Trade Ideas (Part III)

[Revenged25]

Then it would be valid to pay him that money and nobody would care because you then have a really good franchise player that deserves it. The issue the Cavs are in right now is that we dont know who Collin Sexton really is. Is he just a volume scorer who is better suited as a 6th man like Jordan Clarkson or is he a actual pillar of this rebuild who should be here for the next decade.

Time will tell.

Can we stop calling him a volume scorer? A volume scorer is someone who is inefficient, Sexton is not inefficient. If you're claiming Sexton is a volume scorer you need to call everyone that scores a lot of points a volume scorer because you have to take shots to score points.

Fine hes not a volume scorer, hes a normal scorer.

They are in a tough spot. What I am saying is locking a player that you reaaaaally arnt 100% sold on to a near Max contract could prove to be a disaster in 2-3 years IF he does turn out to be that Jordan Clarkson 6th man, who by the way signed a 4/54M deal.

Leaving the debate on the type of scorer alone, how the hell can you keep comparing him to Jordan Clarkson. Clarkson isn't close to being as good of a scorer as Sexton. Clarkson scores 1.16 points per FGA, Sexton scores 1.32 points per FGA. That's a pretty big difference. That's the difference between Clarkson averaging 18.4 PPG and 20.9 PPG. If Sexton had the same points per FGA then he'd be averaging 21.3 PPG instead of his 24.3 PPG.

It's those difference that decide if you're Jordan Clarkson on a 4/54M deal or Devin Booker on a Max. Btw Devin Booker averaged 1.33 points per FGA.

[toooskies]

Then it would be valid to pay him that money and nobody would care because you then have a really good franchise player that deserves it. The issue the Cavs are in right now is that we dont know who Collin Sexton really is. Is he just a volume scorer who is better suited as a 6th man like Jordan Clarkson or is he a actual pillar of this rebuild who should be here for the next decade.

Time will tell.

Can we stop calling him a volume scorer? A volume scorer is someone who is inefficient, Sexton is not inefficient. If you're claiming Sexton is a volume scorer you need to call everyone that scores a lot of points a volume scorer because you have to take shots to score points.

Fine hes not a volume scorer, hes a normal scorer.

They are in a tough spot. What I am saying is locking a player that you reaaaaally arnt 100% sold on to a near Max contract could prove to be a disaster in 2-3 years IF he does turn out to be that Jordan Clarkson 6th man, who by the way signed a 4/51M deal.

The problem is the Jordan Clarkson comparison doesn't make any sense because Sexton is already a better scorer than Clarkson. There's no reason to believe that Sexton won't grow into a better player, and that includes becoming a better scorer.

[LivingLegend]

Can we stop calling him a volume scorer? A volume scorer is someone who is inefficient, Sexton is not inefficient. If you're claiming Sexton is a volume scorer you need to call everyone that scores a lot of points a volume scorer because you have to take shots to score points.

Fine hes not a volume scorer, hes a normal scorer.

They are in a tough spot. What I am saying is locking a player that you reaaaaally arnt 100% sold on to a near Max contract could prove to be a disaster in 2-3 years IF he does turn out to be that Jordan Clarkson 6th man, who by the way signed a 4/54M deal.

Leaving the debate on the type of scorer alone, how the hell can you keep comparing him to Jordan Clarkson. Clarkson isn't close to being as good of a scorer as Sexton. Clarkson scores 1.16 points per FGA, Sexton scores 1.32 points per FGA. That's a pretty big difference. That's the difference between Clarkson averaging 18.4 PPG and 20.9 PPG. If Sexton had the same points per FGA then he'd be averaging 21.3 PPG instead of his 24.3 PPG.

It's those difference that decide if you're Jordan Clarkson on a 4/54M deal or Devin Booker on a Max. Btw Devin Booker averaged 1.33 points per FGA.

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

[jbk1234]

Can we stop calling him a volume scorer? A volume scorer is someone who is inefficient, Sexton is not inefficient. If you're claiming Sexton is a volume scorer you need to call everyone that scores a lot of points a volume scorer because you have to take shots to score points.

