Fire Brad Stevens.

[Green89]

Spo's team just lost by 34 to a team that's not a collection of top 15 players.
Maybe if he was an ex-player his players would respect him and played hard, thus winning the game.

Maybe if he came up with proven offensive sets that worked, players would respect him more. Kyrie first got here and proclaimed him a guru, but then realized it was all smoke and mirrors. Previous to that, he coached mostly rookies, young guys, and no vets. As soon as someone with experience got here, players began to see he wasn't a good as originally thought. He's had how many years to figure out double teams, now? He either needs to go or we need some vet players AND coaches on this team to help out, and particularly an offensive minded coach. The league has gone insanely to the offensive side of the spectrum. Brad's going to be left in the dust soon.

[cloverleaf]

Spo's also won a couple titles and made the Finals last year. Milwaukee shot the lights out but no one is going to argue that the Heat have stopped trying. I'd also give Pat Riley a lot of credit there too. The combo of Spo and Riley runs circles around Danny and Brad.

Spo's likely the best coach in the league right now. Exceptions don't disprove rules, however, in identifying the most likely profile for finding an available candidate who will prove to be a winning coach.

I think I'd go with Cassell or Billups as the next coach if I had to pick someone right now. Ideally it would be a former Celtic but I'm not sure any recently retired Celtic is in the coaching circles. KG is interested in ownership, Pierce doesn't seem ready to commit to that, Rondo is still playing. Maybe James Posey?

I don't quite remember, but I think Perk brought up Billups.

And as I posted just above, I have decided the answer is for Wyc to do the honorable thing and sell the majority of his shares, and whatever partners are interested, to KG. Whatever is enough to put KG in majority control. Then let him sort out the GM and coaching questions.

[BK_2020]

Spo's team just lost by 34 to a team that's not a collection of top 15 players.
Maybe if he was an ex-player his players would respect him and played hard, thus winning the game.

Maybe if he came up with proven offensive sets that worked, players would respect him more. Kyrie first got here and proclaimed him a guru, but then realized it was all smoke and mirrors. Previous to that, he coached mostly rookies, young guys, and no vets. As soon as someone with experience got here, players began to see he wasn't a good as originally thought.

In 2016-2017 only under 25 players getting minutes were Smart, Jaylen and Rozier. It's like as soon as you fact-check these narratives people begin to see how baseless they are.

[BostonCouchGM]

Brad had success with lesser talent because he had almost perfect players for his system. IT could run PnR, penetrate and dish to shooters (Crowder, AB, Brown, Rozier) parked in the corners and was a great shooter himself. He had role players who knew their roles. 3 and D pretty much all around including at the 5.

We could have it again if he would just start Pritchard and Nesmith and Danny replaces the scrubs on the bench and finds a stretch 5. That’d give us shooters all around for spacing so everyone could drive and kick which PP, Nesmith, Brown and Tatum can all do. When he puts Grant, Semi and Langford out there it doesn’t fit his system and I can’t help but wonder if he’s doing it because Danny desperately wants to justify picking them? It really makes no sense basketball wise. If he’s doing it on his own he needs to be fired

[playa-hater]

PS My thinking has evolved beyond "fire Stevens" or "fire Ainge".

I think the right thing for Wyc and any of his partners who can be persuaded is to sell at least the majority of their shares of the C's to KG or KG and his team. Then let them deal with who runs the team on and off the court.

Wyc is the guy ultimately most responsible. He should pass the baton and sure, they can leave him with as a cheerleader very minority partner share if that's what he wants, but when you've got someone like KG looking to get in on NBA team ownership, Grousbeck should aid and abet, not obstruct, him reaching that goal.

the odds of this are Powerball level, even if you're are right.

[playa-hater]

Spo's team just lost by 34 to a team that's not a collection of top 15 players.
Maybe if he was an ex-player his players would respect him and played hard, thus winning the game.

Maybe if he came up with proven offensive sets that worked, players would respect him more. Kyrie first got here and proclaimed him a guru, but then realized it was all smoke and mirrors. Previous to that, he coached mostly rookies, young guys, and no vets. As soon as someone with experience got here, players began to see he wasn't a good as originally thought. He's had how many years to figure out double teams, now? He either needs to go or we need some vet players AND coaches on this team to help out, and particularly an offensive minded coach. The league has gone insanely to the offensive side of the spectrum. Brad's going to be left in the dust soon.

soon??

[bisme37]

I've seen so many comments about Brad's lack of an offensive system that I started buying into it myself. But last night was really striking. In the first half when the starters were playing it looked like everything was ISO and there was no offensive system at all. But then the bench played the 2nd half and suddenly they were actually running sets and getting a lot of open looks.

