Draft Thread Part 4

[Steelo Green]

If it was up to some of this fanbase DeRozan wouldn't have even been on the roster to trade for Kawhi because he would've been dealt for Andrew Wiggins or Josh Jackson

This is some serious disingenuity. Let’s forever reference one trade as a barometer for everything.

So Wiseman + 6 which isn’t Wiggins or Jackson is a bad trade for a meh Siakam?

What do you think Siakam is worth?

Seriously why do people reference perhaps the best trade of the DECADE as the barometer?!

Just continuing to completely ignore top 5 players in the league...

A) hardly EVER happen to be available and to make for even more miniscule odds...

B) we'll be the franchise that a team wants to trade to because we're apparently CERTAIN to have the trade package whatever team wants for said player, that's guaranteed right?!

It's not ridiculous at all to bank your future on that

/greenfont

For me the hindsight is 20/20 is what is being used.

To trade Demar for the number one pick + the 6th pick is a great trade value wise.

To reference the Kawhi trade is to say that we should wait out for those circumstances again.

Pascal for Wiseman + a top 6 pick is a no brainer if we go the rebuild route.

We would have 2 top ten picks, Wiseman and if that Fred trade went through, more young assets and could rebuild really quickly.

[Par36]

You wouldn’t take Wiseman + a top 5 pick for Siakam?

Both trades are actually great if you want to rebuild.

Maybe top 3 post lottery but I wouldn't settle for 5 if the only other return is Wiseman

Wiseman was hurt all year. He’s an elite prospect.

You guys really overvalue what Pascal is worth.

...or you underestimate him?

Overestimate every young player?

But hey...it's a awful hot take. It's what you do!

[UnbelievablyRAW]

I think if Toronto felt uncomfortable with the riskier guys like Barnes, Giddey, Cooper, or Jones, then we need to seriously consider Jaden Springer. I mentioned him a lot before but the more I think about how picks the FO is, he seems like a safe as a pick while also being one of the youngest in the class implying some upside.

Springer is crazy strong which allows him to play above his size. Looking at the numbers 2.0% block% and 44 FTr shows that even though he is not the biggest burst player in the college he was a physical contact type of guy. He also shot 44% from three, TS% .575.

I think he projects as an off-ball guard by most people, but I wonder if he could SF in some line-ups like Norm was. Being able to play three positions, great defense, strong driver, poise/swagger/IT facto are what makes him fit Toronto. This guy was always the youngest player on the court in college and he never felt that way. He would be a modern Kyle with a few more inches of height and wingspan and vert.

He didn't dunk a ton in college but he has bounce:

Read on Twitter

Spoiler:

Without a clogged paint, you can see how in prep school he could fly:

Read on Twitter

Look at that shot chart!

Read on Twitter

He’s gonna go around 20 and it’s why I want the Knicks or Lakers pick

[ATLTimekeeper]

As opposed to what??? Do you want a prospect to say that I have no room for improvement or something along those lines??

To me it shows that he wants to take his game to a next level, and knows the difference between a well rounded player and a Jordan clarkson. I don't get how you can knock a guy for saying and understanding the right things.

You don't have to knock him but you also don't have take it as gospel. Of course everyone is going to say the right things before the draft.

Then why does every organization bother to do them if it all should just be considered practiced pandering?

Sounds like you've received some answers to this, but it's been pointed out that some teams are frustrated with the level of interview coaching that's occurred lately, and there have also been accounts of players rattled by the aggressive interview strategies some teams will use.

But, to be clear, this isn't a team's interview. This is the ESPN draft wonk. The customer here isn't the individual team, who are busy collecting way more information on players than Schmitz will. The customer is you and me.

If it's a prospective lotto pick that teams are interested in, they'll get hours with him, hours with all his teammates, acquaintances and former coaches. They'll have their own little tests that are unique to that team, and lines of inquiry about how that player fits into their specific team.

[Federalies]

While I’ll be interested in the combine measurements and interview insight into a player like Jaden Springer, given his age and skill profile, I still think we’ll seriously look at a prospect like Moses Moody. The way he gets talked about by half the folks on this board you’d think the dude was 80 and had some archaic skill set. He’s still one of the youngest players in the draft, 6’6” with a 7’1” wingspan and starts minimally as a 3&D prospect. If our staff can teach Pascal and OG how to dribble competently, I have no doubt they can turn a competent ball handler into an above average one. He’d push Trent for the starting position at the 2 and slide into the 3 in any small ball closing lineup.

