What would you do vs what will the Cavs do?

Stillwater · Post #1 » by **Stillwater** » Sun Jul 25, 2021 6:00 pm

pick 2 , 1 from group A and 1 from group B
AKA pick 1 from the first 5 and 1 from the 2nd 5
It is a 2 part question as noted in the title...
A 1-5
If the Cavs see Cade and Mobley taken ahead of their selection what would you do?
B1-5
If the Cavs see Cade and Mobley taken ahead of their selection what will they actually do?

A. I would take Green only if he has proven he is a legit 6'5" barefoot and has a 6'10" wingspan and his camp is willing to work out for the Cavs before the draft...otherwise he is not enough of an upgrade to Sexton or Okoro at all imo to justify at 3 at which point I seriously seek out a trade down situation with Orlando and target both Suggs or Barnes at 5 and maybe Kuminga falls to 8 if not there will be a really good option there compared to most drafts that can help this rebuild.
B I think they will actually take Kuminga at 3 if they dont take Green if they cannot trade down and take Kuminga at 5 I think there is a growing trend of negativity surrounding other prospects being unwilling to work out for the Cavs.

KuruptedCav · Post #2 » by **KuruptedCav** » Sun Jul 25, 2021 8:57 pm

If Cunningham and Mobley are gone, you take Green or Suggs. I’m good with either because I think neither Sexton nor Garland is an impediment to drafting Suggs, and I think neither Sexton nor Okoro is an impediment to drafting Green.

I think they will draft Kuminga. Either at #3 or in a trade down to #4 or #5.

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Stillwater · Post #3 » by **Stillwater** » Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:16 am

Now that they worked out both JJohnson and Kuminga where one is almost sure to be there at 8 I am not discounting the option of a 3 for 5&8 swap entirely at all but dont especially think it is wise to pass on a tier higher prospect unless they really see whomever they like at 5 as the same tier and they may

JonFromVA · Post #4 » by **JonFromVA** » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:04 am

Again... the Cavs have every reason to workout everyone willing to come in. It doesn't necessarily tell us who's in their top tier.

toooskies · Post #5 » by **toooskies** » Tue Jul 27, 2021 1:35 pm

Stillwater wrote:Now that they worked out both JJohnson and Kuminga where one is almost sure to be there at 8 I am not discounting the option of a 3 for 5&8 swap entirely at all but dont especially think it is wise to pass on a tier higher prospect unless they really see whomever they like at 5 as the same tier and they may

Jalen Johnson is slipping in mock drafts, and for good reason: he's not a player that contributes to winning, he's quit on two teams already, and his three point shooting in college is probably a mirage. ESPN has him at #12, SI has him at #18, The Ringer has him at #23. The upside might be there but I don't see him putting it together in Cleveland. No way I'm taking him at #8.

Edit: ESPN has him slipping to #18 as well.

Revenged25 · Post #6 » by **Revenged25** » Tue Jul 27, 2021 1:58 pm

toooskies wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Now that they worked out both JJohnson and Kuminga where one is almost sure to be there at 8 I am not discounting the option of a 3 for 5&8 swap entirely at all but dont especially think it is wise to pass on a tier higher prospect unless they really see whomever they like at 5 as the same tier and they may

Jalen Johnson is slipping in mock drafts, and for good reason: he's not a player that contributes to winning, he's quit on two teams already, and his three point shooting in college is probably a mirage. ESPN has him at #12, SI has him at #18, The Ringer has him at #23. The upside might be there but I don't see him putting it together in Cleveland. No way I'm taking him at #8.

Agreed if I'm trading back, it's after the Magic have taken the 2 players I wanted at #5 and #8, which means 2 of Barnes/Kuminga/Bouknight. Anything less than those 2 and I wouldn't even consider making the trade. Oh and they'd also need to swap out Love for Gary Trent so we can get cap savings going forward.

