2021-22 regular season thread

[Stillwater]

Congratulations to Darius ... we may get to see him playing with the big boys for a bit.

Read on Twitter

Hope he doesn't get the delta variant ...
I see they closed off the games to fans already

[yoyoboy]

Good for Darius! If the Finals goes 6-7 games maybe one of Hrue or Booker decides not to go to Tokyo, which would make Garland the replacement, right?

[Stillwater]

Good for Darius! If the Finals goes 6-7 games maybe one of Hrue or Booker decides not to go to Tokyo, which would make Garland the replacement, right?

Yeah maybe he can build up his brand some on a world stage

[JonFromVA]

Good for Darius! If the Finals goes 6-7 games maybe one of Hrue or Booker decides not to go to Tokyo, which would make Garland the replacement, right?

Garland would seem the likely replacement if he plays well and Jrue or Dame can't go; but unless he's single-handedly winning the team exhibition games I wouldn't expect him to replace a player at a different position.

DG's first challenge is getting on the floor in these exhibitions given Pops will start Dame and could then slide one of his SG's over to PG when he sits (ex: Beal or LaVine).

Some players are just better for these FIBA inspired pickup games. For instance, Kyrie simply dominated no matter what they did with him and beat out guys like John Wall and Steph Curry for the PG spot on the select team and then on the national team. Kyrie was happy to pass the ball around early in games and closed quite a few out down the stretch.

DG seems to fit in that mold as a ball-handler, passer, shooter. And given Pops and Sploestra are the lead coaches of the two teams, it wouldn't surprise me if defense was a consideration for the players they chose. If team USA's defense can't navigate hard screens and P&R's they're going to get eaten alive by Euro bigs and guards.

[Stillwater]

Good for Darius! If the Finals goes 6-7 games maybe one of Hrue or Booker decides not to go to Tokyo, which would make Garland the replacement, right?

Garland would seem the likely replacement if he plays well and Jrue or Dame can't go; but unless he's single-handedly winning the team exhibition games I wouldn't expect him to replace a player at a different position.

DG's first challenge is getting on the floor in these exhibitions given Pops will start Dame and could then slide one of his SG's over to PG when he sits (ex: Beal or LaVine).

Some players are just better for these FIBA inspired pickup games. For instance, Kyrie simply dominated no matter what they did with him and beat out guys like John Wall and Steph Curry for the PG spot on the select team and then on the national team. Kyrie was happy to pass the ball around early in games and closed quite a few out down the stretch.

DG seems to fit in that mold as a ball-handler, passer, shooter. And given Pops and Sploestra are the lead coaches of the two teams, it wouldn't surprise me if defense was a consideration for the players they chose. If team USA's defense can't navigate hard screens and P&R's they're going to get eaten alive by Euro bigs and guards.

In some respects I hope DG gets exposed, but at the same time I want him to succeed so they trade him for an actual return worth justifying moving on...
I am not completely sold anyone on here will ever get past the fact that just because DG is a better floor general than Sexton was as a rookie, does not make DG the one to keep unlkess you cant upgrade which imo would be pretty easy with a mid 1st this draft. I would take McBride Bones Hyland, Cooper or Dosumnu over DG any day with or without Sexton as a factor in the choice.

[JonFromVA]

Good for Darius! If the Finals goes 6-7 games maybe one of Hrue or Booker decides not to go to Tokyo, which would make Garland the replacement, right?

Garland would seem the likely replacement if he plays well and Jrue or Dame can't go; but unless he's single-handedly winning the team exhibition games I wouldn't expect him to replace a player at a different position.

DG's first challenge is getting on the floor in these exhibitions given Pops will start Dame and could then slide one of his SG's over to PG when he sits (ex: Beal or LaVine).

Some players are just better for these FIBA inspired pickup games. For instance, Kyrie simply dominated no matter what they did with him and beat out guys like John Wall and Steph Curry for the PG spot on the select team and then on the national team. Kyrie was happy to pass the ball around early in games and closed quite a few out down the stretch.

