Draft Thread Part 2

[Mark_83]

I love this metric ShotQuality which I posted stats for last year. I was looking forward to seeing their stats wings. The most interesting is the one for high quality shot creation for unassisted attempts. Moody is ranked very high and that is excellent to see when you hear the knock on him is not being able to create his own shot.

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Read on Twitter

The caveat with this type of stat is it is based on on what is the highest quality shot for that particular player. Moody rates really high because he takes the same type of high efficiency shot for him that put his team in a good position to get a score. He is the guy who plays within himself. Wagner and Duarte also had impressive numbers which speaks to their own IQ and efficiency.

The guy I have to dig more into is Terrence Shannon Jr. He is probably more athletic than Bouknight (14 dunks last season), plays in the crazy uptempo Texas Tech offense and has a 44.4 FTr which is Harden-esque, also has a 2.5 Steal% which is really good. He is a guy I think the Raps might be interested in for his event creation upside.

Spoiler:

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I really like what I've seen from Duarte. He has such a smooth and quick release. The guy is shooting 44% on shots off the dribble, which is a great skill. He'd look great in our rotation. Wish we had a late first to take him. We know Masai isn't scared to take older players.

[Mark_83]

How does Barnes compare to the current version of Thad Young?
I’ve never seen him play but the toolkit sounds similar to the Thad and his newfound playmaking.

I've never known Young to be elite defensively, which Barnes is at the college level and projects to be in the NBA. I would also say that Barnes is significantly better as a playmaker, he's already making advanced reads as a ball handler. He's nowhere near the scorer that Young is, his 3pt shot is spotty at best and he has zero mid range game, which Young is famous for. Barnes is more like Draymond Green with, in my opinion, some Giannis in his game.

I don't think Barnes has the vertical of Green. Basically, they are two different type of players. Barnes uses his length and size with knowledge of plays, while Green uses his athleticism.

https://sportsworld.nbcsports.com/draymond-green-warriors-michigan-state-tom-izzo/

"Green displayed uninspiring athleticism at the draft combine, finishing 48th out of 55 players in standing vertical jump and in the the bottom half in sprint speed."

[sycammer]

I haven't read the thread, but with the way the Raptors have played this season & lost many close games or let the close games slip away in the last 3/4 mins during regulation time, it's evidently clear we badly need a finisher.

we need can go small ball, which is great but we are lacking size in the SG Position, by which we cant play the normal way.

The raptors are going for SG/SF

[Jstock12]

I love this metric ShotQuality which I posted stats for last year. I was looking forward to seeing their stats wings. The most interesting is the one for high quality shot creation for unassisted attempts. Moody is ranked very high and that is excellent to see when you hear the knock on him is not being able to create his own shot.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

The caveat with this type of stat is it is based on on what is the highest quality shot for that particular player. Moody rates really high because he takes the same type of high efficiency shot for him that put his team in a good position to get a score. He is the guy who plays within himself. Wagner and Duarte also had impressive numbers which speaks to their own IQ and efficiency.

The guy I have to dig more into is Terrence Shannon Jr. He is probably more athletic than Bouknight (14 dunks last season), plays in the crazy uptempo Texas Tech offense and has a 44.4 FTr which is Harden-esque, also has a 2.5 Steal% which is really good. He is a guy I think the Raps might be interested in for his event creation upside.

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

Are there stats like these for international prospects?

[ATLTimekeeper]

He's one of the safer picks in that range. My only concern with him is his lack of burst. Defense, shooting, BBIQ, strength, toughness, he possess all of these traits in spades. If he's there I could see the Raptors taking him. If Jakob Poeltl taught me anything, it's that the FO will be safe when selecting in the lottery, and go for an upside/potential guy in the second round.

I still think of him as an upside pick. He's 18. He's more than a full year younger than Suggs, who has some of the same question marks and will be going top 5. He's going to be someone that has to rely on craft, strength and ballhandling and decision-making, (like Brogdan, FVV, Jimmy Butler, Luka) rather than someone that torches guys off a quick first step.

But yeah, the Poeltl pick was a great example of the Raptors not taking the bust bait in Marquis Chriss. I think people here were jonesing on Wade Baldwin, too, because of his athleticism. And of course, Skal and Deyonta Davis were both thought to be in play for our lotto pick at the time. People here were livid when we passed on both of them for Pascal.

[Mark_83]

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[Reeko]

He's one of the safer picks in that range. My only concern with him is his lack of burst. Defense, shooting, BBIQ, strength, toughness, he possess all of these traits in spades. If he's there I could see the Raptors taking him. If Jakob Poeltl taught me anything, it's that the FO will be safe when selecting in the lottery, and go for an upside/potential guy in the second round.