Fans talk about coaches like they have a remote control and everything the players do reflects the will of the coach. But in reality all the coach can do is trust the guys to play right and then stand there getting a headache when they don't.

[cloverleaf]

I've seen so many comments about Brad's lack of an offensive system that I started buying into it myself. But last night was really striking. In the first half when the starters were playing it looked like everything was ISO and there was no offensive system at all. But then the bench played the 2nd half and suddenly they were actually running sets and getting a lot of open looks.

Fans talk about coaches like they have a remote control and everything the players do reflects the will of the coach. But in reality all the coach can do is trust the guys to play right and then stand there getting a headache when they don't.

You were probably helped by the TNT announcers pointing exactly that out.

[cloverleaf]

PS My thinking has evolved beyond "fire Stevens" or "fire Ainge".

I think the right thing for Wyc and any of his partners who can be persuaded is to sell at least the majority of their shares of the C's to KG or KG and his team. Then let them deal with who runs the team on and off the court.

Wyc is the guy ultimately most responsible. He should pass the baton and sure, they can leave him with as a cheerleader very minority partner share if that's what he wants, but when you've got someone like KG looking to get in on NBA team ownership, Grousbeck should aid and abet, not obstruct, him reaching that goal.

the odds of this are Powerball level, even if you're are right.

You're likely right, but it is the one move that I think aligns the rest. Including renewed commitments from the Jays--despite Tatum's sneering against the praise for KG's leadership.

[bisme37]

I've seen so many comments about Brad's lack of an offensive system that I started buying into it myself. But last night was really striking. In the first half when the starters were playing it looked like everything was ISO and there was no offensive system at all. But then the bench played the 2nd half and suddenly they were actually running sets and getting a lot of open looks.

Fans talk about coaches like they have a remote control and everything the players do reflects the will of the coach. But in reality all the coach can do is trust the guys to play right and then stand there getting a headache when they don't.

You were probably helped by the TNT announcers pointing exactly that out.

Honestly I was sewing a hole in my pants in the 2nd half and didn't hear them say that. Had the game on from beginning to end but my attention started waning as it became a massacre. Sorry for repeating what they said and annoying you.

[ddb]

Brad Stevens went from COTY candidate every year to 2018 when it was his first time having a team that underachieved with Kyrie, returning from injury Hayward, Morris, Horford, Tatum, Brown, Rozier, Smart etc. That team had so much darn talent and Brad & the players just couldn't figure it out. Then last season he gets the team back to the East finals (3/4 years), and this year is really his first horrible season.......There should absolutely be some heat on Brad Stevens. This is now 2 out of 3 rough seasons....this season I think has been Danny's absolute worst! So I tend to blame Danny more....But everyone should be at fault... I am concerned that Danny was unable to figure out a way to surround his best players with solid players that compliment each other. Has Danny lost his eye for the right talent? Then I've been concerned about the lack of fight with this current group. They haven't had the same fight. I'm also concerned that JT/JB for as terrific as they are, perhaps are not capable of being true #1's & leaders. Tatum has the talent to be, but he has never gotten in an opponents face. I'd like to see more fire from Tatum. More of that killer mentality.

Overall I'm fine if Ainge/Stevens and the core return....but Danny needs to make some major moves to shake up the roster. This roster IS NOT IT. period.
If Stevens and the team underachieve again next season, then it's probably time for Brad to go. But I have a feeling that if Brad has the right guys, that he'll be just fine coaching again.

[CelticsFan0007]

This is a joke of a thread. If anyone needs to shoulder most of the blame, it's Danny and the players. Not saying that Brad doesn't deserve some of it, but he deserves I think the least.

Whose job is it to build a team around your core four and so that it fits Brad's system, Danny's. His ability to build a roster out this season has led to an inexperienced bench and players that aren't willing to get into the opponent's face. That's the type of veteran players they need. It's great that he brought in Evan Fournier but they need an **** type of player who isn't going to take ****.

Secondly, I've probably watched roughly around 60 games. The players don't maximize their effort, they turn the ball over way too much and most of those are unforced. There is too much hero ball and when they get punched in the mouth, they don't respond well. Lack of toughness. Brad can't teach them that or coach them up to do that.

COVID and injuries have been a huge part of this team and probably have been hit the hardest by both. So the fact that fans are calling for Brad to be fired, who is one of the top coaches in the NBA, and took the team to three out of four ECFs, is laughable. Plus he just got an extension.

[JHTruth]

This is a joke of a thread. If anyone needs to shoulder most of the blame, it's Danny and the players. Not saying that Brad doesn't deserve some of it, but he deserves I think the least.

