Free Agency, Rumors, Thoughts in General 2.0

[Texas Chuck]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

[MoneyTalks41890]

How is Houston a rebuild with Wall, Wood, 2021 Top 5 Pick, and then Gordon?

Wall definitely not around long term, but they can’t really do a long rebuild. They start owing their first to OKC again in 2024 so assuming they keep the 21 first (50/50 shot) they can start trying to put something together before having obligations to OKC in 24, 25, 26

[Buzzard]

Your throwing out this year because you dont like the results

This isnt even close to intellectual honesty and you know it.

I don't know what betting rules are here. Like if a avatar bet is allowed. But I am more than willing to say Bogdan's TS% for this season will be better than Smart's when its all said and done.

I will for sure put myself on the eat crow list if I am wrong. What say you? Do you enjoy some crow as well?

I mean this in the nicest way possible, but I really dont care enough to make or track this bet.

Your namesake is not worth a little effort . Its all good. I think it was a lock for me anyway.

[Buzzard]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

The hit they took with Curry is pretty apparent most nights. They probably can't fix PF and SG in one deadline. One or the other. Then hope KP gets back to form and stays healthy.

[Texas Chuck]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

The hit they took with Curry is pretty apparent most nights. .

outdated narrative. They could always use more shooting just as any team could, but since the COVID 5 and KP returned, the shooting has been fine. Richardson is the only primary rotation player not shooting well from 3.

[Buzzard]

Yep, if you're trading for Ball you're doing it knowing he's getting paid a ton. Like probably twice what Smart makes.

And I like Ball a lot too, but Smart has been one of Boston's beat players for a while and makes relatively little. Would think it's at least two firsts for him to even get a discussion. But who knows, I don't think he's be available to start.

But you are only getting Smart for one more year at 14.3m then he is a ufa and will be paid in the neighborhood of Ball after next season. I would pay less for Ball if those are the prices of each player and know I am matching a big contract.

That's one year of value for cheap, and a history of Smart being a better player. And I like Ball a good bit.

Smart rates out better in 3 year RAPM, 3 year luck adjusted, multi year of BBall Index's metric, creates a bit more for him self in terms of 2 point shots, isn't much older, and has been able to help lead some really good defenses.

I'm not sure they're like incredibly far off in terms of how good they'll be, but that one year makes a difference and we've seen Smart be a key contributor on successful teams, we haven't with Ball yet (and I'm fairly high on Lonzo myself).

If I have the choice of one cheap year or no cheap years, I'd take the one cheap year. That's not chess vs checkers, its a year vs nothing.

The other part of checkers vs chess is UFA Smart vs RFA Ball. The long term chess move, I can see Ball being the best move. The Hawks are a 4th seed. Its a given you don't make playoff noise unless you are a luxury team. Sooner or later, if the Hawks want to be serious, the luxury tax is a given.

[bondom34]

But you are only getting Smart for one more year at 14.3m then he is a ufa and will be paid in the neighborhood of Ball after next season. I would pay less for Ball if those are the prices of each player and know I am matching a big contract.

That's one year of value for cheap, and a history of Smart being a better player. And I like Ball a good bit.

Smart rates out better in 3 year RAPM, 3 year luck adjusted, multi year of BBall Index's metric, creates a bit more for him self in terms of 2 point shots, isn't much older, and has been able to help lead some really good defenses.

I'm not sure they're like incredibly far off in terms of how good they'll be, but that one year makes a difference and we've seen Smart be a key contributor on successful teams, we haven't with Ball yet (and I'm fairly high on Lonzo myself).

If I have the choice of one cheap year or no cheap years, I'd take the one cheap year. That's not chess vs checkers, its a year vs nothing.

The other part of checkers vs chess is UFA Smart vs RFA Ball. The long term chess move, I can see Ball being the best move. The Hawks are a 4th seed. Its a given you don't make playoff noise unless you are a luxury team. Sooner or later, if the Hawks want to be serious, the luxury tax is a given.

So you'd then pay Smart.

Smart is cheaper for a year and better. Lonzo isn't either. This is a weird argument, and not chess vs checkers at all.

[HartfordWhalers]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

Shooting (that is Offense) Guard (that is Defense). It is everything you need, all in one position.

[Mike lorenzo]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

Would this make THJ available .. ?? ..

[Texas Chuck]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

Would this make THJ available .. ?? ..

