New Poll: Were the Raps asking too much, or was it Kyle?

[Dr Aki]

Masai just mostly Ainged himself

Also, Schroder and KCP made 28.0 mil together, Lowry makes 30.5 mil. The Lakers were 1.5 mil below the hard cap, and that's with 2 open roster spots.

The Lakers most likely required Toronto to take Wes Matthews (3.6 mil) in the trade to make the trade work and give the Lakers the required room under the hard cap to sign 4 minimum guys for the rest of the season.

Then you're asking the Lakers to give up a 27yo, a 28yo and a 20yo, all starters/rotation guys, for a 35yo asking for a 50/2 extension, the Lakers are dying for extra athleticism as it already is. Vogel's not going to asking Lowry to chase around the premier guards/wings while Lebron's doing all the playmaking in the playoffs

Dude the raptors don’t want an overpaid KCP taking up cap space. They can just let Lowry expire instead. That’s just a negative value trade for the raptors.

As opposed to a 35yo with a 50/2 extension? That's not the positive value the Lakers would be willing to give THT up for

Lowry ain't no Lebron

[Johnny Bball]

Masai just mostly Ainged himself

Also, Schroder and KCP made 28.0 mil together, Lowry makes 30.5 mil. The Lakers were 1.5 mil below the hard cap, and that's with 2 open roster spots.

The Lakers most likely required Toronto to take Wes Matthews (3.6 mil) in the trade to make the trade work and give the Lakers the required room under the hard cap to sign 4 minimum guys for the rest of the season.

Then you're asking the Lakers to give up a 27yo, a 28yo and a 20yo, all starters/rotation guys, for a 35yo asking for a 50/2 extension, the Lakers are dying for extra athleticism as it already is. Vogel's not going to asking Lowry to chase around the premier guards/wings while Lebron's doing all the playmaking in the playoffs

Dude the raptors don’t want an overpaid KCP taking up cap space. They can just let Lowry expire instead. That’s just a negative value trade for the raptors.

As opposed to a 35yo with a 50/2 extension? That's not the positive value the Lakers would be willing to give THT up for

Lowry ain't no Lebron

Sorry ...what part of “they can let Lowry expire” wasn’t clear?

[Dr Aki]

Dude the raptors don’t want an overpaid KCP taking up cap space. They can just let Lowry expire instead. That’s just a negative value trade for the raptors.

As opposed to a 35yo with a 50/2 extension? That's not the positive value the Lakers would be willing to give THT up for

Lowry ain't no Lebron

Sorry ...what part of “they can let Lowry expire” wasn’t clear?

That was a condition of the Lowry trade for the Lakers, in case you haven't been following along

[Johnny Bball]

As opposed to a 35yo with a 50/2 extension? That's not the positive value the Lakers would be willing to give THT up for

Lowry ain't no Lebron

Sorry ...what part of “they can let Lowry expire” wasn’t clear?

That was a condition of the Lowry trade for the Lakers, in case you haven't been following along

It’s not me that’s not following along. Without THT, that is a dead **** trade the raptors they never make, and it’s better to let him expire. That is not a case of asking to much, because without it, there’s zero valueor negative value in the trade. I don't even know if they make the deal with THT included since it ties up space. In other words, there’s no way for this to work between the teams.

[Dr Aki]

Sorry ...what part of “they can let Lowry expire” wasn’t clear?

That was a condition of the Lowry trade for the Lakers, in case you haven't been following along

It’s not me that’s not following along. Without THT, that is a dead **** trade the raptors they never make, and it’s better to let him expire. That is not a case of asking to much, because without it, there’s zero valueor negative value in the trade. I don't even know if they make the deal with THT included since it ties up space. In other words, there’s no way for this to work between the teams.

And with THT, then it's a dead trade for the Lakers

Thus no deal was made, and Raptors gets to watch him expire

[IgorK]

Keep in mind that all of this is speculative. Nobody knows exactly what was on the table from LA, Miami, Philly, or any other team for that matter.

My guess is that the Lakers' best package was theoretically worse than the best package from MIA or PHI and Masai was holding out for those two teams' offers to improve. Which they didn't. And Lakers didn't budge because they're a championship front office themselves.

