Official Spec Thread: I guess now's the time to blow this dumpster fire up and bask in the glow!

[EAS Law]

Mo and WCJ is our new Evan and Dipo dilemma. I'd love to keep both for the next 4 years, but not sure how feasible that would be.

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Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

[Def Swami]

It's not the fact that we could lose the pick this year. It's the fact that we could also miss on it next year and only get two 2nd round picks.

The pick the Wolves sent to the Warriors for D'Angelo Russell is top 3 protected this year and unprotected in 2022. The Warriors are guaranteed to collect on that pick. The Magic may never see a first round pick after trading away an all-star big man under contract for two years. I just don't know why you would leave the most valuable asset you get in a trade up to chance with the possibility to never see it.

[Knightro]

It's not the fact that we could lose the pick this year. It's the fact that we could also miss on it next year and only get two 2nd round picks.

The pick the Wolves sent to the Warriors for D'Angelo Russell is top 3 protected this year and unprotected in 2022. The Warriors are guaranteed to collect on that pick. The Magic may never see a first round pick after trading away an all-star big man under contract for two years. I just don't know why you would leave the most valuable asset you get in a trade up to chance with the possibility to never see it.

I'm not really worried about it at all.

It would take cataclysmic bad luck for the Bulls to hit the lottery two years in a row given the fact they're clearly in win-now mode.

[bigdogdylan5]

Mo and WCJ is our new Evan and Dipo dilemma. I'd love to keep both for the next 4 years, but not sure how feasible that would be.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Bamba has faults. Vuc has faults even with him being so great we were still at best the 8 seed with him and worse this year being this great player. I will not apologize for liking us to play players with higher ceilings even if they are raw and it will be painful at times but it’s 100x more exciting. Look at the intrigue of people coming back to the board.

[bigdogdylan5]

It's not the fact that we could lose the pick this year. It's the fact that we could also miss on it next year and only get two 2nd round picks.

The pick the Wolves sent to the Warriors for D'Angelo Russell is top 3 protected this year and unprotected in 2022. The Warriors are guaranteed to collect on that pick. The Magic may never see a first round pick after trading away an all-star big man under contract for two years. I just don't know why you would leave the most valuable asset you get in a trade up to chance with the possibility to never see it.

Has it been reported that if 1st pick not conveyed by 2022 the second first rounder turns into two seconds??

[Skybox]

Mo and WCJ is our new Evan and Dipo dilemma. I'd love to keep both for the next 4 years, but not sure how feasible that would be.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Agree...I think we did well with the Vuc trade but we could have kept him and still made significant changes through the draft (we were rocketing to the bottom anyway) and by moving AG and Evan (TRoss...etc) for a little more impact. I'm fine with where we are but I really don't think WCJ was a target...he was a side effect of the trade for the picks. Lots of moving parts, lots of picks with likely value...but Chad Lowe said the other day "that's the easy part. Anyone can liquidate for picks-the next part is the big deciding factor".

[GelbeWand09]

Mo and WCJ is our new Evan and Dipo dilemma. I'd love to keep both for the next 4 years, but not sure how feasible that would be.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Yea if we miss out on a superstar i'm def. gonna wish back the glory times of being the worst team in the leaque over a 5 year span with Vuc & than 1 winning season with a 42:40 records & another PO ''run'' as one the 4-5 worst playoff teams ever recordwise.
Yes we really take a gigantic risk, in sacraficing these glory times for a rebuild/reset, because we only tried to win with this core for 5 years, in 3 years we would have been a 2nd round team for sure.

[Def Swami]

It's not the fact that we could lose the pick this year. It's the fact that we could also miss on it next year and only get two 2nd round picks.

The pick the Wolves sent to the Warriors for D'Angelo Russell is top 3 protected this year and unprotected in 2022. The Warriors are guaranteed to collect on that pick. The Magic may never see a first round pick after trading away an all-star big man under contract for two years. I just don't know why you would leave the most valuable asset you get in a trade up to chance with the possibility to never see it.

Has it been reported that if 1st pick not conveyed by 2022 the second first rounder turns into two seconds??

