Jeff VanGundy: "Now comes the hard part".

[Oscirus]

I think we're going to make a trade this off season with our draft picks and Obi. We're obviously going to extend Julius Randle so there's no place for Obi on this team. He's way to scrawny to play center even in a small ball lineup.

Randle aint playing 48 miutes and obis cheap. Unless theres a blockbuster deal out there to be made, I suspect Obi will be a knick next season.

[HarthorneWingo]

I think we're going to make a trade this off season with our draft picks and Obi. We're obviously going to extend Julius Randle so there's no place for Obi on this team. He's way to scrawny to play center even in a small ball lineup.

Randle aint playing 48 miutes and obis cheap. Unless theres a blockbuster deal out there to be made, I suspect Obi will be a knick next season.

Most backup PFs who only play about 8-10 a game are cheap.

[thebuzzardman]

Keep RJ & Randle. Sign a guy like Lonzo even if it's a S&T. Then consolidate assets for a 3rd wheel all-star. That gives you four competent, young players. Then see if guys like Rose, Bullock, and Noel are willing to stick around on fair deals 1-2 year deals.

Not sure who that 3rd wheel could be... Lavine? KAT? (not a huge fan of the fit)... sounds like WASH may keep Beal/Westbrook together another season. Maybe Dame Dolla?

Rose is an ABSOLUTE keeper, especially if Lonzo is signed, since Lonzo is allergic to driving the paint except of a fast break.

Again, I don't mind Lonzo, as long as people get that he needs another creative wing on the team, which RJ isn't - yet.
But, if people see the Lonzo move as a move for 2 years from now, when RJ IS that creative wing, but also as an iterative step where maybe the Knicks later add Lavine or Mitchell etc etc, then I don't mind Lonzo as an iterative step that doesn't really make the Knicks that much better, right away.

Knicks are still two years away. Only it's two years away - the right kind of two years - from being a team that is a threat to go deep in the playoffs every year for next 5 years.

[thebuzzardman]

Any trade that will happen for the Knicks is going to revolve around their excess of picks.

Is there a blockbuster trade that fits that? Probably not. Since they only have a handful of "good" young players to put in any trade and we'd assume RJ is a keeper. That narrows a trade down to IQ and Mitch and picks - feels unlikely, but again, it's going to be about some combination (if it happens) of "star complaining away from team" and that team wanting to move on, get under the cap, and get picks back.

Knicks can offer 4 decent picks up at the moment - Dallas 2021 and 23, their own 22 and that Detroit 2nd rounder 2021.
Note "decent" and not "good/great"

They should probably make that iterative move at PG with Lonzo or Schroeder, hold the picks and $ and then look to deal at next year's deadline or target 22 FA, but who knows. WWW/Leon might surprise.

[cgf]

I think we're going to make a trade this off season with our draft picks and Obi. We're obviously going to extend Julius Randle so there's no place for Obi on this team. He's way to scrawny to play center even in a small ball lineup.

Randle aint playing 48 miutes and obis cheap. Unless theres a blockbuster deal out there to be made, I suspect Obi will be a knick next season.

Most backup PFs who only play about 8-10 a game are cheap.

If Obi is always just a backup 4, then yeah he'll have a tough path to more than the 12-15 minutes he's getting now...but if Obi can learn from Taj and eventually get minutes as a smallball-5, then the road to 25-30 minutes a game next to both Mitch & Juliu, will open up for him. Obi has the tools and seems like he has the work ethic, so let's see if he can figure it out.

[DaGawd]

The way these playoffs shake out will be important for our prospects of adding a marquee name. If one of the Rams that have one bomb out bad you never know..

[cgmw]

Randle aint playing 48 miutes and obis cheap. Unless theres a blockbuster deal out there to be made, I suspect Obi will be a knick next season.

Most backup PFs who only play about 8-10 a game are cheap.

