Thoughts in General, Rumors, etc 3.0

[psman2]

Question for my CBA experts? Jalen Brunson was a 2nd round pick who signed a 4 year deal. My understanding is that Dallas can make him a RFA after 3 years or guarantee that 4th year but he becomes an UFA. I feel confident about this part unless something changed. But when do they have to decide this? Couldn't find anything where they had which makes me think they still have time. But obviously this impacts Dallas off-season so wanted to dial it in.

I'm actually not sure how this works since it's a non guarantee and not a team option. Do you still have RFA rights after waiving a player? They'd definitely lose his bird rights
Edit: Plus.. He'd probably get claimed if they tried to waive him. Don't think RFA is an option for him. Why the hell is it not an team option!?

https://houseofhouston.com/2014/06/29/houston-rockets-make-chandler-parsons-restricted-free-agent/

He should be a RFA, not 100% on the bird rights. I think this is the same contract setup as Parsons.

Edit..read more articles, have full bird rights too

[K_chile22]

Question for my CBA experts? Jalen Brunson was a 2nd round pick who signed a 4 year deal. My understanding is that Dallas can make him a RFA after 3 years or guarantee that 4th year but he becomes an UFA. I feel confident about this part unless something changed. But when do they have to decide this? Couldn't find anything where they had which makes me think they still have time. But obviously this impacts Dallas off-season so wanted to dial it in.

I'm actually not sure how this works since it's a non guarantee and not a team option. Do you still have RFA rights after waiving a player? They'd definitely lose his bird rights
Edit: Plus.. He'd probably get claimed if they tried to waive him. Don't think RFA is an option for him. Why the hell is it not an team option!?

https://houseofhouston.com/2014/06/29/houston-rockets-make-chandler-parsons-restricted-free-agent/

He should be a RFA, not 100% on the bird rights.

That was a team option, not a non-guarantee. They are different. If you decline a team option the player does not go on waivers and you keep bird rights. For a non guarantee you have to waive the player, which puts him on waivers for anyone to claim, and waiving a player extinguishes bird rights. I'm sure they thought it likely wouldn't matter because it usually doesn't for second round guys, but a bit of a gaff by Dallas to not make that a team option instead


EDIT:

Wait, actually hoops hype has it as an option and other places had it as a non guarantee. In that case they can make him a rfa by declining the team option which obviously doesn't take effect until FA starts but must be filed before then

[psman2]

I'm actually not sure how this works since it's a non guarantee and not a team option. Do you still have RFA rights after waiving a player? They'd definitely lose his bird rights
Edit: Plus.. He'd probably get claimed if they tried to waive him. Don't think RFA is an option for him. Why the hell is it not an team option!?

https://houseofhouston.com/2014/06/29/houston-rockets-make-chandler-parsons-restricted-free-agent/

He should be a RFA, not 100% on the bird rights.

That was a team option, not a non-guarantee. They are different. If you decline a team option the player does not go on waivers and you keep bird rights. For a non guarantee you have to waive the player, which puts him on waivers for anyone to claim, and waiving a player extinguishes bird rights. I'm sure they thought it likely wouldn't matter because it usually doesn't for second round guys, but a bit of a gaff by Dallas to not make that a team option instead

Do we know for sure of the actual language? I know sites sometimes list non guarantees and options wrong. I just cannot see the advantage of not making it a team option, maybe some deadline type advantage?

[K_chile22]

https://houseofhouston.com/2014/06/29/houston-rockets-make-chandler-parsons-restricted-free-agent/

He should be a RFA, not 100% on the bird rights.

That was a team option, not a non-guarantee. They are different. If you decline a team option the player does not go on waivers and you keep bird rights. For a non guarantee you have to waive the player, which puts him on waivers for anyone to claim, and waiving a player extinguishes bird rights. I'm sure they thought it likely wouldn't matter because it usually doesn't for second round guys, but a bit of a gaff by Dallas to not make that a team option instead

Do we know for sure of the actual language? I know sites sometimes list non guarantees and options wrong. I just cannot see the advantage of not making it a team option, maybe some deadline type advantage?

In this case no there would be no difference except being able to cut him well into next season vs having to make the decision before Free agency , but if you look at the edit I just made, some sources do have it marked as a TO. Going to assume it actually is an option but those other sites didn't care about that distinction

[MoneyTalks41890]

That was a team option, not a non-guarantee. They are different. If you decline a team option the player does not go on waivers and you keep bird rights. For a non guarantee you have to waive the player, which puts him on waivers for anyone to claim, and waiving a player extinguishes bird rights. I'm sure they thought it likely wouldn't matter because it usually doesn't for second round guys, but a bit of a gaff by Dallas to not make that a team option instead

Do we know for sure of the actual language? I know sites sometimes list non guarantees and options wrong. I just cannot see the advantage of not making it a team option, maybe some deadline type advantage?

In this case no there would be no difference, but if you look at the edit I just made, some sources do have it marked as a TO. Going to assume it actually is an option but those other sites didn't care about that distinction

I think it's an option and some sites took Sham's language here literally and the 4th year is a TO, but I guess it could be a NG year?

