Giannis Antetokounmpo 20-21 Thread

[JulesWinnfield]

Great Series Win vs the Nets
Bucks were not the favorite in this series

Game 7

40 PTS
15-24 FG%62.5
13 REBS
14 FREE THROW ATTEMPTS FT% 57.1

Brook Lopez
4 BLKS
8 REBS
19 PTS
3-4 3PT % 75
63.6 FG%

Series average vs Nets

57.4% FG
31.9 PPG
12.9 REBS
8.6 FTA
1 BLK

The Bad
FT% 48.3
AST 3.6
TOVs 4

Good series by Giannis
His teammates didnt shot well except Brook Lopez & the Bucks still won this series.

Also some of the defensive data I saw had him as by far the most effective defender on Durant, held him to like 30% shooting although it was not by any means a massive sample. Entering the series he was the most effective Durant defender of all time (minimum 50 FGa against) holding him to 36% shooting, surprised we didn’t see more of him on him

Giannis is incredible. Great series by a great player. Hope he takes this chip and quiets a lot of the talk about some of his half court offensive limitations. Even with his flaws he’s one of the best players we’ve seen set foot in this league, I want to see him get that due by finishing this.

He didn't guard Durant at all in the series and in very, very few moments he did, he didn't look that well doing so.

They flashed a graphic on the telecast last night that had Durant shooting 30% against him in the series. He saw far less time on him than Tucker and Middleton, it was not by any means a big sample, but my eyes weren’t fooling me when they put that on the screen.

[70sFan]

Also some of the defensive data I saw had him as by far the most effective defender on Durant, held him to like 30% shooting although it was not by any means a massive sample. Entering the series he was the most effective Durant defender of all time (minimum 50 FGa against) holding him to 36% shooting, surprised we didn’t see more of him on him

Giannis is incredible. Great series by a great player. Hope he takes this chip and quiets a lot of the talk about some of his half court offensive limitations. Even with his flaws he’s one of the best players we’ve seen set foot in this league, I want to see him get that due by finishing this.

He didn't guard Durant at all in the series and in very, very few moments he did, he didn't look that well doing so.

They flashed a graphic on the telecast last night that had Durant shooting 30% against him in the series. He saw far less time on him than Tucker and Middleton, it was not by any means a big sample, but my eyes weren’t fooling me when they put that on the screen.

These stats without showing volume are pointless.

Durant averaged 2.1 FGA against Giannis in these 7 games. In comparison, Tucker defended Durant's 11.0 FGA. Lopez defended 4.1 FGA, Middleton defended 4.0 FGA, Jrue defended 2.6 FGA.

Tuckers spent almost 60 minutes in total on Durant, Middleton spent almost 17 min and Jrue just over 11 min. Giannis? Only 6:40.

[JulesWinnfield]

He didn't guard Durant at all in the series and in very, very few moments he did, he didn't look that well doing so.

They flashed a graphic on the telecast last night that had Durant shooting 30% against him in the series. He saw far less time on him than Tucker and Middleton, it was not by any means a big sample, but my eyes weren’t fooling me when they put that on the screen.

These stats without showing volume are pointless.

Durant averaged 2.1 FGA against Giannis in these 7 games. In comparison, Tucker defended Durant's 11.0 FGA. Lopez defended 4.1 FGA, Middleton defended 4.0 FGA, Jrue defended 2.6 FGA.

Tuckers spent almost 60 minutes in total on Durant, Middleton spent almost 17 min and Jrue just over 11 min. Giannis? Only 6:40.

I never claimed the sample was big, in fact I stated repeatedly it wasn’t, so I’m not sure what you’re arguing. You want a more meaningful sample then refer to the fact that no one in the history of the league has held Durant to a lower FG% with a minimum of 50 FGA against, that was also thrown out by sports center last night. He has always done a solid job on Durant and he probably should have seen more time on him than he did

[70sFan]

They flashed a graphic on the telecast last night that had Durant shooting 30% against him in the series. He saw far less time on him than Tucker and Middleton, it was not by any means a big sample, but my eyes weren’t fooling me when they put that on the screen.

These stats without showing volume are pointless.

Durant averaged 2.1 FGA against Giannis in these 7 games. In comparison, Tucker defended Durant's 11.0 FGA. Lopez defended 4.1 FGA, Middleton defended 4.0 FGA, Jrue defended 2.6 FGA.

