WITH THE 12TH PICK IN THE 2021 NBA DRAFT, THE SAN ANTONIO SPURS SELECT - JOSHUA PRIMO

[G R E Y]

Read on Twitter

This is so endearing:

Read on Twitter

[G R E Y]

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[G R E Y]

Read on Twitter

[Phreak50]

I honestly am ok with this pick if the next move I'm anticipating comes true... Murray being shipped out.

This kid already had better handles than DJ and by all looks, a better jumper. He isn't a point guard sure but if we are intent on having average young guards, I'd rather him than Murray, who is increasingly becoming more unlikeable with every social media post he makes.

First the post when he missed the all D team, then the post reacting to the Simmons trade rumours... Just stop.

In saying that, Kai is going to be a star in this modern era and we and other teams failed letting him drop where he did.

Also surprised we didn't go big with the second round pick. Just ugh.

[JeffReal]

An odd choice. Apparently intended to be a starting guard for the Spurs in 3 or 4 years. But why draft such a player now? Nobody can predict three years ahead so it makes no sense. More useful players were certainly available at #12.

[imagump1313]

An odd choice. Apparently intended to be a starting guard for the Spurs in 3 or 4 years. But why draft such a player now? Nobody can predict three years ahead so it makes no sense. More useful players were certainly available at #12.

Having a day to think about it, I think that the Spurs must think they are pretty much set with the current roster and have some goals in free agency and did not think this pick was necessary in the current plan(I have no idea why, but what else could they be thinking?)

Maybe they have some free agents they are pretty confident about behind the scenes. Maybe they fell in love with this kid and his potential 3-4 years down the road? Maybe we dont have any FA's lined up and we are going to tank?

Obviously our FO doesn't seem to know how to deal with having a lottery pick because they could have traded down a number of ways with teams begging to move up and still drafted Primo.

I don't know..... For the first time in a long time I can say I honestly don't know what this team's plan is.

Wright says we are moving toward positionless basketball. But positionless basketball doesnt mean you run with 12 guards who all pretty much the same player. It means you find versatile players who can do more than one thing well.

[Milenkovic]

I still can't believe this pick, not so much so because of who he is, but the fact we drafted 2 guards ... like what

I couldn't care less what some scouting report says, there's the naked eye test and then obviously, seeing him play and develop over the next few years, then ill judge him.

But what guard are we shipping out? and for who ?

[JeffReal]

An odd choice. Apparently intended to be a starting guard for the Spurs in 3 or 4 years. But why draft such a player now? Nobody can predict three years ahead so it makes no sense. More useful players were certainly available at #12.

Having a day to think about it, I think that the Spurs must think they are pretty much set with the current roster and have some goals in free agency and did not think this pick was necessary in the current plan(I have no idea why, but what else could they be thinking?) ...

It does look as if the Spurs didn’t see any use for this pick for, what, the next three years. Given the facts about Primo, it’ll take at least two years and probably three before they can roll him out as a regular, full time starter. Or roll him out at all. Which means they must not have seen any use for Sengun or the others, for the next three years or so.

But is that true, that none of the higher ranked players could have contributed to the Spurs for two or three years? I don’t believe it. I think that if the Spurs had seriously done their “due diligence” they could have taken a player who could contribute something starting with this upcoming season. It’s a team that’s coming off two losing seasons in a row, after all.

Did they adopt the attitude, if we can’t get a superstar then screw it? Or what? Like I said at first, it’s odd.

On your other points I have the same questions and concerns, and no answers.

Oh, one more thought. Assuming Primo works out — an iffy assumption — but say that he does, and he becomes ready to start full time for the Spurs, I would bet that there will be veteran guards available in free agency, at that time, who will still be better NBA players than he is.

[G R E Y]

So in a post-draft interview, Wright said that the team's internal intel and that of other teams differ greatly from public mocks as tweet a fer posts above attests. In an end of season poll, Wright was voted as the most honest GM from his contemporaries, but you can't blame fans for thinking that a team's representative will of course make a selection sound rosy.

One collective fan issue is picking him at #12 from all the other options. Given that public mock drafts had Kai Jones, Moses Moody, and Alperen Sengun as lottery slots and all were all available when we were up, they will forever be linked to Primo, perhaps less so for him as a prospect (though some extra scrutiny will be on him now as a result) than for PATFO's selection at this slot.

