Toronto Blue Jays (49-46) at Boston Red Sox (61-39) - July 26-29

[polo007]

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[dagger]

Barnes DFA'd, Kirby Snead up from BUF.

[polo007]

Barnes DFA'd, Kirby Snead up from BUF.

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[Randle McMurphy]

Barnes DFA'd, Kirby Snead up from BUF.

Like Thornton before him, management had to DFA Barnes so Charlie would stop using him in high leverage situations. Trying to Montoyo proof this roster.

[The_Hater]

Barnes DFA'd, Kirby Snead up from BUF.

Like Thornton before him, management had to DFA Barnes so Charlie would stop using him in high leverage situations. Trying to Montoyo proof this roster.

Meanwhile he has zero faith in Climber as he literally gets everyone out in low-leverage situations.

[vaff87]

Anybody know why Kirk is not in the lineup tonight? Or is it just the usual, that our manager has no idea what he’s doing?

[Randle McMurphy]

Anybody know why Kirk is not in the lineup tonight? Or is it just the usual, that our manager has no idea what he’s doing?

Lineups are almost certainly Ross's call, I bet. I also assume it's a defence thing with Kirk v. McGuire (because it certainly couldn't be an offense thing).

[Randle McMurphy]

I'd bench Grichuk for that throw. No idea what he's doing there.

BTW, Hatch is nowhere near good enough to be a starter in the majors going forward. Secondary stuff just isn't there. He's clearly a reliever long term and it's bizarre how they've handled him for the past month or so with the bullpen in shambles.

[vaff87]

Anybody know why Kirk is not in the lineup tonight? Or is it just the usual, that our manager has no idea what he’s doing?

Lineups are almost certainly Ross's call, I bet. I also assume it's a defence thing with Kirk v. McGuire (because it certainly couldn't be an offense thing).

I doubt Atkins has much if anything to do with the lineup. He’s not in the clubhouse, he doesn’t know how guys are feeling, etc. Also, he’s busy working the trade lines and whatnot.

[Randle McMurphy]

Anybody know why Kirk is not in the lineup tonight? Or is it just the usual, that our manager has no idea what he’s doing?

Lineups are almost certainly Ross's call, I bet. I also assume it's a defence thing with Kirk v. McGuire (because it certainly couldn't be an offense thing).

I doubt Atkins has much if anything to do with the lineup. He’s not in the clubhouse, he doesn’t know how guys are feeling, etc. Also, he’s busy working the trade lines and whatnot.

My understanding (which I believe Montoyo has mentioned before) is that Atkins talks to Montoyo every day. I have very little doubt he and the rest of that management team aren't dictating the lineup. That was the entire point of firing Gibbons and bringing in a puppet in the first place.

[Randle McMurphy]

Maybe next time we should avoid starting the guy with only one pitch against the Boston Red Sox in Fenway.

[johanliebert]

Lineups are almost certainly Ross's call, I bet. I also assume it's a defence thing with Kirk v. McGuire (because it certainly couldn't be an offense thing).

I doubt Atkins has much if anything to do with the lineup. He’s not in the clubhouse, he doesn’t know how guys are feeling, etc. Also, he’s busy working the trade lines and whatnot.

My understanding (which I believe Montoyo has mentioned before) is that Atkins talks to Montoyo every day. I have very little doubt he and the rest of that management team aren't dictating the lineup. That was the entire point of firing Gibbons and bringing in a puppet in the first place.

Gibby was taking orders from ricciardi and AA. His shelf life ended when they went into the rebuild.

[vaff87]

Lineups are almost certainly Ross's call, I bet. I also assume it's a defence thing with Kirk v. McGuire (because it certainly couldn't be an offense thing).

I doubt Atkins has much if anything to do with the lineup. He’s not in the clubhouse, he doesn’t know how guys are feeling, etc. Also, he’s busy working the trade lines and whatnot.

My understanding (which I believe Montoyo has mentioned before) is that Atkins talks to Montoyo every day. I have very little doubt he and the rest of that management team aren't dictating the lineup. That was the entire point of firing Gibbons and bringing in a puppet in the first place.

I just felt they thought Gibbons wasn’t the right fit for a rebuilding team.

[johanliebert]

Hatch’s fastball is dead straight I’m surprised they haven’t went yard yet. This front office loves these mediocre pitchers

[johanliebert]

Anybody know why Kirk is not in the lineup tonight? Or is it just the usual, that our manager has no idea what he’s doing?

Does he look like a guy who can catch everyday?

