[Stein] Dallas Has Tried To Trade For Goran Dragic But Toronto Has Resisted

[Skeezo]

Lol. Ok dude, you got the voo doo, you know what was in everyone’s mind. Raptors spent $19.5 on precious.. they definitely should’ve locked up Holmes for 4 years. Yep yep. You got it bro.

I love how you keep anecdotally bringing up ONE guy (Holmes) who is clearly on a contract that you don't like as a reason why the Raptors should not have valued their cap space.

Dinwiddie just signed for 3 years / 62m? I'll take him ALL-DAY over Holmes... How much is that 17m worth to a team that needs to lessen their luxury tax bill? Fact is, the same apologists who were saying a late first Rd pick was worthless at the deadline last year, are now trying to convince us a late 1st Rd pick (Achuiwa) was good value in exchange for Lowry and all 17m of our cap space this summer.

So you know that management felt it would be good to let Dinwiddie gobble minutes for 3 years vs. Developing GTJ and Flynn at the same cap hold combined? Like, how do you even know that our management cared for dinwiddie? Let alone a dinwidde at $20MM? You like spencer that much, or is he just a name who happened to be available this year so it’s whim we absolutely need to appease the fan base with a name… even though it flys in the face of what we said were doing, which is to develop youth…

You don't think there are enough minutes to go around for 4 players at the PG and SG spot? Dinwiddie or Dragic, they are taking up the same minutes for this year... Who's the better trade asset 28yr old Dinwiddie @ 20m or 35yr old expiring Dragic on @ 20m?

Dude, you don't to pull out anecdotal examples like Holmes to make a point and then get upset when I pull out my on anecdotal example to make a point. "Flies in the face of what we are doing, which is develop youth" ... So your argument is 35 yr old Dragic taking minutes doesn't fly in the face of the youth movement, but a borderline All-Star in Dinwiddie does? Okay

[Apz]

You say terms like ‘good money’ and ‘asset management’, but your entire post history in this thread contradicts this.

Raps get a first round pick with a prospect that they believe in on a rookie scale contract for 3 years. Asset!

Raps had the ability to sign someone long term, but the people they liked went for bigger dollars than they thought they were the worth, so instead of overpaying (turning good money to bad Money) or just signing someone worse who is cheaper, and being tied to a 3-4 year deal with said person you don’t believe in (bad money out the gate), they decided the better path is to punt the cap space till next year, while still retaining a serviceable player for a year at a position of need. They did not turn their ‘good money’ into bad money.. they kept it as good money!

Cheer up pal, you got a first rounder, a savvy vet for a year at a position of need, and maintained flexibility.

Until people realize we paid 17m of our cap space for that "asset" in addition to K.Lowry we really don't understand the opportunity cost of Achuiwa's rights... 19.5m to fill a "positional need" for Dragic in a season where I doubt we are in the Top 10 in the East is not good money management... I'll keep saying it... I hope Achuiwa becomes a monster and proves me wrong because we made a hefty investment to get him

Let's put it another way... Masai wanted all this flexibility to go after Giannis for THIS offseason... Do you know what we got for all that cap space? Achuiwa, Dragic, Boucher, and Watanabe.

Not entirely accurate, we were also opportunistic in acquiring a good older PG during an offseason when there was the largest premium on such PGs that we have seen in recent NBA history. It’s situational and opportunistic, this is a copy-cat league and what we saw w/ Chris Paul is definitely top of mind currently.

Does that mean we’d get an exceptional return for sure, not necessarily, but I’d say this is an excellent gamble to take and the messaging we’ve been using around the trade, including our intention to keep him is exactly what I’d want us to be doing. There’s a good chance someone overpays, there are multiple teams desperate for PGs atm who have all lost our on PG sweepstakes and need to satisfy their star players (Mavs/Pelicans).

Still playing 4D chess young padawans.

Must be 4d chess since nola signed 2 pgs and mavs got 3, so the 4d chess makes it....snt with LA for schröder?

