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OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#161 » by moocow007 » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:20 pm

Gravy wrote:
moocow007 wrote:
I'm having this debate with another poster in the wiretap thread. That poster said that Frank had numerous 15 point games and even some much higher ones this past season. He did not. But to surprisingly a lot of people they seem to want to believe he has.


I remember arguing with someone who said the Knicks never gave Frank a chance to start any games. I showed him a pic of the stats with all the games he started. He says the chart was all lies... Its so strange, its like a qanon delusion.


:lol:

Yeah. I literally went to the game by game log and counted the number of times he scored 10 or more points and the number of times he scored 2 or less points each season. And the 2nd number was always higher than the first...and not even by a close margin. I get that a lot of folks had this image of him and that he comes off as a very humble and likeable guy (and fans like to rally around guys like that vs. the arrogant loud mouthed pro athletes that we see often). I get it. But at some point folks need to see things as what it is not what they want it to be or have convinced themselves is.

Frank as an NBA caliber PG. Frank as an elite NBA defender. Frank as a beast. All of that stuff has shown absolutely no basis in reality. Can he? Sure. Knox also can. Every other prospect that hasn't can also. But that's not reality. That's a hope and a prayer and wishing for the best. Great. But it rarely turns out to be the way you wish it to be (the sad reality of life).

What Frank has shown is that he appears to be a good guy with good character that is at least a real good wing defender and MAY be able to spot shoot (yes he shot real real well from 3 last season but he took only 48 3's total) but who simply cannot create shots off the dribble nor run the point at least not at the NBA level. The inability to create off the dribble or run the point pretty much disqualifies you from being an NBA PG...ya know. To imply that he could do all those things but wasn't allowed to by the 4 different coaching staffs is just silly...it really is.

What he is is a very good defensive wing that in limited shots has shown that he can spot up 3s but that really doesn't carry any offensive game otherwise (he shot an almost impossible to achieve for NBA caliber player just 19% from 2 point range this past season). If he can stay healthy I'm sure he can find a role on some teams bench but as a starter? As a PG? As a "beast"? Not likely at all.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#162 » by Appleshampoo » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:26 pm

What made Frank Frank was having a 15 point game followed by a 5 point game followed by 2-weeks out with a hamstring injury.

I still wanted him to start Game 2 and keep Rose 6th man. He'll have no choice but to embrace off ball playing with Luka and that should help him.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#163 » by Gravy » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:28 pm

Are We Ther Yet wrote:Don't even care. Nearly died on this hill but...I am over it now. Good luck in the future. Next man up... McBride.

Your ears must have been burning. :lol: Dont do this to Mcbride to too!
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#164 » by robillionaire » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:30 pm

moocow007 wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
moocow007 wrote:On Mudiay, Frank and the whole playing time needed for development thing...

Mudiay was 21 when the Knicks traded for him. That is 2 years younger than Frank is right now and at about the same age that you guys are implying are critical development years for young players. So...I'm not getting the argument that giving minutes to Mudiay being an example of the Knicks not trying to develop young players by giving them playing time. Maybe the Knicks view was that Frank just wasn't worth investing in and that in part is why they traded for Mudiay and attempted to give him the playing time that some are saying should have gone to Frank. Mudiay wasn't some veteran hired gun. Just want to make sure folk realize that.


This is about "not trying to develop young players". It's about "not trying to develop Frank", in particular. This is exactly the problem I'm referring to when you bring in a different coaching staff/front office personnel each year. No consistent vision in how we were going to develop him. We just bounced around from PG to PG. He kept falling through the cracks. I can't wait to see him blossom in the next 2-3 years. He's going to be a beast.


But why would the Knicks be willing to develop every other young player but not Frank? Because they don't like the French? Because they want to develop ISO players only? Did he fall through the cracks or was he just not worth developing?

That 4 head coach argument? What it tells me is that 4 different basketball coaches didn't feel Frank was worth developing or using or pushing.

My problem is what you are saying implies some sort of intentional effort to keep Frank down while simultaneously working to prop the other young players up.

Why would they do this?

Not saying it would be beneath them to do this, but it doesn't make sense when folks use this type of argument. Now if Frank actually showed flashes that he was an NBA caliber PG worth developing then sure. But he really hasn't.

Should we also do the same for Knox?

I'm having this debate with another poster in the wiretap thread. That poster said that Frank had numerous 15 point games and even some much higher ones this past season. He did not. But to surprisingly a lot of people they seem to want to believe he has.

He's like Dante Exum...remember him?

Came into that draft as another "golden goose" (slash) "unicorn" type prospect (tall athletic PG). Then folks realized that Exum (who BTW was not drafted by some half baked front office mind you but widely considered one of the "model" franchises in terms of development) just wasn't an NBA caliber PG and that he couldn't be developed into one. And Exum just got picked up off of the scrap heap as well.


