Vegas Summer League Discussion Thread - Suggs, Wagner, Anthony, Hampton, Brazdeikis and TIMMA on the Roster

[KillMonger]

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[shadrock]

Barnes had good stats but i think he looked awkward on offense. His touch around the rim reminds me of AG. He also passes to players who are open not passes them open. I dont know how you can compare him to Kawhi and Giannis. Even his defense seems a little overrated. He is kind of stiff, gets blown by a lot. Overall nice player, very active but i would never pick him ahead of Suggs.

Yeah I dunno where the kawhi comparisons come from. Maybe vecause they are both 6'7 barefoot and have 7 foot wingspans? Otherwise... I always thought Kuminga was more kawhi like between the two.

Barnes, once he has proper nba traning/workout would probably improve his lateral quickness. Is it enough to guard the pg/sg of the league? Remains to be seen cuz right now its a big no

Just one of those cliche draft things. Anyone who cant shoot and is a wing is compared to Kawhi, anyone who is a wing but isnt athletic is Paul Pierce.

[pepe1991]

Memo of every draft comparison:
every 6'7 black kid without elite jumpshot but elite athletics is Jimmy Butler
every 6'7 black athletic kid with jumpshot is Kawhi
evey 6'7 black unathletic kid is Pierce/Middelton
every 6'7 white kid is Gordon Hayward
every 6'9 kid with semi funcional motoric funcions is Giannis
every 6'3 with any sort of jumper is Jrue Holiday worst/ Lillard best
every white big man is new Gasol
every 6'3 PG who can't shoot is Rondo



Barnes isn't Giannis, i feel cringe just typing this. He literally looks like Aaron Gordon , if Gordon at some point broke both legs. Complete lack of fluidity, guy runs like he has been shot in knee.

[zaymon]

I wonder what we do with our second 2 way contract. I like Gravett the most but we have a logjam at the guard spot. Guy just sees the floor well unlike our other guards..... Maybe we want to have another playmaking guard just in case. If not D.J Hogg also looks great and he is 6'8. I must say i am not suprised we won g league last year.
If g league team is the template i dont know why we drafted Anthony...

[RookieStar]

I kept asking, where did this dj hogg come from? where did we pick him up from?

[JBSouthpaw]

Well, I was pretty hyped about this summer league, came away pretty deflated.
Suggs looks good, by far the best on the squad.
Wagner has potential, was hoping for a bit more from a player that played 2 years of college. Did do a bunch of small things well.
RJ got a bit better after that horrid start. at least ended up shooting 44% from 3.
Cole...I had high hopes....Fully was in the Cole camp...

I just wanted 1 player to have that WOW game.

[pepe1991]

Well, I was pretty hyped about this summer league, came away pretty deflated.
Suggs looks good, by far the best on the squad.
Wagner has potential, was hoping for a bit more from a player that played 2 years of college. Did do a bunch of small things well.
RJ got a bit better after that horrid start. at least ended up shooting 44% from 3.
Cole...I had high hopes....Fully was in the Cole camp...

I just wanted 1 player to have that WOW game.

I think that's execlly how season will play out.
I think Suggs will average some healthy 13-16 ppg on 3-5 apg, not great efficiency but he will have some flashes.

I also think that there will be point of season where Cole will try to highjack offense for his inflated 15 ppg-attemp.
I think that, if healthy and in good shape, we could see some Afflalo type Gary Harris season. But given his trackrecord i'm not betting too much on that.

Wagner, if he gets stucked in second lineup behind Cole and Ross probably won't see many shots.

And overall all hypotetical questions like " who should Magic resign, Bamba or Wendell" will end with some conclusion where non of them will look like long term solution.

It's just year two of rebuild, we only had 2 lottery picks so far. Tempering expetations is key.

[zaymon]

Well, I was pretty hyped about this summer league, came away pretty deflated.
Suggs looks good, by far the best on the squad.
Wagner has potential, was hoping for a bit more from a player that played 2 years of college. Did do a bunch of small things well.
RJ got a bit better after that horrid start. at least ended up shooting 44% from 3.
Cole...I had high hopes....Fully was in the Cole camp...

I just wanted 1 player to have that WOW game.

