Olajuwon vs Adetokunbo: Greatest Ethnic Nigerian Player Ever?

[gmoney411]

DWS is just a bad metric. It's not the worst thing on earth but it's pretty bad. But even to your point...his DWS is up because he played more minutes...

As for offensive load, Hakeem's usage went up slightly 93 to 94...not enough to explain it. Similarly his minutes went up by 1.5 per game. Bigger load, yes. Drastic? I'm not sure.

1.5 minutes up from the previous season and 4 minutes up from the 89 season. At the total was 41 minutes a game. 41 minutes a game is insane. Nobody plays 41 minutes a game for 80 games at the age of 31 in their 10th season. The dip was going to happen.

But in summary, the idea that Hakeem was a defensive beast mostly in the 80s is wrong. In the first 5 seasons of the 90s (90-94), Hakeem was hands down the best defensive player in the league. A decline began in 94 but he was still a great defender and the best defender in the league that year and deserved the DPOY.

Hakeem's best offensive years were 93-95 and his best defensive were 89-91. Giannis is a DPOY level guy today.

I'm not sure Hakeem was better than Robinson for whatever's worth.

I'm not really sure what you are getting at by splitting out Hakeem's best years like that. In 86 he averaged 27 a game in the playoffs and led the Rockets to the finals. In 87 averaged 29 in the playoffs. In 88 he averaged 38 in the playoffs. It's not like Hakeem wasn't a really good playoff performer until 93. Hakeem actually averaged 4 more PPG in the playoffs than the regular season for his career and is 13th all time in playoffs ppg ahead of guys like Kobe, Shaq, Malone, and Dirk. He is one of the few rare players that actually had a higher FG% in the playoffs for his career than the regular season.

The unfortunate part of Hakeem's career is that the Rockets were a badly run franchise that put nobody around him and he fought with the team a lot in the early 90s. Rudy T came in and ran an offense that fit Hakeem and the rest is history.

[gmoney411]

With Giannis' finals performance and playoff performance generally, this is a legitimate conversation. Comparable to Hakeem's 1995 performance against Shaq and is having a similarly dominant run.

Giannis just kicked in the the door to get into this discussion.

Finals? Yes. Playoff run? No. in 95 the Rockets beat a 60 win Jazz team as the road team. Beat a 59 win Suns team on the road. Beat a 62 win Spurs team on the road. And then beat a 57 win Magic team on the road. And Hakeem outplayed Malone, Barkley, Robinson, and Shaq in all of those series.

[Harry Garris]

I think you're confusing ethnicity and race. Giannis' race is Nigerian. Ethnically he is more Greek than Nigerian, as ethnicity speaks to the social group that you grew up in and the customs and culture that you are familiar with.

He's a mix of Greek and Nigerian culture. His race is Nigerian but he still has parts of the Nigerian culture within him. Look at an Asian american who was born in this country but whose parents are from China. Sure they have the American culture within in them from going to school and growing up here but they also retain parts of their Chinese culture due to being exposed to their parents and family at home. It's always the second generation after the first born generation that becomes fully immersed in the culture of the country they are born into.

Yeah I am familiar with this idea as my parents are American but I grew up in Belgium. When my family moved back to the US when I was in high school I was culturally very different than other American kids and didn't fit in at all despite speaking the same language and having some of the same culture that they do. I never felt totally Belgian either though. It's a mix of both, I imagine Giannis having a Greek and Nigerian upbringing would be similar.

[dorulo]

as to now, the dream is better, but Giannis is not as far as someone puts in this thread

the dream was a completely different player
but he has the edge on offense, equal on defense (in my opinion), the freak better in passing and playmaking

[Oscar9992]

I think you're confusing ethnicity and race. Giannis' race is Nigerian. Ethnically he is more Greek than Nigerian, as ethnicity speaks to the social group that you grew up in and the customs and culture that you are familiar with.

He's a mix of Greek and Nigerian culture. His race is Nigerian but he still has parts of the Nigerian culture within him. Look at an Asian american who was born in this country but whose parents are from China. Sure they have the American culture within in them from going to school and growing up here but they also retain parts of their Chinese culture due to being exposed to their parents and family at home. It's always the second generation after the first born generation that becomes fully immersed in the culture of the country they are born into.

Yeah I am familiar with this idea as my parents are American but I grew up in Belgium. When my family moved back to the US when I was in high school I was culturally very different than other American kids and didn't fit in at all despite speaking the same language and having some of the same culture that they do. I never felt totally Belgian either though. It's a mix of both, I imagine Giannis having a Greek and Nigerian upbringing would be similar.