[Skeezo]

Lol. Ok dude, you got the voo doo, you know what was in everyone’s mind. Raptors spent $19.5 on precious.. they definitely should’ve locked up Holmes for 4 years. Yep yep. You got it bro.

I love how you keep anecdotally bringing up ONE guy (Holmes) who is clearly on a contract that you don't like as a reason why the Raptors should not have valued their cap space.

Dinwiddie just signed for 3 years / 62m? I'll take him ALL-DAY over Holmes... How much is that 17m worth to a team that needs to lessen their luxury tax bill? Fact is, the same apologists who were saying a late first Rd pick was worthless at the deadline last year, are now trying to convince us a late 1st Rd pick (Achuiwa) was good value in exchange for Lowry and all 17m of our cap space this summer.

Dinwiddie's coming off a torn ACL and he's a poor 3 point shooter. and you're assuming he'd want to come here given the same amount of years and dollars. he's also already 28 years old and he likely wouldn't push the Raptors closer to contention. The minutes are better served given to younger guys like Trent, Malachi, Barnes etc. or even Dragic who comes in at only a one year contract. you also have to consider if the Raptors wanted him at that price due to culture and personality fit. Also you fail to consider the asset that is an expiring contract, and just because he wasn't rerouted to a third team asap for garbage players who you likely consider "assets" doesn't mean he won't be traded at the deadline to a desperate team. or you can just let him expire and have more money available next season or the one after to make moves. it's about flexibility, not making moves for the sake of it. this front office doesn't spend money for the sake of doing so like other clown front offices. they'd rather save the money for bigger and better fish and let cheaper, younger and hungrier players develop.

I also like how you're assuming things about Dragic and the Raptors just because he wasn't contacted by the Raptors in a period when signings weren't even allowed to be made official. I doubt Achiuwa was contacted either but the Raptors still wanted him badly in the trade.

Torn ACL are commonplace in the NBA today... I do think Dinwiddie would come here for the same dollars considering he needed to go to WASHINGTON to compete for minutes with Beal because there was no money left in the market. So because FVV & Siakim are already 27 years old, should we trade them cause they are taking minutes away from Barnes and Flynn?

[redeye514]

I love how you keep anecdotally bringing up ONE guy (Holmes) who is clearly on a contract that you don't like as a reason why the Raptors should not have valued their cap space.

Dinwiddie just signed for 3 years / 62m? I'll take him ALL-DAY over Holmes... How much is that 17m worth to a team that needs to lessen their luxury tax bill? Fact is, the same apologists who were saying a late first Rd pick was worthless at the deadline last year, are now trying to convince us a late 1st Rd pick (Achuiwa) was good value in exchange for Lowry and all 17m of our cap space this summer.

So you know that management felt it would be good to let Dinwiddie gobble minutes for 3 years vs. Developing GTJ and Flynn at the same cap hold combined? Like, how do you even know that our management cared for dinwiddie? Let alone a dinwidde at $20MM? You like spencer that much, or is he just a name who happened to be available this year so it’s whim we absolutely need to appease the fan base with a name… even though it flys in the face of what we said were doing, which is to develop youth…

You don't think there are enough minutes to go around for 4 players at the PG and SG spot? Dinwiddie or Dragic, they are taking up the same minutes for this year... Who's the better trade asset 28yr old Dinwiddie @ 20m or 35yr old expiring Dragic on @ 20m?

Dude, you don't to pull out anecdotal examples like Holmes to make a point and then get upset when I pull out my on anecdotal example to make a point. "Flies in the face of what we are doing, which is develop youth" ... So your argument is 35 yr old Dragic taking minutes doesn't fly in the face of the youth movement, but a borderline All-Star in Dinwiddie does? Okay

Committing $60MM to a non all star, who will expect to have heavy minutes and be a mainstay rotational player, at a position where you have 3 players that you want to develop under contract for multi years ahead of the depth chart vs. $19 MM to a former all star who would be find playing flex minutes.

Yeah that’s the same thing, cause Dinwiddie is the needle mover we absolutely needed. You keep doing you bruh, that grass is always nothing but green and bug free vs the weed bed that our management has saddled us with.