I still think of him as an upside pick. He's 18. He's more than a full year younger than Suggs, who has some of the same question marks and will be going top 5. He's going to be someone that has to rely on craft, strength and ballhandling and decision-making, (like Brogdan, FVV, Jimmy Butler, Luka) rather than someone that torches guys off a quick first step.

But yeah, the Poeltl pick was a great example of the Raptors not taking the bust bait in Marquis Chriss. I think people here were jonesing on Wade Baldwin, too, because of his athleticism. And of course, Skal and Deyonta Davis were both thought to be in play for our lotto pick at the time. People here were livid when we passed on both of them for Pascal.

He's definitely got upside, but his floor is fairly high in comparison to some other players.

Personally I was hoping for Sabonis the year we picked Poeltl, and I was really disappointed that we didn't get him. When we selected Pascal I was screaming "WHo? WHO? WHO??!!!", lol like so many of us here I had no idea who Pascal was.

[OAKLEY_2]

Pretty much #6 and #7 would be Keon Johnson and Scottie Barnes in no particular order. Their potential seems to be higher.

I think the Draft Measurement may have a big or two rise up to #8, so perhaps we have few options outside of Keon and Barnes.

The ringer seems to be low on Barnes (11th) and Moody (16) than most.

Maybe they value shooting and team fits.
I also question if Davion Mitchell only links to the Raptors for being higher on the draft. I wonder what are the other teams will take him over some of the high ceiling prospects in the top 10.

You'll find out when another team takes him 6th or 7th. You can talk Keon Johnson because he likely will there for us but Mitchell is getting picked before Keon. I think Moody is a better prospect than Keon Johnson as well. I likely have Moody as Mitchell fall back.

[Morse Code]

I want Kuminga on this team so bad, sigh.

[DAcReator]

Just curious as to what the insight/thoughts on Josh Christopher? Im sure he was talked about but too lazy to dig in lol

[Psubs]

I want Kuminga on this team so bad, sigh.

Watch on YouTube

Hopefully is so-so stats in the G-League have scouts looking at Davion Mitchell, Scottie Barnes, Keon Johnson or Jalen Johnson slipping ahead of Kuminga.

I think bringing Kuminga along slowly with our depth will help him a lot.

Kuminga has better guard skills than OG but I love how he also has the power in his hops to 2 hand dunk off 1 step from standstill. I don't think Jalen Johnson can do that, I see him laying it up on those.

[Indeed]

I haven't read the thread, but with the way the Raptors have played this season & lost many close games or let the close games slip away in the last 3/4 mins during regulation time, it's evidently clear we badly need a finisher.

we need can go small ball, which is great but we are lacking size in the SG Position, by which we cant play the normal way.

The raptors are going for SG/SF

I think we need a creator / playmaker instead of finisher.
Not that we aren't finishing in close game, but we are more taking bad shots. The SG spot is best to fill a playmaker, replacement of Lowry.

As for the SG/SF, it is a concern, but more with the bench. We may need to upgrade Johnson with a 3&D, unless Watanabe can improve his 3 point shooting. Not seeing any 3&D in FA, and Brissett is gone, drafting one from our 2nd round may make sense:
Trey Murphy III
Kessler Edwards
Terrence Shannon, Jr.
Scottie Lewis
John Petty, Jr.
Herb Jones (small sample size on 3)
Raiquan Gray (small sample size on 3)
Ron Harper Jr.
Chris Smith (undraft?)

Assume this is our off season plan, we may expect a 2nd pick to contribute right away, and an undraft spot is available if we have Harris on the regular contract:
Birch/FA/Gillespie
Siakam/Boucher/2nd
OG/Bembry/Watanabe
Trent/1st/Watson
VanVleet/Flynn/Harris

2-way: 2nd, Undraft

[Psubs]

Just curious as to what the insight/thoughts on Josh Christopher? Im sure he was talked about but too lazy to dig in lol

Really raw but has skills similar to James Harden (also from ASU). He has enough swag to make him at least a rotational player even if inefficient. He should turn pro and avoid any more possible serious injuries and maybe at least be as productive as a Kevin Porter Jr.

Is it weird that maybe colleges recruit similar players? Like Kai Jones and Myles Turner in Texas, Charles Bassey and Mitchell Robinson from Western Kentucky. Coaches may have a type that suits their style of play.

[Morse Code]

I want Kuminga on this team so bad, sigh.

Watch on YouTube

Hopefully is so-so stats in the G-League have scouts looking at Davion Mitchell, Scottie Barnes, Keon Johnson or Jalen Johnson slipping ahead of Kuminga.

I think bringing Kuminga along slowly with our depth will help him a lot.

Kuminga has better guard skills than OG but I love how he also has the power in his hops to 2 hand dunk off 1 step from standstill. I don't think Jalen Johnson can do that, I see him laying it up on those.

