[Project] Top 5 single season peaks by franchises: The Lakers

[Strepbacter]

Yeah, it's "silly" to suggest Bryant should be easily in the top five, but it's not silly to say that Mikan was clearly superior.

You can't even keep up with your own standards.

Do you even care about anything else than Kobe ranking in multiple threads? Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan was more dominant than Kobe. It's not up to debate.

if we didnt adjust for era mikan probably should be #1 to be honest, he was arguably more above his competition than even kareem

And I guarantee he doesn't have Mikan #1, but somehow he's "clearly" superior to Bryant.

Good one.

[Strepbacter]

I'd argue that Mikan peaked clearly higher than Bryant and he led better teams than him to multiple titles.

Yeah, it's "silly" to suggest Bryant should be easily in the top five, but it's not silly to say that Mikan was clearly superior.

You can't even keep up with your own standards.

Do you even care about anything else than Kobe ranking in multiple threads? Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan was more dominant than Kobe. It's not up to debate.

Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan is going to have a strong case against plenty of guys who are generally regarded as having better peaks, but most people are going to take into account era, so exactly how it is indisputable that he peaked higher? Unless you believe the era argument is completely bunk?

Try getting your nonsense straight before worrying about what threads I post in.

[sansterre]

Yeah, it's "silly" to suggest Bryant should be easily in the top five, but it's not silly to say that Mikan was clearly superior.

You can't even keep up with your own standards.

Do you even care about anything else than Kobe ranking in multiple threads? Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan was more dominant than Kobe. It's not up to debate.

Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan is going to have a strong case against plenty of guys who are generally regarded as having better peaks, but most people are going to take into account era, so exactly how it is indisputable that he peaked higher? Unless you believe the era argument is completely bunk?

Try getting your nonsense straight before worrying about what threads I post in.

Is there evidence or argument that could be presented that could persuade you that Kobe's best season wasn't one of the best five player seasons in Laker's history?

If not we're getting near bad faith territory and this 'discussion' is going to be unproductive.

[70sFan]

Yeah, it's "silly" to suggest Bryant should be easily in the top five, but it's not silly to say that Mikan was clearly superior.

You can't even keep up with your own standards.

Do you even care about anything else than Kobe ranking in multiple threads? Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan was more dominant than Kobe. It's not up to debate.

Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan is going to have a strong case against plenty of guys who are generally regarded as having better peaks, but most people are going to take into account era, so exactly how it is indisputable that he peaked higher? Unless you believe the era argument is completely bunk?

Try getting your nonsense straight before worrying about what threads I post in.

Again, "clearly" is the word I'd use if we don't account for era differences. I didn't mean that it's undisputed to have Mikan higher than Kobe.

Maybe I shouldn't use it at all, but my point is that even Mikan has very reasonable case over Kobe and he got no attention in this thread.

Not to mention that we have someone like 1972 Wilt, who was clearly the best player on better team than 2009 Lakers and he also got very little attention. Nobody cries here that there is some hate on Wilt here though, because people understand that the competition is very stacked.

Personally, I'd not even entertain the idea that Kobe is in top 3. He's clealry worse player than 1977 Kareem, 2000 Shaq and 1987 Magic. He has a case over West and James, but in my opinion it'd be more about narrarive and RS-based arguments. I don't think Kobe ever was as good as peak West or 2020 James.

[sansterre]

Do you even care about anything else than Kobe ranking in multiple threads? Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan was more dominant than Kobe. It's not up to debate.

Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan is going to have a strong case against plenty of guys who are generally regarded as having better peaks, but most people are going to take into account era, so exactly how it is indisputable that he peaked higher? Unless you believe the era argument is completely bunk?

Try getting your nonsense straight before worrying about what threads I post in.

Again, "clearly" is the word I'd use if we don't account for era differences. I didn't mean that it's undisputed to have Mikan higher than Kobe.

Maybe I shouldn't use it at all, but my point is that even Mikan has very reasonable case over Kobe and he got no attention in this thread.