Watch on YouTube

[ATLTimekeeper]

In case we get in the top 1-4 range can someone a case for us drafting Evan Mobley. I've watched alot of tape on him and I don't see much. He is a very mobile Center but with the NBA moving away from bigs is he worth drafting top 2? If your getting a center in the top 3 your hoping for a player like Embiid but he seems to be pointing towards Mo Bamba. He has alot of hype but I wouldn't want to draft him in the top 4 tbh

He rotates and switches extremely well for his size, he has a shooting touch and should develop a 3 pt shot. He'll easily get to 230-240 lbs. Excellent passer. Higher ceiling Adebayo. I still favour a scorer but wouldn't be upset with Mobley. Our defense would improve a lot.

His defensive impact isn't the concern. Worst case scenario he pans out to become a rim running Clint Capela. But the offense is what is the problem for me. I don't see Adebayo or Ayton in his offense. His potential is purely hype at this moment. Your banking on what he can become and majority of the time Centers never hit that potential going that high in the draft.

I think his feel for the game is exceptional. Mo Bamba wasn't capably of making passes off the dribble, reading mismatches, taking the ball up the court and initiating offensive sets. These are all things Mobley was doing at USC. These aren't things that Capela or Ayton do or could do either. This is pretty unique to Mobley. He reads the game as a guard, and when he posts up he transitions to reading the game as a big man. While it's still an unknown, he did play with another "traditional C" in college, so I think there's positional versatility with him (like AD).

I'm not sure that Cs don't live up to their potential. AD, KAT, Ayton, Cousins, JV, Embiid, Porzingis worked out just fine for their top 5 position.

Zeller, Len, Okafor, Bender and potentially Wiseman didn't. Majority worked out. The only really uber hyped bust was Okafor.

Mobley is the best prospect in the draft in my eyes. Highest potential to be an impact player on both ends with rock solid stats.

[Indeed]

This is some serious disingenuity. Let’s forever reference one trade as a barometer for everything.

So Wiseman + 6 which isn’t Wiggins or Jackson is a bad trade for a meh Siakam?

What do you think Siakam is worth?

Seriously why do people reference perhaps the best trade of the DECADE as the barometer?!

Just continuing to completely ignore top 5 players in the league...

A) hardly EVER happen to be available and to make for even more miniscule odds...

B) we'll be the franchise that a team wants to trade to because we're apparently CERTAIN to have the trade package whatever team wants for said player, that's guaranteed right?!

It's not ridiculous at all to bank your future on that

/greenfont

For me the hindsight is 20/20 is what is being used.

To trade Demar for the number one pick + the 6th pick is a great trade value wise.

To reference the Kawhi trade is to say that we should wait out for those circumstances again.

Pascal for Wiseman + a top 6 pick is a no brainer if we go the rebuild route.

We would have 2 top ten picks, Wiseman and if that Fred trade went through, more young assets and could rebuild really quickly.

Draft picks are always overrated. Even this year #1 overall pick may not be better than Siakam.

I mean Zion Williams (1st overall pick few years ago) would be similar level to Siakam, you still need more talent to surround Zion for them to be a contender (maybe we should begin with them making to the playoffs).

Most teams have success drafting star guards, but over the last few drafts, there were not many top 5 picks that are 6'8 plus better than Siakam. Probably Tatum, but we are better off keeping Siakam. And that being said, we are not rebuilding, as we are unlikely to get better. What we should focus is start drafting someone for development, while we continue with the players we developed.

[Indeed]

He rotates and switches extremely well for his size, he has a shooting touch and should develop a 3 pt shot. He'll easily get to 230-240 lbs. Excellent passer. Higher ceiling Adebayo. I still favour a scorer but wouldn't be upset with Mobley. Our defense would improve a lot.

His defensive impact isn't the concern. Worst case scenario he pans out to become a rim running Clint Capela. But the offense is what is the problem for me. I don't see Adebayo or Ayton in his offense. His potential is purely hype at this moment. Your banking on what he can become and majority of the time Centers never hit that potential going that high in the draft.