DG seems to fit in that mold as a ball-handler, passer, shooter. And given Pops and Sploestra are the lead coaches of the two teams, it wouldn't surprise me if defense was a consideration for the players they chose. If team USA's defense can't navigate hard screens and P&R's they're going to get eaten alive by Euro bigs and guards.

In some respects I hope DG gets exposed, but at the same time I want him to succeed so they trade him for an actual return worth justifying moving on...
I am not completely sold anyone on here will ever get past the fact that just because DG is a better floor general than Sexton was as a rookie, does not make DG the one to keep unlkess you cant upgrade which imo would be pretty easy with a mid 1st this draft. I would take McBride Bones Hyland, Cooper or Dosumnu over DG any day with or without Sexton as a factor in the choice.

[JonFromVA]

Garland would seem the likely replacement if he plays well and Jrue or Dame can't go; but unless he's single-handedly winning the team exhibition games I wouldn't expect him to replace a player at a different position.

DG's first challenge is getting on the floor in these exhibitions given Pops will start Dame and could then slide one of his SG's over to PG when he sits (ex: Beal or LaVine).

Some players are just better for these FIBA inspired pickup games. For instance, Kyrie simply dominated no matter what they did with him and beat out guys like John Wall and Steph Curry for the PG spot on the select team and then on the national team. Kyrie was happy to pass the ball around early in games and closed quite a few out down the stretch.

DG seems to fit in that mold as a ball-handler, passer, shooter. And given Pops and Sploestra are the lead coaches of the two teams, it wouldn't surprise me if defense was a consideration for the players they chose. If team USA's defense can't navigate hard screens and P&R's they're going to get eaten alive by Euro bigs and guards.

In some respects I hope DG gets exposed, but at the same time I want him to succeed so they trade him for an actual return worth justifying moving on...
I am not completely sold anyone on here will ever get past the fact that just because DG is a better floor general than Sexton was as a rookie, does not make DG the one to keep unlkess you cant upgrade which imo would be pretty easy with a mid 1st this draft. I would take McBride Bones Hyland, Cooper or Dosumnu over DG any day with or without Sexton as a factor in the choice.

Or just stop picking sides and hope both players reach their ceilings.

[Stillwater]

In some respects I hope DG gets exposed, but at the same time I want him to succeed so they trade him for an actual return worth justifying moving on...
I am not completely sold anyone on here will ever get past the fact that just because DG is a better floor general than Sexton was as a rookie, does not make DG the one to keep unlkess you cant upgrade which imo would be pretty easy with a mid 1st this draft. I would take McBride Bones Hyland, Cooper or Dosumnu over DG any day with or without Sexton as a factor in the choice.

Or just stop picking sides and hope both players reach their ceilings.

Sure the arguments are getting old... but the truth is DG is no better than half the point guard prospects projected in the first round of this draft and the Cavs would be foolish not to flip him with some future 2nds for a late lottery pick if they want one with better size defensively or understand on the down low that this probably is his greatest value time being so well liked coming off a nice come back season from the depths of rookie hell

[Stillwater]

I would be excited for this roster most if they managed to get a point forward point guard like Barnes or trade down and take Giddey before I would be cool with them having to pay future assets or current assets to get Cade. Maybe they like the fact he is a knock down outside shooter and think the spacing he will provide at the 3 makes it worth going after him idk...
But despite the fact that I like him enough where I could believe he was the BPA for this current roster assembled, I dont believe the current roster assembly is a contender by adding him. They have to do more and you cannot do that by dumping assets for one kid.
If they do it he better be a hell of a lot better attacking the basket and getting to the charity stripe than he is right now or others will pass him by and the Cavs will see him leave to join up with somebody else

[JonFromVA]

Or just stop picking sides and hope both players reach their ceilings.