From Basketball Insiders website

Pick Swaps

2021 — Owed a first-rounder (top-4 protected in 2021, top-3 in 2022, otherwise converts to 2024 and 2025 second-rounders) from the Chicago Bulls (Nikola Vucevic).
2022 — Owed an Indiana Pacers second-rounder (Jordan Nwora) a year after the Pacers send a second-rounder to the Brooklyn Nets (2022, 2023 or 2024).
2023 — Owed a first-rounder (two years after the 2021 obligation to the Orland Magic, top-4 protected in 2023, top-3 in 2024, otherwise converts to 2026 and 2027 second-rounders) from the Chicago Bulls (Nikola Vucevic).
2025 — Owed a first-rounder (two years after the Denver Nuggets’ obligation to the Oklahoma City Thunder, top-5 protected through 2027, otherwise does not convey) from the Nuggets (Aaron Gordon).
2025 — Owed a second-rounder (the lower of the Memphis Grizzlies and Boston Celtics) from the Celtics (Evan Fournier).
2026 — Owed a Milwaukee Bucks 2020 second-rounder (Jordan Nwora).
2027 — Owed a second-rounder from the Boston Celtics (Evan Fournier).

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/orlando-magic-team-salary/

[MagicTownBaller]

I don't like the looks of those protections.

Also, I just did tankathon and first 3 tries, Chicago keeps their pick.

[bigdogdylan5]

It's not the fact that we could lose the pick this year. It's the fact that we could also miss on it next year and only get two 2nd round picks.

The pick the Wolves sent to the Warriors for D'Angelo Russell is top 3 protected this year and unprotected in 2022. The Warriors are guaranteed to collect on that pick. The Magic may never see a first round pick after trading away an all-star big man under contract for two years. I just don't know why you would leave the most valuable asset you get in a trade up to chance with the possibility to never see it.

Has it been reported that if 1st pick not conveyed by 2022 the second first rounder turns into two seconds??

From Basketball Insiders website

Pick Swaps

2021 — Owed a first-rounder (top-4 protected in 2021, top-3 in 2022, otherwise converts to 2024 and 2025 second-rounders) from the Chicago Bulls (Nikola Vucevic).
2022 — Owed an Indiana Pacers second-rounder (Jordan Nwora) a year after the Pacers send a second-rounder to the Brooklyn Nets (2022, 2023 or 2024).
2023 — Owed a first-rounder (two years after the 2021 obligation to the Orland Magic, top-4 protected in 2023, top-3 in 2024, otherwise converts to 2026 and 2027 second-rounders) from the Chicago Bulls (Nikola Vucevic).
2025 — Owed a first-rounder (two years after the Denver Nuggets’ obligation to the Oklahoma City Thunder, top-5 protected through 2027, otherwise does not convey) from the Nuggets (Aaron Gordon).
2025 — Owed a second-rounder (the lower of the Memphis Grizzlies and Boston Celtics) from the Celtics (Evan Fournier).
2026 — Owed a Milwaukee Bucks 2020 second-rounder (Jordan Nwora).
2027 — Owed a second-rounder from the Boston Celtics (Evan Fournier).

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/orlando-magic-team-salary/

Damn I know it is crazy unlikely they move up twice but now I might root for Chicago to win just enough to get out of the lottery so we get the picks fire guaranteed. I am a little shocked by that. We were trading the all star I was fine with the top 4 protection but to even give the opportunity for it to convert to two seconds is weird.

[Knightro]

The odds of Chicago hitting the lotto this year are going to be somewhere between 0% and 20%. Pretty low.

The odds of Chicago hitting the lotto again next year after adding a top 4 pick (or trading it on draft night for a veteran) *and* having 25M in cap space to add more talent under a win now mandate?

Seems nearly impossible.

[rcklsscognition]

20% chance the Bulls land top 4 right now. Gonna be stressful lottery night.

[bigdogdylan5]

The odds of Chicago hitting the lotto this year are going to be somewhere between 0% and 20%. Pretty low.

The odds of Chicago hitting the lotto again next year after adding a top 4 pick (or trading it on draft night for a veteran) *and* having 25M in cap space to add more talent under a win now mandate?

Seems nearly impossible.

All great points especially with Lavine FA hanging over their heads.

[bigdogdylan5]

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Agree...I think we did well with the Vuc trade but we could have kept him and still made significant changes through the draft (we were rocketing to the bottom anyway) and by moving AG and Evan (TRoss...etc) for a little more impact. I'm fine with where we are but I really don't think WCJ was a target...he was a side effect of the trade for the picks. Lots of moving parts, lots of picks with likely value...but Chad Lowe said the other day "that's the easy part. Anyone can liquidate for picks-the next part is the big deciding factor".

Weltman said if I am not mistaken they did weeks of work on WCJ not to mention the predraft stuff where it was reported we liked him. I feel safe to say he was more than a throw in

[MagicStarwipe]

Mo and WCJ is our new Evan and Dipo dilemma. I'd love to keep both for the next 4 years, but not sure how feasible that would be.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM mobile app

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Show me all of this so called "affection" for Bamba. Like c'mon man... I'm sick of guys just making up stuff.

