Trade Talk (Part Six)

[ChiefKeith91]

We don’t need to add anyone who will take away from Ant ball usage. Simmons can’t shoot so he needs the ball to contribute


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[SO_MONEY]

It seems like Rubio, Culver, and whatever assets they would have to attach to significantly upgrade the roster are the most likely to move pieces in the near-term. Rubio because of his expiring contract and the cap space that would open up for team as well as the fact that he's an expiring that can play actual competent basketball. Culver because it's clear that he doesn't likely have a place in the rotation near-term or in the future and that if there is an NBA career to be salvaged it's with a change of scenery.

Rubio + Culver is $23-24m... that should allow you to go after just about any player that comes on the market. I trust that Rosas will be aggressive in figuring out trading options. Hopefully we can win and close out the season strongly so that Rosas can pitch either FAs or trade partners in something of a Suns parallel given health.

That's the potential value in not tanking even if it means falling to 6th place and really hurting the top 3 chances.

Ummm.....nah.

I’m not really sure I said anything that’s something that someone could disagree with. I just posted information about who is likely the movable pieces for the Wolves and how that salary would match up in a potential trade for an impact player. I then called out that winning and closing out on a strong stretch and strengthening a case that the Wolves, when healthy, are one or two impact pieces from really competing is a benefit from finishing strong even if it decreases our lottery odds this year.

I didn’t really post an opinion just an observation about the positive and negative impacts of a possible future outcome. But you do you....

Your rationale that winning meaningless games, significantly reducing or lottery odds is beyond flawed. Moreover, the Wolves are against/in the LUX if anything they will be shedding salary not taking it on. Past that anything we would get for Rubio and Culver would be a bad contract. Lastly, and I am sure I am not touching all the bases, but there would be no link to our on the court performance and finding trade partners, we either have value they want or not.

So, plenty to disagree with...

Don't win meaningless games.

Hope for a top 3 pick.

Hope you can move some guys for salary relief.

Maybe a Beasley for PF deal materializes?

That is what we should want.

Rubio and Culver for an "impact player" is a pipe dream and also assumes a willingness to go into the LUX an likely become a repeater.

So, ummm......nah.

[SO_MONEY]

The only issue I have is that if MIN replaces this $23-234 mil with another $23-24 mil player, MIN will be over the lux (especially if we keep the pick).

Two months ago I would have said that Rubio is a goner, but right now, I am not so sure it won’t be Malik Beasley. I am not saying Rubio is a better player than Malik, just that he may have relatively more value to the Wolves next year, depending on their priorities. Beasley is clearly the better three point shooter, and that has value to the team. But is MIN prioritizes developing Anthony Edwards, I think Rubio is the better play. He provides a mentor for Ant, he doesn’t take the FGA’s away from Ant that Beasley would want, he plays much better defense than Malik, and he is a team-first leader on this team. Rubio may have to do it in a bench role, but I could see Ant starting but playing more minutes with the bench when DLo plays more as a starter doing pick and roll with KAT. Trading Beasley would also bring back a positive return, which could include some combination of payroll relief, a pick, or a solution to our PF questions.

That's a fair possibility. I don't think it's likely because I don't think that Beasley's contract is really tradable as is. It might become more tradable, but I think teams will be worried in dealing for him despite his play this season. Beasley is one mistake away from jail time on his probation and not exactly a model leader in terms of decision making--even post his incidents this summer. Hate to bring up stuff outside the game, but I don't think teams view Beasley as a positive asset yet.

You could be right. I assumed that shooting 40% 3P and putting up 20 PPG in both seasons for MIN would make him worth a non-lotto 1st. However, the whispers I heard was that there was little interest in Beasley at the trade deadline, so I was probably wrong. I will say that the farther we get past the date of his on court incident, the less it will factor into his trade value (as long as he keeps his nose clean). Historically, the NBA has overlooked plenty of bad behavior, if the player is good enough.

Reportedly, ATL wanted Beasley in a Collins trade, we declined, probably due to a 1st also being involved. I think the rumors are overstated that interest was limited. We didn't want to trade him yet and value him. Teams would be foolish to view his contract as anything other than a positive and I don't think most team's leadership is foolish.