If Obi is always just a backup 4, then yeah he'll have a tough path to more than the 12-15 minutes he's getting now...but if Obi can learn from Taj and eventually get minutes as a smallball-5, then the road to 25-30 minutes a game next to both Mitch & Juliu, will open up for him. Obi has the tools and seems like he has the work ethic, so let's see if he can figure it out.

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars or at least more reliable/valuable right now than the veteran in front of them.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 8-10 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

[cgf]

Most backup PFs who only play about 8-10 a game are cheap.

If Obi is always just a backup 4, then yeah he'll have a tough path to more than the 12-15 minutes he's getting now...but if Obi can learn from Taj and eventually get minutes as a smallball-5, then the road to 25-30 minutes a game next to both Mitch & Juliu, will open up for him. Obi has the tools and seems like he has the work ethic, so let's see if he can figure it out.

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 12 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

[ophdog]

as far as I am concerned a first round win would be like a championship for this team. We flat out was expected to be one of if not the worst team in the league. Anything more than a first round win and a movie is getting made

[cgmw]

If Obi is always just a backup 4, then yeah he'll have a tough path to more than the 12-15 minutes he's getting now...but if Obi can learn from Taj and eventually get minutes as a smallball-5, then the road to 25-30 minutes a game next to both Mitch & Juliu, will open up for him. Obi has the tools and seems like he has the work ethic, so let's see if he can figure it out.

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 12 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

He’ll get PT behind an All-NBA Ironman playing 39 mpg?

Ok.

Obi is the same as Kevin and Frank. People just don’t want to admit it yet. He simply won’t have the opportunity to develop here.

[cgf]

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 12 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

He’ll get PT behind an All-NBA Ironman playing 39 mpg?

Ok.

Obi is the same as Kevin and Frank. People just don’t want to admit it yet.

37 is less than 48...11 less, in fact. So yes, even if Julius continues to play insane minutes next year, Obi will get some PT. Will he get a lot? Not unless he improves enough to get into the mix at the 5...which he'll need to do to carve out a long-term role here.

And Obi might end up the same as them, but by definition, he isn't yet. He's a) just a rookie and b) actually in the rotation. So the coaching staff can't just pretend that he already is another Knox/Ntilikina; especially not if he improves next season.

But hey, there's nothing this fanbase loves more than rushing to judgement off limited sample sizes; so don't let me stop you

[HarthorneWingo]

If Obi is always just a backup 4, then yeah he'll have a tough path to more than the 12-15 minutes he's getting now...but if Obi can learn from Taj and eventually get minutes as a smallball-5, then the road to 25-30 minutes a game next to both Mitch & Juliu, will open up for him. Obi has the tools and seems like he has the work ethic, so let's see if he can figure it out.

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 12 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

Take Taj’s spot? I don’t see that ever happening. Obi doesn’t possess any of the attributes that Taj has nor does have any of the strength and power Taj possesses underneath.

[cgmw]

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

He’ll get PT behind an All-NBA Ironman playing 39 mpg?

Ok.

Obi is the same as Kevin and Frank. People just don’t want to admit it yet.

37 is less than 48...11 less, in fact. So yes, even if Julius continues to play insane minutes next year, Obi will get some PT. Will he get a lot? Not unless he improves enough to get into the mix at the 5...which he'll need to do to carve out a long-term role here.

And Obi might end up the same as them, but by definition, he isn't yet. He's a) just a rookie and b) actually in the rotation. So the coaching staff can't just pretend that he already is another Knox/Ntilikina; especially not if he improves next season.

But hey, there's nothing this fanbase loves more than rushing to judgement off limited sample sizes; so don't let me stop you

I’m not judging Obi.

I’m judging the Knicks. Thibs isn’t playing a non-center at C. Leon/Perry aren’t trading Randle. Obi has little/no chance here.

And that’s neither controversial nor judgmental. To me, it’s the same thing that happened to Knox and Frank except that Obi is stuck behind an immovable object, whereas our other two 8-9 picks were only up against MSG’s garden variety middling veterans. All three would be better off elsewhere.