[tiderulz]

I don't like the looks of those protections.

Also, I just did tankathon and first 3 tries, Chicago keeps their pick.

you really think a team was going to protect it even less? no team is giving away unprotected picks unless they already have a superstar and are guaranteed to make the playoffs.

[MaKiaVeLi7]

I don't think it's in our best interest looking forward to hope for the Bulls to make the playoffs this year in order to secure the pick. Sure, it will convey to us but it will be a 15th-16th pick in the draft which is not great and we'll miss the chance to pick great talent and good contributors in this year's draft.

The best we can hope for is the Bulls to underperform from now on and finish with the 10th-12th worst record and miss the play-in tournament. This is a more riskier scenario for us because our fate with the pick will hang on the draft luck, but we need to aim at the best possible talent from Draft 21. Usually in the mid-first round the talent level is not so good and the more realistic outcome is to draft a solid bench player, not a starter.

A little bit more riskier, but with greater payoff - I believe this is what we need and what WeHam targeted. Measured and acceptable risk with a excellent to great draft pick payoff for us

Looking at the current East standings: I don't see how (if no major injuries happen) the Bulls will manage to overtake Boston, Atlanta or Miami for a standard playoff spot. They will have to settle for the play-in option to make it which means they will have to take care of Toronto (likely) and Indiana (not likely but possible), and hope that the Wizards (might happen) or Cavs (not so sure they won't decide to tank soon) won't go on a hot streak and catch up.

There is a lot to be determined until the season's end and the playoffs and tanking races will certainly be a lot of fun for us Magic fans.

[EAS Law]

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Yea if we miss out on a superstar i'm def. gonna wish back the glory times of being the worst team in the leaque over a 5 year span with Vuc & than 1 winning season with a 42:40 records & another PO ''run'' as one the 4-5 worst playoff teams ever recordwise.
Yes we really take a gigantic risk, in sacraficing these glory times for a rebuild/reset, because we only tried to win with this core for 5 years, in 3 years we would have been a 2nd round team for sure.

Do me a favor and find where “glory times” were mentioned.

The point, because you seem to have missed it badly, is that objectively, Nikola Vucevic has been named to the all star team twice in his career. Mohammed Bamba cannot play more than 15 mins per game. NBA drafts are unpredictable. Anyone remember the Wiggins, Parker, Randle draft? How successful have any of those guys been?

Your sarcasm is misplaced.

[EAS Law]

Evan and Oladipo were actually both good.

Not case with this two.

For start, both are injury prone, and when they do play, they both look like backups more than actual starters, let alone above average players or stars.

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Show me all of this so called "affection" for Bamba. Like c'mon man... I'm sick of guys just making up stuff.

How about willfully ignoring all of his faults and failings while simultaneously demanding he play?

How about willfully justifying or rationalizing everything he has proven he cannot do because he has “potential”...at the tail end of his rookie contract no less

That’s what I’m referring to

[BCS]

I think what I find incredible is how Vuc was constantly abused on this forum for years despite being a legitimate Allstar twice, but we have this unwarranted affection for Mo Bamba and now the new fodder from the trade.

I mean we couldn’t wait to get rid of an actual All star because he played a fundamental, less athletic way—but we salivate at the thought of starting someone who has proven to be an absolute deer in headlights with zero motor by all accounts. Unbelievable. People get what they deserve.

I can only hope that this new batch of rookies actually pans out—because of course, guys that look good in college ALWAYS end up being superstar NBA players.

Yea if we miss out on a superstar i'm def. gonna wish back the glory times of being the worst team in the leaque over a 5 year span with Vuc & than 1 winning season with a 42:40 records & another PO ''run'' as one the 4-5 worst playoff teams ever recordwise.
Yes we really take a gigantic risk, in sacraficing these glory times for a rebuild/reset, because we only tried to win with this core for 5 years, in 3 years we would have been a 2nd round team for sure.

Do me a favor and find where “glory times” were mentioned.

The point, because you seem to have missed it badly, is that objectively, Nikola Vucevic has been named to the all star team twice in his career. Mohammed Bamba cannot play more than 15 mins per game. NBA drafts are unpredictable. Anyone remember the Wiggins, Parker, Randle draft? How successful have any of those guys been?

Your sarcasm is misplaced.

Point is simple here...Vuc is at his peak now...our young core is not ready to compete yet, Vuc ceiling for carrying a team capped at around a .500 team. It was not going to get any better, so why not have hope for something better and play the 21 year old who might never be good but he is young with some potential.

Who cares if Vuc were the best player in the league if he is not making the team into a winning team. At 30+ you have to get value back for him and move on to potential and hope.

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