Ben Simmons Containment Thread Take 3

[shrink]

Hey. I thought some of you might like an update on Minnesota. The Athletic’s Jon Krawczynski was on the local sports radio yesterday (1:11:20), and Baseline was nice enough to summarize what he had to say about the Simmons situation.

https://www.iheart.com/podcast/139-the-dan-barreiro-show-26981004/

- Anticipated the Simmons news today but did not know it would come this early
- Teams have been waiting for this to happen due to Morey's asking price
- When asked what his thoughts are on what the team might be willing to give up, starts by saying Towns and Edwards are off limit. Thinks the Wolves would prefer to keep Russell, but not a must. If it got to a point where the deal had to include Russell, he could see such a scenario happening. Otherwise, Beasley, McDaniels, Beverley and a bunch of picks.
- According to him and Shams Charania, not many teams at the table for Simmons right now
- Golden State not at the table as the Warriors like who they have in Kuminga and Wiseman
- Wolves see Simmons as Draymond Green, not as a PG
- Are the three max guys good enough to vault the team into contention (Simmons' attitude, Russell's ceiling, Towns' leadership). It's not a slam dunk, give up the farm type of scenario. But if you can back Morey into a corner the way the 76ers did the Wolves with Butler, you do that sort of package.
- Reason for wanting to keep Russell is because his shooting/scoring along with Towns and Edwards would allow Simmons to just play.
- His sources tell him Simmons is open to a Wolves move. But has yet to find out if he'd be willing to accept the role of PF.

I should probably mention Jonny K is a big Simmons fan, so while he’s plugged in, keep that in mind when evaluating this information.

I also wanted to add that for those putting Anthony Edwards in Wolves trade packages, Rosas went on the record when this whole thing began that KAT and Edwards were “off the table.” Things haven’t changed, and just a few days ago, Shams reinforced this.

The Timberwolves have been motivated to find a deal for Simmons but would likely require a third team given their asset pool of Malik Beasley, Jaden McDaniels and D’Angelo Russell might not entice the 76ers.

[Saberestar]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade...so I would say the Kings.

Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley and a lottery protected FRP for Ben Simmons. No Maxey involved.

If Maxey is added to the trade the Kings would need to send another FRP to the Sixers.

[Texas Chuck]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade

Cmon now man.

[Godaddycurse]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade...so I would say the Kings.

Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley and a lottery protected FRP for Ben Simmons. No Maxey involved.

If Maxey is added to the trade the Kings would need to send another FRP to the Sixers.

What kind of winning have Hield accomplished in his career..?

[OutsidetheNBA]

Sacramento isn’t willing to offer Haliburton or fox at this time. These teams are just going as low as they can to get Simmons. The Lastest offers seem to just be Bagley and Hield Plus picks.

I’m not sure what Sac is thinking either to be honest. The Fox, Mitchell, Holmes, Simmons line-up is virtually unplayable in the modern NBA. None of them are plus 3 point shooters and only Holmes has a high free throw percentage.

If you are going to add Ben, one of Fox or Mitchell has to be included and you will want to keep Buddy who becomes more valuable.

Ben for Fox makes way to much sense. I understand if Sac feels they need something added to it just for looks wise from the outside.
Hali
Buddy
Barnes
Simmons
Holmes

Is a hell of a place to start though. With Mitchell coming off the bench

Yeah I think a Fox - Simmons swap is a great starting point for both teams. But Fox has a lot more value than Simmons at the moment and Sacramento (like any of the other handful of teams looking at Simmons) has a lot of leverage.

I think Philly has to add a good (not great) asset to balance value. Maxey or Thybulle or a pick or something similar.

[Bowdystuda]

I’m pretty sure you’re saying that as a Warriors fan, you wouldn’t do that deal, right?

Oh yeah that offer is not close.

I think GSW offers Wiggins, Kuminga, 2022 1st for Simmons. There will probably be better offers on the table from Sac & MIN but it will come down to how stubborn Simmons is for his preferred destinations.

If you can get Simmons for Wiggens, Kuminga and a super late 1st round pick, you do it for sure. I just dont think Philly bites on that. Wiggens was better last year, but with the contract, he is not a great asset. Kuminga is a recent top 10 pick with potential.

But if you are Philly, from my trade I did, do you take Van Vleet 20/6/4 to run point and Bagley (high draft pick with potential) who can slide into the 4 Or do you go Wiggens, who probably wont start unless Tobias plays the 4, Kuminga and late 1st?

