Curry V Magic

[iamworthy]

One day people will say Chris Brown is the greatest R&B artist of all time. You gotta just let those people believe that and move on. Curry is in a class of his own, he's a hybrid. He will never be a better PG than magic.

[70sFan]

When I refer to results I don't limit the meaning to just the wins record. Results encompass the surrounding context. For example I didn't conclusively reject the claim Harden>Curry until the 2019 WCSF because of the argument Curry supposedly had the better team which although I didn't really believe I did recognize might have some merit. Harden after having a season that was arguably greater than Jordan's best couldn't close against Curry despite being given a full half head start. He and Paul didn't even play badly. Curry simply blasted by them. Just Curry things.

1. You kept saying that Curry is significantly better player than Harden for years, you didn't enjoy Harden vs Curry debates - at least not on this forum.
2. Curry didn't play that well in the deciding game 6 of 2019 WCSF. For majority of this game he played one of the worst games by superstar I've seen for a while. He went hot at the end, but Warriors were competitive with Curry missing layups and having bad all-around game. Does it mean that Curry's gravity wasn't important? Sure, it was very important - his pressence on the court allowed his teammates to play better. It doesn't make him GOAT though, he's not the only superstar who has such impact without counting boxscore stats.

It's also because of the context of the results that I rate Curry so highly. Curry isn't just having winning results he is setting record results. And he is doing it with what? Draymond Green and Klay Thompson? I wonder as a Spurs fan if you'd rate those two higher than Manu and Parker.

As a Spurs fan, I'd rate 2016 Green higher than any version of Manu and Parker, but prime Green vs prime Manu is close. Parker and Thompson is close, depending on roster structure.

Peak Duncan didn't play with peak Parker or peak Manu though, so this situation isn't the same.

Regarding this year I don't see Curry having weak results at all. He's on a team that was in last place last year. A last place team making it to the playoffs the very next year is a rare occurrence and usually involves a superstar player and more. Knowing that WOWY analysis indicates Wiseman was dragging down the team while he was playing makes Curry's results even more impressive.

Why don't you praise James in Cleveland for the same thing? In 2018 James anchored them to respectable record (better than 2021 Warriors) and in the next year they were the worst in the league. Yet I haven't heard you praising James for that.

I remember you criticizing Kareem for missing playoffs in 1975 even though he got basically identical results as Curry. Right now Warriors aren't even in playoffs, so what's the difference between 1975 Kareem and 2021 Curry?

[70sFan]

Let's put it this way: Curry faced possibly the two closest approximations to Magic and Jordan in this era in Paul and Harden who were playing in concert together and it was still Curry who triumphed.

Why do you think that Curry or Harden is the closest approximation to Magic? Neither of them is even similar stylistically, let alone in terms of impact.

I can also say that Reggie Miller is the closest approximation to Curry in Magic and Jordan era. He won nothing, does it mean that Curry would suck back then?

Of course not, because it's delusional logic.

I don't really care if not many agree with my conclusion right now. They can go join the exposed thread to deny Curry's obvious greatness. I will laugh at them later.

Who exactly denies Curry's greatness? I just called him one of the best offensive players ever and I compared him to Magic (another offensive GOAT candidate). You're extremely sensitive about Curry, that's the only thing that's funny about this discussion.

[BenoUdrihFTL]

They don't allow for real discussion over there only ossified takes.

Weren't you banned because you kept making threads about Curry, while picking a fight with anyone who disagreed with you?

I tried to warn them of the silliness of their takes, how their forum is an echo chamber, and the dubious and spurious way they were conducting one of their projects, but instead of taking my warnings seriously they chose to muzzle. If that's how they handle dissenting opinion then the integrity of the discussion over their is ashes. I wonder how many of those in the "Curry has been totally exposed" thread drew confidence from the conclusions of that ostentatiously erudite forum but learned to their dismay the conclusions drawn there were built upon flimsy matchsticks.

Yikes dude get over yourself

[dhsilv2]

Magics playmaking skills as a 6'8 PG*, and passing ability were comparable to Stephs Shooting and moving off the ball.

They feel like they are very equal in a lot of ways in terms of overall impact.

The thing that Magic has over almost every point guard was the fact that he played Center his rookie season when Kareem went out to win the finals. His body and build were big enough in that ERA.

It's hard comparison, based on Magics MVPs, Championships it's going to be awfully hard for Curry to catch him to get the be the greatest PG of all time.

Curry is #2 on my list now ahead of Oscar.