[TheZachAttack]

Rubio, Beasley and the draft rights to our (hopeful) top-three pick

for

Ben Simmons

I believe Simmons could be a missing link for this group, both offensively and defensively. Finch has used a lot of Russell next to another playmaker (plus Edwards), so this would be no different. Defensively, he combines with McDaniels for a lockdown forward duo.

Russell / Edwards / McDaniels / Simmons / Towns

I know people are worried about luxury tax concerns with another big contract, but by doing the trade this way instead of after the rookie is signed actually clears money on our end because the contracts are matched BEFORE adding another $10 million to the books. Simmons does make about $750,000 more than Rubio and Beasley combined, but I think that's pretty minor. Essentially, we're sending out $43 million and bringing back $33 million.

Simmons for Cade/Suggs/Mobley? I’m a big fan of draft capital, watching Rookies develop and really high on all 3 of these guys.

The fact that I’m wavering tells me that making that trade for Simmons would absolutely be the right move. Suggs or Cade would be a great fit for that Philly roster, too.

I like it, Klomp.

C - Towns
F - Simmons
F - McDaniels
G - Edwards
G - Russell


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Problem with that is, will Ant have enough touches?

I think it would work. Simmons is really the offensive initiator and pushes the ball in transition, where then in the halfcourt Simmons would play somewhat of a Josh Okogie role but way better (i.e. used as a screener on the perimeter, in the corner as a cutter, and in dunker type spots).

Simmons value as a "point guard" is mainly around his insane ability and vision in transition before defenses are set. Once defenses are set, he can move the ball and provide another ball-handler on the court, but we can run all the same types of actions that we have been with Ant and D Lo as "off-ball", but then getting hand offs and other touches early in the half court offense at specific spots on the floor designed to make them effective. Same offense we're running now.

[shrink]

That's a fair possibility. I don't think it's likely because I don't think that Beasley's contract is really tradable as is. It might become more tradable, but I think teams will be worried in dealing for him despite his play this season. Beasley is one mistake away from jail time on his probation and not exactly a model leader in terms of decision making--even post his incidents this summer. Hate to bring up stuff outside the game, but I don't think teams view Beasley as a positive asset yet.

You could be right. I assumed that shooting 40% 3P and putting up 20 PPG in both seasons for MIN would make him worth a non-lotto 1st. However, the whispers I heard was that there was little interest in Beasley at the trade deadline, so I was probably wrong. I will say that the farther we get past the date of his on court incident, the less it will factor into his trade value (as long as he keeps his nose clean). Historically, the NBA has overlooked plenty of bad behavior, if the player is good enough.

Reportedly, ATL wanted Beasley in a Collins trade, we declined, probably due to a 1st also being involved. I think the rumors are overstated that interest was limited. We didn't want to trade him yet and value him. Teams would be foolish to view his contract as anything other than a positive and I don't think most team's leadership is foolish.

I also think his trade value may increase, the more distance he puts between his legal problems, and keeps his nose clean.

I’m not sure what to think.

[SO_MONEY]

You could be right. I assumed that shooting 40% 3P and putting up 20 PPG in both seasons for MIN would make him worth a non-lotto 1st. However, the whispers I heard was that there was little interest in Beasley at the trade deadline, so I was probably wrong. I will say that the farther we get past the date of his on court incident, the less it will factor into his trade value (as long as he keeps his nose clean). Historically, the NBA has overlooked plenty of bad behavior, if the player is good enough.

Reportedly, ATL wanted Beasley in a Collins trade, we declined, probably due to a 1st also being involved. I think the rumors are overstated that interest was limited. We didn't want to trade him yet and value him. Teams would be foolish to view his contract as anything other than a positive and I don't think most team's leadership is foolish.

I also think his trade value may increase, the more distance he puts between his legal problems, and keeps his nose clean.

I’m not sure what to think.

Trust your gut, it is a good contract across the NBA.

[Mattya]

I thought the rumor is the Hawks wanted Jaden along with Beasley in a Collins trade? Maybe I’m wrong. I think they might be more inclined to trade him in a sign & trade this offseason. I saw a tweet that said Collins roll/lob attempts have dropped since the deadline with Capela replacing them. Maybe Beasley, Culver, and Bolmaro rights gets something done for the Hawks now.

[Note30]

I don't see anyway we are going to win with our current guard lineup.

