Marc Stein: Toronto has expressed interest in Ben Simmons

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

If the price gets cheap enough, sure. I'd even be willing to throw in multiple firsts if the ask gets cheap enough.

The problem is, I doubt they settle for Dragic + Boucher and a couple firsts.

[everdiso]

Seems like an incredibly dumb risk. The team already has a high defensive ceiling with Fred and the growth of OG and eventually Scottie Barnes. Your giving up at minimum 9 3PAs from Fred, which shrinks the floor in the half court. Plus Fred's leadership, etc. The guy who had the stones to close down the Oracle v. the guy who has repeatedly tried to hide on the court in the playoffs.

This deal made some sense when it was for Siakam. It makes no sense when it's for OG or Fred.

I am big on FVV too I dont need any convincing about how special is at 5'11. His leadership and all.
But If the philosophy is to (fully) go positionless then Ben would epitomize that philosophy. Fred is a great defender, but Ben is the best perimeter defender in the entire league at 6'10. Both GTjr and OG are 40% 3pt shooters: Ben's penetration's would give them more open 3s. Ben will be just fine without a dominant center

I didn't say he needs a dominant centre, but he needs a shooting center and good ones are rare. Especially at the price point the Raptors would have to offer once his salary is exchanged (he makes way more than Fred).

As for penetration, DRIVES/game

Fred = 14.8, 36.8 minutes, 13.3 assist % off drives.
Simmons = 10.2/32 minutes, 9.5 assist % off drives.

There's not an advantage there, imo. Then factor in that 1/3 of his offensive possessions are transition. For Fred it's 1/5th. I'd be absolutely floored if the Raptors even considered this.

It's scary to think how bad Simmons would look if he didn't have a dominant elite #1 option scorer to play with and give him easy assists.

[ash_k]

Seems like an incredibly dumb risk. The team already has a high defensive ceiling with Fred and the growth of OG and eventually Scottie Barnes. Your giving up at minimum 9 3PAs from Fred, which shrinks the floor in the half court. Plus Fred's leadership, etc. The guy who had the stones to close down the Oracle v. the guy who has repeatedly tried to hide on the court in the playoffs.

This deal made some sense when it was for Siakam. It makes no sense when it's for OG or Fred.

I am big on FVV too I dont need any convincing about how special is at 5'11. His leadership and all.
But If the philosophy is to (fully) go positionless then Ben would epitomize that philosophy. Fred is a great defender, but Ben is the best perimeter defender in the entire league at 6'10. Both GTjr and OG are 40% 3pt shooters: Ben's penetration's would give them more open 3s. Ben will be just fine without a dominant center

I didn't say he needs a dominant centre, but he needs a shooting center and good ones are rare. Especially at the price point the Raptors would have to offer once his salary is exchanged (he makes way more than Fred).

As for penetration, DRIVES/game

Fred = 14.8, 36.8 minutes, 13.3 assist % off drives.
Simmons = 10.2/32 minutes, 9.5 assist % off drives.

There's not an advantage there, imo. Then factor in that 1/3 of his offensive possessions are transition. For Fred it's 1/5th. I'd be absolutely floored if the Raptors even considered this.

You cant compare. FVV would turn mostly into a spot shooter with Embiid. A much better fit than Ben alongside Joel.

Those analytics numbers don't tell you that 6'11 Ben is quicker and faster than 5'11 FVV. He is a much better penetrator off the dribble than FVV and of course a better finisher. better court vision. Birch showed some stretch 5 potential with us.
If the trades is FVV+Dragic+Boucher+picks. You have to go for it.

[Jerry Lucas]

I'm actually way more interested in a Simmons reclamation project now just because Maxey might be part of this too. Another chance for Masai to get him, the more his stock skyrockets the harder it will be to trade for him. This might be the last chance to steal him cheap.

[ATLTimekeeper]

You cant compare. FVV would turn mostly into a spot shooter with Embiid. A much better fit than Ben alongside Joel.

