Usman Garuba

[UcanUwill]

Potential lotto pick with only a 2 page thread where the last post was last November?

Anyone think he can go top 10?

Its very weird to see high profile Euro not being talked about here at all, even guys like Dragan Bender had a longest thread imaginable, but unlike Bender, Garuba is not buried on the bench and is less of the mystery, therefor he is less intriguing. WIth Garuba we know he cant score and his offensive game is very limited, we know that and thats disappointing. Garuba is just not very skilled, he can go top 10, but I dont think he will, I think his feel for the game is underrated however for sure, most players his age have no clue how to play defense, while this guy already plays d like experienced veteran, but upside is limited.

Would you say a better-shooting worse-passing version of Draymond is a realistic outcome for him?

Ibaka is another tempting comparison point, as he also played in the ACB League pre-draft. Garuba seems to be comfortably ahead of Ibaka at the same age, and Ibaka ended up being a really solid NBA player.

Those arent bad comparisons, but I dont know, their offense are nothing alike. Garuba needs to work on his O, because right now hes not a huge contributor, I think best case with him is still Bam, he reminds me of Bam the most, but thats because I project his ball handling skill I got to admit, I think his ball handling and ability to run a fast break is better than been shown, I have seen him do it few times, flashes of it, but he is a teenager big playing on Real Madrid after all, NBA gives their players more freedom and I believe Garuba could be unlocked into more than just a defensive guy, but we will see.

He looks like early bloomer to me though, and that worries me. Some could say there is nothing to bloom about, but no, his IQ is really way beyond his age, but he hasn't been improving skill wise very much, thats what worries me the most.

[Charm]

Its very weird to see high profile Euro not being talked about here at all, even guys like Dragan Bender had a longest thread imaginable, but unlike Bender, Garuba is not buried on the bench and is less of the mystery, therefor he is less intriguing. WIth Garuba we know he cant score and his offensive game is very limited, we know that and thats disappointing. Garuba is just not very skilled, he can go top 10, but I dont think he will, I think his feel for the game is underrated however for sure, most players his age have no clue how to play defense, while this guy already plays d like experienced veteran, but upside is limited.

Would you say a better-shooting worse-passing version of Draymond is a realistic outcome for him?

Ibaka is another tempting comparison point, as he also played in the ACB League pre-draft. Garuba seems to be comfortably ahead of Ibaka at the same age, and Ibaka ended up being a really solid NBA player.

Those arent bad comparisons, but I dont know, their offense are nothing alike. Garuba needs to work on his O, because right now hes not a huge contributor, I think best case with him is still Bam, he reminds me of Bam the most, but thats because I project his ball handling skill I got to admit, I think his ball handling and ability to run a fast break is better than been shown, I have seen him do it few times, flashes of it, but he is a teenager big playing on Real Madrid after all, NBA gives their players more freedom and I believe Garuba could be unlocked into more than just a defensive guy, but we will see.

He looks like early bloomer to me though, and that worries me. Some could say there is nothing to bloom about, but no, his IQ is really way beyond his age, but he hasn't been improving skill wise very much, thats what worries me the most.

If there's one area of growth it's been his shooting. He nearly tripled his 3-point attempt rate from last season to this season, and he hit a more respectable 66% from the line, up from 53% last year. That makes me feel more confident that he'll be at least an adequate floor space (a la Ibaka) in time.

[Mickey8]

There is a zero similarity with Adebayo, as I said his comparison in the NBA is Biyombo, he has poor offensive skills just like him , but could be useful on the defensive end of the floor I guess.

[Charm]

There is a zero similarity with Adebayo, as I said his comparison in the NBA is Biyombo, he has poor offensive skills just like him , but could be useful on the defensive end of the floor I guess.

Biyombo with a 3-point shot is a solid starter though...right? Not half bad if that's something like Garuba's floor.

[pad300]

There is a zero similarity with Adebayo, as I said his comparison in the NBA is Biyombo, he has poor offensive skills just like him , but could be useful on the defensive end of the floor I guess.

Biyombo with a 3-point shot is a solid starter though...right? Not half bad if that's something like Garuba's floor.

Yeah, Biyombo with a 3ptr is potentially a starter, but that's Garuba's floor. He has to develop that 3 pt shot, and he hasn't done it yet. Garuba's actual floor is Biyombo...

[UcanUwill]

There is a zero similarity with Adebayo, as I said his comparison in the NBA is Biyombo, he has poor offensive skills just like him , but could be useful on the defensive end of the floor I guess.

Biyombo with a 3-point shot is a solid starter though...right? Not half bad if that's something like Garuba's floor.