I'm assuming Toronto accommodates Kyle with a S&T after the season ends. I don't think anybody really lost here.

[LuckyLeprechaun]

Trading Lowry for anything other than negative assets would have been a deal to make for the Raptors assuming they aren't going to give him a new contract. It was the perfect opportunity to tank and get a better draft pick while hopefully getting something at all of value.

Imagine a scenario where the Raptors win just enough to get a play in game and actually upset the 7 or 8 seed team just to get swept by the Nets/76ers/Bucks and then they are drafting 15 instead of top 5 if they tanked.

[_qubik]

My opinion is that no one is wrong, those are the facts and opinions I see as most importants

-Lowry is very good, but he is already 35 and was asking for 2/50 extension
-Nets doesnt need him, and in my opinion the Lakers too
-The other "contenders" wouldnt be better than Lakers and Nets adding Lowry, they would need to surrender good pieces to get him

The Lakers will probably add Drummond or Aldridge, given their appeal they will be front runners for the best pieces avaiable, Lebron is among the league top playmakers and the Lakers are the best defensive team, now, and in the Playoffs too.

Utah doesnt need him, they got Conley playing well, Miami could use him for sure, but I dont see my team with real chances at winning adding him still without a answer at the 4.

The teams that could add him didnt think he was the difference between winning or losing, its a steep price to pay and a big gamble to make. If it backfires those teams will need to pay Lowry or let him walk without having any return. It was the wrong year to deal Lowry at the deadline, my bet now is that he will be moved in a S&T in the offseason, he has a lot of respect for the team and may help them get something. Sixers, Heat, Lakers have the rest of the season to try their new pieces, add new ones from the buy out market and can make the needed decisions in the offseason. The most pressed teams to win arent on the Lowry talks, Clippers and Bucks are the team with most to lose

[DCasey91]

When three legitimate buyers (Lakers, 76ers, Heat) all say no to the seller at the last minute and put on the table fair trade packages something is wrong on one side, pretty simple.
Leverage was not in the hands of the seller either.

[Blacksheep25]

Once he said he was looking for $50 million, he basically created a situation where it’s down to a few teams. Only someone who is a contender and views him as the last piece necessary would pay him that, if anyone would pay him that. We will see what the market says in the summer.

He’s always been about the $. It isn’t like he ever gave the Raptors any discount. He was widely considered overpaid until the last few years. I don’t say that as an insult. It’s a business, and I’d want the max amount also. Particularly considering the high Canadian tax rates and just generally high taxes from being up there so much of the year.

To be honest, if he wants to go to a specific team like the Heat or Philly, get paid, and have a shot to win, he’s best off telling them to just sign him straight up in the off season. Particularly Miami, who can just sign him outright.

Why force your new team to give up guys that will prevent you from going out a winner if you can get paid and win? That just hurts his new team and it isn’t like he’s from Toronto and grew up a Raptors fan or owes them anything.

The way those other teams held firm and wouldn’t part with anything, I wouldn’t be surprised if he has some deal in place with Riley already. Basically if they take lowball offer, I’ll come now. If not, I’ll sign in the summer.

I think he will go to the Heat if I had to guess over the summer. He might give them some break and take something a little less than what it will cost the Raptors to retain him. To keep him I imagine the Raptors would have to give him the full $50 million. Maybe Miami or Philly if he wants to go home get a little better deal, but Philly can’t really afford him straight up, so I’d guess Miami. He can sign there for a little cheaper and break even because of the no state income tax.

I just have a feeling he was going to Miami regardless next year and everyone else knew it, hence the lack of other teams offering up anything of value.

Pure guess, but that’s what it feels like. He’s too valuable for none of the contenders to offer anything unless they knew he was a pure rental for anyone besides the Heat. They seemed the team where there was mutual interest, but no reason to part with any real assets when he can just sign with them after they renounce Oladipo.

If I were a Raptor fan, I’d be hoping Oladipo plays out of his mind, because then maybe it could get interesting and something could be salvaged in a sign and trade.

[Lalouie]

if the raps were asking too much it's because they thought kyle was superstar worthy

apparently tht was too high a price and there lowry sits

if you ask me lowry has been with the raps so long i'll bet other teams view him as having found his spot. kyle's place in history has always been debated so when push came to shove his value was dissected, 6x all star in the weak east and no better than 3rd team all star

[bebopdeluxe]

Thybulle, Maxey and TWO 1st round picks?