Tuckers spent almost 60 minutes in total on Durant, Middleton spent almost 17 min and Jrue just over 11 min. Giannis? Only 6:40.

I never claimed the sample was big, in fact I stated repeatedly it wasn’t, so I’m not sure what you’re arguing. You want a more meaningful sample then refer to the fact that no one in the history of the league has held Durant to a lower FG% with a minimum of 50 FGA against, that was also thrown out by sports center last night. He has always done a solid job on Durant and he probably should have seen more time on him than he did

2021 RS: 4:28 min, 16 points on 6/11 FG
2019 RS: 1:55 min, 2 points on 0/1 FG
2018 RS: 10:38 min, 9 points on 3/12 FG

These are extremely small samples, I wouldn't use it as any evidence of Giannis defending Durant well.

[TheProdigy]

These stats without showing volume are pointless.

Durant averaged 2.1 FGA against Giannis in these 7 games. In comparison, Tucker defended Durant's 11.0 FGA. Lopez defended 4.1 FGA, Middleton defended 4.0 FGA, Jrue defended 2.6 FGA.

Tuckers spent almost 60 minutes in total on Durant, Middleton spent almost 17 min and Jrue just over 11 min. Giannis? Only 6:40.

I never claimed the sample was big, in fact I stated repeatedly it wasn’t, so I’m not sure what you’re arguing. You want a more meaningful sample then refer to the fact that no one in the history of the league has held Durant to a lower FG% with a minimum of 50 FGA against, that was also thrown out by sports center last night. He has always done a solid job on Durant and he probably should have seen more time on him than he did

2021 RS: 4:28 min, 16 points on 6/11 FG
2019 RS: 1:55 min, 2 points on 0/1 FG
2018 RS: 10:38 min, 9 points on 3/12 FG

These are extremely small samples, I wouldn't use it as any evidence of Giannis defending Durant well.

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[70sFan]

I never claimed the sample was big, in fact I stated repeatedly it wasn’t, so I’m not sure what you’re arguing. You want a more meaningful sample then refer to the fact that no one in the history of the league has held Durant to a lower FG% with a minimum of 50 FGA against, that was also thrown out by sports center last night. He has always done a solid job on Durant and he probably should have seen more time on him than he did

2021 RS: 4:28 min, 16 points on 6/11 FG
2019 RS: 1:55 min, 2 points on 0/1 FG
2018 RS: 10:38 min, 9 points on 3/12 FG

These are extremely small samples, I wouldn't use it as any evidence of Giannis defending Durant well.

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This is what I just said, efficiency stats without volume are pointless. Giannis and Durant played 20 games h2h, 50 FGA in 20 games is a bit over 2 FG defended per game.

Show me the same stats adjusted for volume and then we can talk.

[TheProdigy]

2021 RS: 4:28 min, 16 points on 6/11 FG
2019 RS: 1:55 min, 2 points on 0/1 FG
2018 RS: 10:38 min, 9 points on 3/12 FG

These are extremely small samples, I wouldn't use it as any evidence of Giannis defending Durant well.

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This is what I just said, efficiency stats without volume are pointless. Giannis and Durant played 20 games h2h, 50 FGA in 20 games is a bit over 2 FG defended per game.

Show me the same stats adjusted for volume and then we can talk.

The stat I've provided is flawed, but you haven't provided any evidence to support your claim that Giannis doesn't defend Durant well. It seems like you're basing your opinion on one double crossover fadeaway highlight that was featured on ESPN all week.

[70sFan]

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This is what I just said, efficiency stats without volume are pointless. Giannis and Durant played 20 games h2h, 50 FGA in 20 games is a bit over 2 FG defended per game.

Show me the same stats adjusted for volume and then we can talk.

The stat I've provided is flawed, but you haven't provided any evidence to support your claim that Giannis doesn't defend Durant well. It seems like you're basing your opinion on one double crossover fadeaway highlight that was featured on ESPN all week.

No, I base my opinion how volume stats we have which proves that Giannis never defended Durant on consistent basis. I already showed them in previous posts, Giannis defended Durant's 2.1 FG in the series which is around 8% of his total shots. In comparison, PJ Tucker defended over 40% of Durant's shots. Middleton and Jrue defended over 15% of his shots each.

Of course I also watched the series and I haven't seen Giannis guarding him consistently. I've also seen Giannis struggling against screens and you can't do that when Durant moves without the ball - Durant losing Giannis on the screen wouldn't be seen in these stats, but it would be a bad defensive possession.

