Ben Simmons Containment Thread Take 3

[Telfaire]

Okogie has regressed last season and he's irrelevant to the Wolves, espeically if they bring in Simmons. No way is he a deal breaker.
Edwards had a nice rookie season,but his shot selection and selfish play is not what's needed next to DLo and KAT.

[Wolveswin]

To Blazers: Beasley + Beverley + 2022 Wolves 1st Swap + 2023 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To 76ers: McCollum + 2024, 26 Wolves 1st Swap + 2025 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To Wolves: Simmons

Blazers try something different with Beasley next to Dame. Plus they load up on expiring contracts and picks (own and owed) for a big ‘support Dame at deadline’ consolidation trade.

76ers replace Simmons with McCollum. Multiple 1sts (including swaps that should convey, unique in this kind of trade) give flexibility as they eye a future disgruntled star.

[Wolveswin]

Okogie has regressed last season and he's irrelevant to the Wolves, espeically if they bring in Simmons. No way is he a deal breaker.
Edwards had a nice rookie season,but his shot selection and selfish play is not what's needed next to DLo and KAT.

The point wasn’t Okogie. Edwards > Simmons in trade value and no way Wolves move him unless Simmons++. And no, Kuzma is not the + here. Lol

[daoneandonly]

Just no real interest in Bertans. The biggest issue with KP was his defense, bertans is even worse at that end.

[shangrila]

Edwards is not available.

Doesn’t matter what you think. If the price for Simmons is Edwards then Gersson moonwalks out the room throwing Morey the double bird.

[Wolveswin]

Wow, not to sensationalize, but I think this is one of the worst deals for Wolves I have seen on here.

If Edwards is in Simmons deal, Wolves are getting Simmons++. But here you went the other way and added more assets + Edwards. Wow.

[Pharaoh]

Question: Since Draymond threw his coach, GM and organization under the bus... does Draymond's trade value drop as much as folks have been saying Ben Simmons' value has dropped from Ben "wanting out" because Doc "threw him under the bus"?

It's a valid question.

No because Draymond has a history of creating confrontation and controversy.

He's actually won on the most important stage, been a huge part of their team over the years and every other situation has been sorted out.

Plus it's a individual player speaking his mind with a former team mate so "player empowerment" and all that.

The Simmons - Doc - Joel thing is something that was bubbling away under the surface long before Doc even arrived and the post playoff comments just magnified what was already a ticking time bomb.

The situations are not the same

Sent from my SM-G781B using RealGM mobile app

[BullyKing]

To Blazers: Beasley + Beverley + 2022 Wolves 1st Swap + 2023 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To 76ers: McCollum + 2024, 26 Wolves 1st Swap + 2025 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To Wolves: Simmons

Blazers try something different with Beasley next to Dame. Plus they load up on expiring contracts and picks (own and owed) for a big ‘support Dame at deadline’ consolidation trade.

76ers replace Simmons with McCollum. Multiple 1sts (including swaps that should convey, unique in this kind of trade) give flexibility as they eye a future disgruntled star.

No offense but your arguments are just so disingenuous. You must have pretended a million times like Wolves picks and swaps are so good and valuable and these swaps are going to convey while also thinking everyone on the Wolves is just so good that Simmons - a two time all-star - would be like the fourth best player on the team. So obviously you think the Wolves will be quite good and these picks pretty weak and the swaps worthless.

[Foshan]

haha, okay, whatever fits your narrative so you can get a deal for your team.

[Wolveswin]

To Blazers: Beasley + Beverley + 2022 Wolves 1st Swap + 2023 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To 76ers: McCollum + 2024, 26 Wolves 1st Swap + 2025 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To Wolves: Simmons

Blazers try something different with Beasley next to Dame. Plus they load up on expiring contracts and picks (own and owed) for a big ‘support Dame at deadline’ consolidation trade.

76ers replace Simmons with McCollum. Multiple 1sts (including swaps that should convey, unique in this kind of trade) give flexibility as they eye a future disgruntled star.

No offense but your arguments are just so disingenuous. You must have pretended a million times like Wolves picks and swaps are so good and valuable and these swaps are going to convey while also thinking everyone on the Wolves is just so good that Simmons - a two time all-star - would be like the fourth best player on the team. So obviously you think the Wolves will be quite good and these picks pretty weak and the swaps worthless.

Wolves picks are so good and valuable in comparison to Nets or Bucks 1sts…trades that are precedent in actual NBA. Prove me wrong?