Maybe Masai thought he was trading Siakam.

[bebopdeluxe]

Masai just mostly Ainged himself

I think if he was negotiating against less smart GM’s, he would’ve got what he wanted. Lowry is very possibly a Sixer right now if Brand was the one doing the negotiating yesterday.

Fixed that for you.

Thybulle, Maxey and TWO 1st round picks. Hoo-boy.

[bebopdeluxe]

If he was overvalued by Masai, then it was only slightly so. Kyle has already proven himself to be good enough to be a championship point guard; he would make the Lakers the favorites (or stronger, if you have them as favorites already). The Sixers & Heat would have improved their odds to make the finals by quite a bit. He's shown that he is aging gracefully too.

Kyle Lowry is the type of guy that is easy to dismiss or be hesitant to trade/pay for UNTIL he's on your team. Unless you've watched a significant chunk of the last 7 years of his career, it's easy to say "meh 6'0, 35 year old point guard no thanks". He makes the whole team better. A good second option, a tremendous third option.

Many Sixers fans would have been OK with Maxey and a 1st round pick. I don't know who is more delusional - Masai for wanting Maxey AND Thybulle AND TWO 1st round picks, or Raptors fans thinking Lowry was worth that.

[Roco14]

If he was overvalued by Masai, then it was only slightly so. Kyle has already proven himself to be good enough to be a championship point guard; he would make the Lakers the favorites (or stronger, if you have them as favorites already). The Sixers & Heat would have improved their odds to make the finals by quite a bit. He's shown that he is aging gracefully too.

Kyle Lowry is the type of guy that is easy to dismiss or be hesitant to trade/pay for UNTIL he's on your team. Unless you've watched a significant chunk of the last 7 years of his career, it's easy to say "meh 6'0, 35 year old point guard no thanks". He makes the whole team better. A good second option, a tremendous third option.

Many Sixers fans would have been OK with Maxey and a 1st round pick. I don't know who is more delusional - Masai for wanting Maxey AND Thybulle AND TWO 1st round picks, or Raptors fans thinking Lowry was worth that.

That is too much to ask, but do we know that was exactly what Masai asked for?

Also, if it ended up resulting in a sixers finals run and a good shot at the whole thing, I think even THAT exchange would've been worth it.

[IAMZOOTED2]

Cop out answer is probably a combination of a few things. Raps demands + salary matching Lowry’s cap hit + Lowry’s extension ask were all hurdles. Not to mention that Masai, Riley and Morey are all calculated guys, the negotiations were probably pretty tough both ways.

I think we all know Riley was probably trying to leverage the Rockets and Raps against each other until the very last minute, the dude knows how to play his cards.

And Masai probably figured that Morey would be more motivated to trade for Lowry if Riley landed Dipo. Instead Morey pivoted to George Hill and the rest is history.

I'll bet you are spot on here. Well said

[FrodoFraggins]

The Raptors were asking too much. the suitors knew his asking price to resign.

[Johnny Tomala]

His price was ridiculous. Lakers would be worse with just Lowry instead of Schroder, KCP and THT. I doubt anyone will pay 50M for 2 years like Lowry wants in the FA.

[trickshot]

When three legitimate buyers (Lakers, 76ers, Heat) all say no to the seller at the last minute and put on the table fair trade packages something is wrong on one side, pretty simple.
Leverage was not in the hands of the seller either.

Another issue was the way the trade would have gutted these contenders midseason. Also if it turned out adding Lowry wasn't enough to beat the Nets the buyer would be seriously screwed. Contention window wouldn't shut but it would be bleak with limited room for improvement

[LakersSoul]

His price was ridiculous. Lakers would be worse with just Lowry instead of Schroder, KCP and THT. I doubt anyone will pay 50M for 2 years like Lowry wants in the FA.

I think Toronto fans are just starting to realize after 20 threads and all teams passing on Lowry.

Toronto didn’t want to extend him but neither does any other teams at the asking price. All this talk of 76ers are key trading partners and they just signed Hill instead. What a slap in the face.