Trade Talk (Part Six)

Neeva · Post #1481 » by **Neeva** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 5:17 am

Toppins is a bust..

Note30 · Post #1482 » by **Note30** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 5:43 am

Worm Guts wrote:
Note30 wrote:
Worm Guts wrote:
He’s declining, we’re already up against the lux, and he’s not a difference maker anymore (despite averaging a triple double)

He hasn't shown any signs of decline. I've been watching him. If we sign anyone else well also hit the tax. Whether he's a difference maker or not is up to debate, but I'd say he's exactly what the Wolves need. A playoff veteran star PG that's a good teammate. He'll bail the Wolves out. We don't have any of that right now.

He makes us one large step closer to a playoff team.

If we keep our pick we will have enough firepower to make the playoffs

Thats more than I can say about any of our PGs.

I don’t watch him but his advanced stats show decline, his current team isn’t good despite having another all-star, and his salary leaves no margin for error.

I don't know about his advanced stats in relation to the team he's on now.

That team has a lot of issues not named Russell Westbrook.

The way I see it we could use a proven star, given that the only one we ever had post KG has been Jimmy Butler.

If we can get him for cheap why not? Worse case situation it's two more years of suckage. Which let's face it, is probably the bare minimum at this point.

We're not magically going to be better but at least Westbrook is better than our current cast of PGs.

Neeva · Post #1483 » by **Neeva** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:08 am

If westbrook and Beal can’t get you close to the playoffs in the east what makes you think he can give us a winning culture??

Norseman79 · Post #1484 » by **Norseman79** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:24 pm

Would Beasley, Rubio and the #1 overall get us Ben Simmons?? (I know we cannot trade the pick, but we can draft the player Phili wants and trade the player).

I know many of us are hung up on getting Simmons....just seems like the perfect fit between Mcdaniels and Kat

jpatrick · Post #1485 » by **jpatrick** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:33 pm

Norseman79 wrote:Would Beasley, Rubio and the #1 overall get us Ben Simmons?? (I know we cannot trade the pick, but we can draft the player Phili wants and trade the player).

I know many of us are hung up on getting Simmons....just seems like the perfect fit between Mcdaniels and Kat

I think it might. Depends on how Philly does in the playoffs this year. But would we do that? Maybe. Simmons is a complete non-shooter. Much worse in that regard than even Rubio/Okogie. Thus, he’s a liability unless you run your offense through him. Are we willing to give up Beasley/#1 for a guy that we have to take the ball out of KATs/Edwards hands for? Maybe. I’m not sure. Defensively the fit is incredible. He may be the best defensive player in the league.

Note30 · Post #1486 » by **Note30** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:37 pm

Neeva wrote:If westbrook and Beal can’t get you close to the playoffs in the east what makes you think he can give us a winning culture??

Yeah... Boil it down to the one season and the worst supporting class ever.

Ignore the fact that he's single handedly carried every team he's been on.

He's one year removed from the best statistical year he's ever had.

Westbrook - X
Edwards - Beasley
McDaniels - Okogie
JJJ - Juancho
Towns - Reid

Assuming we get the pick we should trade for Jaren Jackson Jr if we could get him tor the pick great.

That's a playoff team no questions asked.
Just need a decent defensive backup PG and it's playoffs next season.

Aaron Holiday would be a decent choice for back up PG, really any decent defender who can set up Beasley and the other guys.

Post #1487 » by **Worm Guts** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:43 pm

Note30 wrote:
Neeva wrote:If westbrook and Beal can’t get you close to the playoffs in the east what makes you think he can give us a winning culture??

Yeah... Boil it down to the one season and the worst supporting class ever.

Ignore the fact that he's single handedly carried every team he's been on.

He's one year removed from the best statistical year he's ever had.

His best year was 16-17, statistically he hasn't been close since. Houston essentially dumped him after 1 season.

Since his MVP year his numbers have dropped:
VORP: 9.3 to 1.9
BPM: 11.1 to 2.2
Win Shares/48: .224 to .042
PER: 30.6 to 18.3

It's really pretty dramatic.

jpatrick · Post #1488 » by **jpatrick** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:34 pm

Worm Guts wrote:
Note30 wrote:
Neeva wrote:If westbrook and Beal can’t get you close to the playoffs in the east what makes you think he can give us a winning culture??

Yeah... Boil it down to the one season and the worst supporting class ever.

Ignore the fact that he's single handedly carried every team he's been on.

He's one year removed from the best statistical year he's ever had.

His best year was 16-17, statistically he hasn't been close since. Houston essentially dumped him after 1 season.

Since his MVP year his numbers have dropped:
VORP: 9.3 to 1.9
BPM: 11.1 to 2.2
Win Shares/48: .224 to .042
PER: 30.6 to 18.3

It's really pretty dramatic.