Fine hes not a volume scorer, hes a normal scorer.

They are in a tough spot. What I am saying is locking a player that you reaaaaally arnt 100% sold on to a near Max contract could prove to be a disaster in 2-3 years IF he does turn out to be that Jordan Clarkson 6th man, who by the way signed a 4/51M deal.

The problem is the Jordan Clarkson comparison doesn't make any sense because Sexton is already a better scorer than Clarkson. There's no reason to believe that Sexton won't grow into a better player, and that includes becoming a better scorer.

Here's the thing, there is reason to believe that Sexton won't grow into a better player because players peak sooner than fans and teams would like all the time. They can even regress. When you look at his splits from last season, it wasn't linear improvement. He shot lights out in December and well in January. After that, it was downhill until the last month of the season.

Also, he's already top 30 in usage and FGAs in the NBA. So it's not like the secret plan of just take more shots can go on indefinitely.

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[jbk1234]

Whoa ... a $20M signing will help us re-sign our other picks. He's not TRoss. He can shoot if given enough space and he drives in to the teeth of the defense because we can't spread the floor and he doesn't always find the shooters we have. If he only had to beat his man and a late helper, he'd be extremely hard to stop.

He's still young and improving and at $20M he should also be tradeable, so even if we can't use him we should be able to flip him a lot easier. He wouldn't be a one year rental to the team acquiring him.

I also expect the Cavs have already put a deal in the $20M area on the table. They may be refusing to max him, but I doubt they're playing "hardball".

I'm not debating what the Cavs will do, only what they should do. I would not extend him at all, because one you do, he's untradable this season to any team outside of maybe the Thunder. If you decide you want to move him midseason, the BYC makes it impossible.

I don't get the idea behind gauging his trade market, finding it wanting, and then paying him big money anyway. I really don't.

I don't think spreading the floor for Sexton will be as easy as people pretend. He has weaknesses that need to be compensated for by other types of personnel, and they're not easy to come by.

Please ... when did the compromises ever stop the Cavs from spreading the floor for LeBron James so he could more easily score points and give us a shot to catch an opponent?

I can actually point you to the data for LeBron with shooting lineups and you can draw whatever conclusion you'd like about their effectiveness .vs. the defensive lineups. However, we lack decent data for Collin because of the injuries and the lack of NBA quality backups. So we can't actually point to anything much beyond that fact that in his 20 clutch opportunities, he scored in volume and efficiently.

The idea of gauging his trade market is a reality check. Hopefully for both sides. If his agent was right, then there should have been a team out there willing to give something up of value (at the very least equal to the #8 pick we used to draft him). Getting him signed at a fair market value makes it easier for the Cavs to keep him OR trade him to a team better able to utilize his talents.

Far better than ending up like Dennis Schroeder.

But hey, if the rumors about the Cavs wanting Collin gone sooner rather than later are true, then we could see a trade go down anytime. But reality is the Knicks and Heat have already moved on and it seems unlikely we're going to get anything better from them than what they reportedly put on the table. We can wait and hope for something better, but that doesn't fit in with the idea that the Cavs are desperate to reset their lineup and move on from Collin.

And while rumors that Kevin Love has been asked to come off the bench having been going around, we're not hearing anything like that about Collin.

So, just my read (not based on any rumors - the Cavs have kept things quiet). I think at the right price and in my mind the right price is around $20M/yr, we would lock up Collin today. We drafted Evan Mobley, not Jalen Green. There's a spot for Collin at the right price.

We're comparing Sexton to LBJ now? Because I really can't imagine a less apt comparison.

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[Revenged25]

Fine hes not a volume scorer, hes a normal scorer.

They are in a tough spot. What I am saying is locking a player that you reaaaaally arnt 100% sold on to a near Max contract could prove to be a disaster in 2-3 years IF he does turn out to be that Jordan Clarkson 6th man, who by the way signed a 4/54M deal.