Those analytics numbers don't tell you that 6'11 Ben is quicker and faster than 5'11 FVV. He is a much better penetrator off the dribble than FVV and of course a better finisher. better court vision. Birch showed some stretch 5 potential with us.
If the trades is FVV+Dragic+Boucher+picks. You have to go for it.

Why would I care what FVV can do with Embiid? I'm only discussing this from the Raptors' perspective. Ben just went from 6"10 to 6"11 in the span of two posts He's a better finisher but not as much of a threat in the half court (as shown). Fred is a worse finisher, but passes more and turns the ball over way less. He's effective at creating movement, both in the half court and in transition. If it were Fred for Simmons, Philly would be the one kicking in picks and useful role players. They have the impetus to move Simmons, we don't need him at all.

Here's another stat for you, Siakam 13.8 drives, 7.9 assist %/ 4.9 TOV%, 8.1 PTS off drives. Simmons 10.2, 9.5assist %/7.3 TOV/4.9 PTS off drives.

Not only is Fred better at penetrating than Simmons, so is Siakam. The fact that Masai and Bobby even entertained this is likely because Siakam was moody and through with Nurse after last year.

[Kevin Willis]

Simmons is interesting fit. A defensive end nightmare. Especially if him, OG, Scottie, Pascal and Achiuwa on the court. However, the O will be brutal.

I don't see him wanna come up, he is not getting enough fame here. Plus, he is attention whore, and he just wanna date models. He wanna go LA.

Maybe GS will be a place for him. Flip Wiggins (maybe with a first or Wiseman/Moody) for him. GSW needs to win, and it will help them as Klay and Curry are outside threat.

That's interesting because Toronto has models. Many players have dated, or even married, women from Toronto. I am sure he can find enough to keep him happy.

I don't think he's a great fit here. Barnes is an outgoing personality, I can see issues like with Embiid. He will never be a decent shooter. He might get better but never decent plus he has mental blocks that prevent him from reaching full potential. So you have to consider him as he is more than what he can become because that ship is sailing.

In GSW it would be a wonderful thing with Curry as the shooting guard. Him, Draymond and Klay on defense. Good team. And I can see him and Klay really getting along.

[NotMyKawhi]

My gut says it's likely us but idk if the options are...

Twolves- Russell?
Kings- Buddy and Bagley

I could see them being interested in a FVV over any of those players. I think FVV is the best player out of all those players when you consider contract.

I think FVV, Boucher, and another small piece is the best offer for the Sixers if that's all that's being offered above

[ash_k]

You cant compare. FVV would turn mostly into a spot shooter with Embiid. A much better fit than Ben alongside Joel.

Those analytics numbers don't tell you that 6'11 Ben is quicker and faster than 5'11 FVV. He is a much better penetrator off the dribble than FVV and of course a better finisher. better court vision. Birch showed some stretch 5 potential with us.
If the trades is FVV+Dragic+Boucher+picks. You have to go for it.

Why would I care what FVV can do with Embiid? I'm only discussing this from the Raptors' perspective. Ben just went from 6"10 to 6"11 in the span of two posts He's a better finisher but not as much of a threat in the half court (as shown). Fred is a worse finisher, but passes more and turns the ball over way less. He's effective at creating movement, both in the half court and in transition. If it were Fred for Simmons, Philly would be the one kicking in picks and useful role players. They have the impetus to move Simmons, we don't need him at all.

Here's another stat for you, Siakam 13.8 drives, 7.9 assist %/ 4.9 TOV%, 8.1 PTS off drives. Simmons 10.2, 9.5assist %/7.3 TOV/4.9 PTS off drives.

Not only is Fred better at penetrating than Simmons, so is Siakam. The fact that Masai and Bobby even entertained this is likely because Siakam was moody and through with Nurse after last year.

He is listed as 6'11 in most places.
Anyway..nothing but analytics, I am telling you that there are deceptive because your analytics would imply that FVV and Siakam are superior drivers than Simmons..and they are certainly not (focus on the ability). We are not talking about the same basketball if you cant see it. As long as there is a dominant center in there his drives will be limited.
He stopped driving in the playoffs, after losing his confidence in his FT%. Other great players have gone through those type of struggles and recovered.