[Randle McMurphy]

I doubt Atkins has much if anything to do with the lineup. He’s not in the clubhouse, he doesn’t know how guys are feeling, etc. Also, he’s busy working the trade lines and whatnot.

My understanding (which I believe Montoyo has mentioned before) is that Atkins talks to Montoyo every day. I have very little doubt he and the rest of that management team aren't dictating the lineup. That was the entire point of firing Gibbons and bringing in a puppet in the first place.

I just felt they thought Gibbons wasn’t the right fit for a rebuilding team.

No way that's the case. I suspect they had some kind of falling out before the end. I was listening to a podcast (Bob McCown I think) about a month ago and Gibbons alluded to the fact that he'd seemingly gotten the reputation in front offices as being disagreeable/anti-analytics. At the same time, I believe he mentioned something about thinking managers should still be able to do their own lineups (with the clear suggestion that the Jays management weren't allowing him to do that anymore or had asked to do it and been denied by him). Apparently it has become commonplace for management to be dictating that and he didn't particularly agree with that approach.

[vaff87]

My understanding (which I believe Montoyo has mentioned before) is that Atkins talks to Montoyo every day. I have very little doubt he and the rest of that management team aren't dictating the lineup. That was the entire point of firing Gibbons and bringing in a puppet in the first place.

I just felt they thought Gibbons wasn’t the right fit for a rebuilding team.

No way that's the case. I suspect they had some kind of falling out before the end. I was listening to a podcast (Bob McCown I think) about a month ago and Gibbons alluded to the fact that he'd seemingly gotten the reputation in front offices as being disagreeable/anti-analytics. At the same time, I believe he mentioned something about thinking managers should still be able to do their own lineups (with the clear suggestion that the Jays management weren't allowing him to do that anymore or had asked to do it and been denied by him). Apparently it has become commonplace for management to be dictating that and he didn't particularly agree with that approach.

If they’re that hands on, I don’t know how we still see things like bunting with two strikes, refusing to bring in a closer in a tie game on the road, using crappy relievers in high leverage situations, etc. Because there’s no way guys like Atkins and Shapiro are that dumb.

[Randle McMurphy]

I just felt they thought Gibbons wasn’t the right fit for a rebuilding team.

No way that's the case. I suspect they had some kind of falling out before the end. I was listening to a podcast (Bob McCown I think) about a month ago and Gibbons alluded to the fact that he'd seemingly gotten the reputation in front offices as being disagreeable/anti-analytics. At the same time, I believe he mentioned something about thinking managers should still be able to do their own lineups (with the clear suggestion that the Jays management weren't allowing him to do that anymore or had asked to do it and been denied by him). Apparently it has become commonplace for management to be dictating that and he didn't particularly agree with that approach.

If they’re that hands on, I don’t know how we still see things like bunting with two strikes, refusing to bring in a closer in a tie game on the road, using crappy relievers in high leverage situations, etc. Because there’s no way guys like Atkins and Shapiro are that dumb.

They're that hands-on pre-game (as far as setting lineups, which it sounds like from Gibbons basically every team does at this point), but all of those things you mention are during the actual game. They're wouldn't really be a way to dictate that unless they were constantly giving Montoyo advice by phone during the game (which, perhaps, they should be doing to prevent the utter insanity that I've had to watch for 3 seasons now).

[Randle McMurphy]

How is Hatch still in this game? He's got 1 pitch and is essentially throwing BP to these guys.

[vaff87]

No way that's the case. I suspect they had some kind of falling out before the end. I was listening to a podcast (Bob McCown I think) about a month ago and Gibbons alluded to the fact that he'd seemingly gotten the reputation in front offices as being disagreeable/anti-analytics. At the same time, I believe he mentioned something about thinking managers should still be able to do their own lineups (with the clear suggestion that the Jays management weren't allowing him to do that anymore or had asked to do it and been denied by him). Apparently it has become commonplace for management to be dictating that and he didn't particularly agree with that approach.

If they’re that hands on, I don’t know how we still see things like bunting with two strikes, refusing to bring in a closer in a tie game on the road, using crappy relievers in high leverage situations, etc. Because there’s no way guys like Atkins and Shapiro are that dumb.

They're that hands-on pre-game (as far as setting lineups, which it sounds like from Gibbons basically every team does at this point), but all of those things you mention are during the actual game. They're wouldn't really be a way to dictate that unless they were constantly giving Montoyo advice by phone during the game (which, perhaps, they should be doing to prevent the utter insanity that I've had to watch for 3 seasons now).

They can tell him pre-game. “For God’s sake, don’t, in any situation, bunt with two strikes.” And tell him who to use in high leverage situations.