Leaving the debate on the type of scorer alone, how the hell can you keep comparing him to Jordan Clarkson. Clarkson isn't close to being as good of a scorer as Sexton. Clarkson scores 1.16 points per FGA, Sexton scores 1.32 points per FGA. That's a pretty big difference. That's the difference between Clarkson averaging 18.4 PPG and 20.9 PPG. If Sexton had the same points per FGA then he'd be averaging 21.3 PPG instead of his 24.3 PPG.

It's those difference that decide if you're Jordan Clarkson on a 4/54M deal or Devin Booker on a Max. Btw Devin Booker averaged 1.33 points per FGA.

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

You can't just extrapolate stats like that, it doesn't work. By that theory Malik Monk is a 20.1/3.6/4.1 player who just signed for 1.8 mil to the Lakers. Guess Utah should feel really dumb for paying all that money to Clarkson when they could've gotten a player almost as good for basically vet min.

[LivingLegend]

Leaving the debate on the type of scorer alone, how the hell can you keep comparing him to Jordan Clarkson. Clarkson isn't close to being as good of a scorer as Sexton. Clarkson scores 1.16 points per FGA, Sexton scores 1.32 points per FGA. That's a pretty big difference. That's the difference between Clarkson averaging 18.4 PPG and 20.9 PPG. If Sexton had the same points per FGA then he'd be averaging 21.3 PPG instead of his 24.3 PPG.

It's those difference that decide if you're Jordan Clarkson on a 4/54M deal or Devin Booker on a Max. Btw Devin Booker averaged 1.33 points per FGA.

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

You can't just extrapolate stats like that, it doesn't work. By that theory Malik Monk is a 20.1/3.6/4.1 player who just signed for 1.8 mil to the Lakers. Guess Utah should feel really dumb for paying all that money to Clarkson when they could've gotten a player almost as good for basically vet min.

Why not? The sole purpose of Per 36 is to provide stats if minutes played were the same and Clarkson's/Sextons mins are close enough where it's not really a stretch if he played a few more mins per game.

It's not like I'm comparing a 12 min player to a 34min player.

[KuruptedCav]

Fine hes not a volume scorer, hes a normal scorer.

They are in a tough spot. What I am saying is locking a player that you reaaaaally arnt 100% sold on to a near Max contract could prove to be a disaster in 2-3 years IF he does turn out to be that Jordan Clarkson 6th man, who by the way signed a 4/54M deal.

Leaving the debate on the type of scorer alone, how the hell can you keep comparing him to Jordan Clarkson. Clarkson isn't close to being as good of a scorer as Sexton. Clarkson scores 1.16 points per FGA, Sexton scores 1.32 points per FGA. That's a pretty big difference. That's the difference between Clarkson averaging 18.4 PPG and 20.9 PPG. If Sexton had the same points per FGA then he'd be averaging 21.3 PPG instead of his 24.3 PPG.

It's those difference that decide if you're Jordan Clarkson on a 4/54M deal or Devin Booker on a Max. Btw Devin Booker averaged 1.33 points per FGA.

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

So, Jordan Clarkston’s most efficient year of his career, in a limited role, playing almost exclusively with the second unit and never drawing the opposing team’s best defender was 12% worse than Collin Sexton’s 3rd year, and somehow that means that the comparison is both fair and the same.

That’s like saying the McDonald’s worker who YOLO’d $AMC on WSB is comparable to Warren Buffet because he had a 1000-bagger.


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[LivingLegend]

Leaving the debate on the type of scorer alone, how the hell can you keep comparing him to Jordan Clarkson. Clarkson isn't close to being as good of a scorer as Sexton. Clarkson scores 1.16 points per FGA, Sexton scores 1.32 points per FGA. That's a pretty big difference. That's the difference between Clarkson averaging 18.4 PPG and 20.9 PPG. If Sexton had the same points per FGA then he'd be averaging 21.3 PPG instead of his 24.3 PPG.

It's those difference that decide if you're Jordan Clarkson on a 4/54M deal or Devin Booker on a Max. Btw Devin Booker averaged 1.33 points per FGA.

