Draft Thread Part 8: 4th pick !!!!

[Odie29]

At the end of the day every prospect has some form of weaknesses that make GMs leery otherwise:

Wade doesn't go 5th
Lillard doesn't go 6th
Kawhi doesn't go 15th
Klay doesn't go 11th
Booker doesn't go 12th

Etc. (I may be slightly off by a pick or 2)

Seems like the criteria to get fans happy is elite athleticism/size and wingspan/shooting/defense/"3 level scorer" or else the prospect just isn't that interesting. The players listed above are all HOF esque who any fan would die to get yet they weren't such sure things on their draft nights.

These prospects aren't finished products which is why their career trajectories go so differently.

If you believe in the person and the player you should make the pick and have no regrets. To me I take everything that comes with Suggs even if his handle is basic and isn't the 3 level scorer Jalen Green is. With his current skillset and personality you know he will become something or die trying and the Raps should be thanking the lotto Gods hes even available to us imo. Yes he has some flaws otherwise he would be the number 1 pick and they are flaws I think are being overblown a bit by some on here.

[CanadaB-Ball]

Yes, u do. You cover every player and watch them live at every opportunity at least once.

Giddey has zero defense and a terrible shot.

Highly doubt he was the pick at 7/8. Raps love taller play making guards hence the drafting of Delon and the targeting SGA.

But going with a slow, non defending player at an important position like PG seems unlikely.

I’m quoting this for posterity.

In ten years Giddey will be considered one of the best players to come out of this draft.

I want what you're smoking

Time will tell.

[WuTang_OG]

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that was quick

[Bruin]

Well there goes the plan of getting both Mobleys

[WuTang_OG]

CBS Sports Big Board rank: No. 6

For months there has been a near consensus that there are five players in the top tier of this draft -- rounded out by Kuminga -- who are locks to go top five in some order. Yet as the draft has approached, Kuminga has fallen away from that bunch of Cunningham, Green, Mobley and Suggs in the eyes of teams. It coincides with Scottie Barnes' recent rise and Bouknight's own flail to the finish line of the G League season.


He doesn't fall far here -- just one spot to No. 6 -- but it's a development worth monitoring with Bouknight, Barnes and others all making late pushes. It's hard to imagine he goes higher than No. 5 in this draft, but if Barnes goes fifth, I can't imagine Kuminga slips past the Thunder at six, either. So, at least for right now, he's No. 6 on our board with a draft range that's between 5 and 6.

[CanadaB-Ball]

This is what I'm seeing overall for these prospects:
mobley - Highest outcome is 2nd best defensive player on a championship team and 3rd best offensive player if his jumper translates
Lowest outcome is bench big on a championship team

Green- Highest outcome is 2nd or 3rd best offensive player on a championship team if his playmaking improves quite a bit and 4th or 5th best defensive player if he gets in a good system
Lowest outcome is 4th guard on a championship team so basically a bench guard

Suggs- Highest outcome is 3rd best offensive player on a championship team if the shooting is above average and 2nd or 3rd best defensive player on a championship team
Lowest outcome is Backup guard at both the 1 and 2 on a championship team.

Barnes: Highest outcome is 3rd best offensive player on a championship team if the shooting is average and 2nd defensive player on a championship especially if he can play small ball 5
Lowest outcome is low end starter on championship because of his passing and defensive versatility

Overall, I just don't see anyone with superstar potential here so hopeful these guys reach their highest outcomes.

I’m far higher on Mobley’s high-end.

His high-end, for me, is best defensive player in the NBA. His spatial awareness, rotations, timing, and vertical quickness make him a lock to be an elite defender, and if his feet are as quick horizontally as I think they are, he’ll be Rudy Gobert with the ability to switch off every screen, and guard out to the three.

I don’t know how good he’ll be offensively (I don’t think he’ll ever be a number one option), but if he can shoot, then he’ll be gravitational and, with his passing ability, that’ll make him a number two option in my mind.

I think his high-end is that of a superstar.

[MavCarter]

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that was quick

Damn thought this was evan mobley announcing he's returning for a sec. Scared the **** out of me

[Federalies]

I do find it more than mildly amusing that our armchair talent evaluators think that after a few minutes or hours of “watching tape” they’ve discovered the holy grail of insight that all the experts somehow overlooked?

If Mr. Suggs has such a rudimentary handle and lack of creation, why was he named Mr. Baketball in his state, why did he win 3 gold medals as the lead guard on USA junior teams with Cade, Green, Barnes etc? Why did the consensus #1 college team recruit and hand the reigns over to a rookie who led them to a near undefeated season if he was so…average? Why do experts mock him to the Raptors at 4 while having Suggs #2 on their big boards?

