Ben Simmons Thread (READ FIRST POST)

[moonpie]

I don't see it. The trade is to unite them not swap them.

Is making D'Lo happy really a concern of ours? He's only here because we wanted to keep Towns happy. I don't think we can keep just trading for players that get along off the court so they can play together on our dime.

If KAT gives his blessing, I have no issues trading D'Lo.

I would argue that a big part of why Ben wants to/is open to playing here is because we have DLO. They are super tight from their days as HS teammates and definitely want to play together. I don't see D'angelo going out in any Simmons deal

[KGdaBom]

I don't see it. The trade is to unite them not swap them.

Is making D'Lo happy really a concern of ours? He's only here because we wanted to keep Towns happy. I don't think we can keep just trading for players that get along off the court so they can play together on our dime.

If KAT gives his blessing, I have no issues trading D'Lo.

It's not about making DLo happy at all. It's about not pissing off KAT and Simmons. If you instantly create ill will with a player you traded for and your long time star it's not worth it whatsoever. Simmons won't be on board with coming here if Russell is part of a swap for him.

[KGdaBom]

I don't see it. The trade is to unite them not swap them.

Is making D'Lo happy really a concern of ours? He's only here because we wanted to keep Towns happy. I don't think we can keep just trading for players that get along off the court so they can play together on our dime.

If KAT gives his blessing, I have no issues trading D'Lo.

I would argue that a big part of why Ben wants to play here is because we have DLO. They are super tight from their days as HS teammates and definitely want to play together. I don't see D'angelo going out in any Simmons deal

Eggzactly.

[SO_MONEY]

It’s not about DLo. It’s about Rosas.

About 16 months ago, Rosas let it be known he was really interested in getting Russell. He had the famous helicopter ride to try to sign him as a free agent, and by the trade deadline, it became clear he still wanted him. NBA fans everywhere said, “Rosas is desperate to get DLo, GSW has all the leverage, so they are going to get Covington (a perfect fit for the Warriors) and picks!”

Rosas didn’t do what everyone said. As I predicted (.. he bragged!), Rosas highly prioritizes flexibility. Instead of adding a third max deal, he included Wiggins’ max deal in the trade

I think there are similarities with Simmons. I agree with Klomp - Rosas refused to put Russell off limits, and Krawzinski has said that if push came to shove, he’d trade him. DLo and a 1st is my prediction.

Mark my words if we trade DLo for Simmons, we will never get a PG worth anything in time and it will ultimately destroy the team as constructed... at a loss of both value and time. Just build around ANT if you are doing this, because it is going to happen anyways.

So, if, big if we are to trade DLo, we need to get Maxey back at minimum, perhaps even Springer....that position cannot go unresolved, Simmons cannot be our PG to have any real success. And even that could backfire...if neither Maxey or Springer are starting caliber.

[Klomp]

It’s not about DLo. It’s about Rosas.

About 16 months ago, Rosas let it be known he was really interested in getting Russell. He had the famous helicopter ride to try to sign him as a free agent, and by the trade deadline, it became clear he still wanted him. NBA fans everywhere said, “Rosas is desperate to get DLo, GSW has all the leverage, so they are going to get Covington (a perfect fit for the Warriors) and picks!”

Rosas didn’t do what everyone said. As I predicted (.. he bragged!), Rosas highly prioritizes flexibility. Instead of adding a third max deal, he included Wiggins’ max deal in the trade

I think there are similarities with Simmons. I agree with Klomp - Rosas refused to put Russell off limits, and Krawzinski has said that if push came to shove, he’d trade him. DLo and a 1st is my prediction.

I would also say to counter you that Russell being such an integral addition may make it less likely that he would include him in a trade, even for someone like Simmons. This is very different from the Culver situation...this one hasn't even really had an opportunity to fail.

[Klomp]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

[Macwolf527]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I don’t think the Timberwolves do the Simmons trade if they have to include Russell. With that said, I anticipate Russell will start to be more in line with being the shooting guard, from a defensive perspective. The Wolves offense does not operate with a typical PG. You saw pretty much anyone who could dribble advance the ball up the floor once Finch took over.

It appears this off-season that DLo is really focusing on getting stronger adding muscle mass. That’s what leads me to believe he’s going to operate more as a SG defensively. Next, looking at the type of players they brought in on the 2W and Exhibit-10 contracts in Wright and Miller, both who are strong on-ball defenders. Then the trade for Beverly and bringing Bolmaro over from Europe, again strong on-ball defenders, particularly at the point of attack. The goal is obviously to put more pressure on the oppositions PG, which is not Russell strong suit.

Back to Simmons. He would not be brought over to be the PG in the classic sense, but as probably the 2nd best rebounder in the Wolves starting five, he would be expected to lead the break on most occasions. I would toss positions out the door when classifying how Finch intends to use players. I don’t think it matters with him, especially on the offensive side of the ball.

[SO_MONEY]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I didn't say it would be. I said "if". But the other half of it is that it leaves a giant whole at PG, we probably wouldn't be able to fill sufficiently before the team implodes due to the frustration of being limited/capped. I don't believe such a deal is advisable. Just build around ANT...it is where we are headed.