I think his feel for the game is exceptional. Mo Bamba wasn't capably of making passes off the dribble, reading mismatches, taking the ball up the court and initiating offensive sets. These are all things Mobley was doing at USC. These aren't things that Capela or Ayton do or could do either. This is pretty unique to Mobley. He reads the game as a guard, and when he posts up he transitions to reading the game as a big man. While it's still an unknown, he did play with another "traditional C" in college, so I think there's positional versatility with him (like AD).

I'm not sure that Cs don't live up to their potential. AD, KAT, Ayton, Cousins, JV, Embiid, Porzingis worked out just fine for their top 5 position.

Zeller, Len, Okafor, Bender and potentially Wiseman didn't. Majority worked out. The only really uber hyped bust was Okafor.

Mobley is the best prospect in the draft in my eyes. Highest potential to be an impact player on both ends with rock solid stats.

The Ringer explained that he is one of the rare bigs with go-to scoring potential. Has touch, handle, feel, and fluidity.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

[UnbelievablyRAW]

Seriously why do people reference perhaps the best trade of the DECADE as the barometer?!

Just continuing to completely ignore top 5 players in the league...

A) hardly EVER happen to be available and to make for even more miniscule odds...

B) we'll be the franchise that a team wants to trade to because we're apparently CERTAIN to have the trade package whatever team wants for said player, that's guaranteed right?!

It's not ridiculous at all to bank your future on that

/greenfont

For me the hindsight is 20/20 is what is being used.

To trade Demar for the number one pick + the 6th pick is a great trade value wise.

To reference the Kawhi trade is to say that we should wait out for those circumstances again.

Pascal for Wiseman + a top 6 pick is a no brainer if we go the rebuild route.

We would have 2 top ten picks, Wiseman and if that Fred trade went through, more young assets and could rebuild really quickly.

Draft picks are always overrated. Even this year #1 overall pick may not be better than Siakam.

I mean Zion Williams (1st overall pick few years ago) would be similar level to Siakam, you still need more talent to surround Zion for them to be a contender (maybe we should begin with them making to the playoffs).

Most teams have success drafting star guards, but over the last few drafts, there were not many top 5 picks that are 6'8 plus better than Siakam. Probably Tatum, but we are better off keeping Siakam. And that being said, we are not rebuilding, as we are unlikely to get better. What we should focus is start drafting someone for development, while we continue with the players we developed.

My dude, Zion was better than Pascal almost the second he stepped into the NBA. There certainly isn’t a case for Pascal right now over current Zion

[ATLTimekeeper]

The Ringer explained that he is one of the rare bigs with go-to scoring potential. Has touch, handle, feel, and fluidity.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

He's the only player I'd trade up for. I'm sold.

[Federalies]

Can someone please call “Tankathon” and ask them to update their Mock Draft and Big Board?

My refresh button can’t take much more...that is all!

[tecumseh18]

The Ringer explained that he is one of the rare bigs with go-to scoring potential. Has touch, handle, feel, and fluidity.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

He's the only player I'd trade up for. I'm sold.

I dunno. Taking a big who can't really shoot (yet) this high is so risky.

MINUSES

Thin frame and high center of gravity limit his upside for physical battles against the likes of Joel Embiid and Nikola Jokic; early in his career, at least, he’s best suited in lineups with a stronger big.

Lacks an advanced low post game. As my colleague Jonathan Tjarks wrote, “Shaquille O’Neal will probably hate him.”

Extending his range will take time. He’s a subpar free throw shooter, and not a reliable 3-point shooter.

Needs to tighten his handle as he occasionally loses control of the ball when trying more complex moves.

BTW, O'Connor mocks the 6-7-8 as Davion, Keon and Jalen Johnson. Why the hell would Warriors want Davion?

[Jadoogar]

The Ringer explained that he is one of the rare bigs with go-to scoring potential. Has touch, handle, feel, and fluidity.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

He's the only player I'd trade up for. I'm sold.

I dunno. Taking a big who can't really shoot (yet) this high is so risky.

MINUSES

Thin frame and high center of gravity limit his upside for physical battles against the likes of Joel Embiid and Nikola Jokic; early in his career, at least, he’s best suited in lineups with a stronger big.

Lacks an advanced low post game. As my colleague Jonathan Tjarks wrote, “Shaquille O’Neal will probably hate him.”

Extending his range will take time. He’s a subpar free throw shooter, and not a reliable 3-point shooter.