Philly is looking for win now players and will need a PG if Simmons is traded. That deal wont get it done unless there is other teams involved. Sacramento has better chance to do deal outright if they include PG Haliburton or Fox as Philly will need a PG in any trade.

[Bornstellar]

When did Buddy Hield become so overrated? He's basically a modest man's Bryn Forbes

[Slim Charless]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade...so I would say the Kings.

Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley and a lottery protected FRP for Ben Simmons. No Maxey involved.

If Maxey is added to the trade the Kings would need to send another FRP to the Sixers.

What kind of winning have Hield accomplished in his career..?

I agree. Sacramento makes sense but straight up for Fox. Win win for both sides.

[babyjax13]

Beasley prince McDaniel and pick is not going to do it either. Prince and McDaniel are more like fillers and may not even crack the 10 man Sixers rotation.

Well that would be too bad for Philly. What they thought/hoped would be available for Simmons clearly is not, or he would have been moved already. I do like the modification by Wolveswin:

Philly trades: Ben Simmons
Philly receives: Malik Beasley, Christian Wood
Get two 20ppg players that were on bad teams. As long as one isn't vaporware that is an okay return, even if the fit is not perfect with Wood.

Houston trades: Christian Wood
Houston receives: Jaden McDaniels, Taurean Prince, 2022 MIN 1st
Turn Wood into assets.

Minnesota trades: Malik Beasley, Taurean Prince, Jaden McDaniels, 2022 1st
Minnesota receives: Ben Simmons
Simmons is a nice fit here, has personal connections, etc.

You have to keep in mind that Philly ideally needs a playmaking and defensive PG or SG or SF back for Simmons so that Curry can start. The player needs to add to what this group lacks Curry, Green/Thybulle, Harris, Embiid

They at least need a playmaker. If they get a player like McCollum then Curry won't start, but that's workable. Ideally the non-defensive playmaker would be an SF.

I think they may need to resolve some of their needs in a subsequent trade. First, they have to focus on getting as much value as possible for Simmons.

[Sportfan73]

I’m not sure what Sac is thinking either to be honest. The Fox, Mitchell, Holmes, Simmons line-up is virtually unplayable in the modern NBA. None of them are plus 3 point shooters and only Holmes has a high free throw percentage.

If you are going to add Ben, one of Fox or Mitchell has to be included and you will want to keep Buddy who becomes more valuable.

Ben for Fox makes way to much sense. I understand if Sac feels they need something added to it just for looks wise from the outside.
Hali
Buddy
Barnes
Simmons
Holmes

Is a hell of a place to start though. With Mitchell coming off the bench

Yeah I think a Fox - Simmons swap is a great starting point for both teams. But Fox has a lot more value than Simmons at the moment and Sacramento (like any of the other handful of teams looking at Simmons) has a lot of leverage.

I think Philly has to add a good (not great) asset to balance value. Maxey or Thybulle or a pick or something similar.

Yeah I think they should just get down to business and figure it out. At this point I’d be down with like shake and a pick or something along those lines

[zimpy27]

Well that would be too bad for Philly. What they thought/hoped would be available for Simmons clearly is not, or he would have been moved already. I do like the modification by Wolveswin:

Philly trades: Ben Simmons
Philly receives: Malik Beasley, Christian Wood
Get two 20ppg players that were on bad teams. As long as one isn't vaporware that is an okay return, even if the fit is not perfect with Wood.

Houston trades: Christian Wood
Houston receives: Jaden McDaniels, Taurean Prince, 2022 MIN 1st
Turn Wood into assets.

Minnesota trades: Malik Beasley, Taurean Prince, Jaden McDaniels, 2022 1st
Minnesota receives: Ben Simmons
Simmons is a nice fit here, has personal connections, etc.

You have to keep in mind that Philly ideally needs a playmaking and defensive PG or SG or SF back for Simmons so that Curry can start. The player needs to add to what this group lacks Curry, Green/Thybulle, Harris, Embiid

They at least need a playmaker. If they get a player like McCollum then Curry won't start, but that's workable. Ideally the non-defensive playmaker would be an SF.

I think they may need to resolve some of their needs in a subsequent trade. First, they have to focus on getting as much value as possible for Simmons.

That's a good strategy but I think a riskier one. They probably take that prior to training camp but right now they are looking to make that trade all at once. That will probably mean a 3rd team is needed.

These guys are possibly attainable and fit the Philly need of playmaking in a spot that allows them to start Curry:
Fox, DDR, Lowry, Schroder, Dejounte, LeVert, Rubio

[Slim Charless]

There isn’t a star available right now. That’s why picks are important to Morey, they are currency that can be flipped at anytime when one becomes available. In a rebuild trade, teams generally prefer picks to even young players (like the warriors packages).