Westbrook is a high floor player. With him, he elevates your floor because he plays as a one man team essentially. However, his style will NEVER be conducive to a highly successful team. Durant couldn't wait to get away from him. And those OKC teams, that was Durant carrying them. Every time Durant (or even Harden for that matter) didn't touch the ball on a possession because Westbrook jacked up a shot, was a possession that wasn't as efficient as it should have been.

There is a reason he was traded for Wall, it was two of the worst contracts in the league being traded for one another.

shrink · Post #1489 » by **shrink** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 9:42 pm

Westbrook is already 32, and his game relies on his athleticism. He’s owed $43 and $47 mil for 2021-22, and 22-23.

karch34 · Post #1490 » by **karch34** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:47 pm

zimpy27 wrote:Or if you get a top 3 pick this year - Rubio, Juancho, Culver, pick 1-3 for Simmons?

Tried to respond to this yesterday but had issues. I'd do that in a heartbeat, but I don't think the pick is enough to move Rosas' 3 biggest mistakes for an All Star.

Neeva · Post #1491 » by **Neeva** » Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:49 pm

Simmons is overated.

Post #1492 » by **Klomp** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 12:14 am

IceManBK1 wrote:Dlo for Toppins, quickley and mitch.. Who says no..

I do. That's gross.

Wolveswin · Post #1493 » by **Wolveswin** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:55 am

Klomp wrote:
IceManBK1 wrote:Dlo for Toppins, quickley and mitch.. Who says no..

I do. That's gross.

For the Knicks. Put that in TNT board, it will be a warning for posting unrealistic offers.

MPLS_Wolves · Post #1494 » by **MPLS_Wolves** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 1:59 pm

Neeva wrote:Simmons is overated.

.
No he isn't. He is a top 5 defender in the league (arguably top 3) and a terrific fit with the core of this team. He is a clear-cut top 25 guy in the most talented time in NBA History. You pray and hope your top 3 pick becomes as good as Simmons.

The real question is why does Philly trade Simmons for a top 3 pick and table scraps when they are competing for a title? Makes absolutely no sense. They didn't bring in Doc Rivers to trade their 2nd best player and get worse around an MVP candidate in Embiid.

jpatrick · Post #1495 » by **jpatrick** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:20 pm

MPLS_Wolves wrote:
Neeva wrote:Simmons is overated.

.
No he isn't. He is a top 5 defender in the league (arguably top 3) and a terrific fit with the core of this team. He is a clear-cut top 25 guy in the most talented time in NBA History. You pray and hope your top 3 pick becomes as good as Simmons.

The real question is why does Philly trade Simmons for a top 3 pick and table scraps when they are competing for a title? Makes absolutely no sense. They didn't bring in Doc Rivers to trade their 2nd best player and get worse around an MVP candidate in Embiid.

I don’t watch a lot of Philly, but a lot of people think you can’t win in the modern NBA when your best player refuses to shoot outside three feet. Especially when said player is a perimeter guy.

This is especially troublesome when your MVP candidate (Embiid) works best close to the basket. Simmons man essentially becomes a free safety because the defense knows Simmons refuses to shoot. Not that he will just miss but flat out refuses to shoot.

There is also the concerns that he hasn’t improved offensively at all while in the NBA. I think Philly may see what offers are out there if they flame out early in the playoffs. If they make it to the finals, no chance.

That said, would I traded Suggs, Beasley, Rubio, and filler for him? Maybe. Probably actually. But that’s based much more on his defensive profile than what he would do for us offensively.

Post #1496 » by **Worm Guts** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:30 pm

Still, if Philly was looking to trade Simmons I don't think it would be for a rebuilding package. Not when they are this competitive.

TaylorTag · Post #1497 » by **TaylorTag** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:17 pm

If the Pelicans let Ball go, which seems likely, could they be a destination for Rubio? They have the cap space and would have a need for a PG

TaylorTag · Post #1498 » by **TaylorTag** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:28 pm

Also wonder if the Spurs would be a good trade destination for Juancho.. I could see him fitting in well in that San Antonio offense. They also have like zero forwards on the books next season

Krapinsky · Post #1499 » by **Krapinsky** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:31 pm

MPLSwolves wrote:If the Pelicans let Ball go, which seems likely, could they be a destination for Rubio? They have the cap space and would have a need for a PG

I think any Rubio destination would see him as an expiring contract and not as a starting PG.

TaylorTag · Post #1500 » by **TaylorTag** » Thu Apr 22, 2021 4:32 pm

Krapinsky wrote:
MPLSwolves wrote:If the Pelicans let Ball go, which seems likely, could they be a destination for Rubio? They have the cap space and would have a need for a PG

I think any Rubio destination would see him as an expiring contract and not as a starting PG.

For sure. Helps if Rubio can fill a roll before he is moved at the deadline though