Sure the arguments are getting old... but the truth is DG is no better than half the point guard prospects projected in the first round of this draft and the Cavs would be foolish not to flip him with some future 2nds for a late lottery pick if they want one with better size defensively or understand on the down low that this probably is his greatest value time being so well liked coming off a nice come back season from the depths of rookie hell

The truth is your predictions regarding Garland have all been wrong.

[Stillwater]

Or just stop picking sides and hope both players reach their ceilings.

Sure the arguments are getting old... but the truth is DG is no better than half the point guard prospects projected in the first round of this draft and the Cavs would be foolish not to flip him with some future 2nds for a late lottery pick if they want one with better size defensively or understand on the down low that this probably is his greatest value time being so well liked coming off a nice come back season from the depths of rookie hell

The truth is your predictions regarding Garland have all been wrong.

which ones that he would not replicate his shooting in a one on nobody workout or that he was too small to ever be a good defender and it was even worse next to another small guard?
What about the fact that DG has only proven he can find the big man for easy buckets consistently and the majority of his dimes are just that and usually come when the game is already decided...
I really am surprised you dont understand my concerns are real not imagined, any guard in the NBA should be able to do more than he has as a shooter no matter how many passes he converts on its not resulting in wins

[JonFromVA]

Sure the arguments are getting old... but the truth is DG is no better than half the point guard prospects projected in the first round of this draft and the Cavs would be foolish not to flip him with some future 2nds for a late lottery pick if they want one with better size defensively or understand on the down low that this probably is his greatest value time being so well liked coming off a nice come back season from the depths of rookie hell

The truth is your predictions regarding Garland have all been wrong.

which ones that he would not replicate his shooting in a one on nobody workout or that he was too small to ever be a good defender and it was even worse next to another small guard?
What about the fact that DG has only proven he can find the big man for easy buckets consistently and the majority of his dimes are just that and usually come when the game is already decided...
I really am surprised you dont understand my concerns are real not imagined, any guard in the NBA should be able to do more than he has as a shooter no matter how many passes he converts on its not resulting in wins

I'll leave you to re-read what you wrote about Garland entering the season ... beyond that there's a lot of things you cobstantly repeat that never had any basis in reality but Im not expecting you to realize that.

[Wisedude]

If the Cavs Front Office thinks that adding Cade Cunnigham and giving up 3 & Sexton or Garland, they are off their rocker. The Cavs overall talent is bad. That is why they had the 5th worst record. I would keep building thru the Draft by adding exciting young players that have length. Using the trade market to get rid of overpriced veterans. If I could get 4 1st round draft picks in this draft, I do it. Young, exciting talent with length will generate excitement and sell tickets. Wayne Embry did this when he drafted Brad Daugherty, Ron Harper and Mark Price in the first round. They didn't win much the first year but the people saw the young talent and finally knew they had a team with an exciting future. People bought tickets because these kids were talented. The wins came later. This is really the only path for a medium Midwest market city. I would restructure, re-shape this team with a future goal of winning an NBA Championship. But Altman is too young (even though he is bright) to really do what needs to be done here. July 29th can't come soon enough...LOL.

[jbk1234]

If the Cavs Front Office thinks that adding Cade Cunnigham and giving up 3 & Sexton or Garland, they are off their rocker. The Cavs overall talent is bad. That is why they had the 5th worst record. I would keep building thru the Draft by adding exciting young players that have length. Using the trade market to get rid of overpriced veterans. If I could get 4 1st round draft picks in this draft, I do it. Young, exciting talent with length will generate excitement and sell tickets. Wayne Embry did this when he drafted Brad Daugherty, Ron Harper and Mark Price in the first round. They didn't win much the first year but the people saw the young talent and finally knew they had a team with an exciting future. People bought tickets because these kids were talented. The wins came later. This is really the only path for a medium Midwest market city. I would restructure, re-shape this team with a future goal of winning an NBA Championship. But Altman is too young (even though he is bright) to really do what needs to be done here. July 29th can't come soon enough...LOL.