Needs to tighten his handle as he occasionally loses control of the ball when trying more complex moves.

BTW, O'Connor mocks the 6-7-8 as Davion, Keon and Jalen Johnson. Why the hell would Warriors want Davion?

KOC only posted a big board so far, he'll do a mock after the lottery.
edit: nvm it posted today

[Psubs]

The Ringer explained that he is one of the rare bigs with go-to scoring potential. Has touch, handle, feel, and fluidity.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/mock-draft

He's the only player I'd trade up for. I'm sold.

I dunno. Taking a big who can't really shoot (yet) this high is so risky.

MINUSES

Thin frame and high center of gravity limit his upside for physical battles against the likes of Joel Embiid and Nikola Jokic; early in his career, at least, he’s best suited in lineups with a stronger big.

Lacks an advanced low post game. As my colleague Jonathan Tjarks wrote, “Shaquille O’Neal will probably hate him.”

Extending his range will take time. He’s a subpar free throw shooter, and not a reliable 3-point shooter.

Needs to tighten his handle as he occasionally loses control of the ball when trying more complex moves.

BTW, O'Connor mocks the 6-7-8 as Davion, Keon and Jalen Johnson. Why the hell would Warriors want Davion?

So Davion can guard the opponents quickest or best guard or even small forward.

PG Mitchell - Curry
SG Curry - Poole
SF Klay - Wiggins
PF Draymond - Wiggins
C Wiseman - Looney

[ATLTimekeeper]

I dunno. Taking a big who can't really shoot (yet) this high is so risky.

He can shoot. Also, 70% from the FT line is pretty good for a C. I wouldn't call that a minus like these guys have. Like, AD and Embiid couldn't really shoot, either. If that's the measure we're going with. I have full confidence he'll be able to shoot.

BTW, O'Connor mocks the 6-7-8 as Davion, Keon and Jalen Johnson. Why the hell would Warriors want Davion?

I don't know. I generally don't care what these guys have to say, but maybe he thinks they would like a 3rd guard to compete with Steph's declining window?

[DreamTeam09]

He's the only player I'd trade up for. I'm sold.

I dunno. Taking a big who can't really shoot (yet) this high is so risky.

MINUSES

Thin frame and high center of gravity limit his upside for physical battles against the likes of Joel Embiid and Nikola Jokic; early in his career, at least, he’s best suited in lineups with a stronger big.

Lacks an advanced low post game. As my colleague Jonathan Tjarks wrote, “Shaquille O’Neal will probably hate him.”

Extending his range will take time. He’s a subpar free throw shooter, and not a reliable 3-point shooter.

Needs to tighten his handle as he occasionally loses control of the ball when trying more complex moves.

BTW, O'Connor mocks the 6-7-8 as Davion, Keon and Jalen Johnson. Why the hell would Warriors want Davion?

So Davion can guard the opponents quickest or best guard or even small forward.

PG Mitchell - Curry
SG Curry - Poole
SF Klay - Wiggins
PF Draymond - Wiggins
C Wiseman - Looney

Benching Wiggins for Mitchell makes little sense. And it's not like Mitchell is an above avg playmaker.

Losing too much size when you can have Klay and Wiggins on the wings.

Mitchell might make some sense in a 6th man role

[Steelo Green]

Seriously why do people reference perhaps the best trade of the DECADE as the barometer?!

Just continuing to completely ignore top 5 players in the league...

A) hardly EVER happen to be available and to make for even more miniscule odds...

B) we'll be the franchise that a team wants to trade to because we're apparently CERTAIN to have the trade package whatever team wants for said player, that's guaranteed right?!

It's not ridiculous at all to bank your future on that

/greenfont

For me the hindsight is 20/20 is what is being used.

To trade Demar for the number one pick + the 6th pick is a great trade value wise.

To reference the Kawhi trade is to say that we should wait out for those circumstances again.

Pascal for Wiseman + a top 6 pick is a no brainer if we go the rebuild route.

We would have 2 top ten picks, Wiseman and if that Fred trade went through, more young assets and could rebuild really quickly.

Draft picks are always overrated. Even this year #1 overall pick may not be better than Siakam.

I mean Zion Williams (1st overall pick few years ago) would be similar level to Siakam, you still need more talent to surround Zion for them to be a contender (maybe we should begin with them making to the playoffs).

