The Around The NBA Thread

Repeat 3-peat · Post #1141 » by **Repeat 3-peat** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 1:29 am

Nets having no problem without Harden.

Am2626 · Post #1142 » by **Am2626** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 1:29 am

erlim wrote:
Dresden wrote:
erlim wrote:It's insane the two conference champs last year got knocked out in the first round this year. Not good for the NBA to lose Lebron and the Laker's fan views. I thought they would have repeated.

On the contrary, I think it's great for the nba. It's time they get used to the post-lebron era. I think fans are excited to watch the young players in the playoffs too. It's also good in that it strikes a small blow against the Lebron method of building a team by luring high priced FA's to form a super team. Although of course we now have the Nets employing that model and doing well.

I mean he’s probably going to just bring a bunch of elite players to the Lakers to round out the team.

Personally I’m tired of LeBron. Hope he never wins anything again. Let him keep trying to buy himself championships. Will always root for him to lose unless he comes to the Bulls.

Andi Obst · Post #1143 » by **Andi Obst** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 1:38 am

Playing Teague at all is unnecessary. Playing him in the fourth is just ridiculous. What is it with Bud and his weird rotations?

Can’t blame him for most guys playing like **** though.

Post #1144 » by **kulaz3000** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 1:55 am

If Harden is out for the series, though the Bucks lost this game, I think they win the series still.

johnnyvann840 · Post #1145 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 1:57 am

Repeat 3-peat wrote:Nets having no problem without Harden.

Bucks just laid an egg. Blake and Harris really stepped up for the Nets. Bucks just were flat the whole game. Series will be interesting though without Harden.

johnnyvann840 · Post #1146 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 1:58 am

kulaz3000 wrote:If Harden is out for the series, though the Bucks lost this game, I think they win the series still.

Yeah, I tend to agree with you. One game does not make a series and the Bucks could not have played much worse than that.

johnnyvann840 · Post #1147 » by **johnnyvann840** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:03 am

MrSparkle wrote:
Am2626 wrote:
MrSparkle wrote:Booker scored 70 points in a game. His fundamentals and moves are all a step above Zach’s. He does not rely on athleticism to get to the rim, and his shot selection is confident. He’s always been a talented scorer; now his defense and overall awareness has improved. Obviously CP3 and the rest of the pickups (Suns are actually a veteran-laden team) pushed them into #1 seed. I didn’t expect things to work as well; was shorting the Suns all season long cause I was annoyed they let down last year after the hot start. Part of me thinks they were due for (playoff) improvement with or without Paul; obviously they don’t knock Lebron out of round 1 without CP3 keeping pace.

Zach has some work in the awareness/off-ball department to catch up to Booker. I don’t think they’re on par. He has a good chance to work on it with Vuc though.

You replace Booker with LaVine and the Suns are right in the same place. They are still in the playoffs because of CP3. I don’t see any difference between Booker and LaVine. The 70 point game doesn’t really mean anything. Jordan’s career high is 69. Does that make Booker a better player? If everything lines up and the circumstances are right any prolific scorer can go off and score a lot of points in a given game.

I disagree. Booker is a fundamentally/technically more advanced player. Zach is way more athletic; his first step is like a jet compared to Booker. If he had Devin's footwork and craftiness, he'd be a superstar. Devin pump fakes, works a give-and-go, knows how to use screens effectively, has a variety of push shots from either side of the court. Makes very quick decisions on and off the ball. Very developed game. These things don't show up on the stat sheet.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Go ahead and watch the videos. It's obvious to me that Zach is a phenomenal athlete and scorer, but he takes longer to make his move and doesn't exactly create easy looks for himself (rather he's excellent at making wildly difficult shots)... whereas Booker's foot work is classic, text book SG - like a Kobe, Reggie, MJ. Booker is noticeably better off the ball in catch and shoot and cutting to the rim. He also has a post game. Just watch the highlight reel from 3:00 on.