I think you are overrating 'Greek' in him... Dude was born & raised in Greece but he isn't ethnic Greek at all obviously. But 50% Yoruba through his father & 50% Igbo through his mother. There isn't anything Greek in him other than cityzenship which he gained only in 2013 after NBA Draft... Imagine being born & raised in country without having citizenship of that country, then gaining it after you accomplished something (Getting drafted in 1'st round)

[ken6199]

Jesus **** christ.

[Jakay]

No one will know for sure until both players can be seen through the same rose coloured glasses.

[Alonzo_Morning]

Are you butchering his name on purpose?

Disrespectful as hell

[ken6199]

Are you butchering his name on purpose?

Disrespectful as hell

He is showing respect by using Yoruba spelling. He said it in OP.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adetokunbo

[Alonzo_Morning]

Are you butchering his name on purpose?

Disrespectful as hell

He is showing respect by using Yoruba spelling. He said it in OP.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adetokunbo

Well then a big my bad

[D.Brasco]

One guy grew up in Nigeria the other grew up in Greece, don't see why they should be compared on the fact they share ancestors?

[nikster]

Hakeem is the better shooter, passer, defender and a more well rounded offensive player. Giannis has a long way to go before he catches up.

Others agreed but you cannot be serious about passer. Dream could pass the test as a big but Giannis is at an elite level.

Giannis was mediocre as a passer going in these playoffs, it was the Hawks and Suns series where he really showed improvement there. Still wouldnt call it quite elite, and we will see if he sustains it

[nikster]

Are you butchering his name on purpose?

Disrespectful as hell

He is showing respect by using Yoruba spelling. He said it in OP.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adetokunbo

is that really showing respect tho? Its not how Giannis or his family spell the name, and he's never expressed preferring to be called otherwise

[JN61]

Giannis is Greek.

[gmoney411]

One guy grew up in Nigeria the other grew up in Greece, don't see why they should be compared on the fact they share ancestors?

Both guys grew up with Nigerian parents and we're raised in culturally Nigerian homes. Hakeem grew up in Lagos and Giannis's parents immigrated from there to Greece only 3 years before Giannis was born. It's more than ancestory.

[D.Brasco]

One guy grew up in Nigeria the other grew up in Greece, don't see why they should be compared on the fact they share ancestors?

Both guys grew up with Nigerian parents and we're raised in culturally Nigerian homes. Hakeem grew up in Lagos and Giannis's parents immigrated from there to Greece only 3 years before Giannis was born. It's more than ancestory.

Giannis speaks with a straight Greek accent. I don't see where his parents came from has to do with anything. Anything related to his schooling and basketball development happened in Greece, very different than Hakeem.

If Giannis parents came to America instead and he was born and grew up there would he be compared to African born and raised players? Probably not.

[gmoney411]

One guy grew up in Nigeria the other grew up in Greece, don't see why they should be compared on the fact they share ancestors?

Both guys grew up with Nigerian parents and we're raised in culturally Nigerian homes. Hakeem grew up in Lagos and Giannis's parents immigrated from there to Greece only 3 years before Giannis was born. It's more than ancestory.

Giannis speaks with a straight Greek accent. I don't see where his parents came from has to do with anything. Anything related to his schooling and basketball development happened in Greece, very different than Hakeem.

If Giannis parents came to America instead and he was born and grew up there would he be compared to African born and raised players? Probably not.

You don't see how the culture he grew up in has something to do with the player he is? Giannis is a hard working disciplined player and he has talked about how those were values instilled in him from his parents. The culture you grow up in definitely shapes the type of person you are.

[Liam_Gallagher]

Slow your roll. Hakeem won 2 in a row in the mid 90s.

Gianis beat a mediocre Suns team and a hobbled Nets street ball squad.

[DoctorX]

Both guys grew up with Nigerian parents and we're raised in culturally Nigerian homes. Hakeem grew up in Lagos and Giannis's parents immigrated from there to Greece only 3 years before Giannis was born. It's more than ancestory.

Giannis speaks with a straight Greek accent. I don't see where his parents came from has to do with anything. Anything related to his schooling and basketball development happened in Greece, very different than Hakeem.

If Giannis parents came to America instead and he was born and grew up there would he be compared to African born and raised players? Probably not.

You don't see how the culture he grew up in has something to do with the player he is? Giannis is a hard working disciplined player and he has talked about how those were values instilled in him from his parents. The culture you grow up in definitely shapes the type of person you are.

Agreed you can definitely see that in kids in the US whose parents are from different countries such as Asian American(China,Japan,South Korea,Taiwan) and South Asian American kids(India,Pakistan,Bangladesh).

[MrBigShot]

Hakeem had no weaknesses. Giannis may end up having a better career but I don't think as of yet he has surpassed Hakeem's peak.