2021-22 Season/Offseason Speculation

[sunskerr]

Anyone have Nader ahead of Shamet?

(per 36)

Nader: 16 points, 41% from 3, 111 O-Rating, 111 D-Rating, -3 on / off
Shamet: 14 points, 38% from 3, 113 O-Rating, 118 D-Rating, -4 on / off

Their roles probably won't overlap very much.

[Barkley6]

Anyone have Nader ahead of Shamet?

(per 36)

Nader: 16 points, 41% from 3, 111 O-Rating, 111 D-Rating, -3 on / off
Shamet: 14 points, 38% from 3, 113 O-Rating, 118 D-Rating, -4 on / off

That's interesting. Nader is certainly the better defender, but I don't know if his game is really that of a 2 guard. He doesn't really handle the ball, move or create much, and he's not an Iso scorer. He's much more of a wing in that regard.

That said, I think that if we wanted to play a big lineup for stretches, and say maybe do Book, Nader, CamJ, Frank and McGee...that could be interesting.

[darealjuice]

Nader played 15 mpg over 24 games for that stat line, not exactly a meaningful sample size.

Career Stats

Shamet: 39.7% from 3 on 5.3 attempts per game, 116 ORTG, 115 DRTG, -2.6 on/off
Nader: 36% from 3 on 1.8 attempts, 101 ORTG, 109 DRTG, -11.4 on/off

2020

Shamet: 37.5% from 3 on 5.5 attempts per game, 115 ORTG, 113 DRTG, -3.3 on/off
Nader: 37.5% from 3 on 2.3 attempts per game, 107 ORTG, 111 DRTG, -9.2 on/off

They're just very different players. Nader is more of a bigger wing slasher/defender, Shamet is a shooter.

[Adrao]

Do we consider Dario a good PF? I do, I think he can play in the second unit and he'll be back in February. Payne, Shamet, Johnson, Saric, McGee sounds well.
From October to Febrary we can play with Smith as Crowder backup. Time enought to decide if he can be useful or trade him.

It is sad but Saric will not be able to play that early. He had surgery last week and recovery time is around 9 months for that injury.

6 months is the normal recovey time. He can be training with the team in February and doing other kind of training in just 4 months.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Playoffs start 10 months after Saric's ACL.

Do you think we'll be inserting him into a series without game practice for a year?

[Barkley6]

Do we consider Dario a good PF? I do, I think he can play in the second unit and he'll be back in February. Payne, Shamet, Johnson, Saric, McGee sounds well.
From October to Febrary we can play with Smith as Crowder backup. Time enought to decide if he can be useful or trade him.

It is sad but Saric will not be able to play that early. He had surgery last week and recovery time is around 9 months for that injury.

6 months is the normal recovey time. He can be training with the team in February and doing other kind of training in just 4 months.

The average recovery time in the NBA is longer.

From 2012-2015 there were 14 ACL tears in the NBA, and only one of them had a recovery shorter than 9 months.

http://blog.fb-ninja.com/acl-tears/

[Saberestar]

Do we consider Dario a good PF? I do, I think he can play in the second unit and he'll be back in February. Payne, Shamet, Johnson, Saric, McGee sounds well.
From October to Febrary we can play with Smith as Crowder backup. Time enought to decide if he can be useful or trade him.

It is sad but Saric will not be able to play that early. He had surgery last week and recovery time is around 9 months for that injury.

6 months is the normal recovey time. He can be training with the team in February and doing other kind of training in just 4 months.

No, it is not.

Like you already know there are stats for everything, and the stats say that the average recovery time for an NBA player for that injury is over 9 months.

[BobbieL]

Do we consider Dario a good PF? I do, I think he can play in the second unit and he'll be back in February. Payne, Shamet, Johnson, Saric, McGee sounds well.
From October to Febrary we can play with Smith as Crowder backup. Time enought to decide if he can be useful or trade him.

It is sad but Saric will not be able to play that early. He had surgery last week and recovery time is around 9 months for that injury.