I would rather do Dragic+Boucher for Simmons from a "Raptors perspective." but trades have to fit both teams.

After hearing VP chairman talking about the new approach (implying positonless basketball) and going out of his way to defend Pascal and drafting another positionless player( over a regular 6'3 player): Trading Pascal would not make sense. FVV for Ben would make sense for both teams.

[SurgeIblocka]

Yeah lets trade FVV who actually shows up in the playoffs for overrated Simmons who hides in his turtle shell, he would be such a great influence on Barnes lol.

No way you trade Fred for Ben even if Fred is undersized he still plays like champ.

[vulture]

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[ash_k]

My gut says it's likely us but idk if the options are...

Twolves- Russell?
Kings- Buddy and Bagley

I could see them being interested in a FVV over any of those players. I think FVV is the best player out of all those players when you consider contract.

I think FVV, Boucher, and another small piece is the best offer for the Sixers if that's all that's being offered above

They have to be interested (FVV)
Russell playoffs debut were not convincing at all.
Buddy and Bagley and all the kings have never made the playoffs.
Embiid's knees cannot afford to wait and find out if those Kings players can handle playoffs pressure.
With Embiid, they are in a win-now mode. FVV fits the bill and timeline perfectly. same age as Joel.

[ash_k]

Yeah lets trade FVV who actually shows up in the playoffs for overrated Simmons who hides in his turtle shell, he would be such a great influence on Barnes lol.

No way you trade Fred for Ben even if Fred is undersized he still plays like champ.

the thing though, at some point, y'all need to get over that Hawks series.

Just imagine if that ball did not go in after all those bounces then in OT..Sixers win.

Okay Fred VanVleet against the Sixers 7 games:
2.0 ppg| 12.9FG% | 3.6 3P% totally overmatched in size and weight. What would you call FVV right now??

[WuTang_CMB]

Ha this wiesel has no sources but nice to see

[MoMan24]

Seems like an incredibly dumb risk. The team already has a high defensive ceiling with Fred and the growth of OG and eventually Scottie Barnes. Your giving up at minimum 9 3PAs from Fred, which shrinks the floor in the half court. Plus Fred's leadership, etc. The guy who had the stones to close down the Oracle v. the guy who has repeatedly tried to hide on the court in the playoffs.

This deal made some sense when it was for Siakam. It makes no sense when it's for OG or Fred.

I am big on FVV too I dont need any convincing about how special is at 5'11. His leadership and all.
But If the philosophy is to (fully) go positionless then Ben would epitomize that philosophy. Fred is a great defender, but Ben is the best perimeter defender in the entire league at 6'10. Both GTjr and OG are 40% 3pt shooters: Ben's penetration's would give them more open 3s. Ben will be just fine without a dominant center

I didn't say he needs a dominant centre, but he needs a shooting center and good ones are rare. Especially at the price point the Raptors would have to offer once his salary is exchanged (he makes way more than Fred).

As for penetration, DRIVES/game

Fred = 14.8, 36.8 minutes, 13.3 assist % off drives.
Simmons = 10.2/32 minutes, 9.5 assist % off drives.

There's not an advantage there, imo. Then factor in that 1/3 of his offensive possessions are transition. For Fred it's 1/5th. I'd be absolutely floored if the Raptors even considered this.

Don't you think Ben would get more post ups, drives, and transition opportunities under Nurse and no Embiid. I don't think you just transfer his Sixers numbers and just paste with us. He will be more impowered and be put in positions to succeed like Pascal and Fred were. Or maybe I'm wrong and he sucks.

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

Morey's really screwed himself and the Sixers here. Like, he's had since last year and he's sat on his hands as Ben's value has tanked.

They keep trying to sell the upside, yet they can't make it work. It's funny, because nobody's buying it.

[TorontoRapsFan]

No. Please god no. There is no way he will work out on any team without a clear and recognized superstar to keep him from going all megalomaniac. Or a team that caters to him fully and puts him above every other player. Not worth it. Not even if given for free.