Let's assume, though, that the intersection of team philosophy/needs/ceiling was best met with Primo in PATFO's eyes as Wright asserted. The next question is well, ok, we love Primo best. Even given that he rose up the draft from second round to first because of an excellent Combine, couldn't we just have traded back to get him and gain an asset?

Well this brings us back to the big discrepancy between public mocks and those of teams. And in the sober light of day, turns out it wasn't just Wright blowing smoke; Spurs had solid intel that Primo would be gone by #16 and they couldn't trade back a. before that pick and b. trading back that assured we could still land Primo.

Does it make sense that the Spurs just didn't think to take Primo later? That it didn't occur to them to try?

Perhaps the most surprising lottery pick (and certainly the sneakiest one) was San Antonio’s selection of Josh Primo at No. 12. I think the key thing to remember here is that how public discourse rates a prospect in the draft cycle often differs drastically from how teams value the players. The Spurs’ decision here is a great example of that.

For context, I had Primo going at No. 20 to Atlanta in my final mock. Per sources, Primo was believed to be one of the players the Hawks were targeting in trade-up scenarios. I viewed him as a first-round lock, but the interest in him was much hotter than it seemed based on public mock drafts and whatever information had trickled out on the matter. Per sources, the Hornets (who opted for James Bouknight, after he slid) and Thunder (who could have taken Primo at No. 16 or 18) were also quite interested. The Spurs also loved Primo and were intent on landing him.

The market for Primo was so silent that many rival teams even had no idea he was in play that high. But as I understand it, San Antonio felt there wasn’t a clear opportunity to trade back and completely ensure Primo was still available. When in doubt, you just take the guy you like the most on the board. Like many around the league, the Spurs felt there was a good deal of untapped upside hidden by his role at Alabama. He’s was the youngest player drafted (he turns 19 in December) and in the past couple years has grown to 6'6” while maintaining his coordination and guard skills.

https://www.si.com/nba/2021/07/30/2021-nba-draft-10-parting-thoughts

If fans don't buy that Primo will eventually turn into the BPA at this slot, that's a matter of debate going forward. But the consensus is that had Primo returned to college, he'd be a lottery pick next draft - he'd still be one of the youngest prospects! So the next question is would Primo benefit more from a year of development in college or a year in development from the best developing team in the league?

As to team direction, well Wright said that we're in a place to take BPA and he explained that Primo was the target. He explained that it's a perimeter and outside shooting dominant league which were addressed via the draft and that the Spurs need to get bigger and need bigs help which he said the team would address through other means (ie/trade, RFA/UFA).

We have four guards on contract right now. And with Primo and Wieskamp selections, they automatically slot as the two most efficient 3-point scorers on the team! Floor spacers, off-ball movers, ball movers, drivers - all of which we're short on, all of which we addressed.

There are very few teams that a C-out - there's Bucks with Giannis, maybe LBJ/AD? And even then, they need outside shooters or it doesn't work. We're moving more towards a transition game, a more outside-inside balance rather than the half-court, 2s-dominant team we became with two half-court specialists as our dominant scorers.

This essentially takes out Sengun who isn't yet a consistent 3-shooter and whose game requires a lot of touches inside, and Kai Jones who does have the range but only started playing basketball a few years ago after he outgrew long jump.

At #12, do we want a big who won't be the central go-to guy, rather a complementary piece to perimeter players? Or do we go for who we believe has the highest ceiling for a perimeter player? That leaves Moses Moody, who is a year+ older, who has a freak 7' wingspan, is bigger, and had stronger stats. And yet even he dropped from his projections in public mock drafts.

Spurs loved the maturity and poise, the quick rise, the high upside of Primo. We knew that OKC had its sights on Primo at #16; we couldn't trade back while assuring we got the guy we wanted; we picked Primo at #12.

Side note: I do find it interesting/curious that both Kai Jones and Moses Moody are represented by Klutch. Maybe nothing? But we had three Klutch players this season (DJ, Lonnie, Trey). All things being equal, I wonder whether we went with players whose agents are good to deal with, who bargain in good faith. Just a thought.

I don't think it's such a huge factor that if one player was clear and above better than who we wanted and think projects very well that the agency would sway us away; but it's interesting to think about the dynamics behind the scenes that affect decisions that impact the franchise for years to come.