DLo McLauglin and Rubio are not the future.
That being said we are also really weak on the defensive front. I have a decent idea on how we can fix our rotation

If we get #1-3 I say we trade the pick
Trade it to the Spurs along with Rubio, Layman #1, for Murray, Poetl and the #14 pick

Trade Dlo for Lonzo Ball in a sign and trade (sign and trade minimum would set Lonzo's new contract at 20mill)

Trade Culver and Hernangomez and #14 (from the Spurs) for Christian Wood



Ball (32)/Murray (16)
Edwards (35) / Beasley (13)
McDaniels (30) / Okogie (4)
KAT (32) / x
Poeltl (20) / Wood (24) / Reid

32 minutes reallocated to Murray and Beasley

Ball (32), Edwards, Murray (30), Beasley (28) McDaniels (30), KAT(32), Poeltl (20), Wood (24)

Thats a way stronger rotation than what we have now.

[Worm Guts]

If you think we need to upgrade our PG situation, wouldn’t you just take Suggs?

[Neeva]

I don't see anyway we are going to win with our current guard lineup.

DLo McLauglin and Rubio are not the future.
That being said we are also really weak on the defensive front. I have a decent idea on how we can fix our rotation

If we get #1-3 I say we trade the pick
Trade it to the Spurs along with Rubio, Layman #1, for Murray, Poetl and the #14 pick

Trade Dlo for Lonzo Ball in a sign and trade (sign and trade minimum would set Lonzo's new contract at 20mill)

Trade Culver and Hernangomez and #14 (from the Spurs) for Christian Wood



Ball (32)/Murray (16)
Edwards (35) / Beasley (13)
McDaniels (30) / Okogie (4)
KAT (32) / x
Poeltl (20) / Wood (24) / Reid

32 minutes reallocated to Murray and Beasley

Ball (32), Edwards, Murray (30), Beasley (28) McDaniels (30), KAT(32), Poeltl (20), Wood (24)

Thats a way stronger rotation than what we have now.

Thank god you aint a GM.

[Note30]

I don't see anyway we are going to win with our current guard lineup.

DLo McLauglin and Rubio are not the future.
That being said we are also really weak on the defensive front. I have a decent idea on how we can fix our rotation

If we get #1-3 I say we trade the pick
Trade it to the Spurs along with Rubio, Layman #1, for Murray, Poetl and the #14 pick

Trade Dlo for Lonzo Ball in a sign and trade (sign and trade minimum would set Lonzo's new contract at 20mill)

Trade Culver and Hernangomez and #14 (from the Spurs) for Christian Wood



Ball (32)/Murray (16)
Edwards (35) / Beasley (13)
McDaniels (30) / Okogie (4)
KAT (32) / x
Poeltl (20) / Wood (24) / Reid

32 minutes reallocated to Murray and Beasley

Ball (32), Edwards, Murray (30), Beasley (28) McDaniels (30), KAT(32), Poeltl (20), Wood (24)

Thats a way stronger rotation than what we have now.

Thank god you aint a GM.

Why did you bother responding if you don't even want to say why it sucks?

Is it just to be an ****? Or is that just your thing, Im pretty sure anytime anyone has posted anything you don't agree with you've just given a douchey response.

Either post something useful or **** off.

[Note30]

If you think we need to upgrade our PG situation, wouldn’t you just take Suggs?

Yeah but I wanted to address the defensive gaps as well.

[old school 34]

I thought the rumor is the Hawks wanted Jaden along with Beasley in a Collins trade? Maybe I’m wrong. I think they might be more inclined to trade him in a sign & trade this offseason. I saw a tweet that said Collins roll/lob attempts have dropped since the deadline with Capela replacing them. Maybe Beasley, Culver, and Bolmaro rights gets something done for the Hawks now.

I would entertain the idea of JC sign & trade deal...but won't part with Jaden. I think there's a 3-way deal that makes sense adding Chi in the mix? Chi is a team that may make most sense in taking Rubio & could Atl value & cheaper pf sign & trade for Lauri...more parts besides that obviously but that could be some of the starters of the deal?

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[shrink]

Would you give MEM the #3 and Culver for JJJ?

Great fit, but coming off injury and we’d have to determine the contract for 2022.

[Baseline81]

Would you give MEM the #3 and Culver for JJJ?

Great fit, but coming off injury and we’d have to determine the contract for 2022.

No, I wouldn't.

Having a cost-controlled top-3 pick would certainly help the Wolves going forward. Next year, JJJ will be on the last year of his rookie contract ($9.2M). What will his next contract look like?