I think that's execlly how season will play out.
I think Suggs will average some healthy 13-16 ppg on 3-5 apg, not great efficiency but he will have some flashes.

I also think that there will be point of season where Cole will try to highjack offense for his inflated 15 ppg-attemp.
I think that, if healthy and in good shape, we could see some Afflalo type Gary Harris season. But given his trackrecord i'm not betting too much on that.

Wagner, if he gets stucked in second lineup behind Cole and Ross probably won't see many shots.

And overall all hypotetical questions like " who should Magic resign, Bamba or Wendell" will end with some conclusion where non of them will look like long term solution.

It's just year two of rebuild, we only had 2 lottery picks so far. Tempering expetations is key.

We are so lucky pepe we have you to temper our expectations :p
I hope Mosley will give minutes according to defensive effort and sharing the ball and not seniority.
It will be interesting to see if we start Suggs, Fultz or both. I predict one of the starters will be Gary Harris. He took role of a veteran leader last year, he always gives it all on defense. We must build his authority by starting him. I worry guys like Anthony wont listen to him much if they start over him.
Suggs vs Fultz is very interesting. Biggest factor could be Markelle health, but if he is healthy there is case for both.
Fultz was a starter before injury, he knows how to play in the nba. Not starting him could kill his confidence. Also playing Suggs off the bench would shelter him in the beginning of his carrier
On the other hand Suggs seems very mature, i dont have worries with his defensive effort which was better than Fultz's already. If Fultz doeant magically regain his shot, Suggs is clearly more talented player. There is little downside to starting Jalen and establishing hierarchy early could be beneficial to team chemistry.
Anthony could be out of rotation if he doesnt improve his play. He should be held accountable, no guaranteed minutes. We have too many guards.
Wagner is a team player. I would love to see him starting but it could be a year too early. Constructing our bench will be interesting, but propably one of Suggs/Fultz will be reserve pg so there is hope for Franz to have the ball a little.
I expect WCJ to win the center battle. Bamba is one of the worst passing bigs in the nba. Carter could be a reason we passed on Sengun.

[pepe1991]

Well, I was pretty hyped about this summer league, came away pretty deflated.
Suggs looks good, by far the best on the squad.
Wagner has potential, was hoping for a bit more from a player that played 2 years of college. Did do a bunch of small things well.
RJ got a bit better after that horrid start. at least ended up shooting 44% from 3.
Cole...I had high hopes....Fully was in the Cole camp...

I just wanted 1 player to have that WOW game.

I think that's execlly how season will play out.
I think Suggs will average some healthy 13-16 ppg on 3-5 apg, not great efficiency but he will have some flashes.

I also think that there will be point of season where Cole will try to highjack offense for his inflated 15 ppg-attemp.
I think that, if healthy and in good shape, we could see some Afflalo type Gary Harris season. But given his trackrecord i'm not betting too much on that.

Wagner, if he gets stucked in second lineup behind Cole and Ross probably won't see many shots.

And overall all hypotetical questions like " who should Magic resign, Bamba or Wendell" will end with some conclusion where non of them will look like long term solution.

It's just year two of rebuild, we only had 2 lottery picks so far. Tempering expetations is key.

We are so lucky pepe we have you to temper our expectations :p
I hope Mosley will give minutes according to defensive effort and sharing the ball and not seniority.
It will be interesting to see if we start Suggs, Fultz or both. I predict one of the starters will be Gary Harris. He took role of a veteran leader last year, he always gives it all on defense. We must build his authority by starting him. I worry guys like Anthony wont listen to him much if they start over him.
Suggs vs Fultz is very interesting. Biggest factor could be Markelle health, but if he is healthy there is case for both.
Fultz was a starter before injury, he knows how to play in the nba. Not starting him could kill his confidence. Also playing Suggs off the bench would shelter him in the beginning of his carrier
On the other hand Suggs seems very mature, i dont have worries with his defensive effort which was better than Fultz's already. If Fultz doeant magically regain his shot, Suggs is clearly more talented player. There is little downside to starting Jalen and establishing hierarchy early could be beneficial to team chemistry.
Anthony could be out of rotation if he doesnt improve his play. He should be held accountable, no guaranteed minutes. We have too many guards.
Wagner is a team player. I would love to see him starting but it could be a year too early. Constructing our bench will be interesting, but propably one of Suggs/Fultz will be reserve pg so there is hope for Franz to have the ball a little.
I expect WCJ to win the center battle. Bamba is one of the worst passing bigs in the nba. Carter could be a reason we passed on Sengun.