I acknowledge that Zach would be in the playoffs with the current Suns, but I don't think they'd be as good. Stats are stats, and Zach had an amazing season in that regard, but he was also sub 500 in a much worse conference. This year's EC was a joke. Suns had to duel with Luka, Lillard, Morant and the Spurs for the play-in. And FWIW, the Suns were a game out of the play-in in the really deep west last year, and Ayton/Baynes missed a ton of games, so Booker was rolling with a less talented team than this year's Bulls (Mikul and Cam were less developed, still coming off bench in low minute roles). Pretty much Rubio, Oubre and Saric.

I'm rooting for Zach to take another step this year. Obviously could fill the stat sheet, and he's developed winning habits. He's not the reason we sucked. But there are things he could do offensively that would make this team better, as opposed to an underachiever (we all agree Bulls really underachieved, right? - besides the fact Zach missed those 2 weeks, where the team actually settled down a bit). Sooner than blaming Donovan's defensive schemes. The big tell for me was that the offense looked like jumbled junk when Vuc first joined. Anybody would've guessed the defense would be really out of sorts, but Zach and Vuc couldn't make any 2-man plays work. I get that there weren't practices, chemistry - but I have a hard time thinking Vuc doesn't know how to function 1/2 of the PnR. A guy who made it work with the likes of Fournier and DJ Augustin.

Suns slowed the pace down a lot with CP3, and it took some adjustment but Booker is fine in tight half court sets. Not sure I can say the same about Zach. We looked WAY worse when we got big at the deadline and slowed it down. Sure- we need a PG. But we got to be careful thinking a PG makes this a top seed. It’d be more of a step forward, then a jump.

Great post. I agree with you 100% on all points here. Booker just sees the floor better at a more advanced level and makes better decisions on and off the ball. There is really no comparison.

MrFortune3 · Post #1148 » by **MrFortune3** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:04 am

CobyWhite0 wrote:
johnnyvann840 wrote:Harden out and on his way to the hospital for an MRI. Hamstring. Nets still holding up well without him so far. But without Harden the Nets are obviously in big trouble. I see the Bucks running away with this one in the 2nd half. Hamstring injury could linger and haunt the Nets for the entire series and playoffs even if he's able to come back.

This is easy for me to say now, since BKN is up by 8 with 4:43 left in the 3rd quarter, but I think the Nets will be just fine without Harden.

When he didn't play this season, the Nets were still 17-11... that's a 44-win pace, and the Bucks only won 46 games this season. And many of those 17 wins came when either KD or Kyrie was out.

In fairness to Milwaukee, they shot only 6-30 from 3. That's not likely to occur again. They also missed 8 FT's.

MGB8 · Post #1149 » by **MGB8** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:05 am

Repeat 3-peat wrote:Nets having no problem without Harden.

Not shocked. Bucks live and die by whether Middleton shows up at an all-star level, which is like once every 4th game. Meanwhile, I find Giannis a touch overrated. Simmons with a slightly better jumper, but not as good handle or vision.

MrFortune3 · Post #1150 » by **MrFortune3** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:09 am

MGB8 wrote:
Repeat 3-peat wrote:Nets having no problem without Harden.

Not shocked. Bucks live and die by whether Middleton shows up at an all-star level, which is like once every 4th game. Meanwhile, I find Giannis a touch overrated. Simmons with a slightly better jumper, but not as good handle or vision.

I don't think Giannis is overrated. The issue is that he is not a adept shooter. In the playoffs they can focus in on him too much and force him to the line and he's also a iffy FT shooter.

kodo · Post #1151 » by **kodo** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:16 am

Yes Bucks will surely shoot better from 3 in the future. Middleton will shoot better than 0-5 next game.
But Durant will also shoot better than 1-4. I also think 9 FT total for the Nets isn't going to happen again. They average 23.

The entire "that won't happen again" can go for both sides.

Am2626 · Post #1152 » by **Am2626** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:22 am

Little Nathan wrote:Playing Teague at all is unnecessary. Playing him in the fourth is just ridiculous. What is it with Bud and his weird rotations?

Can’t blame him for most guys playing like **** though.

I would love to see Thibs coach the Bucks and see how good they would be in the playoffs.

Am2626 · Post #1153 » by **Am2626** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:24 am

Little Nathan wrote:Playing Teague at all is unnecessary. Playing him in the fourth is just ridiculous. What is it with Bud and his weird rotations?