Whose job is it to build a team around your core four and so that it fits Brad's system, Danny's. His ability to build a roster out this season has led to an inexperienced bench and players that aren't willing to get into the opponent's face. That's the type of veteran players they need. It's great that he brought in Evan Fournier but they need an **** type of player who isn't going to take ****.

Secondly, I've probably watched roughly around 60 games. The players don't maximize their effort, they turn the ball over way too much and most of those are unforced. There is too much hero ball and when they get punched in the mouth, they don't respond well. Lack of toughness. Brad can't teach them that or coach them up to do that.

COVID and injuries have been a huge part of this team and probably have been hit the hardest by both. So the fact that fans are calling for Brad to be fired, who is one of the top coaches in the NBA, and took the team to three out of four ECFs, is laughable. Plus he just got an extension.

Brad's job as an NBA coach is to best utilize the best talent Danny can acquire. This isn't college, a team's "system" is secondary to talent. Brad has misused his elite talent young big Rob horribly. He has not received buy-in from his two stars Tatum and Brown. Not even Smart or Kemba seems to be as bought-in as normal.

Let's not pretend that Brad doesn't face serious challenges in turning around this team next year. He's in serious trouble IMHO

[cloverleaf]

I've seen so many comments about Brad's lack of an offensive system that I started buying into it myself. But last night was really striking. In the first half when the starters were playing it looked like everything was ISO and there was no offensive system at all. But then the bench played the 2nd half and suddenly they were actually running sets and getting a lot of open looks.

Fans talk about coaches like they have a remote control and everything the players do reflects the will of the coach. But in reality all the coach can do is trust the guys to play right and then stand there getting a headache when they don't.

You were probably helped by the TNT announcers pointing exactly that out.

Honestly I was sewing a hole in my pants in the 2nd half and didn't hear them say that. Had the game on from beginning to end but my attention started waning as it became a massacre. Sorry for repeating what they said and annoying you.

No need to apologize, of course, and I didn't mean to offend. I just thought you might have picked that up from them and their position helped your case.

[chrisab123]

Spo's team just lost by 34 to a team that's not a collection of top 15 players.
Maybe if he was an ex-player his players would respect him and played hard, thus winning the game.

Maybe if he came up with proven offensive sets that worked, players would respect him more. Kyrie first got here and proclaimed him a guru, but then realized it was all smoke and mirrors. Previous to that, he coached mostly rookies, young guys, and no vets. As soon as someone with experience got here, players began to see he wasn't a good as originally thought. He's had how many years to figure out double teams, now? He either needs to go or we need some vet players AND coaches on this team to help out, and particularly an offensive minded coach. The league has gone insanely to the offensive side of the spectrum. Brad's going to be left in the dust soon.

I'm sorry but I would trade 1st rounders to the Heat if they would swap Riley and Spo for Ainge and Brad. Multiple 1sts. Not even in the same league. Brad does his best job coaching with minimal talent on the roster. He gets the most out of his bridge teams but teams that have the pressure to perform he cannot coach. He can't connect with stars. It doesn't mean he sucks but he is just not the coach who will lead you to an NBA title. Will never happen. Doesn't mean he's bad. Hell look at Pringles. He's an assistant in Brooklyn had some really good teams but never could get over the hump. But is he a good coach? Absolutely.

[Ernest]

Celtics need a major shake up and since it’s unlikely that we can trade Kemba changing coaches seems like the move. You can’t have the team show a complete lack of effort 2 out of the last 3 years.

I don't see why we can't trade Kemba. This forum has lowered his value like crazy but i'm not sure the rest of the world has. He put up good numbers, is a marketable player and takes a ton of charges. I don't think we can trade him for an allstar, but if we just want to trade him for someone cheaper and not as good to save money I don't see why we can't. There will always be some bad teams that can't sign anyone good and are way under the cap.

[Ernest]

Brad seems like a good guy and he's a really solid coach but here's the issue, to be honest it's our issue in the front office too, he's just been here too long without winning anything. He's the longest tenured coach we've ever had that hasn't won a title. He's actually coached here longer than KC Jones. If two titles didn't buy KC Jones extra years, what has Brad done to deserve the extra time?

The Celtics are so risk averse that it's crippling them. Look around the league, how many teams have had a coach and GM for as long as we have without winning anything. Even the Pistons eventually let Joe Dumars go and brought in a new voice, not that it's worked out but at least they've tried. I don't dislike Brad or Danny but eventually if you don't win then there has to be some change. I don't really want to hear about the ECF trips. Those teams had no shot against Lebron in the first two and then should have beat the Heat but I'd argue Brad was outcoached badly against Spoelstra.

