Summer League Thread Part 4: Aug 14th Charlotte @7pm TSN2

[WaltFrazier]

double post sorry

[Son Goku 25]

Forget everything else. Would you guys be open to trading Siakam for Moses and Kuminga package now?

[720]

On twitter there is like this weird little group forming that’s apparently “raptors fans” but they have like Suggs on their banner and bio and all they do is **** on Barnes. So weird.

Them people really don't want to see Barnes fail per say they are prolly just frustrated and think Suggs is the better player which rn is TBD.....

But this will be a nonstop thing in Raptorland until Barnes shuts them all up with becoming the better player....But if Suggs does in fact turn into a superstar while Barnes becomes just Meh we won't hear the end of it tbh ....I just hope in next years draft we put a real superstar next to Barnes so it dies off a bit

Yep, part of the frustration is that we desperately need a face of the franchise go to guy which we’re hoping for with the 4th pick.

Based on current skill set and position, Suggs had a clearer path to that than Barnes currently does.

Not saying Barnes can’t become that player but it’s going to take a lot of work on the offensive end. The defense and playmaking is there which is great but you need to be able to score and finish.

Even if we had taken Suggs we still would need a franchise guy. The only time a franchise has won a championship with a small guard being its focal point was the warriors with Curry and the Pistons with Isiah. Suggs is cool but he is never going to be THE centrepiece on a championship team.

We’ll get that guy next year or the year after. Hopefully we get top 5 picks again.

[Raps in 4]

lol at people saying we didnt draft suggs cause we had flynn

Ya, it was a really bad game after looking like a god after the first game. His playmaking just isn't there. Our best playmakers on the team are pascal and Scottie. We lack "connecters" all around.

We are finally going to feel Lowry not being around. The ball movement on offense this year will be hard to watch between Fred/Trent/OG.

People called me out when I said Barnes should be our PG, but he's legitimately our best playmaker.

[HumbleRen]

Positive side to all of this is that, Barnes still ended up with 13/8 on a horrible shooting night while missing 4 FT’s.

Yeah for a not so great game from him, there were a lot of positives.

I'm scared that he can look worse though and that there will be times when he does.

I was surprised by the passive, low-energy start to the game. I'm not sure if it was by design, but he was giving the ball up way too quickly.

It was good to see him make things happen with the ball in his hands in the 2nd half.

The only thing that’s super alarming to me is that he drives to the rim or plays thru contract like he’s 6’2 180.

I’m not sure if it’s just pure lack of balance and skill with the ball or just simply not having the coordination.

OG has the same exact issue and it’s barely gotten better with 5 years of Raptors development under his belt.

[Mikistan]

Another angle

Having watched it now might be a travel, right pivot foot seems to come off the floor ever so slightly/quickly

[simple_jack]

Them people really don't want to see Barnes fail per say they are prolly just frustrated and think Suggs is the better player which rn is TBD.....

But this will be a nonstop thing in Raptorland until Barnes shuts them all up with becoming the better player....But if Suggs does in fact turn into a superstar while Barnes becomes just Meh we won't hear the end of it tbh ....I just hope in next years draft we put a real superstar next to Barnes so it dies off a bit

Yep, part of the frustration is that we desperately need a face of the franchise go to guy which we’re hoping for with the 4th pick.

Based on current skill set and position, Suggs had a clearer path to that than Barnes currently does.

Not saying Barnes can’t become that player but it’s going to take a lot of work on the offensive end. The defense and playmaking is there which is great but you need to be able to score and finish.

Even if we had taken Suggs we still would need a franchise guy. The only time a franchise has won a championship with a small guard being its focal point was the warriors with Curry and the Pistons with Isiah. Suggs is cool but he is never going to be THE centrepiece on a championship team.

We’ll get that guy next year or the year after. Hopefully we get top 5 picks again.

It’s typically hard for anyone to be the centrepiece of a championship team unless your names KD, Kawhi, or Lebron.

But having an elite guard who makes winning plays down the stretch is a good start. E.g CP3, Lowry, Jrue, Kidd, Rondo, etc.

[MavCarter]

Barnes doesn't suck but at #4 he shouldn't have been picked. He looks like a raw talent who came off the bench as a freshman. Which he is.

Name me one other player who did this and was successful. I know Marvin Williams and Corey maggette did, but they never lived up to potential.

Booker, Westbrook and Lavine all came off the bench as freshman and thats just off the top of my head

[AkelaLoneWolf]

Forget everything else. Would you guys be open to trading Siakam for Moses and Kuminga package now?

yes but i've been onboard that train from day 1. idk about masai/webster tho

[Mr.Raptorsingh]

I'd hope that they put the ball in his hands more in the remaining games and less in Banton. It's great that they are trying to see what they have in him (and Johnson), but Barnes is best when he is initiating.

[Tor_Raps]

On twitter there is like this weird little group forming that’s apparently “raptors fans” but they have like Suggs on their banner and bio and all they do is **** on Barnes. So weird.

Them people really don't want to see Barnes fail per say they are prolly just frustrated and think Suggs is the better player which rn is TBD.....

But this will be a nonstop thing in Raptorland until Barnes shuts them all up with becoming the better player....But if Suggs does in fact turn into a superstar while Barnes becomes just Meh we won't hear the end of it tbh ....I just hope in next years draft we put a real superstar next to Barnes so it dies off a bit

Yup, this happens almost every year and that's how it's going to be for Barnes/Suggs. When you pass up on a guy who most thought you'd take, you will be 2nd guessed. Fultz felt it with Tatum, everyone felt it with Luka, etc.