[Merc_Porto]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

[Mattya]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

The problem comes if he is your only player who can breakdown a defense from the perimeter and get into the paint. The Sixers just stall out and expect guys who spot up or slash off of rotation to start creating more offense when defenses sag off Simmons. That wouldn’t be an issue here tho.

[Merc_Porto]

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

The problem comes if he is your only player who can breakdown a defense from the perimeter and get into the paint. The Sixers just stall out and expect guys who spot up or slash off of rotation to start creating more offense when defenses sag off Simmons. That wouldn’t be an issue here tho.

But he's not. We have Ant to breakdown a defense from the perimeter and we also have KAT that occupies different zones of the court than Embiid that lives and dies inside the paint and that would allow Ben to play inside way more times.

And btw, Russell is not a guy that is going to breakdown a defense from the perimeter either since he's so afraid to attack the paint.
So, I don't see a valid reason to be afraid of playing Ben as a point guard.

[SO_MONEY]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

You can't play Simmons on the perimeter.

[Mattya]

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

The problem comes if he is your only player who can breakdown a defense from the perimeter and get into the paint. The Sixers just stall out and expect guys who spot up or slash off of rotation to start creating more offense when defenses sag off Simmons. That wouldn’t be an issue here tho.

But he's not. We have Ant to breakdown a defense from the perimeter and we also have KAT that occupies different zones of the court than Embiid that lives and dies inside the paint and that would allow Ben to play inside way more times.

And btw, Russell is not a guy that is going to breakdown a defense from the perimeter either since he's so afraid to attack the paint.
So, I don't see a valid reason to be afraid of playing Ben as a point guard.

It is almost like you didn’t read my post.

[jpatrick]

Shrink I get you don't like DLo, I am not a big fan either, but a big "heck no" to bringing Simmons to this team as a PG, no, no, no. If that is the plan I want assets for taking him back.

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

Because Simmons has no ability to initiate the offense in the half court. None. He can be a phenomenal passer out of the post or off cuts, but he can’t run pick and roll. Can’t break down his man on the perimeter efficiently. It’s just not his best role. And Ant can do a lot of those things, but you don’t want him orchestrating the offense yet. Telling everyone where to go and what to do. He’s just not there.

Finch has said Saunders offense with several play calls doesn’t work. He wants the players to just play and have a free flowing game. You need someone other than a 20 year old SG to orchestrate that.

I’m not a huge DLo fan, but this trade works a lot better if he stays. Although I know the money will get tight and DLo isn’t worth his own contract.

[Merc_Porto]

Just because Russell would be outgoing doesn't mean Simmons would be coming here to play PG.

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

You can't play Simmons on the perimeter.

Of course, you can.
With 4 others guys that can shoot the ball you can.
He would be a point forward or point guard... Depending on how the other team would defend him.

Ben could be your point guard or your center. At any of those positions, we are talking about an elite passer and an elite finisher at the rim.

[shrink]

Is making D'Lo happy really a concern of ours? He's only here because we wanted to keep Towns happy. I don't think we can keep just trading for players that get along off the court so they can play together on our dime.

If KAT gives his blessing, I have no issues trading D'Lo.

I would argue that a big part of why Ben wants to play here is because we have DLO. They are super tight from their days as HS teammates and definitely want to play together. I don't see D'angelo going out in any Simmons deal

Eggzactly.

You guys are aware that Simmons and KAT are tight too, right?

It’s rumored that Ben didn’t get a suspension after the Embiid-KAT tussle because Towns personally went to the NBA front office to ask that Ben not be punished.

I hear that people put value on the KAT-DLo relationship. I would add Booker in here as well. However, I haven’t heard either Simmons or DLo say they wanted to play together. I think Simmons is one player that KAT would accept in a DLo trade - a close friend that can help him win. And KAT really wants to win, to change what people say about him.

[moonpie]

I'm not saying KAT and Ben aren't tight either. I'm saying that I believe their preference is to team up together (that is KAT, DLO, and Ben)

[Merc_Porto]

It is almost like you didn’t read my post.

I read it.

[shrink]

I still don't see the problem of having Simmons playing PG.
Is like, Ben as PG is better than Russell at everything except shooting the ball...

This idea of being scared of playing Ben as PG comes from where? I don't get it and nobody explained yet

And once again, playing Ben with KAT is completely different from playing Ben with Embiid.

You can't play Simmons on the perimeter.

Of course, you can.
With 4 others guys that can shoot the ball you can.
He would be a point forward or point guard... Depending on how the other team would defend him.

Ben could be your point guard or your center. At any of those positions, we are talking about an elite passer and an elite finisher at the rim.

If you put Simmons on the perimeter, opposing coaches get to have his defending big sag off back towards the basket.

This reduces the space for Ant drives, and it reduces the match up advantage KAT provides.

[shrink]

I'm not saying KAT and Ben aren't tight either. I'm saying that I believe their preference is to team up together (that is KAT, DLO, and Ben)

I think we agree. The preference is to have all three, but some of that could be lip service to keep DLo happy.

But I think when it comes down to a practical trade, it will end up being DLo if Simmons is traded here.