I do agree that maybe it’s a three team where some of that draft compensation gets flipped now for a Brogdon, Dejounte Murray, etc, I’m just not even sure any of those guys are available.

Of the teams in the Simmons sweepstakes, Minnesota probably does win the - we offer the best return for a 2022 first round pick - debate. That being said I think it's highly unlikely Minnesota offers anything more than a 2022 unprotected first and maybe a 2023 swap.

Rosas is not exactly on firm ground with two rough seasons and new owners. There's a decent chance he's fired next summer if next year goes south. That being said, I highly doubt Taylor, Marc and Arod will let him trade first round picks out into the future. If he's fired, it will be tough to land a new POBO with no first round picks, no cap space and stars who can't seem to make the playoffs. No one of note will take the job.

I could easily see Rosas offering multiple first round picks and Taylor vetoing the trade.

I see truth in that argument. But Rosas side of the pitch is we don’t “need” late to real late 1st round picks…we have 4 pillars, 3 with big contracts and Edwards will need to get paid soon enough. 2nd round draft picks will be their friends (in this scenario).

This is the exact reason why I don't see Minny making this happen. Why would Philly trade Simmons for a bunch of picks in the mid to late 20s? They wouldn't. The Kings are the best fit, also Portland depending on how that situation goes.

[zimpy27]

I think LeVert is an interesting option since he can play SG/SF, adds playmaking and is working on defense (not great right now).
Curry, Green, LeVert, Harris, Embiid -- Maxey, Thybulle, Korkmaz, Reed, Drummond

I think Indy would have to give a bit more but it could be a starting piece.

[Sactowndog]

The Kings make the most sense, in my opinion.

Simmons’ playoff issues shouldn’t matter as much to a team that could break the record for consecutive lottery seasons. Simmons would probably get them to the playoffs, and that should be enough for the moment.

They have scoring, They need defense.

They have point guards to trade; the Sixers would need a PG coming back.

Simmons said he wanted to play in California (although he probably wasn’t talking about Sacramento). The Sixers would probably prefer to send Simmons west.

Simmons is a name player who would probably sell some tickets.

Specifically they need wing defense in a conference with LeBron, Leonard, Booker, Zion and Luka. Three of those are in division and we shall see what happens with Kuminga. You either need a wing to match or a wing that can shut them down.

[Saberestar]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade

Cmon now man.

Who they are probably getting better than Hield?
McCollum is not traded. Tell me a name.

[Saberestar]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade...so I would say the Kings.

Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley and a lottery protected FRP for Ben Simmons. No Maxey involved.

If Maxey is added to the trade the Kings would need to send another FRP to the Sixers.

What kind of winning have Hield accomplished in his career..?

Hield is a great scorer and in his prime. Bagley is a good young player with untapped potential. Add a pick and I think that is a solid package for Simmons at his salary.

[the_process]

After the 27th this deal works:

CLE gets Beasley
MIN gets Simmons
PHI gets Rubio, McDaniels, Prince, 22 and 24 swap rights w/ MIN, 23 and 25 MIN unprotected 1sts


I would be okay with that for Philadelphia.

[Saberestar]

The Sixers are in a win-now Mode and Buddy Hield is probably the best player that they can get in any trade...so I would say the Kings.

Buddy Hield, Marvin Bagley and a lottery protected FRP for Ben Simmons. No Maxey involved.

If Maxey is added to the trade the Kings would need to send another FRP to the Sixers.

What kind of winning have Hield accomplished in his career..?

I agree. Sacramento makes sense but straight up for Fox. Win win for both sides.

Fox is on another tier as a player and not disgruntled. No way Fox is traded for Simmons.

[pacers33granger]

What kind of winning have Hield accomplished in his career..?

I agree. Sacramento makes sense but straight up for Fox. Win win for both sides.

Fox is on another tier as a player and not disgruntled. No way Fox is traded for Simmons.

Hasn't Buddy been "disgruntled" for a few years now?

[the_process]

I think Philly is going to be choosing between two packages that aren't great, but the players fit well enough.

1. Portland:
CJ McCollum + Robert Covington
Portland really does not have picks they can trade. Philly would need to include some salary to balance.

2. Minnesota:
Malik Beasley + Taurean Prince + Jaden McDaniels + 2022 MIN 1st

His value has tanked, Philly has no leverage, and Simmons fits great on a few rosters, but on others he just doesn't.

If this is the case… I could see the situation getting a whole lot uglier before any resolution is reached.