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

So, Jordan Clarkston’s most efficient year of his career, in a limited role, playing almost exclusively with the second unit and never drawing the opposing team’s best defender was 12% worse than Collin Sexton’s 3rd year, and somehow that means that the comparison is both fair and the same.

That’s like saying the McDonald’s worker who YOLO’d $AMC on WSB is comparable to Warren Buffet because he had a 1000-bagger.


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Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins and a green light because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

Comparing Sexton and Clarkson is about as easy of a comparison out there are you could make with any players. Its about as easy as a Lavine/Booker comparison.

[Revenged25]

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

So, Jordan Clarkston’s most efficient year of his career, in a limited role, playing almost exclusively with the second unit and never drawing the opposing team’s best defender was 12% worse than Collin Sexton’s 3rd year, and somehow that means that the comparison is both fair and the same.

That’s like saying the McDonald’s worker who YOLO’d $AMC on WSB is comparable to Warren Buffet because he had a 1000-bagger.


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Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins and a green light because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

Comparing Sexton and Clarkson is about as easy of a comparison out there are you could make with any players. Its about as easy as a Lavine/Booker comparison.

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

[KuruptedCav]

Per 36

Clarkson
25/5/3 on 43%/35%/90%

Sexton
25/3/5 on 47%/37%/81%

That is why I keep comparing Jordan Clarkson and Collin Sexton. They are nearly identical players from not only a statistical standpoint but a playstyle standpoint. Neither on them pass well despite being drafted as PGs and neither of them play defense.

Clarkson however, actually has a better Drtg than Sexton does and he can shoot off the dribble with better range than Sexton. And before people start pointing out their 3PT%. Jordan Clarkson takes 9 attempts per game, Sexton takes 4.

SO: Jordan Clarkson makes 4/51M--please tell me again how Collin Sexton deserves 4/100M+

So, Jordan Clarkston’s most efficient year of his career, in a limited role, playing almost exclusively with the second unit and never drawing the opposing team’s best defender was 12% worse than Collin Sexton’s 3rd year, and somehow that means that the comparison is both fair and the same.

That’s like saying the McDonald’s worker who YOLO’d $AMC on WSB is comparable to Warren Buffet because he had a 1000-bagger.


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Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

(.475(sexton)-425(clarkston))/.425(clarkston) = 11.6%

You’ve answered your own question. We know what happens when Clarkston is in the Sexton role, his 2015/16 stat line. It’s significantly lower than what we’re seeing out of Collin.

Everything Clarkston has done since has been in a limited role where he is not drawing a primary defensive assignment.

And that lower level of performance was worth 4 years and $50 million on a $80 million salary cap.


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[jbk1234]

So, Jordan Clarkston’s most efficient year of his career, in a limited role, playing almost exclusively with the second unit and never drawing the opposing team’s best defender was 12% worse than Collin Sexton’s 3rd year, and somehow that means that the comparison is both fair and the same.

That’s like saying the McDonald’s worker who YOLO’d $AMC on WSB is comparable to Warren Buffet because he had a 1000-bagger.


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Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins and a green light because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

Comparing Sexton and Clarkson is about as easy of a comparison out there are you could make with any players. Its about as easy as a Lavine/Booker comparison.

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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[Revenged25]

Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins and a green light because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

Comparing Sexton and Clarkson is about as easy of a comparison out there are you could make with any players. Its about as easy as a Lavine/Booker comparison.

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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I bet his scoring would still be a lot better.

[jbk1234]

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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I bet his scoring would still be a lot better.

I bet Sexton's scoring would be a little better, but given how much more Clarkson shoots from outside, I'm not convinced that the units efficiency would be.

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[JonFromVA]

I'm not debating what the Cavs will do, only what they should do. I would not extend him at all, because one you do, he's untradable this season to any team outside of maybe the Thunder. If you decide you want to move him midseason, the BYC makes it impossible.

I don't get the idea behind gauging his trade market, finding it wanting, and then paying him big money anyway. I really don't.