You don’t think Wolves will be top 10 team even with Simmons? Or even sniff Bucks or Nets do you? That means 1st rewarded are going to be 19th or better for team receiving them. Once again, MUCH better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Now let’s break down swaps. You don’t really think Wolves will be better than 76ers do you? Means 76ers will actually get the swap (unlike 2021 Nets swap and most likely their other 3 owed). Once again, better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Should Simmons get better value than Holiday? Maybe. Should Simmons get more value than Harden? No way.

[Village Idiot]

Indiana trades:

Myles Turner
Malcolm Brogdon

Indiana receives:

Ben Simmons
Seth Curry

Philadelphia trades:

Ben Simmons
Seth Curry

Philadelphia receives:

CJ McCollum
Robert Covington

Portland trades:

CJ McCollum
Robert Covington

Portland receives:

Pascal Siakam
Chris Boucher

Toronto trades:

Pascal Siakam
Chris Boucher

Toronto receives:

Myles Turner
Malcolm Brogdon

Indiana gets a star for the first time in a long while. Ben Simmons slots in at PF while the Pacers also clean up the log-jam at center. Chris Duarte looks plenty ready to take over much of Brogdon's role.

Philadelphia gets a guy in McCollum who is elite in the three areas the Sixers are most lacking: pick-and-roll ball-handling, catch and shoot 3 point shooting and isolation scoring. Roco isn't as good defensively as Simmons but he is really solid at that end and is also a solid catch and shoot guy.

Portland clears up the log-jam at guard while addressing the lack of quality forwards on the roster. Siakam is one of the most well rounded forwards in the league while Boucher is a veteran 3 and D guy.

Toronto gets a solid upgrade at center in Turner and a go-to guy in Brogdon. Barnes looks ready to slot in a forward alongside OG.

[BullyKing]

To Blazers: Beasley + Beverley + 2022 Wolves 1st Swap + 2023 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To 76ers: McCollum + 2024, 26 Wolves 1st Swap + 2025 Wolves 1st (unprotected)

To Wolves: Simmons

Blazers try something different with Beasley next to Dame. Plus they load up on expiring contracts and picks (own and owed) for a big ‘support Dame at deadline’ consolidation trade.

76ers replace Simmons with McCollum. Multiple 1sts (including swaps that should convey, unique in this kind of trade) give flexibility as they eye a future disgruntled star.

No offense but your arguments are just so disingenuous. You must have pretended a million times like Wolves picks and swaps are so good and valuable and these swaps are going to convey while also thinking everyone on the Wolves is just so good that Simmons - a two time all-star - would be like the fourth best player on the team. So obviously you think the Wolves will be quite good and these picks pretty weak and the swaps worthless.

Wolves picks are so good and valuable in comparison to Nets or Bucks 1sts trades that are precedent in actual NBA. Prove me wrong?

You don’t think Wolves will be top 10 team even with Simmons? Or even sniff Bucks or Nets do you? That means 1st rewarded are going to be 19th or better for team receiving them. Once again, MUCH better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Now let’s break down swaps. You don’t really think Wolves will be better than 76ers do you? Means 76ers will actually get the swap (unlike 2021 Nets swap and most likely their other 3 owed). Once again, better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Should Simmons get better value than Holiday? Maybe. Should Simmons get more value than Harden? No way.

You can't really look at things so superficially can you?

1. If Simmons is the 4th best player on the Wolves, why wouldn't they be better than the Sixers where he was the 2nd best player? Is Embiid just individually so much better than KAT, your new savior Edwards, or DLO? Which leads to the second point:

2. What if Embiid gets injured? Still think those swaps are valuable?

3. And the real problem with your reliance on the Harden trade. 1. Harden had 1.5 years left on his contract and is 31. 2. Simmons has four years and is 25. So two big differences here. First, there was no guarantee Harden was going to extend so you had a real risk of him leaving - not even so much for the Nets but for everyone else who might otherwise bid thereby depressing the auction price. But more importantly, there is significant upside that the picks at the end of this deal will be very good because Brooklyn's core will be in their mid 30's at that point. The Wolves core would be significantly younger at the end of the picks and so there is much less upside to them.

TL/DR - Keep on misrepresenting things to make your trash offer seem legitimate.

[Wolveswin]

No offense but your arguments are just so disingenuous. You must have pretended a million times like Wolves picks and swaps are so good and valuable and these swaps are going to convey while also thinking everyone on the Wolves is just so good that Simmons - a two time all-star - would be like the fourth best player on the team. So obviously you think the Wolves will be quite good and these picks pretty weak and the swaps worthless.

Wolves picks are so good and valuable in comparison to Nets or Bucks 1sts trades that are precedent in actual NBA. Prove me wrong?

