Patrick Williams out 4-6 weeks UPDATE since Sept 15

[WindyCityBorn]

Wonder who would get the starting nod if it came to it? Alize fits nicely with the starters, but not sure how his defense is against 4s.

They'll try out different combos for sure during preseason, but I think it'll end up being somebody more seasoned like Caruso or DJJ, with DeMar sliding to the 4 like he did most of last season in San Antonio.

Caruso gives you a bit more in terms of point of attack defense and shooting, but might be redundant with Ball also playing that role. With DJJ, you sacrifice a bit of shooting, but it'll be simpler to balance the rest of the rotations having Caruso come off the bench.

Either way, get ready for a 4-guard lineup!

We really don’t want Derozan playing a lot at the 4. We need a good defender next Vuc.

[coldfish]

Imo, they are going to tape the hell out of his ankle and have him on the floor for walkthroughs and shooting. What he misses in camp won’t be too terrible. Its not like he is in a coma.

[dougthonus]

Damn. Lauri got derailed his second season with an elbow injury...now PWill gets derailed. Damn when will fortune favor the bulls?

PWill is not derailed, he’s injured. It’s not the same thing.

Missing training camp and preseason in my mind is a derailment. PWill isn't a vet who doesn't need those things

Derailed is an outcome. The injury may or may not do so. It's obviously a risk for the reasons you stated. He is a young player that would benefit from these 4-6 weeks of camp. Especially since he missed it last year. At the same time, it's still just 4-6 weeks. He's hopefully been working real hard all summer and has already seen good progression from doing so.

I'll throw WCJ as another guy who was derailed by injuries early in the off-season for multiple years. I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually becomes a better player (and I think Lauri did as well in his final season even though he didn't hit the star levels people once hoped for) due to finally catching up on improvements by being healthy (assuming he is, which I do not follow him anymore).

I do think it matters when you are hurt in the off-season as a young guy as this is often the time you can work on your game the most. Coby White is in a similar boat for the Bulls as well (and worse, because he missed way more time).

[fleet]

Imo, they are going to tape the hell out of his ankle and have him on the floor for walkthroughs and shooting. What he misses in camp won’t be too terrible. Its not like he is in a coma.

I got my medical degree from watching doctor shows on TV, but getting a player with a *high ankle sprain up on his feet with tape ASAP seems like setting back a proper and quick recovery.

* I have no idea what kind of sprain he has. A high ankle sprain seems likely given the projected down time and initial “severe” diagnosis on the internets.

[FranchisePlayer]

IMO it's not an overreaction but understandabe. A designated starter out and no real PF behind him to take his minutes. Anyone saying this is not a big deal is in denial.

He's your 5th best starter and probably even lower on the pecking order presently in terms of his impact on the game. His recovery timetable is such that he may not even miss a single regular season game.

If you want to think it's a big deal then be my guest. Based on his role, if he were to miss 30 games then I'd probably be there with you, but he may literally miss zero at this point. The 6 week timeframe has him missing four games. Until we see this drag into significant real time missed, it isn't that big a deal. Even if he does miss significant time, at best he's the 5th most important guy on the team. Teams lose guys like that and manage.

Ironic to say the least: people telling in the appreciation thread good riddance to Markkanen for being injury prone and now his replacement injures himself even without any contact.

Who will replace Williams?

[coldfish]

Imo, they are going to tape the hell out of his ankle and have him on the floor for walkthroughs and shooting. What he misses in camp won’t be too terrible. Its not like he is in a coma.

I got my medical degree from watching doctor shows on TV, but getting a player with a *high ankle sprain up on his feet with tape ASAP seems like setting back a proper and quick recovery.

* I have no idea what kind of sprain he has. A high ankle sprain seems likely given the projected down time and initial “severe” diagnosis on the internets.

I got mine from the school of hard knocks. First game is Oct 20 or 5 weeks after the 4-6 week estimate. Someone walking on an ankle with support weeks after a sprain isn’t super high risk.

[DuckIII]

IMO it's not an overreaction but understandabe. A designated starter out and no real PF behind him to take his minutes. Anyone saying this is not a big deal is in denial.

He's your 5th best starter and probably even lower on the pecking order presently in terms of his impact on the game. His recovery timetable is such that he may not even miss a single regular season game.

If you want to think it's a big deal then be my guest. Based on his role, if he were to miss 30 games then I'd probably be there with you, but he may literally miss zero at this point. The 6 week timeframe has him missing four games. Until we see this drag into significant real time missed, it isn't that big a deal. Even if he does miss significant time, at best he's the 5th most important guy on the team. Teams lose guys like that and manage.

Ironic to say the least: people telling in the appreciation thread good riddance to Markkanen for being injury prone and now his replacement injures himself even without any contact.

Who will replace Williams?

Fortunately not Lauri. Probably DDR for 4 games.

[fleet]

Imo, they are going to tape the hell out of his ankle and have him on the floor for walkthroughs and shooting. What he misses in camp won’t be too terrible. Its not like he is in a coma.

I got my medical degree from watching doctor shows on TV, but getting a player with a *high ankle sprain up on his feet with tape ASAP seems like setting back a proper and quick recovery.