I don't think spreading the floor for Sexton will be as easy as people pretend. He has weaknesses that need to be compensated for by other types of personnel, and they're not easy to come by.

Please ... when did the compromises ever stop the Cavs from spreading the floor for LeBron James so he could more easily score points and give us a shot to catch an opponent?

I can actually point you to the data for LeBron with shooting lineups and you can draw whatever conclusion you'd like about their effectiveness .vs. the defensive lineups. However, we lack decent data for Collin because of the injuries and the lack of NBA quality backups. So we can't actually point to anything much beyond that fact that in his 20 clutch opportunities, he scored in volume and efficiently.

The idea of gauging his trade market is a reality check. Hopefully for both sides. If his agent was right, then there should have been a team out there willing to give something up of value (at the very least equal to the #8 pick we used to draft him). Getting him signed at a fair market value makes it easier for the Cavs to keep him OR trade him to a team better able to utilize his talents.

Far better than ending up like Dennis Schroeder.

But hey, if the rumors about the Cavs wanting Collin gone sooner rather than later are true, then we could see a trade go down anytime. But reality is the Knicks and Heat have already moved on and it seems unlikely we're going to get anything better from them than what they reportedly put on the table. We can wait and hope for something better, but that doesn't fit in with the idea that the Cavs are desperate to reset their lineup and move on from Collin.

And while rumors that Kevin Love has been asked to come off the bench having been going around, we're not hearing anything like that about Collin.

So, just my read (not based on any rumors - the Cavs have kept things quiet). I think at the right price and in my mind the right price is around $20M/yr, we would lock up Collin today. We drafted Evan Mobley, not Jalen Green. There's a spot for Collin at the right price.

We're comparing Sexton to LBJ now? Because I really can't imagine a less apt comparison.

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I take it your feeling ganged up on and don't feel in the mood for rational discourse.

[KuruptedCav]

Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins and a green light because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

Comparing Sexton and Clarkson is about as easy of a comparison out there are you could make with any players. Its about as easy as a Lavine/Booker comparison.

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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Not sure where you are getting 12% from but sure. Clarkson played 28min and Sexton played 35.

Im not really getting how people cant understand simply by looking at their Per 36 stats that they are almost a identical player with the same strengths and weaknesses. Like, its a extremely easy and clear comparison of two very similar players--one just gets starters mins and a green light because the team hes on has no other option and the other is the 6MOY winner on a contender with a All-Star in front of him on the depth chart.

Comparing Sexton and Clarkson is about as easy of a comparison out there are you could make with any players. Its about as easy as a Lavine/Booker comparison.

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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That’s not the issue. The issue is that we think his efficiency continues its trajectory.

Clarkson and Sexton have the same usage rate. The difference is that Clarkson has it primarily against a second unit.

Drop Collin’s usage to 20-25 and he looks a heck of a lot like Terry Rozier/Fred Vanvleet. And that’s what we expect to see with Rubio running the second unit.

Move him to the bench like Clarkson and mix in Conley, Mitchell, Gobert, Bogs, etc.

Actually, that’s a good question. Would Utah trade Clarkson for Sexton on the same contract?


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[Revenged25]

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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That’s not the issue. The issue is that we think his efficiency continues its trajectory.

Clarkson and Sexton have the same usage rate. The difference is that Clarkson has it primarily against a second unit.

Drop Collin’s usage to 20-25 and he looks a heck of a lot like Terry Rozier/Fred Vanvleet. And that’s what we expect to see with Rubio running the second unit.

Move him to the bench like Clarkson and mix in Conley, Mitchell, Gobert, Bogs, etc.

Actually, that’s a good question. Would Utah trade Clarkson for Sexton on the same contract?


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They'd probably trade several picks as well.

[LivingLegend]

Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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Clarkson would also need 2+ more shots to hit those numbers than Sexton does.

What people aren't allowing for is that on another team, Sexton's usage and FGAs would look a lot like Clarkson's usage and FGAs.

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That’s not the issue. The issue is that we think his efficiency continues its trajectory.

