Brunson or Ball

[WargamesX]

Who are the available PGs this offseason?

Lonzo (RFA)
Brunson
Gragic
Paul
Lowry
Conley

For trade:
Westbrook?
Rubio?

...Payton

Party Mills
Derrick Rose

[moocow007]

Brunson is an excellent backup PG "slash" 6th man (maybe). I'll go with Lonzo Ball.

PS: Where are you guys that were dead set and adamant that LaMelo Ball wouldn't amount to anything and is nothing more than a bum. You don't have to like the guy or his family or his whatever.

The Knicks already has a guy that can do what Brunson does, his name is Derrick Rose. Not an ideal starting PG. Not someone that is going to necessarily make everyone else better or setup teammates for easy shots but someone that is going to be able to score in a backup role.

[Richard4444]

Who are the available PGs this offseason?

Lonzo (RFA)
Brunson
Gragic
Paul
Lowry
Conley

For trade:
Westbrook?
Rubio?

...Payton

Party Mills
Derrick Rose

Schroder UFA
Spencer PO
Devonte RFA
Monk RFA
Bruce Brown RFA
Nunn RFA


Brunson has a TO next season. If he doesn't get the option picked, he will be a RFA.

[aggo]

path of least resistance:


max schroder
trade some combo of obi/mitch/iq/frps for lavine/beal McCollum


why?

Randle is UFA in '22
RJ is RFA in '23


we need to spend the capspace NOW.

[Jimmit79]

Lonzo is floor general even though he doesn't break down defense he has court vision if Knicks he get him he can be Kidd from 2012 Knicks.

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[Jimmit79]

path of least resistance:


max schroder
trade some combo of obi/mitch/iq/frps for lavine/beal McCollum


why?

Randle is UFA in '22
RJ is RFA in '23


we need to spend the capspace NOW.

I think with current roster construction without all vet min, two way and obi/frank/knox Knicks should have 40 mil to spend by 2023 they will have more with Noah salary erased from cap. If they decide to sign one of Burks Bullocks Noel to MLE they will have more money to spend.

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[Juco24]

Neither is worth the money they're looking for.
I'd rather get Lowry/Conley on a short-term deal and then use one of our 2 first round picks to get a decent PG prospect.
Ayo Dosunmu, Miles McBride, and Jared Butler are all strong prospects and at least 1 of them should be available.

Yep!! Getting Lowry and selecting Butler would simply be perfect imo

[AusKnicksTape]

I think Lonzo is perfect for this team and happy to go somewhere between 18-20 mil for him.

Payton out Lonzo in.

Pelle out, draft picks in.

Those are the only roster changes I’d make next year. Just seeing the guys on the bench even the ones getting next to no minutes, Obi Kev Frank etc - they’re just so hype all the time for the team. That’s culture. They’ve bought in. I think let’s keep them around and see how they can develop with another pre season under Thibs.

[Chanel Bomber]

Depends on what role you want to fill.

Brunson's your guy if you want a quality back-up PG.

Lonzo's your guy if you want a SG who can handle the ball, move the ball, defend and is a streaky shooter. Probably a 7th man on a good team.

Neither is a quality starting point guard.

[AusKnicksTape]

Depends on what role you want to fill.

Brunson's your guy if you want a quality back-up PG.

Lonzo's your guy if you want a SG who can handle the ball, move the ball, defend and is a streaky shooter. Probably a 7th man on a good team.

Neither is a quality starting point guard.

I disagree I think Lonzo is easily a quality starting PG if he can stay healthy. He is also the perfect addition for a future free agent who would want to come in and fit with the team. He’s pass first and makes those around him better. Think what he could do to help players like Obi for example.

Even if I think about 3 players I’d like to see on the Knicks in the future and all 3 of them would fit in a team with Lonzo RJ and Randle - Spida, Lavine or Booker.

Lonzo’s not the franchise player but he’s going to be the perfect fit when we do get that big free agent.

[Chanel Bomber]

Depends on what role you want to fill.

Brunson's your guy if you want a quality back-up PG.

Lonzo's your guy if you want a SG who can handle the ball, move the ball, defend and is a streaky shooter. Probably a 7th man on a good team.

Neither is a quality starting point guard.

I disagree I think Lonzo is easily a quality starting PG if he can stay healthy. He is also the perfect addition for a future free agent who would want to come in and fit with the team. He’s pass first and makes those around him better. Think what he could do to help players like Obi for example.

Even if I think about 3 players I’d like to see on the Knicks in the future and all 3 of them would fit in a team with Lonzo RJ and Randle - Spida, Lavine or Booker.

Lonzo’s not the franchise player but he’s going to be the perfect fit when we do get that big free agent.

The Pelicans have the best roll man in the NBA yet they're unable to run plays for him. There's a reason they're so bad despite having two All-Star forwards. They simply have no point guard play. Yesterday's game was not an aberration (honestly asking, did you watch the game or did you miss it?), Lonzo simply cannot run a halfcourt offense.

Lonzo is pass-first naturally and by default, because he can't score off the dribble. Just because he's unselfish doesn't mean he's a point guard.

[Jeff Van Gully]

Luka will make anybody look good. I like Brunson but he’s starting to get unbelievably overrated.