He started as center for like 2 games and wasn't the center for the majority of the game...that shouldn't matter at all...

[dhsilv2]

I feel it inappropriate and inaccurate for Magic's playmaking skills to be compared to Steph's shooting and off ball skills the way presented in your post and suggesting they are equivalent. That's comparing one aspect of Magic's game to two aspects of Curry's. If that's what you have to do to make Magic look equivalent then it's a stretch. Curry is more skilled.

You can add Magic's post game, which is GOAT level. You can also add his transition game - again, GOAT level.

These two are the most skilled players ever, they just use their skills in much different way.

You think Magic's post game is on par with Shaq???????????????

[GYK]

I’ll say this. Great player. Top 15 all time. Post 2016 he plays like a top 10 candidate. I have been denying the “he changed the game” line as I felt there was other players and teams just as influential in the movement. But with taking a stars worth of shots just from deep that’s absolutely one of a kind. I stand by denying the “unselfish” title. Not that he’s selfish but screen running takes just as much clock as dribbling or any other ball in hand style. It was like calling Shaq unselfish because most of his time is jockeying for post position.
However to bring this sort of fandom he’s undeniably iconic. When posters sound like preachers giving the word you reached a new level of fame. If I’m him I’m dropping the best looking sneakers I got right now. This is a moment.

[dhsilv2]

Weren't you banned because you kept making threads about Curry, while picking a fight with anyone who disagreed with you?

I tried to warn them of the silliness of their takes, how their forum is an echo chamber, and the dubious and spurious way they were conducting one of their projects, but instead of taking my warnings seriously they chose to muzzle. If that's how they handle dissenting opinion then the integrity of the discussion over their is ashes. I wonder how many of those in the "Curry has been totally exposed" thread drew confidence from the conclusions of that ostentatiously erudite forum but learned to their dismay the conclusions drawn there were built upon flimsy matchsticks.

PC Board is the best place for basketball discussion. My opinions are not popular across the board, yet I never had any problems with mods.

Maybe calling everyone wrong and assuming that you are always right, all while worshipping one player 100% time isn't the best way to discuss about basketball..?

Oh they have a mod there who's truly truly god awful. But what can you do. It's by far the best forum on here but it's hard to deal with it when they have a mod there who trolls through modding.

[70sFan]

I feel it inappropriate and inaccurate for Magic's playmaking skills to be compared to Steph's shooting and off ball skills the way presented in your post and suggesting they are equivalent. That's comparing one aspect of Magic's game to two aspects of Curry's. If that's what you have to do to make Magic look equivalent then it's a stretch. Curry is more skilled.

You can add Magic's post game, which is GOAT level. You can also add his transition game - again, GOAT level.

These two are the most skilled players ever, they just use their skills in much different way.

You think Magic's post game is on par with Shaq???????????????

Probably not, but I think the case can be made. 1989-91 Magic's post game was stupidly good, he was GOAT post playmaker and he couldn't be guarded one on one by guard/forward. Of course you can't defend him by big either, because he'd kill him on perimeter.

[70sFan]

I tried to warn them of the silliness of their takes, how their forum is an echo chamber, and the dubious and spurious way they were conducting one of their projects, but instead of taking my warnings seriously they chose to muzzle. If that's how they handle dissenting opinion then the integrity of the discussion over their is ashes. I wonder how many of those in the "Curry has been totally exposed" thread drew confidence from the conclusions of that ostentatiously erudite forum but learned to their dismay the conclusions drawn there were built upon flimsy matchsticks.

PC Board is the best place for basketball discussion. My opinions are not popular across the board, yet I never had any problems with mods.

Maybe calling everyone wrong and assuming that you are always right, all while worshipping one player 100% time isn't the best way to discuss about basketball..?

Oh they have a mod there who's truly truly god awful. But what can you do. It's by far the best forum on here but it's hard to deal with it when they have a mod there who trolls through modding.

Who are you talking about? They have basically 5 active mods and none of them is known for trolling or that is awful.

[Ducksplatt]

Here are some comparisons using numbers and such:

https://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/stephen_curry_vs_magic_johnson.htm

https://basketball.realgm.com/player/Magic-Johnson/Comparison/4618/Stephen-Curry/1600

Of note:
Curry is ahead on Scoring
Magic is ahead on Rebounds, Assists, Steals and Blocks.

[dhsilv2]

You can add Magic's post game, which is GOAT level. You can also add his transition game - again, GOAT level.

These two are the most skilled players ever, they just use their skills in much different way.

You think Magic's post game is on par with Shaq???????????????