Yeah, Biyombo with a 3ptr is potentially a starter, but that's Garuba's floor. He has to develop that 3 pt shot, and he hasn't done it yet. Garuba's actual floor is Biyombo...

His worst case scenario is probably Ekpe Udoh?

[Charm]

Biyombo with a 3-point shot is a solid starter though...right? Not half bad if that's something like Garuba's floor.

Yeah, Biyombo with a 3ptr is potentially a starter, but that's Garuba's floor. He has to develop that 3 pt shot, and he hasn't done it yet. Garuba's actual floor is Biyombo...

His worst case scenario is probably Ekpe Udoh?

Seems harsh to say he hasn’t developed a 3-pt shot…I mean, tell that to Valencia. He’s a 19 year old big who’s already made ~50 career 3’s, it’d take a Fultz-like meltdown for him to become a complete non-shooter from here.

[Hal14]

Yeah, Biyombo with a 3ptr is potentially a starter, but that's Garuba's floor. He has to develop that 3 pt shot, and he hasn't done it yet. Garuba's actual floor is Biyombo...

His worst case scenario is probably Ekpe Udoh?

Seems harsh to say he hasn’t developed a 3-pt shot…I mean, tell that to Valencia. He’s a 19 year old big who’s already made ~50 career 3’s, it’d take a Fultz-like meltdown for him to become a complete non-shooter from here.

32% from 3 this season is definitely respectable for a 19 yr old kid playing in the 2nd best league in the world after the NBA, especially considering he shot 10/23 (43.5%) during a 9 game stretch at the end of this past season..

[EvanZ]

His worst case scenario is probably Ekpe Udoh?

Seems harsh to say he hasn’t developed a 3-pt shot…I mean, tell that to Valencia. He’s a 19 year old big who’s already made ~50 career 3’s, it’d take a Fultz-like meltdown for him to become a complete non-shooter from here.

32% from 3 this season is definitely respectable for a 19 yr old kid playing in the 2nd best league in the world after the NBA, especially considering he shot 10/23 (43.5%) during a 9 game stretch at the end of this past season..

He shot 32% and 66% from the free throw line (worse if you consider the prior 2 seasons). You guys always forget to mention the FT shooting when it suits the argument. I think it's unlikely he is shooting many 3s in the NBA. Not impossible, but not something I'd bet on being a strength.

[Charm]

Seems harsh to say he hasn’t developed a 3-pt shot…I mean, tell that to Valencia. He’s a 19 year old big who’s already made ~50 career 3’s, it’d take a Fultz-like meltdown for him to become a complete non-shooter from here.

32% from 3 this season is definitely respectable for a 19 yr old kid playing in the 2nd best league in the world after the NBA, especially considering he shot 10/23 (43.5%) during a 9 game stretch at the end of this past season..

He shot 32% and 66% from the free throw line (worse if you consider the prior 2 seasons). You guys always forget to mention the FT shooting when it suits the argument. I think it's unlikely he is shooting many 3s in the NBA. Not impossible, but not something I'd bet on being a strength.

Scroll up...I explicitly mentioned his free throw percentage (even though I think it's important to pay attention to sample size, and the sample size is bigger for 3-pointers than for free throws in this case).

I wouldn't bet on him being a great shooter, but I think there's a pretty good chance that when he's playing PF he'll spend a lot of the time parked in the corner on offense. And I think it's realistic that he'll hit that shot often enough to keep the defense honest. That's what matters. Do you disagree?

Compared to the other PF-adjacent players at the top of this class (Mobley, Johnson, Kuminga, Barnes, Jones, Sengun, Jackson), Garuba's shooting volume and percentages look positively rosy.

[clyde21]

Usman should be eval'd as a 5 primarily, who can slide to the 4 depending on the lineup next to him

[The-Power]

Usman should be eval'd as a 5 primarily, who can slide to the 4 depending on the lineup next to him

I think he can and will be a 4 next to a 5 that can shoot. Of course you also want him to be able to handle minutes at the 5, and if he's coming off the bench that might actually be the where he spends the majority of his minutes.

[clyde21]

Usman should be eval'd as a 5 primarily, who can slide to the 4 depending on the lineup next to him

I think he can and will be a 4 next to a 5 that can shoot. Of course you also want him to be able to handle minutes at the 5, and if he's coming off the bench that might actually be the where he spends the majority of his minutes.

yea, sure, but i mean, if Onyeka was seen as a 5 not sure why people are trying to pidgeon hole Usman at the 4...he CAN play the four but like you said next to a stretch 5, but the primary eval is with him at the 5 who can slide down whenever needed not the other way around.