[cgf]

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 12 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

Take Taj’s spot? I don’t see that ever happening. Obi doesn’t possess any of the attributes that Taj has nor does have any of the strength and power Taj possesses underneath.

Obi has a similar frame to Taj and is as quick as Taj was in his prime; he just needs to fill that frame...which he's only had for 3 years now...out so he can have the strength to play that game. But Taj isn't just out there Shaq'ing through people, there's a lot of his game that Obi could learn while he's building up the strength to become a viable smallball 5 option.

If he does put some muscle on those legs, he'll have all of the tools to play that Taj game on D, only with better length & springiness...and if he's to carve out a role on this team, becoming a viable smallball-5 is going to have to be part of it cause that he at least has the tools to someday do; whereas he's never going to be able to defend down on the perimeter.

[br7knicks]

A first round series win is likely, depending on if they maintain the fourth seed, and everyone is healthy.

A second round win is plausible, but unlikely, if it's against one of the big 3.

They might win a game or two, but I doubt the series.

For a series victory, the Knicks would have to be completely healthy, and one of those big name guys would have to go down. Not saying I want it to happen, but that's likely what it would take to make ECF

[cgf]

He’ll get PT behind an All-NBA Ironman playing 39 mpg?

Ok.

Obi is the same as Kevin and Frank. People just don’t want to admit it yet.

37 is less than 48...11 less, in fact. So yes, even if Julius continues to play insane minutes next year, Obi will get some PT. Will he get a lot? Not unless he improves enough to get into the mix at the 5...which he'll need to do to carve out a long-term role here.

And Obi might end up the same as them, but by definition, he isn't yet. He's a) just a rookie and b) actually in the rotation. So the coaching staff can't just pretend that he already is another Knox/Ntilikina; especially not if he improves next season.

But hey, there's nothing this fanbase loves more than rushing to judgement off limited sample sizes; so don't let me stop you

I’m not judging Obi.

I’m judging the Knicks. Thibs isn’t playing a non-center at C. Leon/Perry aren’t trading Randle. Obi has little/no chance here.

And that’s neither controversial nor judgmental. To me, it’s the same thing that happened to Knox and Frank except that Obi is stuck behind an immovable object, whereas our other two 8-9 picks were only up against MSG’s garden variety middling veterans. All three would be better off elsewhere.

Thibs has already tried Obi & Julius together, so it's not unprecedented, and Thibs has no qualms playing a smallball 5 like Gibson. Why wouldn't he try Obi & Julius together again if somebody tells Obi about leg day this summer + he can learn enough of the positional stuff Taj does to become a good defender?

[cgf]

A first round series win is likely, depending on if they maintain the fourth seed, and everyone is healthy.

A second round win is plausible, but unlikely, if it's against one of the big 3.

They might win a game or two, but I doubt the series.

For a series victory, the Knicks would have to be completely healthy, and one of those big name guys would have to go down. Not saying I want it to happen, but that's likely what it would take to make ECF

That, or Philly s****ing the bed in round 1 after going all out to get the #1 seed & avoid Brooklyn/Milwaukee until the conference finals

[cgmw]

37 is less than 48...11 less, in fact. So yes, even if Julius continues to play insane minutes next year, Obi will get some PT. Will he get a lot? Not unless he improves enough to get into the mix at the 5...which he'll need to do to carve out a long-term role here.

And Obi might end up the same as them, but by definition, he isn't yet. He's a) just a rookie and b) actually in the rotation. So the coaching staff can't just pretend that he already is another Knox/Ntilikina; especially not if he improves next season.

But hey, there's nothing this fanbase loves more than rushing to judgement off limited sample sizes; so don't let me stop you

I’m not judging Obi.

I’m judging the Knicks. Thibs isn’t playing a non-center at C. Leon/Perry aren’t trading Randle. Obi has little/no chance here.

And that’s neither controversial nor judgmental. To me, it’s the same thing that happened to Knox and Frank except that Obi is stuck behind an immovable object, whereas our other two 8-9 picks were only up against MSG’s garden variety middling veterans. All three would be better off elsewhere.

