Draft Thread Part 4

[Reeko]

I think if Toronto felt uncomfortable with the riskier guys like Barnes, Giddey, Cooper, or Jones, then we need to seriously consider Jaden Springer. I mentioned him a lot before but the more I think about how picks the FO is, he seems like a safe as a pick while also being one of the youngest in the class implying some upside.

Springer is crazy strong which allows him to play above his size. Looking at the numbers 2.0% block% and 44 FTr shows that even though he is not the biggest burst player in the college he was a physical contact type of guy. He also shot 44% from three, TS% .575.

I think he projects as an off-ball guard by most people, but I wonder if he could SF in some line-ups like Norm was. Being able to play three positions, great defense, strong driver, poise/swagger/IT facto are what makes him fit Toronto. This guy was always the youngest player on the court in college and he never felt that way. He would be a modern Kyle with a few more inches of height and wingspan and vert.

He didn't dunk a ton in college but he has bounce:

Read on Twitter

Spoiler:

Without a clogged paint, you can see how in prep school he could fly:

Read on Twitter

Look at that shot chart!

Read on Twitter

He’s gonna go around 20 and it’s why I want the Knicks or Lakers pick

What? Springer is a lottery pick easily. He's most likely top 10, but definitely lottery. There's no way he's there at 20.

[tecumseh18]

I really don't understand the appeal for so many posters here to "tear it all down", and rebuild ground-up. This isn't Masai (or his people)'s M.O., and expecting that for the Raptors is setting yourself up for disappointment.

You can be a fan of more than one team - if you enjoy following the rebuilding process, why not adopt the Thunder as your second team. Unless it's all about s***posting, in which case, leave it on Twitter dude. Some people just have a "crabs in a bucket" mentality.

All that said, there's seemingly already a consensus top 5-6. Typically the combine causes at least 1-2 names to catch fire and rise up the boards, possibly shaking one of those other names down to 7. There's a lot of talent in this draft - I trust the Raptors are gonna get a good one.

Just to make it clear, I was mainly attempting to rebut the idea that Raps would trade Siakam to GSW for the 6th pick (plus Wiggins). That just wouldn't happen (unless Kuminga was still on the board and the Raps really liked him). You can't trade a known, controlled quantity who was all-NBA the previous season for a pig in a poke.

But I was also acknowledging that if GSW got the fourth pick, then there is the possibility of a trade there. Depending on who was left at four (and five). If Green is still on the board, yes. Not saying I'd want to trade, but GSW would be in a position to make a Godfather offer that the Raps would have to listen to.

Pascal is currently being paid for every ounce of his production. Raps are not realizing any net "profit" there in terms of player value. So trading a player like that in the abstract is really a neutral proposition for the team. They can use that salary in more efficient ways. But taking on Wiggins' ridiculous salary for another two years is the opposite of value investing.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

I really don't understand the appeal for so many posters here to "tear it all down", and rebuild ground-up. This isn't Masai (or his people)'s M.O., and expecting that for the Raptors is setting yourself up for disappointment.

You can be a fan of more than one team - if you enjoy following the rebuilding process, why not adopt the Thunder as your second team. Unless it's all about s***posting, in which case, leave it on Twitter dude. Some people just have a "crabs in a bucket" mentality.

All that said, there's seemingly already a consensus top 5-6. Typically the combine causes at least 1-2 names to catch fire and rise up the boards, possibly shaking one of those other names down to 7. There's a lot of talent in this draft - I trust the Raptors are gonna get a good one.

Just to make it clear, I was mainly attempting to rebut the idea that Raps would trade Siakam to GSW for the 6th pick (plus Wiggins). That just wouldn't happen (unless Kuminga was still on the board and the Raps really liked him). You can't trade a known, controlled quantity who was all-NBA the previous season for a pig in a poke.

But I was also acknowledging that if GSW got the fourth pick, then there is the possibility of a trade there. Depending on who was left at four (and five). If Green is still on the board, yes. Not saying I'd want to trade, but GSW would be in a position to make a Godfather offer that the Raps would have to listen to.

Pascal is currently being paid for every ounce of his production. Raps are not realizing any net "profit" there in terms of player value. So trading a player like that in the abstract is really a neutral proposition for the team. They can use that salary in more efficient ways. But taking on Wiggins' ridiculous salary for another two years is the opposite of value investing.

you can say that for many players in this league. You don't make a move for the sake of making a move. Siakam isn't 30+ or even reached his career prime, imho. and plus like you said, Wiggins is coming back, so that is a big no for me.

