Defensive identity

[kpt]

Assuming we draft Cade and assuming we roll out a frequent lineup of Stewart, Grant, Bey, Cade, and Hayes. We have five above average defenders or at least trending that way for their position. defense will at least be part of our identity.

Extra. Position flexibility/versatility is another. How many players on our team would you consider that just play one position?

[Homelander87]

Not having anyone over 6’10 is still a real cause for concern but the team length on the perimeter will be elite

[tmorgan]

Not having anyone over 6’10 is still a real cause for concern but the team length on the perimeter will be elite

Eh, so Embiid and Jokic would punish us a little. That’s not really a problem to worry about at this stage.

[Pharaoh]

Not having anyone over 6’10 is still a real cause for concern but the team length on the perimeter will be elite

Eh, so Embiid and Jokic would punish us a little. That’s not really a problem to worry about at this stage.

They punish everyone though, regardless of height!

Doesn't matter if a guy is 6'10 or 7'1 if he's not skilled.

Did no one watch Rudy Gobert get played?



Sent from my SM-G781B using RealGM mobile app

[Manocad]

Not having anyone over 6’10 is still a real cause for concern but the team length on the perimeter will be elite

I don't see that. Not like we have a player like him, but Ben Wallace was GENEROUSLY listed as 6'9" and could hold his own against the likes of Shaq, and shut down most traditional centers. Stew isn't exactly a pushover in the post; if he hits the weights like Ben did and works on establishing some solid post defensive fundamentals such that he isn't being abused by bigger centers I think they'll be fine. Plus you can still throw some quick double teams/collapses in there from time to time.

[bstein14]

With Stewart we're going to be able to defend traditional bigs better than most teams at center. And he also defends the pick and roll better than most traditional bigs. He still is learning the NBA, and has a ways to go, but I could for sure see him getting some all-defensive team consideration down the road.

If Cade is defending opposing SG's his size and length will certainly give some of them problems. We say it when we put Prince on smaller SG's. You really can't get up in a jump shooter without fouling them nowadays so the real advantage defensively comes from size and long arms.

Bey is the tough one to figure out. The eye test says he's ok defensively I think the effort has been there, but the advanced defensive numbers last year were not kind to him at all. It will be interesting to see how he does this year. My hope from him this year is slightly better defensively, slightly better 3 point %, and gets a little bit better when taking the ball to the basket in the half court, or turning and facing up his defender in the half court.

[FloridaMan78]

With Stewart we're going to be able to defend traditional bigs better than most teams at center. And he also defends the pick and roll better than most traditional bigs. He still is learning the NBA, and has a ways to go, but I could for sure see him getting some all-defensive team consideration down the road.

If Cade is defending opposing SG's his size and length will certainly give some of them problems. We say it when we put Prince on smaller SG's. You really can't get up in a jump shooter without fouling them nowadays so the real advantage defensively comes from size and long arms.

Bey is the tough one to figure out. The eye test says he's ok defensively I think the effort has been there, but the advanced defensive numbers last year were not kind to him at all. It will be interesting to see how he does this year. My hope from him this year is slightly better defensively, slightly better 3 point %, and gets a little bit better when taking the ball to the basket in the half court, or turning and facing up his defender in the half court.

Yea I remember when you mentioned that during the season and I started to really pay attention to that. Bey played it really safe and made sure people didn’t drive past him. He always got a hand up but gave a bit too much space. I hope he’s learned more of the players and their tendencies and will get more up in peoples faces this year.

[bstein14]

It's a small sample size for Hayes, but according to the advanced numbers Hayes, Sekou and Sirvydis were the worst 3 defenders on the team and the best three defenders were Grant, Stewart, and Plumlee. That could in part be because later in the season when Hayes was playing it was pretty much tank city at that point and the same effort wasn't there as it was with all the close games we were competing on earlier in the year. We''ll get a much better look at Hayes defensively in October.

[DetroitSho]

It's a small sample size for Hayes, but according to the advanced numbers Hayes, Sekou and Sirvydis were the worst 3 defenders on the team and the best three defenders were Grant, Stewart, and Plumlee. That could in part be because later in the season when Hayes was playing it was pretty much tank city at that point and the same effort wasn't there as it was with all the close games we were competing on earlier in the year. We''ll get a much better look at Hayes defensively in October.