Read on Twitter

?s=20

[K_chile22]

Do we know for sure of the actual language? I know sites sometimes list non guarantees and options wrong. I just cannot see the advantage of not making it a team option, maybe some deadline type advantage?

In this case no there would be no difference, but if you look at the edit I just made, some sources do have it marked as a TO. Going to assume it actually is an option but those other sites didn't care about that distinction

I think it's an option and some sites took Sham's language here literally and the 4th year is a TO, but I guess it could be a NG year?

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Yeah, I think that's what happened. Probably pretty common for unguaranteed vs Team Option to get lost in translation. This made me looks and it appears none of the common sites have KJ Martin's 4th year as a TO, but I know for a fact it is, so definitely not just happening to Brunson

[K_chile22]

So to actually answer Chucks question: Day Before Free Agency lol

[Texas Chuck]

So to actually answer Chucks question: Day Before Free Agency lol

Yeah I was thinking the Parsons decision was made shortly before FA and that was my reference point, but didn't want to assume anything. The idea I was exploring got kinda busted by a different Chuck CBA problem forgetting BYC was a thing so sorry I had you guys checking something when I had a different issue altogether.

I just need to stop getting greedy of trying to add salary to Dallas and stay over the cap. I need to concede that full MLE.

[Scoot McGroot]

Read on Twitter

?s=21

5 months would be November. Does this make it unlikely Siakam is moved this offseason?

[MoneyTalks41890]

Read on Twitter

?s=21

5 months would be November. Does this make it unlikely Siakam is moved this offseason?

I think so. And more unlikely that Lowry comes back, that they move back from 7, etc.

[jbk1234]

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?s=21

5 months would be November. Does this make it unlikely Siakam is moved this offseason?

I don't see how. Teams are going to want to see how he looks after the surgery before offering full value and the Raptors would be foolish trade him after a down season AND surgery.

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[babyjax13]

I think it actually makes it more likely he is moved and Toronto transitions into a mini-rebuild around OG.

[MoneyTalks41890]

I think it actually makes it more likely he is moved and Toronto transitions into a mini-rebuild around OG.

Maybe, but he's been declining on court and with this injury they would big taking a big loss on perceived value. Ignoring fit, I don't know that I'd give a pick higher than 12 or 14 for him right now.

[K_chile22]

I think it actually makes it more likely he is moved and Toronto transitions into a mini-rebuild around OG.

Maybe, but he's been declining on court and with this injury they would big taking a big loss on perceived value. Ignoring fit, I don't know that I'd give a pick higher than 12 or 14 for him right now.

Yeah I think moving him now is a big time sell low move unless you think he just won't be the same

[babyjax13]

I think it actually makes it more likely he is moved and Toronto transitions into a mini-rebuild around OG.

Maybe, but he's been declining on court and with this injury they would big taking a big loss on perceived value. Ignoring fit, I don't know that I'd give a pick higher than 12 or 14 for him right now.

Yeah I think moving him now is a big time sell low move unless you think he just won't be the same

Well it was a one year regression in which they did not have home-court, were not even near their homes, and in which Siakam was apparently injured. If this were something that we've heard a lot of player's careers getting derailed by I think I'd be more worried...any maybe I should be, I don't really know how big of a deal this is other than the recovery time.

[Texas Chuck]

I'm not sold he's declining. He had a bad shooting season this year, but mostly he was a 3rd best player on the championship team asked to be the best player now. I think in the right situation he's still a very useful player. He's just being asked to do more than he should be doing.

[MoneyTalks41890]

I think declining is the wrong word what I mean here is that a lot of what made him valuable in my eyes was his three point shooting. 2 years ago that was 37%, last year 36, this year 30. Am I trading for him as a 37% three point shooter or a 30 percent one?

[Texas Chuck]

I think declining is the wrong word what I mean here is that a lot of what made him valuable in my eyes was his three point shooting. 2 years ago that was 37%, last year 36, this year 30. Am I trading for him as a 37% three point shooter or a 30 percent one?

As one who has put him in a few fictional trade proposals here, this board by and large sees him as the 30% guy. I tend to believe he's probably more a 35% guy who bumped it a bit a couple years and hit a nadir of variance this year in what was a pretty difficult season for the Raptors in Tampa and with guys in and out of the lineup.

I give him a bit more benefit of the doubt. Not a sniper for sure, but not a guy you can just not guard out there either.

[zimpy27]

I see Siakams value at Wiggins value right now.

Siakam has a lot more money owed than Wiggins and has only been slightly better this season, now he's having surgery.

If Raptors think he can recoup value then they should just keep him.

I think Jonathon Isaac will be better over the next 4 years than Siakam. His contract he got is likely indicative of Siakams value vs that max contract he got.

[Buzzard]

Question for my CBA experts? Jalen Brunson was a 2nd round pick who signed a 4 year deal. My understanding is that Dallas can make him a RFA after 3 years or guarantee that 4th year but he becomes an UFA. I feel confident about this part unless something changed. But when do they have to decide this? Couldn't find anything where they had which makes me think they still have time. But obviously this impacts Dallas off-season so wanted to dial it in.

This is what I found at spotrac.

2021 non-guaranteed, fully guaranteed on 08/01/2021

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/dallas-mavericks/jalen-brunson-26999/