertans: The best offer we got for Davis last year seems to have been from the Celtics -- either the #26 or #30 pick. You're looking for the same kind of deal, but this year we'll take the #35 instead of that #26.

Obviously, the drop in the pick recognizes that Davis's trade value isn't what it was. I wonder whether you're realistic in thinking a drop of 9 spots in the pick being offered really suffices to address the fact that 1) Davis isn't playing as well as he did last year (he's closer than his overall stats would indicate, but still...), 2) he now comes with a big price tag attached to him over the next several years, & 3) by taking on that salary, a team is also saving us a ton of money.

In any case, he may not even be on the market. We'll find out soon enough.

2. #7 & Brown <> #22 & Wood: simple question -- if you were Houston's new GM, would you do this deal?

Bertans: I have zero idea about what his market is or was. Im not saying that he is less valuable this year, but that if you look at the teams picking 22-30 you have 8 teams (Rockets have 2 pick). We can rule the rockets out as they are rebuilding.
The Clippers, Lakers, Jazz, and Nets cant trade their 2021 pick as they have already traded their 2022 pick.
That leaves the Suns, Nuggets, and 76ers.
- The Suns have Saric, Bridges, Crowder, and Cam Johnson all wing shooters throwing up 20 3PA/game and hitting them at 39%. Dont think Bertans is a good fit.
- The 76ers will probably make a move for a legit PG (Lowry)
- The Nuggets have MPJ as their 3/4 3 point specialist

2) Yes, If im the Rockets I would certainly make that trade. The Rockets are in a full rebuild and Wood is signed for 2 years after this one. He doesnt fit their timeline. As to the value, it would take a pick i the late lotto 11-13 to move up from 22 to 7. Is there a team that would provide better value to the Rockets than pick 12 and expirings for Wood? Maybe, but I dont see the teams in that range doing so.
*** I would be open to making it the Bucks pick (25) instead of the Portland pick (22), but I may want a future 2nd for that. Brown is worth an early-mid 2nd (~40) and isnt simply filler. That said, it financially doesnt work so I would have to rethink it.

... I guess maybe if their new GM is a Wizards fan, he might do that trade. Otherwise, no.

Christian Wood is a bargain at his salary. No reason in the world to trade him. He's 25 & has many productive years ahead of him. IOW, you were right the first time -- you're dreaming.

In any case, since none of this is happening (again, that's something you said not me) there can be no way to resolve this kind of thing. Really, every year for the last 3 years you've said that we're one player (a guy we can get, too) away from being a contender in the East. Meanwhile, we post a .371 record over those 3 years. Not much of a path back to reality.