You don’t think Wolves will be top 10 team even with Simmons? Or even sniff Bucks or Nets do you? That means 1st rewarded are going to be 19th or better for team receiving them. Once again, MUCH better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Now let’s break down swaps. You don’t really think Wolves will be better than 76ers do you? Means 76ers will actually get the swap (unlike 2021 Nets swap and most likely their other 3 owed). Once again, better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Should Simmons get better value than Holiday? Maybe. Should Simmons get more value than Harden? No way.

You can't really look at things so superficially can you?

1. If Simmons is the 4th best player on the Wolves, why wouldn't they be better than the Sixers where he was the 2nd best player? Is Embiid just individually so much better than KAT, your new savior Edwards, or DLO? Which leads to the second point:

2. What if Embiid gets injured? Still think those swaps are valuable?

3. And the real problem with your reliance on the Harden trade. 1. Harden had 1.5 years left on his contract and is 31. 2. Simmons has four years and is 25. So two big differences here. First, there was no guarantee Harden was going to extend so you had a real risk of him leaving - not even so much for the Nets but for everyone else who might otherwise bid thereby depressing the auction price. But more importantly, there is significant upside that the picks at the end of this deal will be very good because Brooklyn's core will be in their mid 30's at that point. The Wolves core would be significantly younger at the end of the picks and so there is much less upside to them.

TL/DR - Keep on misrepresenting things to make your trash offer seem legitimate.

Despite Harden’s own set of circumstances, if you think he has less value than Simmons…make your case. That take is pure laughable to me.

If you think Wolves will be better than 76ers, make your case. Not as laughable but, ok.

76ers will get a Simmons lite replacement for their win-now efforts (because Dame and Beal aren’t on the table).

What if Towns gets hurt? We can play the injury what if nonsense all day.

[MiltownHawkeye]

MIN Gets:
Ben Simmons

They get a complimentary All-Star that would allow them to win now while KAT and DLo are on their prime.

KAT/McDaniels/Okogie/DLo/Simmons

PHI Gets:
CJ McCollum
Taurean Prince

They get the perimeter shot creator that they need and some defense.

Curry/CJ/Harris/Prince/Embiid

POR Gets:
Paschal Siakam

Powell was a perfect fit in Portland as soon as we was traded and he is a natural SG. This trade allows them to get bigger and play around Dame.

Dame/Powell/Covington/Siakam/Nurkic

TOR Gets:
Anthony Edwards
Malik Beasley

Toronto does a mini rebuild by getting a young talent with superstar potential. They can probably do another trade for someone like Bagley or Turner

FVV/Edwards/Barnes/OG/Boucher

Makes no sense for Minnesota to give up the best asset in this deal (Ant) PLUS Beasley only to get Simmons back. If anything if I were them I'd cut Philly out and try to get Siakam, and even then that's not enough to move Ant.

[BullyKing]

Wolves picks are so good and valuable in comparison to Nets or Bucks 1sts trades that are precedent in actual NBA. Prove me wrong?

You don’t think Wolves will be top 10 team even with Simmons? Or even sniff Bucks or Nets do you? That means 1st rewarded are going to be 19th or better for team receiving them. Once again, MUCH better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Now let’s break down swaps. You don’t really think Wolves will be better than 76ers do you? Means 76ers will actually get the swap (unlike 2021 Nets swap and most likely their other 3 owed). Once again, better asset than Nets or Bucks.

Should Simmons get better value than Holiday? Maybe. Should Simmons get more value than Harden? No way.

You can't really look at things so superficially can you?

1. If Simmons is the 4th best player on the Wolves, why wouldn't they be better than the Sixers where he was the 2nd best player? Is Embiid just individually so much better than KAT, your new savior Edwards, or DLO? Which leads to the second point:

2. What if Embiid gets injured? Still think those swaps are valuable?

3. And the real problem with your reliance on the Harden trade. 1. Harden had 1.5 years left on his contract and is 31. 2. Simmons has four years and is 25. So two big differences here. First, there was no guarantee Harden was going to extend so you had a real risk of him leaving - not even so much for the Nets but for everyone else who might otherwise bid thereby depressing the auction price. But more importantly, there is significant upside that the picks at the end of this deal will be very good because Brooklyn's core will be in their mid 30's at that point. The Wolves core would be significantly younger at the end of the picks and so there is much less upside to them.

TL/DR - Keep on misrepresenting things to make your trash offer seem legitimate.

Despite Harden’s own set of circumstances, if you think he has less value than Simmons…make your case. That take is pure laughable to me.

If you think Wolves will be better than 76ers, make your case. Not as laughable but, ok.

76ers will get a Simmons lite replacement for their win-now efforts (because Dame and Beal aren’t on the table).

What if Towns gets hurt? We can play the injury what if nonsense all day.