Clarkson and Sexton have the same usage rate. The difference is that Clarkson has it primarily against a second unit.

Drop Collin’s usage to 20-25 and he looks a heck of a lot like Terry Rozier/Fred Vanvleet. And that’s what we expect to see with Rubio running the second unit.

Move him to the bench like Clarkson and mix in Conley, Mitchell, Gobert, Bogs, etc.

Actually, that’s a good question. Would Utah trade Clarkson for Sexton on the same contract?


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Well Clarkson plays 28min. Not 20-25. He also plays a lot more with the 1s than you think he does, especially towards the end of games. I watched him do it all postseason, its not like he is out there strictly with 2nd units all the time. He was helping close out games in the playoffs.

I think the Jazz would do the trade strictly because of age, but Clarkson fits exactly what the Jazz need and thats a guy who could come off the bench and light up the scoreboard. I dont think Sextons more slow and methodical ISO approach would work on that Jazz team.

[jbk1234]

Please ... when did the compromises ever stop the Cavs from spreading the floor for LeBron James so he could more easily score points and give us a shot to catch an opponent?

I can actually point you to the data for LeBron with shooting lineups and you can draw whatever conclusion you'd like about their effectiveness .vs. the defensive lineups. However, we lack decent data for Collin because of the injuries and the lack of NBA quality backups. So we can't actually point to anything much beyond that fact that in his 20 clutch opportunities, he scored in volume and efficiently.

The idea of gauging his trade market is a reality check. Hopefully for both sides. If his agent was right, then there should have been a team out there willing to give something up of value (at the very least equal to the #8 pick we used to draft him). Getting him signed at a fair market value makes it easier for the Cavs to keep him OR trade him to a team better able to utilize his talents.

Far better than ending up like Dennis Schroeder.

But hey, if the rumors about the Cavs wanting Collin gone sooner rather than later are true, then we could see a trade go down anytime. But reality is the Knicks and Heat have already moved on and it seems unlikely we're going to get anything better from them than what they reportedly put on the table. We can wait and hope for something better, but that doesn't fit in with the idea that the Cavs are desperate to reset their lineup and move on from Collin.

And while rumors that Kevin Love has been asked to come off the bench having been going around, we're not hearing anything like that about Collin.

So, just my read (not based on any rumors - the Cavs have kept things quiet). I think at the right price and in my mind the right price is around $20M/yr, we would lock up Collin today. We drafted Evan Mobley, not Jalen Green. There's a spot for Collin at the right price.

We're comparing Sexton to LBJ now? Because I really can't imagine a less apt comparison.

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I take it your feeling ganged up on and don't feel in the mood for rational discourse.

Sexton can't even defend his position let alone provide help at the rim. The next time Sexton decides that getting his teammates going early, or ever, is important, will be the first time. I don't know that Sexton has ever had a 10 assist game. I'm not feeling ganged up on, I'm feeling exasperated.

There are real limitations to the young man's game that simply didn't exist with LBJ, fans are ignoring them because the Cavs don't, presently, have better options at SG, and it will be really difficult to build a successful roster around him as a starter.

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[Stillwater]

We're comparing Sexton to LBJ now? Because I really can't imagine a less apt comparison.

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I take it your feeling ganged up on and don't feel in the mood for rational discourse.

Sexton can't even defend his position let alone provide help at the rim. The next time Sexton decides that getting his teammates going early, or ever, is important, will be the first time. I don't know that Sexton has ever had a 10 assist game. I'm not feeling ganged up on, I'm feeling exasperated.

There are real limitations to the young man's game that simply didn't exist with LBJ, fans are ignoring them because the Cavs don't, presently, have better options at SG, and it will be really difficult to build a successful roster around him as a starter.

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The Cavs have every opportunity in the world to value another guard over Mobley and they didn't. They also could have used future 2nds to at minimum add a big pg/combo like Dosumnu or a spacer like Weiskamp at the 2 and 3 but they instead opted for Sexton and Okoro. They also added a veteran pg who is a better playmaker than DG but got rid of a floor spacer