I can all but guarantee that they won't trade back for more picks. That team you're talking about Embry putting together started with Daugherty and he was No. 1 overall.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

[JonFromVA]

If the Cavs Front Office thinks that adding Cade Cunnigham and giving up 3 & Sexton or Garland, they are off their rocker. The Cavs overall talent is bad. That is why they had the 5th worst record. I would keep building thru the Draft by adding exciting young players that have length. Using the trade market to get rid of overpriced veterans. If I could get 4 1st round draft picks in this draft, I do it. Young, exciting talent with length will generate excitement and sell tickets. Wayne Embry did this when he drafted Brad Daugherty, Ron Harper and Mark Price in the first round. They didn't win much the first year but the people saw the young talent and finally knew they had a team with an exciting future. People bought tickets because these kids were talented. The wins came later. This is really the only path for a medium Midwest market city. I would restructure, re-shape this team with a future goal of winning an NBA Championship. But Altman is too young (even though he is bright) to really do what needs to be done here. July 29th can't come soon enough...LOL.

I can all but guarantee that they won't trade back for more picks. That team you're talking about Embry putting together started with Daugherty and he was No. 1 overall.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J327A using RealGM mobile app

It was also an era where players stayed in school for 3 or 4 years, so not only did you have a better idea what you were drafting - they were contributing quicker.

Just drafting for length gets us Knox, Culver, and Toppin/Okongwu.... not exactly Price, Harper, and Daugherty.

[LivingLegend]

Sure the arguments are getting old... but the truth is DG is no better than half the point guard prospects projected in the first round of this draft and the Cavs would be foolish not to flip him with some future 2nds for a late lottery pick if they want one with better size defensively or understand on the down low that this probably is his greatest value time being so well liked coming off a nice come back season from the depths of rookie hell

The truth is your predictions regarding Garland have all been wrong.

which ones that he would not replicate his shooting in a one on nobody workout or that he was too small to ever be a good defender and it was even worse next to another small guard?
What about the fact that DG has only proven he can find the big man for easy buckets consistently and the majority of his dimes are just that and usually come when the game is already decided...
I really am surprised you dont understand my concerns are real not imagined, any guard in the NBA should be able to do more than he has as a shooter no matter how many passes he converts on its not resulting in wins

I mean to be fair, the VAST majority of all star level guards in the NBA are bad defenders. Curry, Lillard, Luka, Kemba back when he was good, Westbrook, ECT are all sub par defenders.

DGs playmaking ability is already pushing the boundaries of elite and he's only 21. He has also showed flashes of being a 3 level #1 scoring option when he looks for his shot. I think a lot of his issues are learning to balance his offense and become the most effective he can be by picking when to be a scorer and when to be a facilitator--which I believe will happen with more time/experience.

Right now he's often regulated to a facilitator role when sharing the floor with Sexton because Sexton tries to do all of the scoring every night.

It really hard not to get excited about his potential to take it to the next level and become more assertive and efficient. The main fault I see with him for the past 2 years has been his confidence level. When he's aggressive and confident he looks like a All Star. Again I think his confidence/consistency will come with age and experience.

[Stillwater]

The truth is your predictions regarding Garland have all been wrong.

which ones that he would not replicate his shooting in a one on nobody workout or that he was too small to ever be a good defender and it was even worse next to another small guard?
What about the fact that DG has only proven he can find the big man for easy buckets consistently and the majority of his dimes are just that and usually come when the game is already decided...
I really am surprised you dont understand my concerns are real not imagined, any guard in the NBA should be able to do more than he has as a shooter no matter how many passes he converts on its not resulting in wins

I mean to be fair, the VAST majority of all star level guards in the NBA are bad defenders. Curry, Lillard, Luka, Kemba back when he was good, Westbrook, ECT are all sub par defenders.