[G R E Y]

A good read about Primo from a journalist embedded in his camp during the draft:

Read on Twitter

[JeffReal]

I still can't believe this pick, not so much so because of who he is, but the fact we drafted 2 guards ... like what

I couldn't care less what some scouting report says, there's the naked eye test and then obviously, seeing him play and develop over the next few years, then ill judge him.

But what guard are we shipping out? and for who ?

Good question. Wieskamp is tall enough I suppose he could be called an SF, especially with how the Spurs have been doing things.

The Spurs roster for next season, as it looks at the moment, including the draft picks (and depending on how you shuffle the deck chairs on the Titanic), 12 players total:

One center, Poeltl.

One PF/Center, Eubanks.

One PF, Samanic.

One SF, Keldon. Or two if you put Wieskamp here.

Seven guards. Or eight if you put Wieskamp here.

Maybe argue that Vassell is an SF?? Who knows.

But there’s at least six players for the two guard positions. Maybe seven. Maybe eight.

Yes, something has to give. I don’t know what.

[G R E Y]

I still can't believe this pick, not so much so because of who he is, but the fact we drafted 2 guards ... like what

I couldn't care less what some scouting report says, there's the naked eye test and then obviously, seeing him play and develop over the next few years, then ill judge him.

But what guard are we shipping out? and for who ?

I like JeffReal's breakdown of our current roster. To it I'd add that we currently have FOUR guards on contract - DJ, Derrick, Lonnie, and Tre.

Keldon played mostly at 3 (83%), a little 2 (6%), and some 4 (12%)

Devin played 3/2 split almost evenly

Tre was almost exclusively a 1

Derrick and Lonnie were at the 2 the vast majority of the time.

With Patty and DeMar UFAs, and Quinn no longer with the team, it dispels the too-may guards issue we used to have. And with Wright talking about a movement towards less positionless basketball - which I take to mean versatility - with a focus on perimeter players (rather than bigs) dominating the game, then we see that the focus was less on position - G - and more on what they provide for the team.

Right away, Joe and Joshua become out TOP TWO 3 shooters in terms of efficiency. Right away, they are floor spacers, off-ball movers, and 2-point getters as well as finishers at the rim. So assuming DeMar signs elsewhere, we'll have four players able to take a 3 from the starting group rather than two previously (DD and Jakob). And we run like the wind and defend better. But if DeMar does happen to return, then he has two more reliable shooters to pass to.

These are clear needs for a team that averaged the fewest 3s attempted and made per game last season. We took the most 2s per game than any other team. We must have better outside weapons and we got them. This helps us to better balance the 2s/3s shot distribution.

That said, IF we traded DJ and Lonnie and picks/swaps for, say, Jaylen Brown, it would balance out both teams and we'd have an incredible perimeter player to expedite our improvement. So if we do focus on the fact that we drafted two guards, it now gives us options of who is best for our team going forward and make moves based on that.

I think it indicates that we're not 100% sold on our perimeter players and want to have as many options going forward as possible. Wright said he wants to address team needs of size and bigs through means other than draft. So these selections are part of a several step process to round out the team.

I do think that despite Joshua and Joe being guards, we're on our way to being a better balanced, better D team.

[Milenkovic]

One thing that also hasn't been mentioned is that, Josh is 18, more than likely to grow moving forward, so we could groom him into a SF potentially, with the ball handling of a guard.

[JeffReal]

I still can't believe this pick, not so much so because of who he is, but the fact we drafted 2 guards ... like what

I couldn't care less what some scouting report says, there's the naked eye test and then obviously, seeing him play and develop over the next few years, then ill judge him.

But what guard are we shipping out? and for who ?

I like JeffReal's breakdown of our current roster. To it I'd add that we currently have FOUR guards on contract - DJ, Derrick, Lonnie, and Tre.

Actually 5 right at this moment. The Spurs claimed DaQuan Jeffries off waivers in May. 6’5” shooting guard. His contract includes a team option with a deadline of tomorrow 8/1. Minimum salary. No idea why the Spurs claimed him, or if they’d keep him. We’ll know tomorrow.


The first round draft pick automatically gets a 4 yr contract (with the first two fully guaranteed.). So Primo can be considered under contract whether the paper has been signed yet or not.


Anyway, I suspect they won’t keep Jeffries, but with Primo it’ll be 5 under contract who are unambiguously identified as guards.

