Ben Simmons trades go here (and here only): Expect warnings if not following forum rules

[wolves_89]

Morey's plan for Simmons this off-season seems pretty clear.

Option 1 - trade Simmons for Lillard or Beal. Since those players weren't available at the start of the off-season, Morey called around making ridiculous trade proposals so that he could say he was trying to move Ben (when he really wasn't). The hope was that one of those guys would ask out at some point before training camp. Unfortunately this hope never happened.

Option 2 - try to get Simmons to come back and play until Lillard/Beal (or a similar caliber player) become available. This would let the Sixers rack up wins and could possibly improve Simmons trade value. Simmons doesn't seem remotely interested in making this option workable. The most recent Woj rumor seems to be the final nail in the Simmons returns option.

Option 3 - I think there are two paths here and I'm unsure of which Morey will take. The first would be to move Simmons for the best value he can get in the next few weeks (some useful players and some picks for a later deal). The second option is to let the situation drag on and pray that something happens that will improve Morey's position. The danger is that this could backfire even further in terms of team disfunction coupled with a continued decline in Simmons trade value.

I'll be fascinated to see how this plays out. Thibs tried a fairly similar approach to what Morey is doing (with Butler) and got badly burned, it will be interesting to see if Morey follows the path to a similar conclusion.

[BullyKing]

Man that would be an exciting group. Wonder how this would stack up against the Warriors best package, specifically in terms of DeRozan vs Wiggins

DeRozan, white and a late 1st has absolutely no value whatsoever so any team can stack up against this ridiculous offer.

You think Sixers would value Wiggins more or DeRozan more? I agree many teams could and should offer better than this

I doubt they would value either, they are just there for salary purposes. The problem for both teams is they aren't even neutral salary filler so you'd need some assets just to get to square one before you start bidding for Simmons.

[eminence]

What young assets would GS need to add to this basic premise?

GS IN: Simmons

PHI IN: Murray, Young

SA IN: Wiggins

PHI gets a starting level guard and another good depth piece + ??? picks, SA gets ??? young players, GS gets the young star hopefully pushing them over the top.

*I can also see SA preferring to stay more relevant and just dealing with PHI directly.

[Texas Chuck]

It certainly doesn't help.

I don't think Woj's tweet today changes anything. If Simmons was open to playing with the Sixers, then its not that his trade value goes up, its that they simply don't trade him.

Everyone has known where Simmons stands for a long time now. If I was running a team where he made sense, this would just spur me to make my final serious offer. Obviously they will trade him if they get a real offer, so if you want him, just make one. But thinking they are going to take your crappy players who don't fit just because he's not showing up to camp isn't something I expect real GM's to believe.

I think it's different. We've had rumblings of guys planning to not show up and we've had threats that turned out to be empty. This might be the first time i've actually heard credibly (from Woj/Shams) that a player wont show up for training camp and actually believed it.

If Simmons is truly adamant about not wearing a Sixers jersey again, something i thought was just an empty threat like we hear all the time, the most recent being Harden's camp saying he wouldnt show up in Houston, then i cant imagine how it doesnt effect the Sixers negotiation stance.

Of course it effects their stance. If he was coming back to the team they wouldn't trade him. But if the best offer is like most of the stuff itt that doesn't make sense value or basketball wise then you just sit on him. You are still good enough to make the playoffs without him and its not your obligation to just give him away when he's got 4 years left on his deal.

And he remains a very good basketball player. And it only takes one smart team to realize that and say let me make an offer I can live with, but that the Sixers could realistically accept. And that's not Wall and a 1st. Or Buddy Hield and Marvin Bagley and a first. Or asking the Sixers to add Seth Curry to get CJ or whatever else.

He's an odd fit on Dallas with Luka, but if other teams really see this situation like posters here do I sure hope Harrison is calling up and saying take your pick of our players save Luka and here are some unprotected 1sts and let's go. You want THJ, Kleber, Dorian, Brunson, 2 unp 1sts, and a swap or two? Sure. I'd not start my offer by like well you gotta take Powell and then let me protect this one pick and well you got no choice. That's not how this works.

[eminence]

I kinda like the THJ/DFS/Brunson+picks offer from Dallas (I think I'd avoid taking Kleber who I don't see having a big spot in their rotation and duck the luxury tax instead were I Philly).

