Two hot trade topics in one move

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Is this a solid for both teams?

Yes
2
13%
No, only solid for the Mavericks
3
20%
No, only solid for the Wizards
3
20%
OP has lost his mind. This is not good for either team.
7
47%
 
Total votes: 15

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Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#1 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:06 pm

Dallas Out:
KP and Powell
Dallas In:
Westbrook and Bertans

Why Dallas? They get a 2nd all star to pair with Luka; and a dead eye shooter to ease the blow of moving off KP.

Washington Out:
Westbrook and Bertans
Washington In:
KP and Powell

Why Washington? They get a 26 year old project to pair with Bryant, Rui, Deni, and Gafford. I'd suspect their next move would be trading Beal for prospects and picks. Who knows though? Maybe Beal is the Batman KP needs to get his career jump started again?

I honestly think this is pretty even so I did not add sweetener either way. Please feel free to do so if you think its needed.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#2 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:11 pm

Westbrook playing for a Cuban team would be something after all the time Mark spent trolling him and calling him a non-star.

Also you might could find a worse pairing of "star" players than Luka and Westbrook but you'd be hard pressed to find many. Both are extraordinarily ball dominant and both come with real concerns about how effective they could be off-ball.

For Washington they just downgrade twice from Westbrook to KP and Bertans to Powell. They should pass on that alone.

Not a fan for either side.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#3 » by nykballa2k4 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:22 pm

Buzzard wrote:Dallas Out:
KP and Powell
Dallas In:
Westbrook and Bertans

Why Dallas? They get a 2nd all star to pair with Luka; and a dead eye shooter to ease the blow of moving off KP.

Washington Out:
Westbrook and Bertans
Washington In:
KP and Powell

Why Washington? They get a 26 year old project to pair with Bryant, Rui, Deni, and Gafford. I'd suspect their next move would be trading Beal for prospects and picks. Who knows though? Maybe Beal is the Batman KP needs to get his career jump started again?

I honestly think this is pretty even so I did not add sweetener either way. Please feel free to do so if you think its needed.

Interesting. But Both teams are worse off for it. Chuck nailed it in Westbrook-Luka would be worse than Westbrook-Harden. Wizards also get worse in that Westbrook pretty much was the engine who drove them to the playoffs.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#4 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:22 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:Westbrook playing for a Cuban team would be something after all the time Mark spent trolling him and calling him a non-star.

Also you might could find a worse pairing of "star" players than Luka and Westbrook but you'd be hard pressed to find many. Both are extraordinarily ball dominant and both come with real concerns about how effective they could be off-ball.

For Washington they just downgrade twice from Westbrook to KP and Bertans to Powell. They should pass on that alone.

Not a fan for either side.

By your next to last sentence this is a clear win talent wise for Dallas. I do like it for Washington as a 1/2 season experiment. If Beal and KP with the youngsters clicks, they could be a fun team to watch. If not, Beal should get enough assets to start a great retool.

I don't see how Luka, Westbrook, and Carlisle cannot learn to play together. I think he not only can, Luka is going to have to. Its decent to me and no one is left in a bad state. This definitely shows the league that the Mavericks are serious about putting money and talent around Luka.

Edit: Cuban does have his public issues with player relations. If he can clean that up. maybe Dallas will one day be looked at as a more positive destination.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#5 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:27 pm

Buzzard wrote:
I don't see how Luka, Westbrook, and Carlisle cannot learn to play together. I think he not only can, Luka is going to have to. Its decent to me and no one is left in a bad state. This definitely shows the league that the Mavericks are serious about putting money and talent around Luka.


If you can't see how that trio would have issues you are either married to this idea or simply not looking at who they have all been. :D

Luka is going to have to learn to be more effective off-ball. No question. It was topic A at the end of season media day, but they mean that in moderation. He's maybe the best on-ball player in the world right now. So Dallas isn't looking to turn him into Steph running around off screens and such. Just a few more possessions each half where his load is reduced. Adding a secondary playmaker is a must for Dallas. Think more like adding Bogdan to Trae. Trae is still the main guy, but Bogdan eases his load while still being a real threat off-ball when Trae is running PNR.