Not to mention that we have someone like 1972 Wilt, who was clearly the best player on better team than 2009 Lakers and he also got very little attention. Nobody cries here that there is some hate on Wilt here though, because people understand that the competition is very stacked.

Personally, I'd not even entertain the idea that Kobe is in top 3. He's clealry worse player than 1977 Kareem, 2000 Shaq and 1987 Magic. He has a case over West and James, but in my opinion it'd be more about narrarive and RS-based arguments. I don't think Kobe ever was as good as peak West or 2020 James.

I was along these lines. To have Kobe in the top 5 you have to either:

1) not really care about anybody pre-1975; or
2) discount partially for era (taking Mikan, Baylor and Wilt off the board compared to Kobe) and care enough about the regular season that 2020 LeBron isn't an option.

That second option is what led me to going Bryant. But coming up in the top two against '61 Baylor, '49 Mikan, '66 West, '72 Wilt and '20 LeBron is . . . a tall order.

[Strepbacter]

Do you even care about anything else than Kobe ranking in multiple threads? Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan was more dominant than Kobe. It's not up to debate.

Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan is going to have a strong case against plenty of guys who are generally regarded as having better peaks, but most people are going to take into account era, so exactly how it is indisputable that he peaked higher? Unless you believe the era argument is completely bunk?

Try getting your nonsense straight before worrying about what threads I post in.

Again, "clearly" is the word I'd use if we don't account for era differences. I didn't mean that it's undisputed to have Mikan higher than Kobe.

Lol @ the hilarious backtracking. You said Mikan was clearly superior, had your nonsense called out, and now you're insisting that you only meant he was clearly superior relative to era. Riiiiight. If you don't believe Mikan was indisputably better, then you shouldn't have said he was clearly better. How hard is that? And you know your criteria isn't exclusively built around in-era greatness, so you're still all over the place.

Get back to me when you get your story straight.

[70sFan]

Without adjusting for era differences, Mikan is going to have a strong case against plenty of guys who are generally regarded as having better peaks, but most people are going to take into account era, so exactly how it is indisputable that he peaked higher? Unless you believe the era argument is completely bunk?

Try getting your nonsense straight before worrying about what threads I post in.

Again, "clearly" is the word I'd use if we don't account for era differences. I didn't mean that it's undisputed to have Mikan higher than Kobe.

Lol @ the hilarious backtracking. You said Mikan was clearly superior, had your nonsense called out, and now you're insisting that you only meant he was clearly superior relative to era. Riiiiight. And you know your criteria isn't exclusively built around in-era greatness, so you're still all over the place. With West and LBJ, it's they were simply "better players". With Mikan, it's "he was clearly superior without adjusting for era differences"

Get back to me when you get your story straight.

So admitting that I'm wrong is a bad thing now? I said, I shouldn't use the words I did. I wrote it quickly and I tried to explain my thoughts better in second post, why is such a crime to you? Can we move on? Or do you want to prove how much superior you are? If so, then I don't see any reason to continue this discussion.

It's true, I have Mikan outside of top 5 because of era adjustments. I don't do it in big degree and in all other franchises Mikan would definitely make my list. That's the point though - Lakers are so full of talent that even such small things like slightly weaker era or slightly lesser abilities matter.

My point wasn't that Mikan should be ranked higher than Kobe. My point was broader - you have a lot of amazing basketball players missing this list, yet you're the only one who complains. Nobody have anti-Kobe agenda, we simply missed a lot of all-timers like Mikan, Baylor, Wilt, Kobe or Davis. Most of them have cases to be in this list, but it doesn't mean that it's disgrace to miss them.

Who would you take out of the list by the way?

[giordunk]

Interesting discussion. If anything I'm just shocked by the fact that people are making the case for LeBron when Lakers are the team with some of the greatest peaks in NBA history and this is a season that many would not throw into consideration as LeBron's season... Just puts into perspective how good LeBron is.

[LakerLegend]

lol, imagine 01 Kobe in the Bubble with 2020 rules.

[HeartBreakKid]

lol, imagine 01 Kobe in the Bubble with 2020 rules.

Wrong thread...