[mtcan]

I'd hope that they put the ball in his hands more in the remaining games and less in Banton. It's great that they are trying to see what they have in him (and Johnson), but Barnes is best when he is initiating.

They need to invest in developing Flynn, Barnes, Banton, Johnson, Champagnie and Achiuwa...**** the rest.

[Tor_Raps]

Positive side to all of this is that, Barnes still ended up with 13/8 on a horrible shooting night while missing 4 FT’s.

Yeah for a not so great game from him, there were a lot of positives.

I'm scared that he can look worse though and that there will be times when he does.

I was surprised by the passive, low-energy start to the game. I'm not sure if it was by design, but he was giving the ball up way too quickly.

It was good to see him make things happen with the ball in his hands in the 2nd half.

Ya I was watching most of the game thinking "we didn't draft a guy 4th overall to be a beta, we need a damn alpha." It was this part of the pick that made me hesitant picking Suggs over Barnes.

Obviously I'm not judging fully from summer league but I hope this isn't the case once the games start to mean something.

[720]

Yep, part of the frustration is that we desperately need a face of the franchise go to guy which we’re hoping for with the 4th pick.

Based on current skill set and position, Suggs had a clearer path to that than Barnes currently does.

Not saying Barnes can’t become that player but it’s going to take a lot of work on the offensive end. The defense and playmaking is there which is great but you need to be able to score and finish.

Even if we had taken Suggs we still would need a franchise guy. The only time a franchise has won a championship with a small guard being its focal point was the warriors with Curry and the Pistons with Isiah. Suggs is cool but he is never going to be THE centrepiece on a championship team.

We’ll get that guy next year or the year after. Hopefully we get top 5 picks again.

It’s typically hard for anyone to be the centrepiece of a championship team unless your names KD, Kawhi, or Lebron.

But having an elite guard who makes winning plays down the stretch is a good start. E.g CP3, Lowry, Jrue, Kidd, Rondo, etc.

I know, I was specifically addressing the franchise go to guy comment. I would have loved him on the team. Heck I feel like I was his number one fanboy pre draft. But I also know the rebuild isn’t over. I can see a Barnes succeeding next to a Banchero/Emoni type. It would be super intriguing as well.

[Oakvillehoops]

Read on Twitter

This was the flash I wanted to see, game 2 was worth it for this plus all the fouls drawn. Barnes is a grown ass man

Nice, but he travelled. Pivot foot fully left the floor before shooting

[vaff87]

Barnes being Draymond would be a failure by Masai Ujiri and Bobby Webster.

This is an absurd take. Draymond Green might end up in the HOF. He’s one of the best defensive players of all time, a 3 time champion, 3 time all star, and one of the best playmakers in the league.

Calling that a “failure” with the 4th pick is … ridiculous.

All of those accolades are a function of who he played next to. He's a great role player who played next to three of the greatest shooters of all time. Steph and KD are among the greatest players of all time, period.

He's an elite role player. But you typically want more than that from a 4th overall pick.

His playmaking and specifically his defense aren’t a function of who he plays with. If you can get a player that provides what he provides with the fourth pick, you take it and run. Why do people think the fourth pick is the first pick? A player like him is a lot more valuable than a mediocre first option that isn’t good enough in his role to win a championship, like DeMar DeRozan, for example.

[c3luong]

Read on Twitter

This was the flash I wanted to see, game 2 was worth it for this plus all the fouls drawn. Barnes is a grown ass man

Nice, but he travelled. Pivot foot fully left the floor before shooting

It's fine, in a couple of years when he becomes a superstar all his moves will have travels in them and nobody will care.

[YelloC]

Barnes definitely has to work on his coordination. I’m hoping that it’s because he’s still growing. It’s nice to have a guy that could get to the line consistently. He just has to make them. 8-12 freethrows isn’t bad though.
Banton had at least two plays where I thought he should’ve took it to the basket instead of making the unselfish play.
Precious has surprising handles when taking a rebound coast to coast. Needs to work on ball security in the paint.
Flynn seemed like he was in his own head.
Wainwright has good defence overall but not much lift.

[Tor_Raps]

Thought Barnes fine today. He looked great in the 3rd when he was actually able to initiate off the bounce. His ball handling held up against some good defensive pressure. His finishing at the rim is soft and uncoordinated but he was able to draw contact and hit FTs.

2/8 is deceptive because he missed 3 putback attempts in one possession.

He just didn't get much usage this game. A lot of him standing around not being involved in the offense.

We can't play him off the ball and expect him to succeed. He literally has no off-ball skills.

Well he better learn those damn skills if he got picked 4th overall. There is no way Barnes can be primarily on the ball most of the time. He does not have the Ben Simmons handle.

He can provide secondary ball handling but if truly pressured by good defenders, he will turn into a turnover machine.

[bakafool]

Read on Twitter

This was the flash I wanted to see, game 2 was worth it for this plus all the fouls drawn. Barnes is a grown ass man

Nice, but he travelled. Pivot foot fully left the floor before shooting

Doesn't look like it. When he reverse pivots, he does so with his heel first then ends with his toes. That's not a clear travel at all.