Westbrook? A major over-correction. To get value out of Westbrook you have to give him the ball.

Sure Dallas adds talent but its not additive. It would in fact be the opposite of that.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#6 » by daoneandonly » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:33 pm

Agree with those that say the RUss-Luka pairing wont work, they just dont compliment one another at all
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#7 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:34 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
Buzzard wrote:
I don't see how Luka, Westbrook, and Carlisle cannot learn to play together. I think he not only can, Luka is going to have to. Its decent to me and no one is left in a bad state. This definitely shows the league that the Mavericks are serious about putting money and talent around Luka.


If you can't see how that trio would have issues you are either married to this idea or simply not looking at who they have all been. :D

Luka is going to have to learn to be more effective off-ball. No question. It was topic A at the end of season media day, but they mean that in moderation. He's maybe the best on-ball player in the world right now. So Dallas isn't looking to turn him into Steph running around off screens and such. Just a few more possessions each half where his load is reduced. Adding a secondary playmaker is a must for Dallas.

Westbrook? A major over-correction. To get value out of Westbrook you have to give him the ball.

Sure Dallas adds talent but its not additive. It would in fact be the opposite of that.

I am not married to the idea. But I do think Luka will do fine with Westbrook. KP and THJ got a total of 28.9 touches a game. Westbrook got 19.0. I don't see a problem at all.

Every team with two all stars has a similar mix. Its almost like you are saying Luka cannot play with another great scorer who demands the ball. WTF is he suppose to do? Play with role players his whole career...
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#8 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:38 pm

daoneandonly wrote:Agree with those that say the RUss-Luka pairing wont work, they just dont compliment one another at all

Maybe so but if it works I remember the days of Westbrook and Durant being pretty good.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#9 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:38 pm

I have no idea where you are getting your numbers, but Westbrook had a billion more touches than 19. Oh you are looking at FGA and ignoring FTA, turnovers, assists, potential assists....
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#10 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:39 pm

Buzzard wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Agree with those that say the RUss-Luka pairing wont work, they just dont compliment one another at all

Maybe so but if it works I remember the days of Westbrook and Durant being pretty good.


Do you think Luka and KD play remotely the same game? You are married to this idea lol. KD would be amazing next to Luka. Westbrook not at all amazing.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#11 » by zimpy27 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:45 pm

Westbrook would actually be good with KP to support the rebounding deficit. I do like KP on the Wiz but Westbrook has to stay there.

Also, we saw Westbrook and Harden struggle to fit, that would be similar to Luka.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#12 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:46 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:I have no idea where you are getting your numbers, but Westbrook had a billion more touches than 19. Oh you are looking at FGA and ignoring FTA, turnovers, assists, potential assists....

FGA is what I am looking at.

Lakers: LeBron 18.3, AD 17.0
Nets: Irving 20.1, Durant 17.2, Harden 16.6

How in the world can you think Luka cannot learn to share the ball/load? Looking at the Lakers and Nets, I cannot even comprehend that opinion.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#13 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:54 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
Buzzard wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Agree with those that say the RUss-Luka pairing wont work, they just dont compliment one another at all

Maybe so but if it works I remember the days of Westbrook and Durant being pretty good.


Do you think Luka and KD play remotely the same game? You are married to this idea lol. KD would be amazing next to Luka. Westbrook not at all amazing.

Offensively they play a very similar game. Both are heavy ISO and both can get their shots usually due to their size. Luka favors the three ball a lot more.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#14 » by Texas Chuck » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:55 pm

Buzzard wrote:How in the world can you think Luka cannot learn to share the ball/load?