I watched SL just to see Hampton and Cole improvments. After 2 games, and watching other second year players, i just srug shoulders in confirmation of what i expected.
Nobody can convice me into idea of Cole being "contributor" . He just does not do anything good enough. But carries himself as Kobe.
Hampton, i like him, but in year two you expect player to do more than just try to run faster than opponents. He has whole year to convice me he made progress. SL was complete stinker for him.

I don't care about Fultz. With >30% three point shot on healthy 300 attemps a year we talk about fringe rotation player , and unplayable player in playoffs.
As for rookies, i was always very high on Suggs, so i'm happy about finally picking PG of future.
Wagner... meh. I struggle to find role for him in nba. He looks to be very low usage PF. Basically potentially more polished Aminu. Who also was 8th pick. There hasn't been anything about his game in college, nor SL where would come off as clear strenght of his. Team defense? Sure , fine, it works against that competition, but i simply can't imagine him being able to hold his own against some Paul George, Kawhi, Durant or Lebron, players he will be tasked to guard every night.
And where it doesn't matter at all, there is something to be said about 8th pick in nba from historic perspective.

Spoiler:

Year Player School/Country – Team

2019 Jaxson Hayes, Texas – New Orleans Pelicans
2018 Collin Sexton, Alabama – Cleveland Cavaliers
2017 Frank Ntilikina, France – New York Knicks
2016 Marquese Chriss, Washington – Sacramento Kings
2015 Stanley Johnson, Arizona – Detroit Pistons
2014 Nik Stauskas, Michigan – Sacramento Kings
2013 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Georgia – Detroit Pistons
2012 Terrence Ross, Washington – Toronto Raptors
2011 Brandon Knight, Kentucky – Detroit Pistons
2010 Al-Farouq Aminu, Wake Forest – L.A. Clippers

2000’s

2009 Jordan Hill, Arizona – New York Knicks
2008 Joe Alexander, West Virginia – Milwaukee Bucks
2007 Brandan Wright, North Carolina – Charlotte Bobcats (Draft rights traded to Golden State Warriors)
2006 Rudy Gay, Connecticut – Houston Rockets (Draft rights traded to Memphis Grizzlies)
2005 Channing Frye, Arizona – New York Knicks
2004 Rafael Araujo, BYU – Toronto Raptors
2003 T.J. Ford, Texas – Milwaukee Bucks
2002 Chris Wilcox, Maryland – L.A. Clippers
2001 DeSagana Diop, Oak Hill Academy (Va.) – Cleveland Cavaliers
2000 Jamal Crawford, Michigan – Cleveland Cavaliers (Draft rights traded to Chicago Bulls

Not a single 8th pick made allstar since VIn Baker in 1985 so yea... expetations are very, very low.

[zaymon]

I watched SL just to see Hampton and Cole improvments. After 2 games, and watching other second year players, i just srug shoulders in confirmation of what i expected.
Nobody can convice me into idea of Cole being "contributor" . He just does not do anything good enough. But carries himself as Kobe.
Hampton, i like him, but in year two you expect player to do more than just try to run faster than opponents. He has whole year to convice me he made progress. SL was complete stinker for him.

I don't care about Fultz. With >30% three point shot on healthy 300 attemps a year we talk about fringe rotation player , and unplayable player in playoffs.
As for rookies, i was always very high on Suggs, so i'm happy about finally picking PG of future.
Wagner... meh. I struggle to find role for him in nba. He looks to be very low usage PF. Basically potentially more polished Aminu. Who also was 8th pick. There hasn't been anything about his game in college, nor SL where would come off as clear strenght of his. Team defense? Sure , fine, it works against that competition, but i simply can't imagine him being able to hold his own against some Paul George, Kawhi, Durant or Lebron, players he will be tasked to guard every night.
And where it doesn't matter at all, there is something to be said about 8th pick in nba from historic perspective.