You really struggle with very basic concepts. You keep coming back to Harden and ask me to make a case why Simmons is more valuable. It really makes me wonder about your reading comprehension because my entire argument wasn't that Simmons was more valuable than Harden but demonstrating why your package is significantly less value than Harden's. And that's before we even get to the fact that the Nets sent out Allen (who returned another first) and Levert (who returned Oladipo but Houston doing something dumb doesn't reflect the price the Nets paid).

But yes, we could keep going all day because that's what happens when someone continuously misrepresents facts or moves the goalposts to keep an argument they are losing going. And I choose not to engage with you further.

[BullyKing]

When you know what the proposal's going to be before you even open the thread....

[Wolveswin]

You can't really look at things so superficially can you?

1. If Simmons is the 4th best player on the Wolves, why wouldn't they be better than the Sixers where he was the 2nd best player? Is Embiid just individually so much better than KAT, your new savior Edwards, or DLO? Which leads to the second point:

2. What if Embiid gets injured? Still think those swaps are valuable?

3. And the real problem with your reliance on the Harden trade. 1. Harden had 1.5 years left on his contract and is 31. 2. Simmons has four years and is 25. So two big differences here. First, there was no guarantee Harden was going to extend so you had a real risk of him leaving - not even so much for the Nets but for everyone else who might otherwise bid thereby depressing the auction price. But more importantly, there is significant upside that the picks at the end of this deal will be very good because Brooklyn's core will be in their mid 30's at that point. The Wolves core would be significantly younger at the end of the picks and so there is much less upside to them.

TL/DR - Keep on misrepresenting things to make your trash offer seem legitimate.

Despite Harden’s own set of circumstances, if you think he has less value than Simmons…make your case. That take is pure laughable to me.

If you think Wolves will be better than 76ers, make your case. Not as laughable but, ok.

76ers will get a Simmons lite replacement for their win-now efforts (because Dame and Beal aren’t on the table).

What if Towns gets hurt? We can play the injury what if nonsense all day.

You really struggle with very basic concepts. You keep coming back to Harden and ask me to make a case why Simmons is more valuable. It really makes me wonder about your reading comprehension because my entire argument wasn't that Simmons was more valuable than Harden but demonstrating why your package is significantly less value than Harden's. And that's before we even get to the fact that the Nets sent out Allen (who returned another first) and Levert (who returned Oladipo but Houston doing something dumb doesn't reflect the price the Nets paid).

But yes, we could keep going all day because that's what happens when someone continuously misrepresents facts or moves the goalposts to keep an argument they are losing going. And I choose not to engage with you further.

For a mod, your negative take argument style is vast.

We are talking just picks here. You don’t think players will be involved from Wolves too? Isn’t that how trades work?

And let’s use your weak argument above. My trade was McCollum to 76ers. McCollum is 2nd best player on Blazers, a playoff team in West. Don’t you think a McCollum/Embiid team would be better than Wolves even with Simmons. By your reasoning, only answer is yes.

Which once again validates Wolves 1sts and Swaps are more valuable than Nets or Bucks (which one would think is an obvious point that doesn’t need explaining to you).

[youngcrev]

The Sixers best remaining players after trading Simmons would be a 4 and a 5. Why would they trade him for a 4/5? Particularly one that's older, worse, and presents even more fit issues.

The Warriors should be keeping Draymond. His value to that team is far greater than it would be elsewhere (where it's questionable whether he's even viewed as much of a positive). Having him and Simmons presents some overlap issues, but that's a pretty unique situation where your best 2 players are 2 of the greatest shooters of all time, and they don't really require a ton of perimeter spacing around them since they warp the floor so much. They've run heavy minute lineups with Draymond and a non-shooting center like Looney or Bogut on the floor with success. I think it's workable, particularly if you stagger them. Plus the defense of those 2? Chef's kiss.

Regardless, the only way the Sixers are sending Ben to the Warriors is if they can get a major pile of assets that they can flip as part of a package for the next star that becomes available.

[Helsbyte]

Another trade where Indy sends out Turner and loses talent and value on the court and losing the pick swap.....smh

[Nate the Great]

Not good for the Warriors, either. The Warriors care mostly about playoff success at this point, and Simmons is terrible in the postseason.

I agree that he hasn't been good at all inthe playoffs, BUT, if he's with the Warriors, with Steph and a healthy Klay, playing at the 4 spot, that's a whole different scenario.

IF the Warriors truly do want Ben, I can't see it working with him and Draymond on the same team.

Always thought if he goes to the Warriors, Draymond has to go out. Include the Blazers in the trade and send Green to them and CJ to Sixers with others added. Dray would give the Blazers that edge they sorely lack

He was afraid to dunk in the playoffs because he’s a terrible free throw shooter and didn’t want to get embarrassed. How does a change in teammates change that?