Right away, Joe and Joshua become out TOP TWO 3 shooters in terms of efficiency. ...

We can hope. Neither has played a minute in the NBA yet, of course. But it looks like a reasonable plan. Unless the Spurs depart from their historical pattern, neither of the draft picks will get substantial playing time next season.

But it does look good — on paper — for two or three years from now.

[G R E Y]

I still can't believe this pick, not so much so because of who he is, but the fact we drafted 2 guards ... like what

I couldn't care less what some scouting report says, there's the naked eye test and then obviously, seeing him play and develop over the next few years, then ill judge him.

But what guard are we shipping out? and for who ?

I like JeffReal's breakdown of our current roster. To it I'd add that we currently have FOUR guards on contract - DJ, Derrick, Lonnie, and Tre.

Actually 5 right at this moment. The Spurs claimed DaQuan Jeffries off waivers in May. 6’5” shooting guard. His contract includes a team option with a deadline of tomorrow 8/1. Minimum salary. No idea why the Spurs claimed him, or if they’d keep him. We’ll know tomorrow.


The first round draft pick automatically gets a 4 yr contract (with the first two fully guaranteed.). So Primo can be considered under contract whether the paper has been signed yet or not.


Anyway, I suspect they won’t keep Jeffries, but with Primo it’ll be 5 under contract who are unambiguously identified as guards.

Right away, Joe and Joshua become out TOP TWO 3 shooters in terms of efficiency. ...

We can hope. Neither has played a minute in the NBA yet, of course. But it looks like a reasonable plan. Unless the Spurs depart from their historical pattern, neither of the draft picks will get substantial playing time next season.

But it does look good — on paper — for two or three years from now.

Sure, fair point about Jeffries, but in terms of practical playing time, he's not a factor. Curious that we let Reynolds go and replaced him with Jeffries, but looking at their salaries (Reynolds' - $110K for this season to Jeffries' 1.7M team option for next season) it may have something to do with cap math or potentially trade filler.

And yes we can pencil in Primo's contract, too. But I think people were coming from the impression that there would be no room for either draft pick because of 'so many guards' when in reality at least two or three spots opened up with Q departing and Patty and DeMar being UFAs.

So it's not adding two guards (and Joe can comfortably slot into the 3) to seven guards already, it's adding two guards who space the floor to really four guards who get regular minutes.

As to the 3s, well we know we need more 3s shooters and our draft picks have great shots. The scouts have done their job, now the development department takes over, and they have a solid foundation to work with.

It's an interesting point about historical patterns of development. Manu and Tony, for example, were later picks but had a lot of professional playing experience already so they contributed more sooned. Subsequent draftees had a lot of talent to outplay, or put another way, because of that talent, could take the necessary time to develop and contribute incrementally.

And as we've drafted late in the first round so often, a lot guys needed the development. But it's not a rote process; if a guy pushes through and forces the issue, he plays. Devin got more minutes than any rookie since #2; Lonnie was drafted a year earlier and higher than Keldon yet Keldon has emerged as the starter. Sometimes it's opportunity like when Derrick stepped up with DJ out; sometimes it's like Pop says, play so well you make him look like an idiot for not playing you.

So with three years of college under his belt and a signature skill, Joe looks the more ready-to-contribute prospect and I expect him to get more minutes than previous second rounders have. And Primo talked openly about his development being whatever is best for him whether Austin or SA. But as Keldon and Devin have shown, it's also up to him. He's very young, but he has a bit more polish to his game already than, say, DJ or Lonnie had coming into the league. And given that his development has taken surprising leaps, it will be very interesting to see how he pushes his way onto the SA roster.

[G R E Y]

One thing that also hasn't been mentioned is that, Josh is 18, more than likely to grow moving forward, so we could groom him into a SF potentially, with the ball handling of a guard.

For sure, he's already grown to 6'5" (I've read 6'6" most recently and growing), and plenty of guys grow from their freshman to sophomore years. And he HUGE hands - 9" length, 10" width, and a great touch already.

[G R E Y]

These look awesome every time a new Spur gets one! But seeing Primo on the back of a jersey has to be a marketer's dream.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[G R E Y]

Signed and sealed:

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[G R E Y]

Read on Twitter

[DWhiteMamba]

Spurs scouting record speaks for itself. Primo looked great in summer league. All the flashes you wanted to see. He looks like a future starter for us at the least, and potentially an all-star guard.