[redeye514]

I love how you keep anecdotally bringing up ONE guy (Holmes) who is clearly on a contract that you don't like as a reason why the Raptors should not have valued their cap space.

Dinwiddie just signed for 3 years / 62m? I'll take him ALL-DAY over Holmes... How much is that 17m worth to a team that needs to lessen their luxury tax bill? Fact is, the same apologists who were saying a late first Rd pick was worthless at the deadline last year, are now trying to convince us a late 1st Rd pick (Achuiwa) was good value in exchange for Lowry and all 17m of our cap space this summer.

Dinwiddie's coming off a torn ACL and he's a poor 3 point shooter. and you're assuming he'd want to come here given the same amount of years and dollars. he's also already 28 years old and he likely wouldn't push the Raptors closer to contention. The minutes are better served given to younger guys like Trent, Malachi, Barnes etc. or even Dragic who comes in at only a one year contract. you also have to consider if the Raptors wanted him at that price due to culture and personality fit. Also you fail to consider the asset that is an expiring contract, and just because he wasn't rerouted to a third team asap for garbage players who you likely consider "assets" doesn't mean he won't be traded at the deadline to a desperate team. or you can just let him expire and have more money available next season or the one after to make moves. it's about flexibility, not making moves for the sake of it. this front office doesn't spend money for the sake of doing so like other clown front offices. they'd rather save the money for bigger and better fish and let cheaper, younger and hungrier players develop.

I also like how you're assuming things about Dragic and the Raptors just because he wasn't contacted by the Raptors in a period when signings weren't even allowed to be made official. I doubt Achiuwa was contacted either but the Raptors still wanted him badly in the trade.

Torn ACL are commonplace in the NBA today... I do think Dinwiddie would come here for the same dollars considering he needed to go to WASHINGTON to compete for minute with Beale because there was no money left in the market. So because FVV & Siakim are already 27 years old, should we trade them cause they are taking minutes away from Barnes and Flynn?

FVV amd Siakam are home grown players that management believes in. Big difference. You know management like Dinwiddie the same way they like those guys?? Or you just assuming this as fact to support this half baked position? How you know management doesn’t think Dinwiddie is a goof not worth investing in?

[Pooh_Jeter]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

[aligator]

Seems pretty cut and dried to me. Raptors have Birch and Achiuwa. And Boucher for depth. They don't need another back-up centre which is Powell. He would only take minutes from them.

So what can Dallas send back in salary that we want? Nothing really. So it would have to include their first round pick. Dallas won't do that. So, there isn't a deal to be had.

The only other way this happens is if Dallas maybe finds a shooting/point guard that's a third team to trade to us, but that seems like that is a bit of trading the same for the same, unless it's a younger version/prospect.

Gillespie also here as 3rd C and he will get minutes when one of Birch/ Ochiuwa down or being rested.

[aligator]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

U don't know what the Sioxers offered looked like. Many in the know have suggested there was no frp....only Green and Maxey. Whatever, that was not the main reason there was no deal. It was because Kyle would not commit to a contract with Philly.

[SurgeIblocka]

For those saying Management didn’t contact Dragic until recently, need to stop complaining because he was still the property of Miami until the trade was finalized with the league, until that happened Raptors couldn’t contact him. Masai doesn’t operate like Balmer, give it a break we have some class.

[Badonkadonk]

So we decided to give up all our cap space for a 35yr old PG making 19.5m dollars, "HOPING" a team has an injury, or positional need to somehow make Dragic valuable on the trade market? I don't know, it doesn't sound like either good money or asset management. I really do hope Precious Achiuwa proves me wrong, and that the 19.5m dollar investment was worth it.

"Give up our cap space" is a misrepresentation. It's been written up in many places, but the only way to free up meaningful cap space (eg. for a run at Allen, who the Cavs would've matched anyway) would've been to renounce a bunch of players, including several who are now committed to next season (Trent Jr., Boucher, Lowry of course was leaving anyway, possibly Yuta and up to 7 others depending on how much).

Consensus was that the Raps would operate as an above-tax team for good reason.