[ontnut]

Yeah lets trade FVV who actually shows up in the playoffs for overrated Simmons who hides in his turtle shell, he would be such a great influence on Barnes lol.

No way you trade Fred for Ben even if Fred is undersized he still plays like champ.

the thing though, at some point, y'all need to get over that Hawks series.

Just imagine if that ball did not go in after all those bounces then in OT..Sixers win.

Okay Fred VanVleet against the Sixers 7 games:
2.0 ppg| 12.9FG% | 3.6 3P% totally overmatched in size and weight. What would you call FVV right now??

Don't go down this road man. I tried it, it didn't go well lol.
People refuse to see the opposite view.

Not trading Fred for Ben, as much as I like Fred and despise Ben, would be foolish. If shooting is a concern, it can be found elsewhere. You see how that hypothetical 6'9"+ switchable lineup goes. If it doesn't work well, then Siakam is movable for some shooting at the guard spot, and you move Ben to the 4.

[TRex520]

Simmons is interesting fit. A defensive end nightmare. Especially if him, OG, Scottie, Pascal and Achiuwa on the court. However, the O will be brutal.

I don't see him wanna come up, he is not getting enough fame here. Plus, he is attention whore, and he just wanna date models. He wanna go LA.

Maybe GS will be a place for him. Flip Wiggins (maybe with a first or Wiseman/Moody) for him. GSW needs to win, and it will help them as Klay and Curry are outside threat.

That's interesting because Toronto has models. Many players have dated, or even married, women from Toronto. I am sure he can find enough to keep him happy.

I don't think he's a great fit here. Barnes is an outgoing personality, I can see issues like with Embiid. He will never be a decent shooter. He might get better but never decent plus he has mental blocks that prevent him from reaching full potential. So you have to consider him as he is more than what he can become because that ship is sailing.

In GSW it would be a wonderful thing with Curry as the shooting guard. Him, Draymond and Klay on defense. Good team. And I can see him and Klay really getting along.

Toronto or Canada in general has a lot of great models. However, it is the fame that Ben Simmons enjoy. First Kardashian then the chick that he went to Wimbledon with. Speaking of Wimbledon, he said he would work on his game during that time. I guess he meant the dating game.

Anyway, I don't think he will end up here. I mean it will causes great defensive team but no 3s, no shooter and lack of interior size will not bring us far.

Ya only GSW make sense, they can carry him on offence. He will be valuable on D, which GSW can definitely use some of it. GSW wanna win while still have the core of Steph, Klay and Draymond. Iggy experiment helped them before and Simmons can provide something similar. I will say that's the best fit for both Simmons and GSW

[ash_k]

Yeah lets trade FVV who actually shows up in the playoffs for overrated Simmons who hides in his turtle shell, he would be such a great influence on Barnes lol.

No way you trade Fred for Ben even if Fred is undersized he still plays like champ.

the thing though, at some point, y'all need to get over that Hawks series.

Just imagine if that ball did not go in after all those bounces then in OT..Sixers win.

Okay Fred VanVleet against the Sixers 7 games:
2.0 ppg| 12.9FG% | 3.6 3P% totally overmatched in size and weight. What would you call FVV right now??

Don't go down this road man. I tried it, it didn't go well lol.
People refuse to see the opposite view.

Not trading Fred for Ben, as much as I like Fred and despise Ben, would be foolish. If shooting is a concern, it can be found elsewhere. You see how that hypothetical 6'9"+ switchable lineup goes. If it doesn't work well, then Siakam is movable for some shooting at the guard spot, and you move Ben to the 4.

all in with your take!
his struggles (Free throw issues) started right away against the Wizards and this is what he did against those same Wizards:
14.8ppg|10.2rpg|9.2apg|64.0 FG% while containing Westbrook.

[Federalies]

Ha this wiesel has no sources but nice to see

Confirmed by multiple “Sauces”!

The “he’s willing to go to any team that’s not the 76ers” part starts at 4:00!

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