Bud did a right decision with not trying Giannis on Durant.

[JulesWinnfield]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the history of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

[70sFan]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the history of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

I'm not agressive, I just said that you can't use such an incomplete data to prove anything. 50 FGA for 20 games is extremely small sample of size, how can you deny that?

I also don't say that Giannis is terrible KD defender, but he's not well suited to guard him full-time. Also, KD didn't cook PJ Tucker, who spent most of the series on him. Stats back it up and it was visible when you watched games. Of course KD still scored on him and had some great performances on him, but he didn't cook Tucker.

[JulesWinnfield]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the history of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

I'm not agressive, I just said that you can't use such an incomplete data to prove anything. 50 FGA for 20 games is extremely small sample of size, how can you deny that?

I also don't say that Giannis is terrible KD defender, but he's not well suited to guard him full-time. Also, KD didn't cook PJ Tucker, who spent most of the series on him. Stats back it up and it was visible when you watched games. Of course KD still scored on him and had some great performances on him, but he didn't cook Tucker.

Tucker was physical and very active but I don’t know that I’d call him all that effective, especially outside of game 4. Tucker did see the most time on him but Durant shot a higher % vs him than any of the other defenders (Middleton and to a lesser extent Giannis). Not to mention tucker couldn’t make a shot all series until late in game 7. He was getting a lot of praise for his activity level and toughness. I thought a lot of it was well overdone. Outside of game 4 he was getting cooked consistently and couldn’t do anything on offense all series with his open looks

[70sFan]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the history of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

I'm not agressive, I just said that you can't use such an incomplete data to prove anything. 50 FGA for 20 games is extremely small sample of size, how can you deny that?

I also don't say that Giannis is terrible KD defender, but he's not well suited to guard him full-time. Also, KD didn't cook PJ Tucker, who spent most of the series on him. Stats back it up and it was visible when you watched games. Of course KD still scored on him and had some great performances on him, but he didn't cook Tucker.

Tucker was physical and very active but I don’t know that I’d call him all that effective, especially outside of game 4. Tucker did see the most time on him but Durant shot a higher % vs him than any of the other defenders (Middleton and to a lesser extent Giannis). Not to mention tucker couldn’t make a shot all series until late in game 7. He was getting a lot of praise for his activity level and toughness. I thought a lot of it was well overdone. Outside of game 4 he was getting cooked consistently and couldn’t do anything on offense all series with his open looks

1. You are wrong, Tucker defended him slightly better than Middleton (I won't touch Giannis, because he basically didn't guard KD):

Durant vs Tucker: 93 points on 35/77 FGA (45.5 FG%), 8/26 3PA (30.8 3P%) and 54.2 TS%
Durant vs Middleton: 44 points on 13/28 FGA (46.4 FG%), 4/8 3PA (50.0 3P%) and 63.0 TS%

2. Who cares that Tucker shot poorly for most of the series? We're talking about his defense on Durant here.

[JulesWinnfield]

I'm not agressive, I just said that you can't use such an incomplete data to prove anything. 50 FGA for 20 games is extremely small sample of size, how can you deny that?

I also don't say that Giannis is terrible KD defender, but he's not well suited to guard him full-time. Also, KD didn't cook PJ Tucker, who spent most of the series on him. Stats back it up and it was visible when you watched games. Of course KD still scored on him and had some great performances on him, but he didn't cook Tucker.

Tucker was physical and very active but I don’t know that I’d call him all that effective, especially outside of game 4. Tucker did see the most time on him but Durant shot a higher % vs him than any of the other defenders (Middleton and to a lesser extent Giannis). Not to mention tucker couldn’t make a shot all series until late in game 7. He was getting a lot of praise for his activity level and toughness. I thought a lot of it was well overdone. Outside of game 4 he was getting cooked consistently and couldn’t do anything on offense all series with his open looks

1. You are wrong, Tucker defended him slightly better than Middleton (I won't touch Giannis, because he basically didn't guard KD):

Durant vs Tucker: 93 points on 35/77 FGA (45.5 FG%), 8/26 3PA (30.8 3P%) and 54.2 TS%
Durant vs Middleton: 44 points on 13/28 FGA (46.4 FG%), 4/8 3PA (50.0 3P%) and 63.0 TS%

2. Who cares that Tucker shot poorly for most of the series? We're talking about his defense on Durant here.

Where are you getting these numbers? Because I saw espn post a different graphic on tv