This is true but Exum got drafted in 2014 and he's somehow still getting jobs in the NBA so I guess that means there's hope for Frank to be around another 4 more years chugging along at 5ppg as well just based on the allure of being a former lottery pick like Exum has by teams hoping to find a lottery ticket. Not much different from the knicks bringing in top 10 picks like Hezonja or Mudiay or Jennings or Vonleh or Derrick Williams except all those guys were much better than Frank and they're all out of the NBA now like Frank will be by next summer
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#165 » by HarthorneWingo » Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:35 pm

We’ll see who laughs last. I’ve written down all of your names. Frank Hive never forgets.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#166 » by Jalen Bluntson » Fri Sep 17, 2021 9:05 pm

Gravy wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:Don't even care. Nearly died on this hill but...I am over it now. Good luck in the future. Next man up... McBride.

Your ears must have been burning. :lol: Dont do this to Mcbride to too!


I don't have anything to hide. I loved the kids defense and wanted him to get a consistent 3pt shot...improve on offense. He did but...too little too late. The injuries that kept happening every time he had a chance to shine are what really made me wanna move on. Maybe he puts it together elsewhere. Maybe not. I don't care anymore and haven't for a while.

The haters are sure gonna miss him though. They're the ones who would bring him up constantly. Even when he wasn't playing. :lol:
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#167 » by seren » Fri Sep 17, 2021 9:14 pm

HarthorneWingo wrote:We’ll see who laughs last. I’ve written down all of your names. Frank Hive never forgets.


:lol:
Love this
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#168 » by Sark » Fri Sep 17, 2021 9:28 pm

Kevin Knox and Mitchell Robinson, next year to the Mavs confirmed.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#169 » by HarthorneWingo » Fri Sep 17, 2021 9:57 pm

Is there any way on this forum to block certain thread topics? :lol: I can’t do this anymore. :cry:
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#170 » by Clyde_Style » Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:25 pm

Frank is now the biggest real estate tycoon in the NBA the way he lives rent free in some of your heads
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#171 » by Capn'O » Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:55 pm

Sark wrote:Kevin Knox next year to the Mavs confirmed


:rock:

and Mitchell Robinson, next year to the Mavs confirmed


:cry:
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#172 » by Capn'O » Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:55 pm

HarthorneWingo wrote:Is there any way on this forum to block certain thread topics? :lol: I can’t do this anymore. :cry:


After this thread Frank talk is only allowed in the Around the NBA thread.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#173 » by Chanel Bomber » Fri Sep 17, 2021 11:07 pm

It's only a discussion. We're all willingly participating in this thread, from the positive to the negative. Some of those who were most expressive in promoting Frank just ran out of arguments, as Frank showed 0 signs of progress and had one foot out of the league before signing with Dallas 10 days before training camp, so the only thing left to do is to blame other posters for posting.

What I never understood is those saying people are "obsessed with Frank". It paints people as irrational or creepy, and it looks like an attempt to discourage them from posting. Actually, maybe I understand the logic behind it, I just find it nasty. Not that I'm perfect.

Frank was a wasted lottery pick, who just got released by the Knicks after being a hot topic of conversation for 4 years. He matters, and discussing what led to this failure is interesting, because we can learn from it.

It leads to relevant conversations about James Dolan (who only fired Phil after the draft), or about developing players in roles that they are not suited for, seeing the value of certain players in specific areas through advanced stats (eg Frank shooting well in catch-and-shoot situations), or tracking development (Frank getting worse on defense, him becoming a better 3-point shooter) and managing expectations. I think the last part is key for us as fans - and Frank should serve as a cautionary tale.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#174 » by ITGM » Sat Sep 18, 2021 2:42 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:We’ll see who laughs last. I’ve written down all of your names. Frank Hive never forgets.


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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#175 » by Clyde_Style » Sat Sep 18, 2021 3:07 am

Capn'O wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:Is there any way on this forum to block certain thread topics? :lol: I can’t do this anymore. :cry:


After this thread Frank talk is only allowed in the Around the NBA thread.


How about the OT: French Cuisine and Garnishes thread?
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#176 » by Capn'O » Sat Sep 18, 2021 4:34 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:Is there any way on this forum to block certain thread topics? :lol: I can’t do this anymore. :cry:


After this thread Frank talk is only allowed in the Around the NBA thread.


How about the OT: French Cuisine and Garnishes thread?


Constantly wilin'
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#177 » by Rasho Brezec » Sat Sep 18, 2021 10:39 am

9 pages. Y'all need help.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#178 » by Guano » Sat Sep 18, 2021 1:52 pm

HarthorneWingo wrote:We’ll see who laughs last. I’ve written down all of your names. Frank Hive never forgets.


having to write things down to not forget - getting old must really suck.
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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#179 » by robillionaire » Sat Sep 18, 2021 2:07 pm

Capn'O wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:Is there any way on this forum to block certain thread topics? :lol: I can’t do this anymore. :cry:


After this thread Frank talk is only allowed in the Around the NBA thread.


“After this thread”

I thought this was the eternal Frank thread, you know the containment zone, because it’s going to 100, and we aren’t just talking about 1 thread, Lebron tell them how many parts this thread is going to have

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Re: OT: Frank Ntilikina to the mavs!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Post#180 » by nedleeds » Sat Sep 18, 2021 3:12 pm

Maybe Frank can get his groin right in Dallas.
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