Agreed.Dude is done for the year. Gotta remember, he JUST had the surgery. A 6 month return never happens in the NBA for ACL.
Even if he was able to return for the playoffs, he'd be rusty and not have chemistry with the team.

Yep Saric is gone until April or May

Hence the conundrum of deciding whether to package him with Smith for an upgrade this year

I would still be good with
1) signing Millsap now
2) waiting for buyout market

[RunDogGun]

Anyone have Nader ahead of Shamet?

(per 36)

Nader: 16 points, 41% from 3, 111 O-Rating, 111 D-Rating, -3 on / off
Shamet: 14 points, 38% from 3, 113 O-Rating, 118 D-Rating, -4 on / off

They don't like facts here. But yes, honestly I don't see Shamet getting minutes due to his limited defense, but because Monty wanted Shamet, we will probably see a bunch of minutes for him.

[RunDogGun]

Playoffs start 10 months after Saric's ACL.

Do you think we'll be inserting him into a series without game practice for a year?

Didn't Monty coach Saric in Philly? So yes, I think he would try Saric, even if he was still in knee brace.

[RunDogGun]

I am still in shock that Schroder turned down 4 yrs for $84 mil, for 1 yr $5.9 million. I guess he knew they would probably just trade him for someone else, but dang that is a lot of money to give up.

[bwgood77]

Nader played 15 mpg over 24 games for that stat line, not exactly a meaningful sample size.

Career Stats

Shamet: 39.7% from 3 on 5.3 attempts per game, 116 ORTG, 115 DRTG, -2.6 on/off
Nader: 36% from 3 on 1.8 attempts, 101 ORTG, 109 DRTG, -11.4 on/off

2020

Shamet: 37.5% from 3 on 5.5 attempts per game, 115 ORTG, 113 DRTG, -3.3 on/off
Nader: 37.5% from 3 on 2.3 attempts per game, 107 ORTG, 111 DRTG, -9.2 on/off

They're just very different players. Nader is more of a bigger wing slasher/defender, Shamet is a shooter.

Yeah, anyone who has watched a decent amount of basketball wouldn't have Shamet ahead of him. He has been solid, an elite career 3 pt shooter and has had a lot of playoff experience already as a 3rd year player, even shooting 43% from 3 against the Bucks where they took them further than we did. That's about what CamJ shot against the Nets. Defense isn't going to be a big thing against bench units. He's a bench guy to come in and get you 3s.

He had a better DRPM than Payne by quite a bit, and not that much worse than Carter. He also had a better D RAPTOR than Book, Paul and Craig this season.

It's comical when I see people say teams will target him on defense. This is a bench guy where it's not like big time scorers are going to often be game planning to switch onto everything. By all accounts he's a big time hustler on defense who just needs improvement..just like Booker needed and he isn't nearly as bad as he was for pretty much all of his years prior to this one.

Booker for example had a -2.47 DRPM inn his 3rd year, and a -2.87 DRPM in his 4th year (worse than Shamet's rookie year), ranking 509th out of 513 players. That is much much worse than any year of Shamet.

CP3 seems to have a serious impact on guys on the defensive end as well.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Anyone have Nader ahead of Shamet?

(per 36)

Nader: 16 points, 41% from 3, 111 O-Rating, 111 D-Rating, -3 on / off
Shamet: 14 points, 38% from 3, 113 O-Rating, 118 D-Rating, -4 on / off

I think it would honestly be situational. Depending upon the matchup, If size and defense is needed vs. Scoring and playmaking fluidity. If opposing teams go bigger, I'd expect us to use Nader to match ( unless said big is slow and lumbering)? And if opposing teams go small, I'd expect us to go with Shamet to match pace and "run n gun" uptempo offensive style of play?

[RunDogGun]

Again, we can stop this, "if anyone watches basketball" crap. We all watch basketball here, and we all know that guys who can play both sides of the ball and play team basketball are better to play than chuckers, unless those chuckers are already stars. Nader is a good defender, and can handle the switches, and guard guys that are either smaller or bigger than him. He also doesn't take the ball out of our real shooters' hands.