[DG88]

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=TheHardwoodHerald

[CoinTossRoss31]

I think if Toronto felt uncomfortable with the riskier guys like Barnes, Giddey, Cooper, or Jones, then we need to seriously consider Jaden Springer. I mentioned him a lot before but the more I think about how picks the FO is, he seems like a safe as a pick while also being one of the youngest in the class implying some upside.

Springer is crazy strong which allows him to play above his size. Looking at the numbers 2.0% block% and 44 FTr shows that even though he is not the biggest burst player in the college he was a physical contact type of guy. He also shot 44% from three, TS% .575.

I think he projects as an off-ball guard by most people, but I wonder if he could SF in some line-ups like Norm was. Being able to play three positions, great defense, strong driver, poise/swagger/IT facto are what makes him fit Toronto. This guy was always the youngest player on the court in college and he never felt that way. He would be a modern Kyle with a few more inches of height and wingspan and vert.

He didn't dunk a ton in college but he has bounce:

Read on Twitter

Spoiler:

Without a clogged paint, you can see how in prep school he could fly:

Read on Twitter

Look at that shot chart!

Read on Twitter

He’s gonna go around 20 and it’s why I want the Knicks or Lakers pick

What? Springer is a lottery pick easily. He's most likely top 10, but definitely lottery. There's no way he's there at 20.

Depending how the lottery shapes up I can totally see springer going 15-25

[Reeko]

He’s gonna go around 20 and it’s why I want the Knicks or Lakers pick

What? Springer is a lottery pick easily. He's most likely top 10, but definitely lottery. There's no way he's there at 20.

Depending how the lottery shapes up I can totally see springer going 15-25

There is almost no chance of that happening.

[720]

Holy moly!

[CoinTossRoss31]

What? Springer is a lottery pick easily. He's most likely top 10, but definitely lottery. There's no way he's there at 20.

Depending how the lottery shapes up I can totally see springer going 15-25

There is almost no chance of that happening.

Lol okay there bud. This draft is so fluid from 6-25 that anything can happen. But I guess we will just have to see

[PhilBlackson]

I think if Toronto felt uncomfortable with the riskier guys like Barnes, Giddey, Cooper, or Jones, then we need to seriously consider Jaden Springer. I mentioned him a lot before but the more I think about how picks the FO is, he seems like a safe as a pick while also being one of the youngest in the class implying some upside.

Springer is crazy strong which allows him to play above his size. Looking at the numbers 2.0% block% and 44 FTr shows that even though he is not the biggest burst player in the college he was a physical contact type of guy. He also shot 44% from three, TS% .575.

I think he projects as an off-ball guard by most people, but I wonder if he could SF in some line-ups like Norm was. Being able to play three positions, great defense, strong driver, poise/swagger/IT facto are what makes him fit Toronto. This guy was always the youngest player on the court in college and he never felt that way. He would be a modern Kyle with a few more inches of height and wingspan and vert.

He didn't dunk a ton in college but he has bounce:

Read on Twitter

Spoiler:

Without a clogged paint, you can see how in prep school he could fly:

Read on Twitter

Look at that shot chart!

Read on Twitter

He’s gonna go around 20 and it’s why I want the Knicks or Lakers pick

What? Springer is a lottery pick easily. He's most likely top 10, but definitely lottery. There's no way he's there at 20.

I'm not sure where Springer lands but I think it's far from definitive he's drafted in the top 15. Looking at many of the names in that 6-15 range I can easily see the following go before (whether it turned out to be the right decision or not isn't the question)...

I can name 9 (which would put him outside the lottery), I'm pretty confident will go ahead of him..

Barnes
Bouknight
Moody
Sengun
Mann
Mitchell
K Johnson
J Johnson

Then there's a big group after I can see possibly going too...

Williams
Giddey
Garuba
Ayo
Wagner
Kispert
Jones
Christopher
Thomas
Butler

That's 24 players (with the top 5 included) that could very easily see going before him. Not saying they will but there is definitely a CHANCE (and I think a fairly good one) that he isn't gone in the lottery.

[bon]

This is some serious disingenuity. Let’s forever reference one trade as a barometer for everything.

So Wiseman + 6 which isn’t Wiggins or Jackson is a bad trade for a meh Siakam?

What do you think Siakam is worth?

Seriously why do people reference perhaps the best trade of the DECADE as the barometer?!

Just continuing to completely ignore top 5 players in the league...

A) hardly EVER happen to be available and to make for even more miniscule odds...

B) we'll be the franchise that a team wants to trade to because we're apparently CERTAIN to have the trade package whatever team wants for said player, that's guaranteed right?!