I’ll admit I personally like the Suggs fit on our team. He may not be as tall as Cade but he is 4” taller then the GROAT, he may not be an above the rim athlete but he’s plenty athletic in a Raptors kind of smash mouth way, he may not have scored almost 18 points per game over an amazingly taxing 15 game Gleague season but he did score over 14 per playing on a stacked team with a 50.3 FG%, he may not guard 1-5 but he can lock down 1-2 (which seems important). All this to say, Jalen Suggs doesn’t need to be your favourite player or pick but let’s not pretend he’s a scrub who’ll wash out of the league like Darko.

https://www.si.com/nba/raptors/news/toronto-raptors-nba-draft-jalen-suggs-special-corey-kispert?jwsource=cl

Lol, this is basically a slight at me right?

I pointed out a very specific part of Suggs game that I consider weak. Why would that stop him for winning a bunch of awards and accolades? Listen up everyone, don't discuss possible weaknesses in any of Cade/Suggs/Green/Mobley's game because they've all racked up gold medals and Mr. Basketballs! It's idiotic logic.

No one called him a scrub, I would take him 4th. Such a stupid strawman to equate discussing weaknesses to considering the guy is a scrub.

PSA EVERYONE: Stop evaluating prospects, we're all armchair evaluators that have no right to opinion. Leave it to the experts.

Lol, not just you my friend, this is a reaction to all those with “definitive” hot takes about player A or B and in this case Re: Suggs.

That said, It’s not like you said the 20 yr old kid could “stand to tighten his handle” or “he needs to work on his creation skills”. You chose to use terms and phrases that come across as “definitive” not just “opinion”. It’s a free country, you can have any “opinion” you want, just don’t be surprised when others site qualified professionals that aren’t coming to the same conclusions as you to support their “opinions”.

“I can't get over how rudimentary Suggs' handle is. I can't remember a top guard prospect coming in with less of a bag than him. We don't even see flashes, I've gone over so much of his full game highlights and he just never does anything beyond a simple crossover and in/out dribble. Hardly even dribbles the ball through his legs. Consistent through HS/College/International play.

No shake, no deception, purely north-south. Effective at the college level but I wonder how it'll translate against better defenders where you need to generate an advantage to force the defense to react.

Expectations need to be tempered with him IMO. He's simply not going to be a high usage, primary scorer. He's no Wade/Mitchell/Roy - you watch their college highlights and they are doing what they did there what they end up doing in the NBA. Suggs hasn't shown any of that kind of self-creation ability.”

[MavCarter]

I really cant tell is scottie barnes rising is some team outside of the top 5 pushing an agenda or if he's actually rising. Is his jumpshot fixable?

[MavCarter]

OKC telling chad ford they have scottie ranked higher than suggs seems suspect as hell to me. What benefit do you get telling that to ford? Seems like they're the ones pushing the agenda lmao

[simple_jack]

I'll never forget how pissed celtics fans were when they took a raw jaylen brown when a majority of big boards had bender and kriss dunn (a lot had marquese chriss too) ranked ahead of him. Stop being so close minded

Honestly Kris Dunn could’ve been good on the Celtics.

Fit matters. Minnesota ruins a lot of careers lol

[dgr81]

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obviously it's houston

[Bruin]

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obviously it's houston

If this is true and it’s Houston I wonder what Cleveland does. Do they take Mobley and try to make it work with Allen?

[tdotrep2]

OKC telling chad ford they have scottie ranked higher than suggs seems suspect as hell to me. What benefit do you get telling that to ford? Seems like they're the ones pushing the agenda lmao

its a hail mary to get one of kuminga/suggs to fall to them, pretty desperate. theres no needs for them to be telling chad ford anything without an agenda attached.

[tecumseh18]

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obviously it's houston

Yup. He wants to go as high as possible. A promise from Cavs (or us) would be meaningless. I wonder if the top 3 (including Mobley to Cavs) all get promises?

[WuTang_OG]

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obviously it's houston

I think its Cleveland

[WuTang_OG]

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obviously it's houston

If this is true and it’s Houston I wonder what Cleveland does. Do they take Mobley and try to make it work with Allen?

Everything I'm seeing is them re-upping Allen.

CLE is the wild card here. They could very easily pass on Mobley and go for Kuminga/Barnes

[gojoorange]

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obviously it's houston

Maybe it's the Pistons and the talk about them trading down is true.

[720]

Has to be Houston. That means we're getting one of Suggs or Mobley depending on what Cleveland does.

[PhilBlackson]

It's obviously HOU lol why are you guys even wondering?!

It's long been rumored already and he was already seen chatting on his live with KP Jr.