[bondom34]

No idea how this ultimately plays out, but given this is pretty much the Sixers last real shot to put a 2nd major player with Embiid, the Sixers having to trade Simmons for nothing I'm not entirely sure works. Because if the ultimate goal is that (or similar), then options are:

1. Trade Simmons for nothing and waste Embiid's prime.

2. Don't trade him yet, see what comes up. Possibly waste Embiid's prime, possibly not.

So I guess in the end, again no clue how this ends up but if the options are a bunch of bad trade returns I struggle seeing it happen just because the level of "wasting Embiid's prime" doesn't matter in the end, it's a simple yes/no situation.

[MasterIchiro]

My thing is, assuming the Sixers would need a replacement to run point guard, who is the PG returning in a Simmons trade? When it comes to matching his value at the position, the list is very very short imo.

So while Morey may want to take best offer, he needs a return that addresses starting point guard. So the number of teams able to field competitive bids is small.

I think the small supply of teams able to return a PG indicates a buyer's market for Simmons. Houston entering the bidding holding Wall as a negative asset is not a good omen for equal value return.

Morey is probably better off trading Simmons for best available player then shipping off Harris for someone like Wall.

[MasterIchiro]

That being said, who is the starting PG of the Sixers when camp starts?

[kuclas]

That being said, who is the starting PG of the Sixers when camp starts?

Maxey or Milton

[mademan]

I don't think Woj's tweet today changes anything. If Simmons was open to playing with the Sixers, then its not that his trade value goes up, its that they simply don't trade him.

Everyone has known where Simmons stands for a long time now. If I was running a team where he made sense, this would just spur me to make my final serious offer. Obviously they will trade him if they get a real offer, so if you want him, just make one. But thinking they are going to take your crappy players who don't fit just because he's not showing up to camp isn't something I expect real GM's to believe.

I think it's different. We've had rumblings of guys planning to not show up and we've had threats that turned out to be empty. This might be the first time i've actually heard credibly (from Woj/Shams) that a player wont show up for training camp and actually believed it.

If Simmons is truly adamant about not wearing a Sixers jersey again, something i thought was just an empty threat like we hear all the time, the most recent being Harden's camp saying he wouldnt show up in Houston, then i cant imagine how it doesnt effect the Sixers negotiation stance.

Of course it effects their stance. If he was coming back to the team they wouldn't trade him. But if the best offer is like most of the stuff itt that doesn't make sense value or basketball wise then you just sit on him. You are still good enough to make the playoffs without him and its not your obligation to just give him away when he's got 4 years left on his deal.

And he remains a very good basketball player. And it only takes one smart team to realize that and say let me make an offer I can live with, but that the Sixers could realistically accept. And that's not Wall and a 1st. Or Buddy Hield and Marvin Bagley and a first. Or asking the Sixers to add Seth Curry to get CJ or whatever else.

He's an odd fit on Dallas with Luka, but if other teams really see this situation like posters here do I sure hope Harrison is calling up and saying take your pick of our players save Luka and here are some unprotected 1sts and let's go. You want THJ, Kleber, Dorian, Brunson, 2 unp 1sts, and a swap or two? Sure. I'd not start my offer by like well you gotta take Powell and then let me protect this one pick and well you got no choice. That's not how this works.

Dont get me wrong, i dont think they should just give him away, but a pick package might end up being the best, most valuable offer, and i dont see it getting much better. Kings or Wolves giving up playable contracts like Hield/Beasley+ alongside multiple unprotected 1st's/swaps is the highest value the Sixers will get, imo. The problem for the Sixers is that theyre looking for win now talent and thats just not available atm.

[Texas Chuck]

I kinda like the THJ/DFS/Brunson+picks offer from Dallas (I think I'd avoid taking Kleber who I don't see having a big spot in their rotation and duck the luxury tax instead were I Philly).

For the record, I was just trying to make the point that everyone would be on the table. If they didn't want/value those players then I'm on the phone trying to swap them for something Philly prefers.



It's not a very good offer imo. Those Dallas players are solid but how much better than Maxey is Brunson? Do you play THJ over Curry? Dorian how much better than Green/Thybulle? I actually have Maxi upgrading Drummond/Niang as probably the biggest on court win. Brunson and DFS are UFA's next year which hurts their value

I'm just saying I'd make an actual serious offer, the best I could.