DGs playmaking ability is already pushing the boundaries of elite and he's only 21. He has also showed flashes of being a 3 level #1 scoring option when he looks for his shot. I think a lot of his issues are learning to balance his offense and become the most effective he can be by picking when to be a scorer and when to be a facilitator--which I believe will happen with more time/experience.

Right now he's often regulated to a facilitator role when sharing the floor with Sexton because Sexton tries to do all of the scoring every night.

It really hard not to get excited about his potential to take it to the next level and become more assertive and efficient. The main fault I see with him for the past 2 years has been his confidence level. When he's aggressive and confident he looks like a All Star. Again I think his confidence/consistency will come with age and experience.

I agree with some of the reasoning to be optimistic but I think that time has passed, because I do not agree DG was held back by Sexton otherwise we would have seen Garland take advantage all the minutes Sexton was not playing with him and he didnt
Sexton however did take advantage and so did Okoro to end the season with DG on the bench.

[JonFromVA]

which ones that he would not replicate his shooting in a one on nobody workout or that he was too small to ever be a good defender and it was even worse next to another small guard?
What about the fact that DG has only proven he can find the big man for easy buckets consistently and the majority of his dimes are just that and usually come when the game is already decided...
I really am surprised you dont understand my concerns are real not imagined, any guard in the NBA should be able to do more than he has as a shooter no matter how many passes he converts on its not resulting in wins

I mean to be fair, the VAST majority of all star level guards in the NBA are bad defenders. Curry, Lillard, Luka, Kemba back when he was good, Westbrook, ECT are all sub par defenders.

DGs playmaking ability is already pushing the boundaries of elite and he's only 21. He has also showed flashes of being a 3 level #1 scoring option when he looks for his shot. I think a lot of his issues are learning to balance his offense and become the most effective he can be by picking when to be a scorer and when to be a facilitator--which I believe will happen with more time/experience.

Right now he's often regulated to a facilitator role when sharing the floor with Sexton because Sexton tries to do all of the scoring every night.

It really hard not to get excited about his potential to take it to the next level and become more assertive and efficient. The main fault I see with him for the past 2 years has been his confidence level. When he's aggressive and confident he looks like a All Star. Again I think his confidence/consistency will come with age and experience.

I agree with some of the reasoning to be optimistic but I think that time has passed, because I do not agree DG was held back by Sexton otherwise we would have seen Garland take advantage all the minutes Sexton was not playing with him and he didnt
Sexton however did take advantage and so did Okoro to end the season with DG on the bench.

It's too bad you never look at stats or listen to other members of the board.

Garland's best month (15 games) was in April when he went 20 & 7 on 58.6 TS% ... the team was +0.7 when he was on the floor.

Neither Sexton nor Okoro were touching those numbers in May when Garland was out.

However, I don't agree that anyone is holding anyone else back ... young players not forcing action when they have teammates to help them is a good trait, not a bad one.

[Stillwater]

I mean to be fair, the VAST majority of all star level guards in the NBA are bad defenders. Curry, Lillard, Luka, Kemba back when he was good, Westbrook, ECT are all sub par defenders.

DGs playmaking ability is already pushing the boundaries of elite and he's only 21. He has also showed flashes of being a 3 level #1 scoring option when he looks for his shot. I think a lot of his issues are learning to balance his offense and become the most effective he can be by picking when to be a scorer and when to be a facilitator--which I believe will happen with more time/experience.

Right now he's often regulated to a facilitator role when sharing the floor with Sexton because Sexton tries to do all of the scoring every night.

It really hard not to get excited about his potential to take it to the next level and become more assertive and efficient. The main fault I see with him for the past 2 years has been his confidence level. When he's aggressive and confident he looks like a All Star. Again I think his confidence/consistency will come with age and experience.