Thibs has already tried Obi & Julius together, so it's not unprecedented, and Thibs has no qualms playing a smallball 5 like Gibson. Why wouldn't he try Obi & Julius together again if somebody tells Obi about leg day this summer + he can learn enough of the positional stuff Taj does to become a good defender?

Idk man, sixteen season Taj sure looks like a center to me.

Anyway these are luxury problems for the Knicks. I’m rooting for Obi, but nobody should be shocked if Leon picks up a veteran backup PF this summer. Unless they trade Mitch, hard to see Obi factoring into the future at C. Maybe but like i said, luxury problems. Obi should get traded to Cleveland so he actually has a chance.

[Zenzibar]

Obi. Kevin, and Frank’s only chance is if they ball the F out in limited minutes to show they are basically potential All Stars.

Burks, Bullock, Payton, Taj, and Noel all got playing time and opportunity in their first 3 seasons in the league, which helped them develop into the veteran role players we see today.

I’m not judging because the proof is in the 4 seed pudding, but the Knicks have taken a different track. They expect rookie contract players to be better than seasoned veterans right now.

Obi is getting the benefit of being Leon’s pick because he never acquired another backup 4. We’ll see how long that lasts, but it’s hard to see how he gets more than 12 mpg barring a Randle injury. Because Thibs sure as sh*t isn’t playing either one of them at the 5.

Can't lump Obi in with Kevin & Frank, he may get a senior-citizen discount, but he's still a rookie. As long as he keeps playing hard, he'll get PT behind Julius at the very least...whether he can start getting minutes as a small-ball 5 or not, is on how much he improves.

And it wouldn't be all that shocking if he claimed Taj's spot as our 3rd string C, for himself; if not over this coming summer then over the course of the following season.

He’ll get PT behind an All-NBA Ironman playing 39 mpg?

Ok.

Obi is the same as Kevin and Frank. People just don’t want to admit it yet. He simply won’t have the opportunity to develop here.

Have to wholeheartedly disagree with Obi's development comment.
What was the biggest concern regarding Obi? Wasn't it his defense?

Seems to me that as the season has progressed the young man's defensive game has, not just a little, but tremendously improved.
Obi's board game is really strong right now and that second unit outscores the other bench by twice most nights.
That has to be credited not only to DRose and IQ's scoring, but Obi holding it down next to Taj.

Obi wasn't ready to contribute to a contender but is flourishing in a winning situation under this staff.

IMO, any young player coming through this new Knicks coaching program is worth more than some of you are giving.
Some colleges produce more stars than others and I feel the Knicks staff will be producing just that.

Thoughts?

[Zenzibar]

He’ll get PT behind an All-NBA Ironman playing 39 mpg?

Ok.

Obi is the same as Kevin and Frank. People just don’t want to admit it yet.

37 is less than 48...11 less, in fact. So yes, even if Julius continues to play insane minutes next year, Obi will get some PT. Will he get a lot? Not unless he improves enough to get into the mix at the 5...which he'll need to do to carve out a long-term role here.

And Obi might end up the same as them, but by definition, he isn't yet. He's a) just a rookie and b) actually in the rotation. So the coaching staff can't just pretend that he already is another Knox/Ntilikina; especially not if he improves next season.

But hey, there's nothing this fanbase loves more than rushing to judgement off limited sample sizes; so don't let me stop you

I’m not judging Obi.

I’m judging the Knicks. Thibs isn’t playing a non-center at C. Leon/Perry aren’t trading Randle. Obi has little/no chance here.

And that’s neither controversial nor judgmental. To me, it’s the same thing that happened to Knox and Frank except that Obi is stuck behind an immovable object, whereas our other two 8-9 picks were only up against MSG’s garden variety middling veterans. All three would be better off elsewhere.

Bro, your post is crazy confusing. Why do you care about these young dudes?
It appears that Obi and IQ love it here and Knox needs that work under Payne's tutelage.
Why get some old get off the bench when we have young legs on the cheap right now?