[Dr Positivity]

I'm sticking with McCollum/Simmons with Olshey in one year away from fired mode I have a hard time seeing him turn down that straight up trade just to try Lillard/McCollum again for however many years in a row

[doctor him]

That being said, who is the starting PG of the Sixers when camp starts?

Maxey or Milton

It'll be Maxey. Milton isn't a #1 guard.

I'm not sure who backs up Maxey.

[Celts17Pride]

My opinion is Morey overplayed his hand with an asset with diminishing value in Ben Simmons. The real time to move Simmons was before the NBA draft in my opinion. Morey kept asking for ridiculous returns and was turned away. Now Morey has put the Sixers in a really tough spot. Offers will be pennies on the dollar and Simmons most likely will sit out.

Question, if Ben Simmons is forced to play for the Sixers in order to get payed what kind of player are the Sixers going to get? Could see Simmons playing 30 minutes and putting up 4 ppg, 3 rpg and 4apg stats. Can't fine a player for playing poorly. Sixers need to find a solution in a hurry and move on.

Just my opinion.

[tidho]

That being said, who is the starting PG of the Sixers when camp starts?

Ricky Rubio

My opinion is Morey overplayed his hand with an asset with diminishing value in Ben Simmons. The real time to move Simmons was before the NBA draft in my opinion. Morey kept asking for ridiculous returns and was turned away. Now Morey has put the Sixers in a really tough spot. Offers will be pennies on the dollar and Simmons most likely will sit out.

Question, if Ben Simmons is forced to play for the Sixers in order to get payed what kind of player are the Sixers going to get? Could see Simmons playing 30 minutes and putting up 4 ppg, 3 rpg and 4apg stats. Can't fine a player for playing poorly. Sixers need to find a solution in a hurry.

Just my opinion.

100%

Even if PHI didn't specifically want rookies this year it would have been much easier to get veterans for picks that were about to be made than it is for future picks.

The worst case for PHI is if you get a Kevin Love version of him spending his night pedaling a stationery bike rather than on the court. PHI isn't so deep that they couldn't afford to do a two for one deal. They won't match Simmons' value in one player, but two good players worthy of an 8/9 man rotation still works.

[K_chile22]

I think he gets traded for a picks package and role players and Morey tries again next offseason to flip those picks+Philly picks for Lillard or something, maybe using one for a deadline deal. There's just no good players out there now who make sense

If they get enough picks it would surely be worth more than Ben if he actually does sit out all year/to the deadline

[arbsn]

At this point Philly's best bet is to do Fred Van Vleet, Dragic and Boucher for Simmons. They would still compete for a title and Toronto would get younger and have insane defense

[Roy The Natural]

I'm sticking with McCollum/Simmons with Olshey in one year away from fired mode I have a hard time seeing him turn down that straight up trade just to try Lillard/McCollum again for however many years in a row

CJ + RoCo still makes the most sense to me... But whatever.

[Roy The Natural]

I think he gets traded for a picks package and role players and Morey tries again next offseason to flip those picks+Philly picks for Lillard or something, maybe using one for a deadline deal. There's just no good players out there now who make sense

If they get enough picks it would surely be worth more than Ben if he actually does sit out all year/to the deadline

Debatable. Picks before the season has some inherent risk. Especially depending on the team. If he is traded for picks to a team like Minnesota and they look like a perennial playoff team after the trade.... Philly just lost a ton of value and pretty much any ability to get a better established player than Ben alone.

[Ruzious]

No idea how this ultimately plays out, but given this is pretty much the Sixers last real shot to put a 2nd major player with Embiid, the Sixers having to trade Simmons for nothing I'm not entirely sure works. Because if the ultimate goal is that (or similar), then options are:

1. Trade Simmons for nothing and waste Embiid's prime.

2. Don't trade him yet, see what comes up. Possibly waste Embiid's prime, possibly not.

So I guess in the end, again no clue how this ends up but if the options are a bunch of bad trade returns I struggle seeing it happen just because the level of "wasting Embiid's prime" doesn't matter in the end, it's a simple yes/no situation.

Philly's in a must-win situation now. They can't be focused on showing Simmons who's boss; they need to focus on being a championship contender. Not saying they should rush into a bad trade, but the longer they wait, the worse it'll get, and the more likely they end up settling for a mediocre option.