[70sFan]

Tucker was physical and very active but I don’t know that I’d call him all that effective, especially outside of game 4. Tucker did see the most time on him but Durant shot a higher % vs him than any of the other defenders (Middleton and to a lesser extent Giannis). Not to mention tucker couldn’t make a shot all series until late in game 7. He was getting a lot of praise for his activity level and toughness. I thought a lot of it was well overdone. Outside of game 4 he was getting cooked consistently and couldn’t do anything on offense all series with his open looks

1. You are wrong, Tucker defended him slightly better than Middleton (I won't touch Giannis, because he basically didn't guard KD):

Durant vs Tucker: 93 points on 35/77 FGA (45.5 FG%), 8/26 3PA (30.8 3P%) and 54.2 TS%
Durant vs Middleton: 44 points on 13/28 FGA (46.4 FG%), 4/8 3PA (50.0 3P%) and 63.0 TS%

2. Who cares that Tucker shot poorly for most of the series? We're talking about his defense on Durant here.

Where are you getting these numbers? Because I saw espn post a different graphic on tv

NBA.com

[ShotCreator]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the historyi of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

I agree Giannis can’t guard KD pretty well, definitely better than vice versa but one of the greatest offensive series ever?

Good lord no. Not even the best one in these playoffs.

The way Milwaukee was guarding KD, I really didn’t even like his approach, not enough screen action.

[ZeppelinPage]

FG% allowed for a single player is not a good stat and not really indicative of defensive ability. FG% isn't even factoring in the extra value of 3s, compared to eFG%, so using that stat in 2021 is pointless. I've personally never used it, but for those that think it provides useful information, here's the Bucks' former Director of Basketball Research on it:

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[TroubleS0me]

Bucks are paper tigers.

hmm how do you feel about this now?

[JulesWinnfield]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the historyi of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

I agree Giannis can’t guard KD pretty well, definitely better than vice versa but one of the greatest offensive series ever?

Good lord no. Not even the best one in these playoffs.

The way Milwaukee was guarding KD, I really didn’t even like his approach, not enough screen action.

I don’t know. 35.4 ppg on a tick under 60% TS. If you were to compile a list listing series where someone
scored at that volume with that efficiency I don’t believe the list would be all that long. You going to find 20-25 series like that? I’d have my doubts. Especially with a minimum sample of 6 games or more. I found what Durant did in this series to be pretty special

[FC93]

I don’t know how anyone can be so aggressive in the camp that Giannis can’t guard Durant when the evidence shows us that there’s literally never been anyone in the historyi of the league to hold Durant to lower efficiency with a minimum of 50 attempts guarded. If Giannis was such a bad Durant defender then he wouldn’t top that list through 50+ attempts. I don’t care if it took 50 seasons to get off those 50 attempts

You could say it’s misleading, but you can’t say he’s a flat out bad matchup and bud was right to not use him more when Durant just cooked every non Giannis defender to the tune of one of the greatest offensive series we’ve ever seen

I agree Giannis can’t guard KD pretty well, definitely better than vice versa but one of the greatest offensive series ever?

Good lord no. Not even the best one in these playoffs.

The way Milwaukee was guarding KD, I really didn’t even like his approach, not enough screen action.

I don’t know. 35.4 ppg on a tick under 60% TS. If you were to compile a list listing series where someone
scored at that volume with that efficiency I don’t believe the list would be all that long. You going to find 20-25 series like that? I’d have my doubts. Especially with a minimum sample of 6 games or more. I found what Durant did in this series to be pretty special

The flipside is that almost all that efficiency came from two monster games (including one masterpiece). He was negative efficiency in the other five (even game 7, thanks to an awful OT). Of course, he didn't have much help for a lot of the series and was asked to do it all, but if someone wanted to say Dame or Luka or Kawhi or Jokic had comparably good offensive series this playoffs I think that's at least worth entertaining (I haven't actually looked at the numbers yet).

[BobbyPortisFan]

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This is what I just said, efficiency stats without volume are pointless. Giannis and Durant played 20 games h2h, 50 FGA in 20 games is a bit over 2 FG defended per game.

Show me the same stats adjusted for volume and then we can talk.

The stat I've provided is flawed, but you haven't provided any evidence to support your claim that Giannis doesn't defend Durant well. It seems like you're basing your opinion on one double crossover fadeaway highlight that was featured on ESPN all week.

He definitely shouldn't start on durant, but he's good at switching onto him i think