It's not ridiculous at all to bank your future on that

/greenfont

For me the hindsight is 20/20 is what is being used.

To trade Demar for the number one pick + the 6th pick is a great trade value wise.

To reference the Kawhi trade is to say that we should wait out for those circumstances again.

Pascal for Wiseman + a top 6 pick is a no brainer if we go the rebuild route.

We would have 2 top ten picks, Wiseman and if that Fred trade went through, more young assets and could rebuild really quickly.

How did you both miss the point that you don't just trade one of your top assets for cheap? It's bad asset management, obviously the barometer for trading SIakam isn't just for a superstar. I already said the package is okay if the pick is higher than 5-6, but you're not acknowledging the huge drop after the top 4-5. Otherwise who are you taking at #6 to justify making that trade?

Again if you don't think the Warriors are frantically trying to package an unready Wiseman and a pick for an allstar I don't know what to tell you lol.

[Dalek]

He’s gonna go around 20 and it’s why I want the Knicks or Lakers pick

What? Springer is a lottery pick easily. He's most likely top 10, but definitely lottery. There's no way he's there at 20.

Depending how the lottery shapes up I can totally see springer going 15-25

To me, Springer could go anywhere in the first. It really depends on if people want to believe in all of these big wings. A guy like Ziaire, Greg Brown, Brandon Boston are all lowly rated right now, but that kind of size and athleticism and potential could sway people.

I personally think Springer from a fit perspective is ideal for Toronto and getting an 18 year-old that is as developed as he is already is an easy move. He will be a very solid pro with some Devin Booker or Jimmy Butler like potential. I think he may grow a bit more, but even if his skills improve marginally, he should be a lock to be a starter. He'd be the first real AAU prep star Toronto has on their roster. He has already been a basketball lifer at this stage.

[VanWest82]

Evan Mobley is from SD. Maybe Kawhi will put in a good word for us.

[Reeko]

Evan Mobley is from SD. Maybe Kawhi will put in a good word for us.

Nah, Mobley's about to hire Uncle Dennis as his agent.

[VanWest82]

Evan Mobley is from SD. Maybe Kawhi will put in a good word for us.

Nah, Mobley's about to hire Uncle Dennis as his agent.

Bet Uncle Dennis has good things to say about us. We gave them everything they wanted including a title and negotiating power over the Clippers. And don't forget about the RealGM Toronto Uber story!

[Jerry Lucas]

Jeez Coach K was so rattled from coaching a player as soft as Jalen Johnson that he couldn't take it anymore and retired.

[VanWest82]

Jeez Coach K was so rattled from coaching a player as soft as Jalen Johnson that he couldn't take it anymore and retired.

Jalen Johnson just doesn’t have what it takes to keep a full head of all black hair into his 70s.

[tdotrep2]

Evan Mobley is from SD. Maybe Kawhi will put in a good word for us.

the only team mobley follows is the raptors

[720]

[PhilBlackson]

Evan Mobley is from SD. Maybe Kawhi will put in a good word for us.

the only team mobley follows is the raptors

The conspiracy nut in me says the fix is in for Silver disrespecting Masai for the cop incident, not to mention not supporting the Raptors more financially in Tampa. I don't believe it's the case but it is an odd thing to me out of all the teams why just the Raps though...

While personally I want Jalen Green more than anyone in the draft, it would be amazing to get Mobley and hard to pass on a guy with that kinda talent that actually loves the team...

[Morse Code]

I really don't understand the appeal for so many posters here to "tear it all down", and rebuild ground-up. This isn't Masai (or his people)'s M.O., and expecting that for the Raptors is setting yourself up for disappointment.

You can be a fan of more than one team - if you enjoy following the rebuilding process, why not adopt the Thunder as your second team. Unless it's all about s***posting, in which case, leave it on Twitter dude. Some people just have a "crabs in a bucket" mentality.

All that said, there's seemingly already a consensus top 5-6. Typically the combine causes at least 1-2 names to catch fire and rise up the boards, possibly shaking one of those other names down to 7. There's a lot of talent in this draft - I trust the Raptors are gonna get a good one.

The appeal is that it gives us way more chances to get a franchise type player, when we’re in a league ruled by superstars, and currently don’t have anyone with that potential. Add the fact that our assets are good enough to consolidate and get good picks for, it would give us an even higher chance to get a superstar talent. We’re good enough to remain in no mans land for a few years, but not good enough to break the trend and win without a superstar. I’d rather be bad than good, and great than bad.