[twix2500]

The Wolves have a quality big 3 in the making. Edwards, Towns and Russell. Those who are talking about trading any of those three is ridiculous and its one of the many reason why this franchise stay in a hole. The focus needs to be coaching staff and finding quality veteran role players that fit the big 3 and system.

Use the draft pick and the young players as trade bait to get quality and the right veteran role players. Trade down in the draft.

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[jpatrick]

The Wolves have a quality big 3 in the making. Edwards, Towns and Russell. Those who are talking about trading any of those three is ridiculous and its one of the many reason why this franchise stay in a hole. The focus needs to be coaching staff and finding quality veteran role players that fit the big 3 and system.

Use the draft pick and the young players as trade bait to get quality and the right veteran role players. Trade down in the draft.

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You don’t trade a top three pick in a four person draft for role players. You just don’t. Especially when all three of Cade, Mobley, and Suggs provide skills this team needs.

I’m still not convinced our “big three” will ever be championship level, especially DLo.

[twix2500]

The Wolves have a quality big 3 in the making. Edwards, Towns and Russell. Those who are talking about trading any of those three is ridiculous and its one of the many reason why this franchise stay in a hole. The focus needs to be coaching staff and finding quality veteran role players that fit the big 3 and system.

Use the draft pick and the young players as trade bait to get quality and the right veteran role players. Trade down in the draft.

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You don’t trade a top three pick in a four person draft for role players. You just don’t. Especially when all three of Cade, Mobley, and Suggs provide skills this team needs.

I’m still not convinced our “big three” will ever be championship level, especially DLo.

You can not keep delaying building a title contender around Towns because you want to spend years developing young players. This franchise keep going into circles. Build properly around Edwards , Russell and Towns and let them prove themselves. It's time to stop looking for some teenager massiah that leads the franchise to the promise land. You win with 27 year olds and older.

You got to let them fail or succeed multiple years.

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[Worm Guts]

The Wolves have a quality big 3 in the making. Edwards, Towns and Russell. Those who are talking about trading any of those three is ridiculous and its one of the many reason why this franchise stay in a hole. The focus needs to be coaching staff and finding quality veteran role players that fit the big 3 and system.

Use the draft pick and the young players as trade bait to get quality and the right veteran role players. Trade down in the draft.

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You don’t trade a top three pick in a four person draft for role players. You just don’t. Especially when all three of Cade, Mobley, and Suggs provide skills this team needs.

I’m still not convinced our “big three” will ever be championship level, especially DLo.

You can not keep delaying building a title contender around Towns because you want to spend years developing young players. This franchise keep going into circles. Build properly around Edwards , Russell and Towns and let them prove themselves. It's time to stop looking for some teenager prophet that leads the franchise to the promise land. You win with 27 year olds and older.

You got to let them fail or succeed multiple years.

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It is true that you win with 27 year olds as opposed to 19 year olds, but I would definitely be hesitant part with an elite prospect to support a core that just finished at the bottom of the league. Obviously Towns and Russell had injury issues and Edwards is still growing as a player, but you still want to see competitiveness before trading away a Cunningham or a Suggs in an attempt to win now.

[Note30]

The Wolves have a quality big 3 in the making. Edwards, Towns and Russell. Those who are talking about trading any of those three is ridiculous and its one of the many reason why this franchise stay in a hole. The focus needs to be coaching staff and finding quality veteran role players that fit the big 3 and system.

Use the draft pick and the young players as trade bait to get quality and the right veteran role players. Trade down in the draft.

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You don’t trade a top three pick in a four person draft for role players. You just don’t. Especially when all three of Cade, Mobley, and Suggs provide skills this team needs.

I’m still not convinced our “big three” will ever be championship level, especially DLo.

You can not keep delaying building a title contender around Towns because you want to spend years developing young players. This franchise keep going into circles. Build properly around Edwards , Russell and Towns and let them prove themselves. It's time to stop looking for some teenager massiah that leads the franchise to the promise land. You win with 27 year olds and older.

You got to let them fail or succeed multiple years.

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I don't think you're wrong about building with more experienced players, that's fine.
DLo and to a lesser extent Towns aren't it.

They've both had multiple seasons to carry a team and neither have successfully done so. Nothing this season in their return screams that they will in the future.