Yeah, stats be damned when judging Kuminga. He needs development. He’s one of those prospects you just need to watch to see the potential. I think you’re right too, if we brought him along slowly he would develop so well. Need some other guys to take big leaps in workouts and whatnot and maybe Kuminga falls far enough or we trade up.

[anotherhomer]

kuminga has no jmper....really raw prospect

[Psubs]

I haven't read the thread, but with the way the Raptors have played this season & lost many close games or let the close games slip away in the last 3/4 mins during regulation time, it's evidently clear we badly need a finisher.

we need can go small ball, which is great but we are lacking size in the SG Position, by which we cant play the normal way.

The raptors are going for SG/SF

I think we need a creator / playmaker instead of finisher.
Not that we aren't finishing in close game, but we are more taking bad shots. The SG spot is best to fill a playmaker, replacement of Lowry.

As for the SG/SF, it is a concern, but more with the bench. We may need to upgrade Johnson with a 3&D, unless Watanabe can improve his 3 point shooting. Not seeing any 3&D in FA, and Brissett is gone, drafting one from our 2nd round may make sense:
Trey Murphy III
Kessler Edwards
Terrence Shannon, Jr.
Scottie Lewis
John Petty, Jr.
Herb Jones (small sample size on 3)
Raiquan Gray (small sample size on 3)
Ron Harper Jr.
Chris Smith (undraft?)

Assume this is our off season plan, we may expect a 2nd pick to contribute right away, and an undraft spot is available if we have Harris on the regular contract:
Birch/FA/Gillespie
Siakam/Boucher/2nd
OG/Bembry/Watanabe
Trent/1st/Watson
VanVleet/Flynn/Harris

2-way: 2nd, Undraft

WTF, Yuta is shooting 40% from 3. Do you need him to shoot 42%? He just needs overall experience to polish up each aspect of his game to move up the depth chart. Maybe up to Toni Kukoc level with better 3pt shooting? Raptor fans are spoiled.

Bembry can't shoot 3's for a SG/SF, he will need to move on and let another team use him. He's like a slightly better Alan Anderson. Good bye.

I've been seeing Trent bring up the ball a few occasions with Fred saving some steps. The pick will definitely be able to play SF as OG can also cover SG and PF.

Birch/FA/Gillespie
Siakam/Boucher/2nd
OG/Watanabe/1st
Trent/Watson/Harris/1st
VanVleet/Flynn/Harris

The 1st pick could move up the depth chart fast throughout training camp and pre-season.

[Reeko]

I want Kuminga on this team so bad, sigh.

Watch on YouTube

Hopefully is so-so stats in the G-League have scouts looking at Davion Mitchell, Scottie Barnes, Keon Johnson or Jalen Johnson slipping ahead of Kuminga.

I think bringing Kuminga along slowly with our depth will help him a lot.

Kuminga has better guard skills than OG but I love how he also has the power in his hops to 2 hand dunk off 1 step from standstill. I don't think Jalen Johnson can do that, I see him laying it up on those.

Yeah, stats be damned when judging Kuminga. He needs development. He’s one of those prospects you just need to watch to see the potential. I think you’re right too, if we brought him along slowly he would develop so well. Need some other guys to take big leaps in workouts and whatnot and maybe Kuminga falls far enough or we trade up.

I think I heard on the podcast with Sam Vecenie that Kuminga's advanced stats in the G league were really poor, I think he posted a negative WS/48. Although I don't know how much you can take from a shortened G League season.

[Psubs]

kuminga has no jmper....really raw prospect

He has one but it just needs reps as the form is good.

Do we believe that he's 1/2 a year younger (from DR Congo) than the other prospects at 18 1/2?

He could potential still grow to be 6'9 then.

He's built like OG with handles. He can similarly learn to shoot.

Watch on YouTube

[Psubs]

I think I heard on the podcast with Sam Vecenie that Kuminga's advanced stats in the G league were really poor, I think he posted a negative WS/48. Although I don't know how much you can take from a shortened G League season.

I watched a bunch of those games and I think Brian Shaw just had them keep it simple and didn't really run anything.

It just felt like a pickup game. Jalen Green did well.

So his performance in the GLeague makes it possible for him to drop a few spaces, which is amazing for Toronto!!!

[Raptorfan2012]

I haven't read the thread, but with the way the Raptors have played this season & lost many close games or let the close games slip away in the last 3/4 mins during regulation time, it's evidently clear we badly need a finisher.

we need can go small ball, which is great but we are lacking size in the SG Position, by which we cant play the normal way.

The raptors are going for SG/SF

Unless there is a big trade, pretty sure Trent Jr will be our starting SG next season.