[Charm]

Usman should be eval'd as a 5 primarily, who can slide to the 4 depending on the lineup next to him

I think he can and will be a 4 next to a 5 that can shoot. Of course you also want him to be able to handle minutes at the 5, and if he's coming off the bench that might actually be the where he spends the majority of his minutes.

yea, sure, but i mean, if Onyeka was seen as a 5 not sure why people are trying to pidgeon hole Usman at the 4...he CAN play the four but like you said next to a stretch 5, but the primary eval is with him at the 5 who can slide down whenever needed not the other way around.

Not meaning to pidgeon hole him at the 4...I just think he has the versatility to play that position because he's already a competent catch-and-shoot 3-point guy. Defenses can't ignore him on the 3-point line the way they can ignore Okongwu.

[The-Power]

yea, sure, but i mean, if Onyeka was seen as a 5 not sure why people are trying to pidgeon hole Usman at the 4...he CAN play the four but like you said next to a stretch 5, but the primary eval is with him at the 5 who can slide down whenever needed not the other way around.

I understand that point of view. My response to the Okongwu comparison would be that Garuba has shown a lot more ability to defend out on the perimeter and he's already used to playing as a 5 next to a big Center (including being used to space the floor and shoot when open, even though he's still bad at it), so he can produce in that role from day one if a team want him to. Okongwu is also heavier, isn't he?

I wouldn't pigeon-hole Garuba as a 4 but I do believe that if he's primarily a 5 in the NBA that means he's probably coming off the bench. His path to high-impact, in my view, is by being able to start at the 4 and then play the 5 in smaller line-ups – like Draymond (on defense).

But I'm curious about your thoughts here: what players are you thinking of that are primarily 5s but can/do slide down when needed? It seems a bit counterintuitive based on where the NBA has been going over the years, but maybe you have a comparison/an example in mind?

[Charm]

Here's the last of his three triples vs. Valencia, in the final minutes of a win-or-go-home playoff game. I don't see why he can't do the exact same thing in the NBA.

[EvanZ]

Here's the last of his three triples vs. Valencia, in the final minutes of a win-or-go-home playoff game. I don't see why he can't do the exact same thing in the NBA.

Yeah I mean I don't see why every NBA player can't make 100% of their shots based on one clip of a guy making a shot.

[Charm]

Here's the last of his three triples vs. Valencia, in the final minutes of a win-or-go-home playoff game. I don't see why he can't do the exact same thing in the NBA.

Yeah I mean I don't see why every NBA player can't make 100% of their shots based on one clip of a guy making a shot.

This is a designed play by a top-5 international team in a critical playoff situation. They trust Garuba to make that shot because they know he’s made it dozens of times in-game and thousands of times in practice. It’s a whole lot more meaningful than an experimental 3 an NCAA big puts up in garbage time of a meaningless regular-season game.

[clyde21]

I understand that point of view. My response to the Okongwu comparison would be that Garuba has shown a lot more ability to defend out on the perimeter and he's already used to playing as a 5 next to a big Center (including being used to space the floor and shoot when open, even though he's still bad at it), so he can produce in that role from day one if a team want him to. Okongwu is also heavier, isn't he?

thats the reason why he should be viewed as a 5, because that's what makes him a mismatch, being able to defend the perimeter from the 5 hole, if you slide him to the 4 you're getting 4 level mobility without the 4 level skill, at least until he develops it.

I wouldn't pigeon-hole Garuba as a 4 but I do believe that if he's primarily a 5 in the NBA that means he's probably coming off the bench. His path to high-impact, in my view, is by being able to start at the 4 and then play the 5 in smaller line-ups – like Draymond (on defense).

i guess that depends on how much skill he develops in the next few years and how his rim/paint protection is, but I don't see a reason why he can't be a starter at the 5 if those things develop. that skill cap would be even steeper at the 4.

But I'm curious about your thoughts here: what players are you thinking of that are primarily 5s but can/do slide down when needed? It seems a bit counterintuitive based on where the NBA has been going over the years, but maybe you have a comparison/an example in mind?

actually a lot of the young guys can do that..i think guys like Bam and Onyeka can both slide to the 4 if you wanna go bigger and put a stretch 5 next to them, i think Zion should be a 5 who slides to the 4 sometimes if you want to go bigger, Jonathan Isaac, Evan Mobley coming up, etc.

i just think slotting Garuba at the 4 means you kinda HAVE to put a stretch 5 in front of him, so that kinda limits your lineups in general if that's the primary objective u wanna go for...i'd rather have Garuba at the 5 who CAN slide down if I want to go bigger with a stretch 5, just gives me more versatility in general.

[yosemiteben]

If he is there at 11, I'd take a long hard look at him for the Hornets. Bring him off the bench and could be part of interesting lineup combinations like Melo - Hayward - Miles - PJ - Garuba.