I agree with some of the reasoning to be optimistic but I think that time has passed, because I do not agree DG was held back by Sexton otherwise we would have seen Garland take advantage all the minutes Sexton was not playing with him and he didnt
Sexton however did take advantage and so did Okoro to end the season with DG on the bench.

It's too bad you never look at stats or listen to other members of the board.

Garland's best month (15 games) was in April when he went 20 & 7 on 58.6 TS% ... the team was +0.7 when he was on the floor.

Neither Sexton nor Okoro were touching those numbers in May when Garland was out.

However, I don't agree that anyone is holding anyone else back ... young players not forcing action when they have teammates to help them is a good trait, not a bad one.

I hope someone with your optimism is on the other end of the phone call with Koby when DG gets shopped next season at this time lol
But seriously I look at stats I just dont take them out of context or think they are the end game... Sexton had more assists without Dg out there to close the season and he did it playing off ball next to Okoro who looked great on ball and the pairing was solid...
It does not mean DG was better without them if it meant he stepped up his offense in Sextons absence, but it didn't happen very often and it does mean Okoro especially with the opportunity to show he was are better without someone eating up that amount of ball time made a difference in evaluating his usage on ball vs off.
I think the Cavs have 3 guards that are better on ball than off and Sexton is the only one who has shown so far to be capable of scoring on or off ball consistently. Okoro appears to be a far lesser offensive impact player off ball and DG seems to be capable of running an offense but settles too often for dump offs and lobs when he should be kicking out even if the player on the perimeter or cutting is not that good and needs more shot reps.
If they hand DG the keys again next season and the record is anything less than 35 wins I think he can pack his bags.

[LivingLegend]

I agree with some of the reasoning to be optimistic but I think that time has passed, because I do not agree DG was held back by Sexton otherwise we would have seen Garland take advantage all the minutes Sexton was not playing with him and he didnt
Sexton however did take advantage and so did Okoro to end the season with DG on the bench.

It's too bad you never look at stats or listen to other members of the board.

Garland's best month (15 games) was in April when he went 20 & 7 on 58.6 TS% ... the team was +0.7 when he was on the floor.

Neither Sexton nor Okoro were touching those numbers in May when Garland was out.

However, I don't agree that anyone is holding anyone else back ... young players not forcing action when they have teammates to help them is a good trait, not a bad one.

I hope someone with your optimism is on the other end of the phone call with Koby when DG gets shopped next season at this time lol
But seriously I look at stats I just dont take them out of context or think they are the end game... Sexton had more assists without Dg out there to close the season and he did it playing off ball next to Okoro who looked great on ball and the pairing was solid...
It does not mean DG was better without them if it meant he stepped up his offense in Sextons absence, but it didn't happen very often and it does mean Okoro especially with the opportunity to show he was are better without someone eating up that amount of ball time made a difference in evaluating his usage on ball vs off.
I think the Cavs have 3 guards that are better on ball than off and Sexton is the only one who has shown so far to be capable of scoring on or off ball consistently. Okoro appears to be a far lesser offensive impact player off ball and DG seems to be capable of running an offense but settles too often for dump offs and lobs when he should be kicking out even if the player on the perimeter or cutting is not that good and needs more shot reps.
If they hand DG the keys again next season and the record is anything less than 35 wins I think he can pack his bags.

I mean Sexton has had the keys for 2 years now and he has led the Cavs to a 19 win season and a 22 win season so why aren't his bags already packed?

But in seriousness, I'm not pitting them against each other. I just want whatever combination that is best for the team. From watching, DG is not nearly as effective when sharing the court with Sexton, but he cranks up the aggressiveness when Sexton is off the floor.

Another thing that would work is to make sure Sexton primarily plays off-ball at SG and not this stupid combo guard hybrid thing he has been. This will ensure DG still initiates the offense using his strengths but Sexton can get his points off ball by cutting and coming off screens.
Either way the defense with both of them on the floor will be terrible, which is something I wanted to see them fix by changing the lineup.