[RunDogGun]

If Nader was guarding Middleton, and Shamet was on the court, I bet that Middleton would call for a switch with whoever Shamet was guarding. I would, and guess what, I actually play and coach basketball, not just watch it.

But damn this thread will probably get locked now.

[bwgood77]

You realize you are only repeating the same thing over and over and are like an echo chamber here since you are only agreeing with yourself. The guy plays playoff minutes for contenders in every playoffs and has even started in 10 playoff games, so playing against stars in starting units.

He obviously can play in the playoffs and Jones/Monty obviously wouldn't have traded for him if they thought that.

And guys who are career 40% 3 pt shooters are not "chuckers"

[RunDogGun]

Anyone have Nader ahead of Shamet?

(per 36)

Nader: 16 points, 41% from 3, 111 O-Rating, 111 D-Rating, -3 on / off
Shamet: 14 points, 38% from 3, 113 O-Rating, 118 D-Rating, -4 on / off

I think it would honestly be situational. Depending upon the matchup, If size and defense is needed vs. Scoring and playmaking fluidity. If opposing teams go bigger, I'd expect us to use Nader to match ( unless said big is slow and lumbering)? And if opposing teams go small, I'd expect us to go with Shamet to match pace and "run n gun" uptempo offensive style of play?

Honestly, the way I look at it, Booker gets 34 minutes, CP3 gets 30, which leaves 32 minutes. If Payne hasn't earned somewhere close to 24-28 minutes, I would be disappointed in our coach. Payne shot 44% from three last year, so if we need a scorer, % wise, he would be our best chance at getting buckets from deep.
So if those numbers are close, that leaves 4-8 minutes at the guard spot, and I would much rather have Bridges or Nader take those. Now some miracle could happen, where Shamet becomes a vastly improved defender just being around our guys in practice, but since he hasn't improved since coming into the league, I am not going to count on it.

[RunDogGun]

You realize you are only repeating the same thing over and over and are like an echo chamber here since you are only agreeing with yourself. The guy plays playoff minutes for contenders in every playoffs and has even started in 10 playoff games, so playing against stars in starting units.

He obviously can play in the playoffs and Jones/Monty obviously wouldn't have traded for him if they thought that.

And guys who are career 40% 3 pt shooters are not "chuckers"

Ha, you are saying the same thing over and over as well, so maybe you should take your own advice. If Galloway couldn't get on the court with better shooting and similar defense, it doesn't make sense that Shamet would. But I agree, Monty will most likely try it as often as he can. We have better shooters and defenders.

But please keep using the comment of "if you really watch basketball" or "anyone who actually watches basketball" in everyone of your Shamet comments, it in no way is a feeble attempt at agreeing with yourself.(green font)

[bwgood77]

You realize you are only repeating the same thing over and over and are like an echo chamber here since you are only agreeing with yourself. The guy plays playoff minutes for contenders in every playoffs and has even started in 10 playoff games, so playing against stars in starting units.

He obviously can play in the playoffs and Jones/Monty obviously wouldn't have traded for him if they thought that.

And guys who are career 40% 3 pt shooters are not "chuckers"

Ha, you are saying the same thing over and over as well, so maybe you should take your own advice. If Galloway couldn't get on the court with better shooting and similar defense, it doesn't make sense that Shamet would. But I agree, Monty will most likely try it as often as he can. We have better shooters and defenders.

It's all you are mentioning, even out of nowhere in threads completely off on different topics...like somehow you found a way to make it's way into the summer league thread.

For whatever reason you don't like the guy, don't realize he is a better shooter from 3 on a huge sample size than anyone on our team or realize that shot distribution impacts overall FG%. He may not have hit better from 3 on high volume tough shots, but those players are more valuable than guys who hit a limited # of 3s on minimal shots. They spread the floor and he can get his shots off in multiple ways. You have ignored the multitude of data presented to the contrary of your weak argument.

Just give it a rest please. It is derailing multiple threads and is getting close to trolling at this point.

[RunDogGun]

It seems like people here think it is easier to just come in in spot minutes and shoot well, than it is to play more minutes, and shoot worse.