Most teams have success drafting star guards, but over the last few drafts, there were not many top 5 picks that are 6'8 plus better than Siakam. Probably Tatum, but we are better off keeping Siakam. And that being said, we are not rebuilding, as we are unlikely to get better. What we should focus is start drafting someone for development, while we continue with the players we developed.

Pascal wasn’t even a top 5 pick in retrospect in his own class.

Anyone in the NBA would trade Pascal for Cade.

This team next year barring a huge lottery win will fight for the playoffs and people are eating it up in excitement thinking the next Kawhi is just knocking at the door, not remembering the fact that our best player in our 7 year run is finished as a Raptor.

People really excited for Fred, Pascal and OG?

Look at the duos/trios in the NBA.

Toronto is going to keep falling. We will be in the lottery soon anyways with this group but likely low lottery because we are literally in no mans land as is.

Rebuilding from the bottom up is way better to go than pursue your 1-2 options as below average league efficiency players who one cannot shoot to save his life and the other is just a glorified three point shooter.

[tecumseh18]

BTW, O'Connor mocks the 6-7-8 as Davion, Keon and Jalen Johnson. Why the hell would Warriors want Davion?

So Davion can guard the opponents quickest or best guard or even small forward.

Benching Wiggins for Mitchell makes little sense. And it's not like Mitchell is an above avg playmaker.

Losing too much size when you can have Klay and Wiggins on the wings.

Mitchell might make some sense in a 6th man role

Sure. So Davion should be, and probably will be drafted in the teens. To pick a guy at #6 to come off the bench for the foreseeable future strikes me as not good asset management.

But one way or another, GSW is gonna trade the Minny pick if it conveys and maybe their own pick to get a real forward. If it ends up fourth, maybe for Pascal. If it's sixth, not Pascal (who's worth more than Davion f'n Mitchell).

[DangerZone13]

I really don't understand the appeal for so many posters here to "tear it all down", and rebuild ground-up. This isn't Masai (or his people)'s M.O., and expecting that for the Raptors is setting yourself up for disappointment.

You can be a fan of more than one team - if you enjoy following the rebuilding process, why not adopt the Thunder as your second team. Unless it's all about s***posting, in which case, leave it on Twitter dude. Some people just have a "crabs in a bucket" mentality.

All that said, there's seemingly already a consensus top 5-6. Typically the combine causes at least 1-2 names to catch fire and rise up the boards, possibly shaking one of those other names down to 7. There's a lot of talent in this draft - I trust the Raptors are gonna get a good one.

[PhilBlackson]

Seriously why do people reference perhaps the best trade of the DECADE as the barometer?!

Just continuing to completely ignore top 5 players in the league...

A) hardly EVER happen to be available and to make for even more miniscule odds...

B) we'll be the franchise that a team wants to trade to because we're apparently CERTAIN to have the trade package whatever team wants for said player, that's guaranteed right?!

It's not ridiculous at all to bank your future on that

/greenfont

For me the hindsight is 20/20 is what is being used.

To trade Demar for the number one pick + the 6th pick is a great trade value wise.

To reference the Kawhi trade is to say that we should wait out for those circumstances again.

Pascal for Wiseman + a top 6 pick is a no brainer if we go the rebuild route.

We would have 2 top ten picks, Wiseman and if that Fred trade went through, more young assets and could rebuild really quickly.

Draft picks are always overrated. Even this year #1 overall pick may not be better than Siakam.

I mean Zion Williams (1st overall pick few years ago) would be similar level to Siakam, you still need more talent to surround Zion for them to be a contender (maybe we should begin with them making to the playoffs).

Most teams have success drafting star guards, but over the last few drafts, there were not many top 5 picks that are 6'8 plus better than Siakam. Probably Tatum, but we are better off keeping Siakam. And that being said, we are not rebuilding, as we are unlikely to get better. What we should focus is start drafting someone for development, while we continue with the players we developed.

I'm no Zion homer but you can't seriously believe Siakam is on par with Zion now or ever....

Zion's ROOKIE numbers match Siakam's BEST and now just dwarf's him, within 2-3 years that will be a laughable comparison if it isn't already.

I'm also willing to bet my account not only will Cade have a better career than Siakam but you can throw in Green and Mobley and you can put that in a sig to cash in later.