It should in theory yes. But if not I guess it just means Dallas plays a lot of 3 guard looks with Luka defending PF's more than he currently does.

[HartfordWhalers]

Read on Twitter

[psimanic1]

So, if Denver trades for Gordon today, can he play against ORL tomorrow?

[Buzzard]

That's one year of value for cheap, and a history of Smart being a better player. And I like Ball a good bit.

Smart rates out better in 3 year RAPM, 3 year luck adjusted, multi year of BBall Index's metric, creates a bit more for him self in terms of 2 point shots, isn't much older, and has been able to help lead some really good defenses.

I'm not sure they're like incredibly far off in terms of how good they'll be, but that one year makes a difference and we've seen Smart be a key contributor on successful teams, we haven't with Ball yet (and I'm fairly high on Lonzo myself).

If I have the choice of one cheap year or no cheap years, I'd take the one cheap year. That's not chess vs checkers, its a year vs nothing.

The other part of checkers vs chess is UFA Smart vs RFA Ball. The long term chess move, I can see Ball being the best move. The Hawks are a 4th seed. Its a given you don't make playoff noise unless you are a luxury team. Sooner or later, if the Hawks want to be serious, the luxury tax is a given.

So you'd then pay Smart.

Smart is cheaper for a year and better. Lonzo isn't either. This is a weird argument, and not chess vs checkers at all.

UFA Smart has options. RFA Ball does not. Lock Ball up long term; keep playing Chess.

[Buzzard]

It seems the Mavs want Fournier ... Johnson and 2 seconds ... would be the offer ... supposedly.

Dallas going for an all SG team I guess.....

Shooting (that is Offense) Guard (that is Defense). It is everything you need, all in one position.

I got a good laugh there

[bondom34]

The other part of checkers vs chess is UFA Smart vs RFA Ball. The long term chess move, I can see Ball being the best move. The Hawks are a 4th seed. Its a given you don't make playoff noise unless you are a luxury team. Sooner or later, if the Hawks want to be serious, the luxury tax is a given.

So you'd then pay Smart.

Smart is cheaper for a year and better. Lonzo isn't either. This is a weird argument, and not chess vs checkers at all.

UFA Smart has options. RFA Ball does not.

I mean, he does. There's just a distinct chance he gets a bigger offer.

And I wouldn't take a worse player on a larger contract an extra year while paying more for him.

If you're paying both 4/80 on the next contract it's 4/80 for Ball, 5/95 for Smart after the trade. And you're getting a worse player.

There is actual, tangible, intrinsic value to having that cheap year.

[Buzzard]

So you'd then pay Smart.

Smart is cheaper for a year and better. Lonzo isn't either. This is a weird argument, and not chess vs checkers at all.

UFA Smart has options. RFA Ball does not.

I mean, he does. There's just a distinct chance he gets a bigger offer.

And I wouldn't take a worse player on a larger contract an extra year while paying more for him.

If you're paying both 4/80 on the next contract it's 4/80 for Ball, 5/95 for Smart after the trade. And you're getting a worse player.

There is actual, tangible, intrinsic value to having that cheap year.

I think Ball gets between 15 - 20 million. I think Smart does to. Difference is Smart can choose which team he wants to go to. Ball cannot being a RFA.

Checkers is the 1.5 season play with Smart. Chess is the 4.5 year play with Ball. That is what I am saying. Fine and dandy if you disagree. That is what this board is all about. Everyone's opinions that cares to post them.

[HartfordWhalers]

To me, Oladipo to Atlanta never makes sense as I think he takes less money elsewhere and the elsewhere happens in a few months.
I'm not sold Smart would stay, but in theory it could be a fit that looks good and a team that looks good, so there is a decent chance he stays if you offer a ton of money.
Ball, you know will stay. Unless things get really crazy (q/o).

If I'm a fictional team with lots of trouble keeping players and winning (call it the Timber Kings, or maybe the Piston Wizards), then I prioritize Ball and pass on Smart. If I'm Atlanta, I'm checking with Smart's agent and thinking I can keep him. If that call doesn't go well, I'm moving in a different direction. But a year and a half is a lot of control.

[bondom34]

UFA Smart has options. RFA Ball does not.

I mean, he does. There's just a distinct chance he gets a bigger offer.

And I wouldn't take a worse player on a larger contract an extra year while paying more for him.

If you're paying both 4/80 on the next contract it's 4/80 for Ball, 5/95 for Smart after the trade. And you're getting a worse player.