Misrepresentation ??? Raps has 17m in cap space that included that cap hold for GTJ... Letting go of Watanabe would have given us enough space to get in the Dinwiddie discussions... Yes, if we wanted the 27m in cap space we would have had to trade Boucher or not take his team option...

If there was a consensus, you were going to operate above the cap, why did they trade Powell to ultimately pay the same AAV for GTJ? I thought the idea was that GTJ has a smaller cap hold which would allow us to better take advantage of our cap space... The "consensus" isn't making much sense.

I guess we'll do it again. Refer to Blake's "Scenarios" table in the link below. Let's assume the Raptors needed at least $21M to match Dinwiddle - in all likelihood, they would've needed to bid higher. That's above the "Lowry leaves, moderate cap space" scenario which frees up $19.6M and retains only Yuta, Boucher, Freddy G. and GTJ's cap hold (it renounces/cuts 11 others, notably Khem).

So to start going higher, you're cutting into Boucher (obviously) and then others depending on bidding. Who exactly would have moved the needle in FA that would have justified the risk in advance? I'm not sure who you follow, but Raps Twitter and even the mainstream guys were pretty much expecting them to operate over-cap given the circumstances. Link for scenarios (3rd table, about 1/3rd down):

https://theathletic.com/2743853/2021/08/01/raptors-free-agency-refresh-cap-situation-and-scenarios-key-dates-targets-kyle-lowry-and-more/

In the post-Lowry presser, Bobby confirms that once the FA market started to price guys as high as they did (he didn't mention which guys obviously), it kind of made the decision to go over-cap and gather young guys obvious.

[Skeezo]

So you know that management felt it would be good to let Dinwiddie gobble minutes for 3 years vs. Developing GTJ and Flynn at the same cap hold combined? Like, how do you even know that our management cared for dinwiddie? Let alone a dinwidde at $20MM? You like spencer that much, or is he just a name who happened to be available this year so it’s whim we absolutely need to appease the fan base with a name… even though it flys in the face of what we said were doing, which is to develop youth…

You don't think there are enough minutes to go around for 4 players at the PG and SG spot? Dinwiddie or Dragic, they are taking up the same minutes for this year... Who's the better trade asset 28yr old Dinwiddie @ 20m or 35yr old expiring Dragic on @ 20m?

Dude, you don't to pull out anecdotal examples like Holmes to make a point and then get upset when I pull out my on anecdotal example to make a point. "Flies in the face of what we are doing, which is develop youth" ... So your argument is 35 yr old Dragic taking minutes doesn't fly in the face of the youth movement, but a borderline All-Star in Dinwiddie does? Okay

Committing $60MM to a non all star, who will expect to have heavy minutes and be a mainstay rotational player, at a position where you have 3 players that you want to develop under contract for multi years ahead of the depth chart vs. $19 MM to a former all star who would be find playing flex minutes.

Yeah that’s the same thing, cause Dinwiddie is the needle mover we absolutely needed. You keep doing you bruh, that grass is always nothing but green and bug free vs the weed bed that our management has saddled us with.

• First, Dinwiddie has been an All-Star, albeit a borderline one
• Second, did the Raptors not just make a 54m dollar commitment to a non-Allstar in GTJ?
• Third, Is borderline All-Star like Dinwiddie @ 20m per year over three years not a solid trade asset? He doesn't need to be a needle mover
• Fourth, we have 2 players at the guard spots we are trying to develop... If FVV is still developing, than so is Dinwiddie

[navyblue]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

windhorst said the the miami package was duncan + harkless + dragic at the deadline; nothing more

[TorontoRapsFan]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

Whether Raptors asked for too much or not doesn't matter. Miami chose Oladipo trade over Lowry trade. Miami made the choice. Miami, not Webster, not Masai, not you, not anyone else. Pat Riley said, no no this is what we are going to do.

Have a read and see if they chose to do what they have done so far or not.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/29/22355881/miami-heat-trade-deadline-nba-offseason

[redeye514]

You don't think there are enough minutes to go around for 4 players at the PG and SG spot? Dinwiddie or Dragic, they are taking up the same minutes for this year... Who's the better trade asset 28yr old Dinwiddie @ 20m or 35yr old expiring Dragic on @ 20m?