I understand we've had injuries and bad luck but eventually you start to look at the whole picture and realize, Hayward, Horford, and Kyrie all wanted to leave. That doesn't speak highly of their opinions on Brad and Danny being able to lead a championship team.

That logic is silly.

Let's look at Doc. What has he won after leaving us? He went left us because we were rebuilding to go to a really good team. Now moved on to another really good team. How many more titles than Brad does he have?

You are setting up impossible standards. A title every few years to keep your job? I really can't tell if this forum is just trolling as a joke.

[celtics543]

Brad seems like a good guy and he's a really solid coach but here's the issue, to be honest it's our issue in the front office too, he's just been here too long without winning anything. He's the longest tenured coach we've ever had that hasn't won a title. He's actually coached here longer than KC Jones. If two titles didn't buy KC Jones extra years, what has Brad done to deserve the extra time?

The Celtics are so risk averse that it's crippling them. Look around the league, how many teams have had a coach and GM for as long as we have without winning anything. Even the Pistons eventually let Joe Dumars go and brought in a new voice, not that it's worked out but at least they've tried. I don't dislike Brad or Danny but eventually if you don't win then there has to be some change. I don't really want to hear about the ECF trips. Those teams had no shot against Lebron in the first two and then should have beat the Heat but I'd argue Brad was outcoached badly against Spoelstra.

I understand we've had injuries and bad luck but eventually you start to look at the whole picture and realize, Hayward, Horford, and Kyrie all wanted to leave. That doesn't speak highly of their opinions on Brad and Danny being able to lead a championship team.

That logic is silly.

Let's look at Doc. What has he won after leaving us? He went left us because we were rebuilding to go to a really good team. Now moved on to another really good team. How many more titles than Brad does he have?

You are setting up impossible standards. A title every few years to keep your job? I really can't tell if this forum is just trolling as a joke.

How many coaches keep their job for this long without winning a title? I'm not trying to troll. You brought up Doc which is interesting because he's considered a good coach by everyone but the Clippers still fired him because he'd been there so long without winning a title.

Is there a single coach in the league that's been with their team as long as Brad without winning a title? Sometimes it's just time to move on.

[Triple7]

I've seen so many comments about Brad's lack of an offensive system that I started buying into it myself. But last night was really striking. In the first half when the starters were playing it looked like everything was ISO and there was no offensive system at all. But then the bench played the 2nd half and suddenly they were actually running sets and getting a lot of open looks.

Fans talk about coaches like they have a remote control and everything the players do reflects the will of the coach. But in reality all the coach can do is trust the guys to play right and then stand there getting a headache when they don't.

If that is true, then the starters have definitely checked out on Brad. I have been saying this since that **** season with Kyrie. All that chucking 3’s non stop and isos, i was questioning if that was Brad’s offensive system, because if it’s not, then players are deliberately not following him. Then that doesn’t look good either for Stevens.

[Triple7]

Brad seems like a good guy and he's a really solid coach but here's the issue, to be honest it's our issue in the front office too, he's just been here too long without winning anything. He's the longest tenured coach we've ever had that hasn't won a title. He's actually coached here longer than KC Jones. If two titles didn't buy KC Jones extra years, what has Brad done to deserve the extra time?

The Celtics are so risk averse that it's crippling them. Look around the league, how many teams have had a coach and GM for as long as we have without winning anything. Even the Pistons eventually let Joe Dumars go and brought in a new voice, not that it's worked out but at least they've tried. I don't dislike Brad or Danny but eventually if you don't win then there has to be some change. I don't really want to hear about the ECF trips. Those teams had no shot against Lebron in the first two and then should have beat the Heat but I'd argue Brad was outcoached badly against Spoelstra.

I understand we've had injuries and bad luck but eventually you start to look at the whole picture and realize, Hayward, Horford, and Kyrie all wanted to leave. That doesn't speak highly of their opinions on Brad and Danny being able to lead a championship team.

That logic is silly.

Let's look at Doc. What has he won after leaving us? He went left us because we were rebuilding to go to a really good team. Now moved on to another really good team. How many more titles than Brad does he have?

You are setting up impossible standards. A title every few years to keep your job? I really can't tell if this forum is just trolling as a joke.

How many coaches keep their job for this long without winning a title? I'm not trying to troll. You brought up Doc which is interesting because he's considered a good coach by everyone but the Clippers still fired him because he'd been there so long without winning a title.

Is there a single coach in the league that's been with their team as long as Brad without winning a title? Sometimes it's just time to move on.

I agree with this. If it’s not working for almost a decade now, then i think the team needs to go in a different direction. New culture, new coach is what this team needs.