Stillwater · Post #7 » by **Stillwater** » Tue Jul 27, 2021 2:50 pm

Make no mistake i have not put jj back in the top 8 on my bb either but he was once considered a top 5 prospect despite his likely kpj type free fall on draft night due to the commitment issues, and in typical Altman fashion it would not surprise me if they want a pick in the lare teens early 20s if hes there... But i think the skill set as a point forward with the athletic ability and better shooting stroke than Barnes so if they miss on Barnes at 5 could easily have Altman high on Johnson at 8.I dont have enough info myself on him but i wouldn't touch him without the private visit and he and Kuminga so far are the only higher tier prospects to visit so the notion they are just doing their diligence seems unlikely

JonFromVA · Post #8 » by **JonFromVA** » Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:15 pm

toooskies wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Now that they worked out both JJohnson and Kuminga where one is almost sure to be there at 8 I am not discounting the option of a 3 for 5&8 swap entirely at all but dont especially think it is wise to pass on a tier higher prospect unless they really see whomever they like at 5 as the same tier and they may

Jalen Johnson is slipping in mock drafts, and for good reason: he's not a player that contributes to winning, he's quit on two teams already, and his three point shooting in college is probably a mirage. ESPN has him at #12, SI has him at #18, The Ringer has him at #23. The upside might be there but I don't see him putting it together in Cleveland. No way I'm taking him at #8.

Edit: ESPN has him slipping to #18 as well.

I'm not sure his "commitment issues" are a cause for concern at the professional level, and maybe you could go in to more detail about JJ's struggles but turnovers are pretty common with a young player advancing to a new level. Cade is on track to go #1 and his turnovers were unacceptably high if Detroit is planning to use him as their PG (and he can't cut them way down).

Now if people are hiding that JJ just can't get along with people, won't listen to coaches, would rather do drugs than play ball, etc, etc, maybe there's some fire under that smoke.

edit: if Johnson is really slipping down the boards ala KPJ, the Cavs may be interested in monitoring if he falls far enough to grab him with a pick they get back in a Nance or perhaps even a Prince trade.

KuruptedCav · Post #9 » by **KuruptedCav** » Wed Jul 28, 2021 12:18 am

Stillwater wrote:Make no mistake i have not put jj back in the top 8 on my bb either but he was once considered a top 5 prospect despite his likely kpj type free fall on draft night due to the commitment issues, and in typical Altman fashion it would not surprise me if they want a pick in the lare teens early 20s if hes there... But i think the skill set as a point forward with the athletic ability and better shooting stroke than Barnes so if they miss on Barnes at 5 could easily have Altman high on Johnson at 8.I dont have enough info myself on him but i wouldn't touch him without the private visit and he and Kuminga so far are the only higher tier prospects to visit so the notion they are just doing their diligence seems unlikely

Does visit mean more than interview?

Because they’ve interviewed/worked out: Kispert, Keon Johnson, Scottie Barnes, Ziaire Williams, Cooper, McBride, Boston, Kai Jones, Jalen Johnson, Jalen Tate, Chandler Vaudrin, and Kuminga.

My guess is Cunningham, Mobley, and Green are risky interviews/visits because if you tip your hand you risk Houston extorting you…

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Stillwater · Post #10 » by **Stillwater** » Wed Jul 28, 2021 1:24 am

KuruptedCav wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Make no mistake i have not put jj back in the top 8 on my bb either but he was once considered a top 5 prospect despite his likely kpj type free fall on draft night due to the commitment issues, and in typical Altman fashion it would not surprise me if they want a pick in the lare teens early 20s if hes there... But i think the skill set as a point forward with the athletic ability and better shooting stroke than Barnes so if they miss on Barnes at 5 could easily have Altman high on Johnson at 8.I dont have enough info myself on him but i wouldn't touch him without the private visit and he and Kuminga so far are the only higher tier prospects to visit so the notion they are just doing their diligence seems unlikely

Does visit mean more than interview?

Because they’ve interviewed/worked out: Kispert, Keon Johnson, Scottie Barnes, Ziaire Williams, Cooper, McBride, Boston, Kai Jones, Jalen Johnson, Jalen Tate, Chandler Vaudrin, and Kuminga.

My guess is Cunningham, Mobley, and Green are risky interviews/visits because if you tip your hand you risk Houston extorting you…

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I mean they interviewed a ton of prospects at the combine but a prospect and his agent working together with the Cavs to come to CLE for a private workout in depth testing measuring full process top to bottom etc is far more influential I would think if they were deciding between similar level prospects. But yeah the visit per say might have just solidified them NOT taking said prospect who knows

JonFromVA · Post #11 » by **JonFromVA** » Wed Jul 28, 2021 2:48 pm

KuruptedCav wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Make no mistake i have not put jj back in the top 8 on my bb either but he was once considered a top 5 prospect despite his likely kpj type free fall on draft night due to the commitment issues, and in typical Altman fashion it would not surprise me if they want a pick in the lare teens early 20s if hes there... But i think the skill set as a point forward with the athletic ability and better shooting stroke than Barnes so if they miss on Barnes at 5 could easily have Altman high on Johnson at 8.I dont have enough info myself on him but i wouldn't touch him without the private visit and he and Kuminga so far are the only higher tier prospects to visit so the notion they are just doing their diligence seems unlikely

Does visit mean more than interview?