Dude, you don't to pull out anecdotal examples like Holmes to make a point and then get upset when I pull out my on anecdotal example to make a point. "Flies in the face of what we are doing, which is develop youth" ... So your argument is 35 yr old Dragic taking minutes doesn't fly in the face of the youth movement, but a borderline All-Star in Dinwiddie does? Okay

Committing $60MM to a non all star, who will expect to have heavy minutes and be a mainstay rotational player, at a position where you have 3 players that you want to develop under contract for multi years ahead of the depth chart vs. $19 MM to a former all star who would be find playing flex minutes.

Yeah that’s the same thing, cause Dinwiddie is the needle mover we absolutely needed. You keep doing you bruh, that grass is always nothing but green and bug free vs the weed bed that our management has saddled us with.

• First, Dinwiddie has been an All-Star, albeit a borderline one
• Second, did the Raptors not just make a 54m dollar commitment to a non-Allstar in GTJ?
• Third, Is borderline All-Star like Dinwiddie @ 20m per year over three years not a solid trade asset? He doesn't need to be a needle mover
• Fourth, we have 2 players at the guard spots we are trying to develop... If FVV is still developing, than so is Dinwiddie

You have zero insight on managements view of Dinwiddie. You’re just propping him because he was available this year. Our team has literally explained their thought process, and has prive. They are not afraid to go after the player they want vs what main stream media tho is is better (check Barnes vs Suggs). You say we’re being apologists. And I laugh. I’m just listening to what’s being said by the people way more knowledgable and in the know them you and I, whom has EARNED my trust. But clearly not yours. Complain bruh, complain and whine. World is your oyster.

[Boardbreaker]

You don't think there are enough minutes to go around for 4 players at the PG and SG spot? Dinwiddie or Dragic, they are taking up the same minutes for this year... Who's the better trade asset 28yr old Dinwiddie @ 20m or 35yr old expiring Dragic on @ 20m?

Dude, you don't to pull out anecdotal examples like Holmes to make a point and then get upset when I pull out my on anecdotal example to make a point. "Flies in the face of what we are doing, which is develop youth" ... So your argument is 35 yr old Dragic taking minutes doesn't fly in the face of the youth movement, but a borderline All-Star in Dinwiddie does? Okay

Committing $60MM to a non all star, who will expect to have heavy minutes and be a mainstay rotational player, at a position where you have 3 players that you want to develop under contract for multi years ahead of the depth chart vs. $19 MM to a former all star who would be find playing flex minutes.

Yeah that’s the same thing, cause Dinwiddie is the needle mover we absolutely needed. You keep doing you bruh, that grass is always nothing but green and bug free vs the weed bed that our management has saddled us with.

• First, Dinwiddie has been an All-Star, albeit a borderline one
• Second, did the Raptors not just make a 54m dollar commitment to a non-Allstar in GTJ?
• Third, Is borderline All-Star like Dinwiddie @ 20m per year over three years not a solid trade asset? He doesn't need to be a needle mover
• Fourth, we have 2 players at the guard spots we are trying to develop... If FVV is still developing, than so is Dinwiddie

When was Dinwiddie ever an all star?

[Pooh_Jeter]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

Whether Raptors asked for too much or not doesn't matter. Miami chose Oladipo trade over Lowry trade. Miami made the choice. Miami, not Webster, not Masai, not you, not anyone else. Pat Riley said, no no this is what we are going to do.

Have a read and see if they chose to do what they have done so far or not.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/29/22355881/miami-heat-trade-deadline-nba-offseason

Miami and Philly decided against Lowry because the price was too high, not because they preferred Oladipo or Hill over Lowry.

[TorontoRapsFan]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

Whether Raptors asked for too much or not doesn't matter. Miami chose Oladipo trade over Lowry trade. Miami made the choice. Miami, not Webster, not Masai, not you, not anyone else. Pat Riley said, no no this is what we are going to do.