Probably not, but I think the case can be made. 1989-91 Magic's post game was stupidly good, he was GOAT post playmaker and he couldn't be guarded one on one by guard/forward. Of course you can't defend him by big either, because he'd kill him on perimeter.

No elite offensive player can be guarded one on one, that's just normal. And he was a GOAT playmaker anywhere, but his scoring the post was imo just good. He just happened to be in an era with less talent.

[70sFan]

You think Magic's post game is on par with Shaq???????????????

Probably not, but I think the case can be made. 1989-91 Magic's post game was stupidly good, he was GOAT post playmaker and he couldn't be guarded one on one by guard/forward. Of course you can't defend him by big either, because he'd kill him on perimeter.

No elite offensive player can be guarded one on one, that's just normal. And he was a GOAT playmaker anywhere, but his scoring the post was imo just good. He just happened to be in an era with less talent.

Magic is GOAT post scorer below 6'9. Only Barkley could compete with him in that aspect.

"Less talented era" argument is always used when you don't have good arguments. I don't see any reason why Magic wouldn't be as effective today in the post as he was.

[dhsilv2]

PC Board is the best place for basketball discussion. My opinions are not popular across the board, yet I never had any problems with mods.

Maybe calling everyone wrong and assuming that you are always right, all while worshipping one player 100% time isn't the best way to discuss about basketball..?

Oh they have a mod there who's truly truly god awful. But what can you do. It's by far the best forum on here but it's hard to deal with it when they have a mod there who trolls through modding.

Who are you talking about? They have basically 5 active mods and none of them is known for trolling or that is awful.

i mean clearly not going to call one out publicly but he's not one who posts much, his modding however imo is often flat out trolling and he baits like crazy with how he does it. I don't have a single person I can think of right now I truly wish anything negative on. Online, famous, or in person...other than this guy. Truly the only person I've ever really had an this level of an issue with. But hey, we move on.

[dhsilv2]

Probably not, but I think the case can be made. 1989-91 Magic's post game was stupidly good, he was GOAT post playmaker and he couldn't be guarded one on one by guard/forward. Of course you can't defend him by big either, because he'd kill him on perimeter.

No elite offensive player can be guarded one on one, that's just normal. And he was a GOAT playmaker anywhere, but his scoring the post was imo just good. He just happened to be in an era with less talent.

Magic is GOAT post scorer below 6'9. Only Barkley could compete with him in that aspect.

"Less talented era" argument is always used when you don't have good arguments. I don't see any reason why Magic wouldn't be as effective today in the post as he was.

Wait what? You think Magic's scrawny butt could be as effective today where you can assault post players and not get called for a foul? And you think Magic is a better post guy than MJ?

[murphyslamz]

I think this is a worthy discussion. I would be tempted to take Curry over Magic in an All time redraft.
Although Magic was 6'8 was he even a better defender than Curry?
Curry's value without the ball>>>>> Magic's value without the ball

[magicsanta]

orange vs apple

[No-more-rings]

Magic pretty easily.

[OdomFan]

Maybe calling everyone wrong and assuming that you are always right, all while worshipping one player 100% time isn't the best way to discuss about basketball..?

Should Curry ever universally become considered the greatest basketball player ever I will take great delight and satisfaction in knowing I recognized his greatness while a forum supposedly full of learned basketball aficionados devoted to basketball discussion that does nothing but endlessly compare and rank basketball players completely missed the boat.

That will never happen. Mainly because theirs too many elite players who've been elite on offense as well as defense. Unlike Curry.

[ATRAIN53]

Intersting comparison, I'd say best players of their era.

everyone loved Magic when he came into the NBA. He was charasmatic, ushered in a new era of Showtime ball in LA
it was magic

Curry took a few years to get it going and then it has really taken me a good decade to apprecite him. The Warriors went from 'fun' to 'smug' pretty quick and they were more fun to root against - vs cheering for either BOS or the Lakers when Magic was playing.

Here are some comparisons using numbers and such:

https://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/stephen_curry_vs_magic_johnson.htm

https://basketball.realgm.com/player/Magic-Johnson/Comparison/4618/Stephen-Curry/1600

Of note:
Curry is ahead on Scoring
Magic is ahead on Rebounds, Assists, Steals and Blocks.

How about this stat-
Magic 906 games - 1,076 3 point attempts
Curry 750 games - 6,342 3 point attempts

that's insane!

Curry will probaly take over 10,000 3's and be the Best at it - EVER.
We''ll never see a shooter this good, enjoy him while you can.