Can’t blame him for most guys playing like **** though.

I would love to see Thibs coach the Bucks and see how good they would be in the playoffs. Thibs has never had a team with that kind of talent and Giannis seems like the perfect superstar to play under a coach like Thibs.

dice · Post #1154 » by **dice** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:42 am

MGB8 wrote:
Repeat 3-peat wrote:Nets having no problem without Harden.

Not shocked. Bucks live and die by whether Middleton shows up at an all-star level, which is like once every 4th game. Meanwhile, I find Giannis a touch overrated. Simmons with a slightly better jumper, but not as good handle or vision.

if middleton didn't play like an all-star at least every other game, he probably wouldn't be an all-star

Andi Obst · Post #1155 » by **Andi Obst** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 2:48 am

MGB8 wrote:
Repeat 3-peat wrote:Nets having no problem without Harden.

Not shocked. Bucks live and die by whether Middleton shows up at an all-star level, which is like once every 4th game. Meanwhile, I find Giannis a touch overrated. Simmons with a slightly better jumper, but not as good handle or vision.

Simmons isn’t even close in terms of strength and aggressiveness, especially around the rim. If he was the force Giannis is, the Sixers would be in a much better spot without Embiid.

CobyWhite0 · Post #1156 » by **CobyWhite0** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 3:47 am

The Bucks had the best record in the league each of the last 2 years, and fell apart when facing tough competition in the playoffs. They blew a 2-0 lead in the ECF two years ago, and lost to a much less-talented Heat team last season. I don't know why anyone would be the least bit surprised if it happens again this season?

Giannis is a great regular-season player, but he becomes "easy" to stop in a playoff series once a team can game plan for him. "Easy" as in he certainly doesn't look like the back-to-back MVP.

TheStig · Post #1157 » by **TheStig** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 4:40 am

CobyWhite0 wrote:The Bucks had the best record in the league each of the last 2 years, and fell apart when facing tough competition in the playoffs. They blew a 2-0 lead in the ECF two years ago, and lost to a much less-talented Heat team last season. I don't know why anyone would be the least bit surprised if it happens again this season?

Giannis is a great regular-season player, but he becomes "easy" to stop in a playoff series once a team can game plan for him. "Easy" as in he certainly doesn't look like the back-to-back MVP.

He's not a guy who lifts his game in the playoffs but he's also a guy without a lot of help either. He's been the only real creator on those teams. Middleton is really the modern day Loul Deng. He's not a #2. Brogdan and Bledsoe weren't either. And I don't think Holiday is either. He's in the same position Dame is in but he's not a super high usage guy.

MrFortune3 · Post #1158 » by **MrFortune3** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 4:43 am

kodo wrote:Yes Bucks will surely shoot better from 3 in the future. Middleton will shoot better than 0-5 next game.
But Durant will also shoot better than 1-4. I also think 9 FT total for the Nets isn't going to happen again. They average 23.

The entire "that won't happen again" can go for both sides.

That is true but the Bucks played like **** for most of the game and had about the worst performance you will see from a team and still were in the running to win.
Durant and Kyrie are very good and play well together, losing Harden hurts but doesn't fully kill them.
I still think we will see the Bucks play a lot better in the rest of the series.

Andi Obst · Post #1159 » by **Andi Obst** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 4:45 pm

Interesting to see Kidd turning down the chance at the Blazers job (LOL). Reports that Lillard wants to see what happens in the offseason before he’s ready to decide on his future with team.

More and more smoke...

kodo · Post #1160 » by **kodo** » Sun Jun 6, 2021 5:10 pm

Little Nathan wrote:Interesting to see Kidd turning down the chance at the Blazers job (LOL). Reports that Lillard wants to see what happens in the offseason before he’s ready to decide on his future with team.

More and more smoke...

I think it's understandable. This situation could easily lead to Portland blowing this up and Lillard asking for a trade; Kidd isn't going commit to a team led by Anfernee Simons for the next 4 years when he won a title last season.

He really developed Giannis well, he's probably not looking for another gig as an A->B coach but gets dumped just when the team becomes competitive.