Have a read and see if they chose to do what they have done so far or not.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/29/22355881/miami-heat-trade-deadline-nba-offseason

Miami and Philly decided against Lowry because the price was too high, not because they preferred Oladipo or Hill over Lowry.

Read the article and then tell yourself Miami didn't do it because it was how they wanted to manage their offseason.

[Skeezo]

Committing $60MM to a non all star, who will expect to have heavy minutes and be a mainstay rotational player, at a position where you have 3 players that you want to develop under contract for multi years ahead of the depth chart vs. $19 MM to a former all star who would be find playing flex minutes.

Yeah that’s the same thing, cause Dinwiddie is the needle mover we absolutely needed. You keep doing you bruh, that grass is always nothing but green and bug free vs the weed bed that our management has saddled us with.

• First, Dinwiddie has been an All-Star, albeit a borderline one
• Second, did the Raptors not just make a 54m dollar commitment to a non-Allstar in GTJ?
• Third, Is borderline All-Star like Dinwiddie @ 20m per year over three years not a solid trade asset? He doesn't need to be a needle mover
• Fourth, we have 2 players at the guard spots we are trying to develop... If FVV is still developing, than so is Dinwiddie

You have zero insight on managements view of Dinwiddie. You’re just propping him because he was available this year. Our team has literally explained their thought process, and has prive. They are not afraid to go after the player they want vs what main stream media tho is is better (check Barnes vs Suggs). You say we’re being apologists. And I laugh. I’m just listening to what’s being said by the people way more knowledgable and in the know them you and I, whom has EARNED my trust. But clearly not yours. Complain bruh, complain and whine. World is your oyster.

• I never once said I had any insight on management's view of Dinwiddie
• I'm not complaining... I'm merely making an opportunity cost analysis of gaining Achuiwa's rights, and saying he better be good because he cost a lot to get him
• There's a lot of people who I trust more too, who said this deal, and others were on the table back at the deadline. These same people have way more knowledge than you and others, but I still had to listen to people like you saying those knowledgable people were only "speculating" ...
• You will never convince me in a million years that Achiuwa wasn't on the table at the deadline last year... We could have had NOT taken Dragic's team option and STILL had our cap space... But yes, keep apologizing for the Front Office's handlings of Lowry's going away.

[Johnny Bball]

This idea that management had locked into Achiuwa and are playing 4d chess is laughable.

KOC on the Bill Simmons Podcast said that from what his sources told him Precious, Duncan and matching salary was the deal being discussed at the deadline. We already know what the 76ers package looked like.

The Raptors had the power at the deadline and they chose not to utilize it, instead we are in a situation where Miami flexed their power and you are left with a deal that isn't as good as the ones presented at the deadline. It's simply poor asset management.

U don't know what the Sioxers offered looked like. Many in the know have suggested there was no frp....only Green and Maxey. Whatever, that was not the main reason there was no deal. It was because Kyle would not commit to a contract with Philly.

Yeah the proof there is all these ideas that Lowry would have signed in Philly because he comes from Philly are clearly just speculation as there was none. He lives in Miami and went to Miami. So yeah, he wouldn't have signed in Philly, probably told them he wouldn't knowing he can go to UFA and go to the Heat, making any proposed trade of 2 first round picks and good players even more unlikely. His salary demand right after the rumour were all the proof I needed. These guys need to just finally take their L on that rumour.

Even philly fans are calling the source terrible now.

[Johnny Bball]

[
• You will never convince me in a million years that Achiuwa wasn't on the table at the deadline last year... We could have had NOT taken Dragic's team option and STILL had our cap space... But yes, keep apologizing for the Front Office's handlings of Lowry's going away.

What the.... why would they decline Dragic if the were operating above the cap, which they clearly have chosen to do? I don't think you need a million years to see that, or that not taking Dragic's option would have given us any real space under the cap after adding Achiuwa. It doesn't matter if we traded him then or now, It's pretty much the same thing.

And miami had other salary baggage they wanted to move first last season in Olynyk and someone else, can't recall who, which they indeed did move first, so we do know that.