Spoiler:

Year Player School/Country – Team

2019 Jaxson Hayes, Texas – New Orleans Pelicans
2018 Collin Sexton, Alabama – Cleveland Cavaliers
2017 Frank Ntilikina, France – New York Knicks
2016 Marquese Chriss, Washington – Sacramento Kings
2015 Stanley Johnson, Arizona – Detroit Pistons
2014 Nik Stauskas, Michigan – Sacramento Kings
2013 Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Georgia – Detroit Pistons
2012 Terrence Ross, Washington – Toronto Raptors
2011 Brandon Knight, Kentucky – Detroit Pistons
2010 Al-Farouq Aminu, Wake Forest – L.A. Clippers

2000’s

2009 Jordan Hill, Arizona – New York Knicks
2008 Joe Alexander, West Virginia – Milwaukee Bucks
2007 Brandan Wright, North Carolina – Charlotte Bobcats (Draft rights traded to Golden State Warriors)
2006 Rudy Gay, Connecticut – Houston Rockets (Draft rights traded to Memphis Grizzlies)
2005 Channing Frye, Arizona – New York Knicks
2004 Rafael Araujo, BYU – Toronto Raptors
2003 T.J. Ford, Texas – Milwaukee Bucks
2002 Chris Wilcox, Maryland – L.A. Clippers
2001 DeSagana Diop, Oak Hill Academy (Va.) – Cleveland Cavaliers
2000 Jamal Crawford, Michigan – Cleveland Cavaliers (Draft rights traded to Chicago Bulls

Not a single 8th pick made allstar since VIn Baker in 1985 so yea... expetations are very, very low.

I see some potential in Anthony but not as a starter. He has one skill that could be crucial and that is off the dribble 3 point shooting. Thats the thing that transformed Jazz offense last year. As a starter he is too limited right now but from the bench where the talent is lower that could carry the offense the same way Ross movement shooting did. We could also combine the two until we trade Ross. I wont be too sad if he is out of rotation tough. He should earn every minute. Thing is i would rather focus on improving Okeke and Wagner off the dribble shooting and give the shots to them instead.
Hampton needs to find himself in a more limited role. He wont be primary with Suggs on board, not in a million years. His growth spurt and improved 3 point shooting are great to see. I wouldnt play him above Harris but i see more overall potential than Anthony
I am not putting much stock into Fultz. If he doesnt improve his shooting he is not above average starter but he could be good stop gap until Suggs is ready ( and he is propably ready right now)
I will defend Wagner until proven otherwise. In comparison he is much taller than both Barnes and Kuminga. He was on another level defensively than Barnes. Much more disciplined, better rim protector. He was listed as a guard in college, he is capable of defending 2s and 3s. Despite underdeveloped body he arguably locked Kuminga in stretches. I see him as a 3 for sure, maybe even a 2 in a Klay Thompson mold. Franz was suprisingly good at off the dribble shooting, 82 percentile !!!! All of that being younger than most freshman. I dont see much downside ?

[Skybox]

I agree with a lot of the previous observations about SL and the questions ahead...
-Hampton, as a sophomore, should have come in and dominated these newbies - but didn't. I really don't know if his ceiling is notable.
-Cole has that "Alpha" mentality but didn't show any maturity or growth in his game. I still like him in a TRoss role off the bench but he's got to develop some eyes for his teammates or his career will be a succession of one-year deals like Austin Rivers (with occasional big scoring games)
-I like Wagner's versatility and he'll need minutes...but so does Chuma. I hope we can find which one(s) is for real on the same team.
-I really have no interest in WCJ. Bamba's ceiling (that I cling to) seems more and more of a fantasy. Isaac may be our unicorn C.
-Suggs is the best/luckiest thing to happen to ORL in a very long time. From a pure talent/upside basis (emphasis on upside) - A Fultz/Suggs backcourt is still the best vision we have on our roster. Again, lots of good things would have to fall in place.
-I like the apparent mentality of our vets/mentors...Harris, RoLo, TRoss. All can contribute on and off the court. Each are still potentially good enough to be moved to a contender at the TD if it makes sense at the time.
-Mosley has his work cut out for him but he's saying the right things. I'm really encouraged that we have a "new" Coach rather than a retread. He's the biggest piece of the puzzle, IMO.

So many questions but plenty of realistic opportunities for things to proceed in a good way too.