There is actual, tangible, intrinsic value to having that cheap year.

I think Ball gets between 15 - 20 million. I think Smart does to. Difference is Smart can choose which team he wants to go to. Ball cannot being a RFA.

Checkers is the 1.5 season play with Smart. Chess is the 4.5 year play with Ball. That is what I am saying. Fine and dandy if you disagree. That is what this board is all about. Everyone's opinions that cares to post them.

Its not 1.5 seasons with Smart though. And you've got him locked up at least that long. You don't with Ball, and he's cheaper short term. And Bird rights have value.

Its better to have the cheaper/better player.

Edit: And I get this a bit too

To me, Oladipo to Atlanta never makes sense as I think he takes less money elsewhere and the elsewhere happens in a few months.
I'm not sold Smart would stay, but in theory it could be a fit that looks good and a team that looks good, so there is a decent chance he stays if you offer a ton of money.
Ball, you know will stay. Unless things get really crazy (q/o).

If I'm a fictional team with lots of trouble keeping players and winning (call it the Timber Kings, or maybe the Piston Wizards), then I prioritize Ball and pass on Smart. If I'm Atlanta, I'm checking with Smart's agent and thinking I can keep him. If that call doesn't go well, I'm moving in a different direction. But a year and a half is a lot of control.

But would say I'd still say Smart is better. If I'm a younger team, I may pay less for the younger guy. But that doesn't mean his value is less just that I'd rather that player more.

[Scoot McGroot]

Read on Twitter

?s=20

links to AhnFireDigital which seems to be the worst offender of the "aggregator world", which then says that it's from Jake Fischer at Bleacher Report (yikes), and just says this:

Hornets chief executive Mitch Kupchak is not known to swing many midseason deals, but the Indiana Pacers are a team to watch in this situation, sources said, as are the active Knicks. Perhaps there's a deal that sends Myles Turner to Charlotte, which has long coveted a center, sources said, and the Pacers have maintained a willingness to discuss Turner dating back to last offseason.

Which...what? There's no reporting, really. Otherwise, what role does Graham hold in Indiana? Does he supplant TJ McConnell off the bench as the backup PG? Probably not. TJ is playing great and is absolutely a Nate Bjorkgren favorite. He probably beats out Aaron Holiday in his slump right now, but does he beat out all of Justin Holiday, Jeremy Lamb, and Doug McDermott for minutes? At that point, what's the point of the "upgrade"? I just don't see it as anything other than "Charlotte could deal Graham, and Charlotte also liked Myles Turner, so watch a Graham to Indy deal".

I do like following NBA Central merely for the quick gathering of lots of info, but I hit Twitter lists for real info.

[Buzzard]

I mean, he does. There's just a distinct chance he gets a bigger offer.

And I wouldn't take a worse player on a larger contract an extra year while paying more for him.

If you're paying both 4/80 on the next contract it's 4/80 for Ball, 5/95 for Smart after the trade. And you're getting a worse player.

There is actual, tangible, intrinsic value to having that cheap year.

I think Ball gets between 15 - 20 million. I think Smart does to. Difference is Smart can choose which team he wants to go to. Ball cannot being a RFA.

Checkers is the 1.5 season play with Smart. Chess is the 4.5 year play with Ball. That is what I am saying. Fine and dandy if you disagree. That is what this board is all about. Everyone's opinions that cares to post them.

Its not 1.5 seasons with Smart though. And you've got him locked up at least that long. You don't with Ball, and he's cheaper short term. And Bird rights have value.

Its better to have the cheaper/better player.

Edit: And I get what HW is saying too. But I'd just rather the better player as well. If Ball gets a later first that's my guess for market value. RFA's generally don't have a ton of trade value.

We disagree on one being substantially better than the other also. With Ball's shooting improvement, its pretty much board wide, Ball has helped his value. His FT% and 3PT% have made huge strides this season.

Its no secret, I do not value Smart as much as most on this board do. I do prefer Ball over Smart. I just think Smart is a hole offensively and after 7 years his upside is no longer relevant. What you see is what you get on both ends of the floor. Ball only being in his 4th season is showing some upside.

Smart is a good 6th man. I see Ball as a better potential starter next to Trae. If Ainge is going to move Smart, this is the season. He hew haws around like with Horford and Hayward, he could end up in a similar boat. A player he likes but does not want to pay.