Because they’ve interviewed/worked out: Kispert, Keon Johnson, Scottie Barnes, Ziaire Williams, Cooper, McBride, Boston, Kai Jones, Jalen Johnson, Jalen Tate, Chandler Vaudrin, and Kuminga.

My guess is Cunningham, Mobley, and Green are risky interviews/visits because if you tip your hand you risk Houston extorting you…

Oh, I'm sure the Cavs would workout Cade/Mobley/Green if given the opportunity - and if they wanted to keep it on the down low for some reason they would at least attempt to hold a private workout. Often easier said than done, but they can certainly arrange a zoom meeting easy enough and not announce it to anyone.

Detroit or Houston could potentially play games, but they have to do so without risking losing the player they really want. For instance, remember the smoke about the Cavs wanting Toppin last year? Given we didn't actually draft him, it's seems awfully likely that was meant to entice the Knicks to give us something to swap places. It seemed quite likely Okoro would still be there for us to take.

The Knicks didn't bite, though, and still got Toppin.

KuruptedCav · Post #12 » by **KuruptedCav** » Thu Jul 29, 2021 10:45 pm

JonFromVA wrote:
KuruptedCav wrote:
Stillwater wrote:Make no mistake i have not put jj back in the top 8 on my bb either but he was once considered a top 5 prospect despite his likely kpj type free fall on draft night due to the commitment issues, and in typical Altman fashion it would not surprise me if they want a pick in the lare teens early 20s if hes there... But i think the skill set as a point forward with the athletic ability and better shooting stroke than Barnes so if they miss on Barnes at 5 could easily have Altman high on Johnson at 8.I dont have enough info myself on him but i wouldn't touch him without the private visit and he and Kuminga so far are the only higher tier prospects to visit so the notion they are just doing their diligence seems unlikely

Does visit mean more than interview?

Because they’ve interviewed/worked out: Kispert, Keon Johnson, Scottie Barnes, Ziaire Williams, Cooper, McBride, Boston, Kai Jones, Jalen Johnson, Jalen Tate, Chandler Vaudrin, and Kuminga.

My guess is Cunningham, Mobley, and Green are risky interviews/visits because if you tip your hand you risk Houston extorting you…

Oh, I'm sure the Cavs would workout Cade/Mobley/Green if given the opportunity - and if they wanted to keep it on the down low for some reason they would at least attempt to hold a private workout. Often easier said than done, but they can certainly arrange a zoom meeting easy enough and not announce it to anyone.

Detroit or Houston could potentially play games, but they have to do so without risking losing the player they really want. For instance, remember the smoke about the Cavs wanting Toppin last year? Given we didn't actually draft him, it's seems awfully likely that was meant to entice the Knicks to give us something to swap places. It seemed quite likely Okoro would still be there for us to take.

The Knicks didn't bite, though, and still got Toppin.

Yeah, went back and looked at the Cavs workout/Interview history. You’re right, I was over-thinking.

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Stillwater · Post #13 » by **Stillwater** » Fri Jul 30, 2021 12:02 am

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/draft_simulator/view/875302/
last minute on the fly mock

Post #14 » by **Jamaaliver** » Fri Jul 30, 2021 12:31 am

Congrats, cavs fan. This guy is the best Cavs draftee since Kyrie.

JonFromVA · Post #15 » by **JonFromVA** » Fri Jul 30, 2021 1:20 am

Jamaaliver wrote:Congrats, cavs fan. This guy is the best Cavs draftee since Kyrie.

Thanks, what's your take?

I think we got lucky that Evan fell to us. The Cavs have focused on character and talent with their top picks and Evan should fit in nicely.

Running a twin tower offense/defense in this day and age will be interesting to say the least.

Post #16 » by **Jamaaliver** » Wed Aug 4, 2021 9:33 pm

JonFromVA wrote:Thanks, what's your take?

I think we got lucky that Evan fell to us. The Cavs have focused on character and talent with their top picks and Evan should fit in nicely.

Running a twin tower offense/defense in this day and age will be interesting to say the least.

I think he will be a Kevin Garnett caliber player for you guys. He'll elevate you to playoff team in his prime, but he'll need more wing creation/scoring next to him.

As far as the Jarrett Allen signing...whoo. That's alot of money. I honestly don't know if this pairing will work out long term.

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