That's crazy because just watching, Hayes was very disruptive defensively.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

[bstein14]

There are a bunch of different advanced stats for defense and all of them have some merit and some flaws, but if you look at the different categories Plumlee and Stewart seem to be near the top. This could also be some bias in the formula's for things such as rebounding and blocks.

Defensive rating per 100 possessions. (Points the team has given up per 100 possessions while on the court?)
Plumlee 109
Stewart 109
Killian Hayes 113
Bey 114
Grant 114

Defensive win shares (estimate of wins added by a player due to defense)
Plumlee 2.1
Stewart 2.1
Josh Jackson 1.7
Bey 1.7
Grant 1.6

Defensive Box +/-
Plumlee 1.8
Stewart .4
Saban Lee .3

[bstein14]

It's a small sample size for Hayes, but according to the advanced numbers Hayes, Sekou and Sirvydis were the worst 3 defenders on the team and the best three defenders were Grant, Stewart, and Plumlee. That could in part be because later in the season when Hayes was playing it was pretty much tank city at that point and the same effort wasn't there as it was with all the close games we were competing on earlier in the year. We''ll get a much better look at Hayes defensively in October.

That's crazy because just watching, Hayes was very disruptive defensively.

Sent from my SM-N975U using RealGM mobile app

I think I may have been wrong on that as I was pulling from basketball reference and I may have been a column off. Those 3 likely were bottom 3 in offfensive box plus/minus not defensive. For the most part Hayes looks pretty middle of the pack for us on defensive stats, although Saban Lee appears to be slightly ahead of him in most of those positions. I agree Hayes for sure in his second stint with the team looked solid defensively.

[tmorgan]

Those defensive numbers aren’t that shocking. Bigs tend to do better in most metrics, and Plumlee shining in general makes sense. He’s got experience making reads and is by most accounts a solid (but not shot blocking) big. Plumlee is pretty athletic and mobile.

Hayes has potential as a very good defender, certainly has great hands for poke aways and deflections, but he did a lot of dumb stuff. Rookie guards that don’t do a lot of dumb stuff are extremely rare.

[DET_Athletics]

Not having anyone over 6’10 is still a real cause for concern but the team length on the perimeter will be elite

I don't see that. Not like we have a player like him, but Ben Wallace was GENEROUSLY listed as 6'9" and could hold his own against the likes of Shaq, and shut down most traditional centers. Stew isn't exactly a pushover in the post; if he hits the weights like Ben did and works on establishing some solid post defensive fundamentals such that he isn't being abused by bigger centers I think they'll be fine. Plus you can still throw some quick double teams/collapses in there from time to time.

I want to agree, but you can gain length. Today is a much different day than when Ben Wallace was killing it. You might have 2 or 3 players that can Bang that are all all-star game scheme changers. Stew is a great strong side option, just nobody's weak side or clean up man.

Sent from my SM-G986U using RealGM mobile app

[DET_Athletics]

At some point we are going to have to aquire a starting level mobile center that is long and can protect the rim, Stewart can't be our only rim protection, and as good of a player Plumlee is, he isn't the rim protector he use to be.

Sent from my SM-G986U using RealGM mobile app

[Homelander87]

Not having anyone over 6’10 is still a real cause for concern but the team length on the perimeter will be elite

I don't see that. Not like we have a player like him, but Ben Wallace was GENEROUSLY listed as 6'9" and could hold his own against the likes of Shaq, and shut down most traditional centers. Stew isn't exactly a pushover in the post; if he hits the weights like Ben did and works on establishing some solid post defensive fundamentals such that he isn't being abused by bigger centers I think they'll be fine. Plus you can still throw some quick double teams/collapses in there from time to time.

I want to agree, but you can gain length. Today is a much different day than when Ben Wallace was killing it. You might have 2 or 3 players that can Bang that are all all-star game scheme changers. Stew is a great strong side option, just nobody's weak side or clean up man.

Sent from my SM-G986U using RealGM mobile app

Agreed! Also, people forget that Ben had Rasheed at 6'11 guarding bigger players as well helping him out. Right now the Pistons don't have a quality inside player over 6'10. This is why I really wanted Evan Mobley before we landed #1 to draft Cade.