Not what I've said a half dozen times now. You can listen to what I say and how it pertains specifically to Westbrook or you can continue to construct a straw man to argue against. But this is pointless as is so good luck. Maybe others will love the idea of Westbrook and Luka together.
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#15 » by Mike lorenzo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:57 pm

Luka is too Alpha, a star PG is not a good fit..Kemba / Russ not even CP3 or Lowry seem like perfect settings to me, in my opinion (they would be bored) .. Someone like Hayward / PG / DRR (on offense) would be ideal alongside Luka, guys who can generate their own offense, dribble ... but don't need the ball ... I'm Luka's N1 fan ... but he's terrible, off the ball, he's uncomfortable, bored
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#16 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:59 pm

zimpy27 wrote:Westbrook would actually be good with KP to support the rebounding deficit. I do like KP on the Wiz but Westbrook has to stay there.

Also, we saw Westbrook and Harden struggle to fit, that would be similar to Luka.

Luka is not Harden. I hate that comparison. Its no different than saying Trae is Steph. Another stupid comparison. Just like Trae will never sniff Curry's 3P%, Luka will never sniff Harden's TS%.
BAF 2021/22 Pacers

PG Luka Doncic/Killian Hayes
SG Moses Moody/Tre Mann
SF Saddiq Bey/Josh Richardson
PF Zion Williamson/Onyeka Okongwu
C Kristaps Porzingis/Marvin Bagley III

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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#17 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:01 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
Buzzard wrote:How in the world can you think Luka cannot learn to share the ball/load?


Not what I've said a half dozen times now. You can listen to what I say and how it pertains specifically to Westbrook or you can continue to construct a straw man to argue against. But this is pointless as is so good luck. Maybe others will love the idea of Westbrook and Luka together.

So Westbrook is the one star that can't play with Luka. Not buying but you keep selling...
BAF 2021/22 Pacers

PG Luka Doncic/Killian Hayes
SG Moses Moody/Tre Mann
SF Saddiq Bey/Josh Richardson
PF Zion Williamson/Onyeka Okongwu
C Kristaps Porzingis/Marvin Bagley III

Offense - Pace & Space
Defense - Attack
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#18 » by Mike lorenzo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:05 pm

If I could choose a perfect companion for Luka,

1Durant
2Embiid 3Klay (Healthy)
4Tatum
5KL
I really don't care about the order
1+1=11
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#19 » by Buzzard » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:12 pm

Mike lorenzo wrote:If I could choose a perfect companion for Luka,

1Durant
2Embiid 3Klay (Healthy)
4Tatum
5KL
I really don't care about the order

This thread is about the perfect companion you can get for KP and Powell. I like the idea of Westbrook and Bertans a lot. Its only a three year run to see if two of the most dominant scorers in the league can do more damage than a 1st round exit...
BAF 2021/22 Pacers

PG Luka Doncic/Killian Hayes
SG Moses Moody/Tre Mann
SF Saddiq Bey/Josh Richardson
PF Zion Williamson/Onyeka Okongwu
C Kristaps Porzingis/Marvin Bagley III

Offense - Pace & Space
Defense - Attack
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Re: Two hot trade topics in one move 

Post#20 » by Mike lorenzo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:18 pm

Buzzard wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:
Buzzard wrote:How in the world can you think Luka cannot learn to share the ball/load?


Not what I've said a half dozen times now. You can listen to what I say and how it pertains specifically to Westbrook or you can continue to construct a straw man to argue against. But this is pointless as is so good luck. Maybe others will love the idea of Westbrook and Luka together.

So Westbrook is the one star that can't play with Luka. Not buying but you keep selling...

Luka is very dominant on the ball, and quite bad, without the ball. Russ is very dominant on the ball and a terrible shooter. Why are the Mavs paying a guy $ 44 to get the ball out of his star's hands? When it is your best virtue ...
Westbrook is a beast, but as the game has evolved, he needs very specific partners, to be successful.
1+1=11

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