He’s quite literally the Patty Mills of Point Guards. Pass.

isn't patty mills a... nevermind.

[Deeeez Knicks]

I would still love to get Ball. He struggled shooting in this one, but played good defense (besides that last second shot) and see's the floor well. Ball would be a nice complimentary player that can do a little bit of everything.

He is not an attacker, but Randle and RJ can attack with the starters; bring Rose back off the bench. It all balances each other out. We won't miss Payton's 7 bricks a game at the rim

[duetta]

Ball didn't have a great game but I love to watch him pass. Seriously. Our passing has been so poor since Jason Kidd left the team that it might be worth watching just to see him put the ball in a player's hands with the ability to do something.

[moocow007]

path of least resistance:


max schroder
trade some combo of obi/mitch/iq/frps for lavine/beal McCollum


why?

Randle is UFA in '22
RJ is RFA in '23


we need to spend the capspace NOW.

Exactly. Yeah now definitely is the time to spend and do what it takes to get your "core" guys for the next step up the ladder. Successful top notch teams realize that timing of the additions is almost as critical as the additions themselves. Hopefully Brock Aller will earn his keep.

[moocow007]

Luka will make anybody look good. I like Brunson but he’s starting to get unbelievably overrated.

He’s quite literally the Patty Mills of Point Guards. Pass.

isn't patty mills a... nevermind.

I remember folks were all up in Mills jock and wanted the Knicks to get him to be the PGOTF (point guard of the future) because, hey, if you take him off a team that perfectly focused on his strengths and masked his weaknesses that we can be like that team too.

Brunson is better than Mills but he's not worth imagining as a starting PG for a winning team any more than FVV was last season.

[Signature NYK]

Ball looked bad in this game yes but he'd still be a major upgrade over Payton. Doesn't seem like he's sticking with the Pels so the price probably went down.

Things he brings that we currently lack from our starting PG.

Size - He's 6'6 and can switch onto Sg's on defense which thibs will love

Outside shooting and offensive awareness - It's not just that he shoots better than Payton its that he'll gravitate to a corner three instinctually when he's not with the ball creating space for RJ and Randle (And hopefully Lavine in a year) to operate in halfcourt sets

Pushes the ball up the floor - He'll increase the number of transition buckets we get x10. Rn we're probably the worst transition offense in the NBA. This helps RJ and Mitch SOOO much getting easy baskets in transition pushes RJ to a 20+ ppg scorer.

Courtvision and passing ability/willingness - Zo can freaking pass with hit aheads and in just finding the open man in general much better than Payton tunnel vision having ass

With RJ and Randle you need a PG that can space the floor and doesnt require the ball in his hands to be effective. Zo can be that guy. No he's not perfect and hopefully we keep Rose to keep that dribble penetration and mid range scoring off the bench.

Now all that said theres a couple of other PG's id be fine with over Zo. Lowry, Conley, Schroeder, Brogdan to be precise BUT age wise and cost wise those options still aren't ideal..

I will also say that I make it a point not to watch Mavs games soo I'm not too familiar with Brunson's game but I know hes small. Personally not a big fan of small guards.

Added bonus Zo and Jules are ex teammates and good friends. Chemistry is important

Like I've been saying. Get Lonzo Get Lavine team will flourish. If we can get Lavine in FA Then We'd still have picks/assets to trade for a legit star.

Zo/Rose/IQ
Lavine/Burks/IQ
RJ/Bullok
Randle/Obi??
Mitch/Noel/Taj

[moocow007]

As far as Ball and last night goes? To judge a guy based on one game (good or bad)?

Brandon Ingram looked like he was auditioning for the role originally made famous by Claude Rains (Google it) last night. Does that mean he's trash?

Eric Bledsoe looked terrific last night...shades of what got him the nickname "Mini Lebron". Should we now do whatever it takes to trade for him?

Kira Lewis looked like the Obi of point guards last night. Does that mean a good number of you guys were dead wrong about him being the second coming of De'Aaron Fox (admit it, that's what you guys imagined)?

[Deeeez Knicks]

Depends on what role you want to fill.

Brunson's your guy if you want a quality back-up PG.

Lonzo's your guy if you want a SG who can handle the ball, move the ball, defend and is a streaky shooter. Probably a 7th man on a good team.

Neither is a quality starting point guard.

I disagree I think Lonzo is easily a quality starting PG if he can stay healthy. He is also the perfect addition for a future free agent who would want to come in and fit with the team. He’s pass first and makes those around him better. Think what he could do to help players like Obi for example.

Even if I think about 3 players I’d like to see on the Knicks in the future and all 3 of them would fit in a team with Lonzo RJ and Randle - Spida, Lavine or Booker.

Lonzo’s not the franchise player but he’s going to be the perfect fit when we do get that big free agent.

Thats a big reason I like Ball. If we can bring in one more max cat, he gives us a lot of flexibility in who fits in. Can even pair someone like Lilliard or Curry (I know, a crazt long shot) if they become available.

[duetta]

If Ball works out, and IQ does the necessary work this offseason (and he has to upgrade his drive game), you can plausibly play them together, while moving RJ up to the 3 and bringing Rose off the bench.