* I have no idea what kind of sprain he has. A high ankle sprain seems likely given the projected down time and initial “severe” diagnosis on the internets.

I got mine from the school of hard knocks. First game is Oct 20 or 5 weeks after the 4-6 week estimate. Someone walking on an ankle with support weeks after a sprain isn’t super high risk.

I don’t recommend that prescription. My professional opinion is rest, therapy, and amps.

[eierluke]

Dotson (2 way at best), Thompson, Stanley Johnson (scrub), and Thomas (3 pt shot but WNBA athletic) won't make the team.
This injury in combination with our lack of size might be the big chance for Tyler Cook, who is at least 6'8 to make the roster.

[dougthonus]

Ironic to say the least: people telling in the appreciation thread good riddance to Markkanen for being injury prone and now his replacement injures himself even without any contact.

Well Lauri missed time in four straight seasons. So far, Pat Williams has played one completely healthy season in one attempt and has an injury that may not cause him to miss any regular season games. I don't think Lauri's injury status was one of the top reasons people were happy to see him leave, but to the extent there is some irony there, we should probably have Pat Williams miss a single regular season game before calling it out.

Who will replace Williams?

I'd say Alize Johnson will be the biggest beneficiary minutes wise if Williams misses notable time because it was questionable to me whether he'd play at all in the rotation, but I'd guess he almost assuredly has a spot in the rotation with Williams out. Otherwise, I expect them to play small a lot more and use DJJ and TBJ more.

Certainly front court depth isn't a great strength of the team, Williams himself isn't even a true four. I don't really think swapping Williams out for DJJ, TBJ, or Alize will have a meaningful impact on the Bulls ability to win though if Williams were to miss notable time it certainly won't help with his development any.

[ATRAIN53]

Tough call if I want to be angry and blame his Olympic stint on the injury

I still think the experience of being over there and with stars like KD wil help the kid more than the possible 20/30 games he misses due to this. He's just a baby, should recover quickly.

[MGB8]

I do think that this is a bigger deal than folks are letting on, at least if he's out for any length of time.

What Pat brings to the table that is fairly unique among Bulls players is his "do everything" versatility at the forward spot. Big enough to defend the vast majority of opposing 4s, and on offense, skilled enough to hit the 3 (spacing - needed since DeRozan isn't much of a threat from 3) but also drive, finish, make the right pass and cut, etc.

Neither Derrick Jones Jr. nor Alize Johnson have demonstrated a meaningful ability to hit the 3.

Alize did at least shoot 38% from 2 two seasons ago - but that was on one half an attempt per game (in 7 mpg). His college production was mixed - 39% from 3 as a frosh, but 28% from 3 as a sophomore (while increasing his FT% from 68 to 76). There very well may be upside there - but it's not something that you can count on.

DJJ shot 21% on negligible volume in college and has bounced between 28 and 32% on very low volume in the last 3 years.

Troy Brown also hasn't been great from 3 (bouncing between 32-34% on low volume) and also may have issues defending stronger players (per that recent analysis that was posted).

[MGB8]

This may, in a way, be a blessing in disguise (assuming Pat isn't out for too long and also isn't hampered once he comes back).

I think this will force the coaching staff to really dive into whether Alize or DJJr is going to be the #2 guy at the 4. And/or Brown, Stanley Johnson, etc.

And the more I look into Alize Johnson, the more I see a player who, if he's putting the work in (and all reports are that he's a hard worker), could really carve out a nice role for himself in the NBA for a very long time. If he can work become a respectably 3 pt shooter (and the 38% on super low volume 2 years ago at least gives some signs for optimism, as well as Freshman year shooting 39% on middling volume)... well, now you really have a poor man's Brandon Clarke - the rebounding, defensive versatility, energy, 3 point shooting bail-out option... everything but the extra of rim defense.

[sco]

I do think that this is a bigger deal than folks are letting on, at least if he's out for any length of time.

What Pat brings to the table that is fairly unique among Bulls players is his "do everything" versatility at the forward spot. Big enough to defend the vast majority of opposing 4s, and on offense, skilled enough to hit the 3 (spacing - needed since DeRozan isn't much of a threat from 3) but also drive, finish, make the right pass and cut, etc.

Neither Derrick Jones Jr. nor Alize Johnson have demonstrated a meaningful ability to hit the 3.

Alize did at least shoot 38% from 2 two seasons ago - but that was on one half an attempt per game (in 7 mpg). His college production was mixed - 39% from 3 as a frosh, but 28% from 3 as a sophomore (while increasing his FT% from 68 to 76). There very well may be upside there - but it's not something that you can count on.

DJJ shot 21% on negligible volume in college and has bounced between 28 and 32% on very low volume in the last 3 years.

Troy Brown also hasn't been great from 3 (bouncing between 32-34% on low volume) and also may have issues defending stronger players (per that recent analysis that was posted).

I think Pat IS just an OK player, and we won't miss him much. It is easy to confuse Pat having enormous potential with what Pat has shown so far. He'll be our 5th option scorer, so his 3pt volume isn't a big issue with the starters (nor will the rest of his offense). His defense has been good, but far from great so far and I don't expect much, if any fall off with any of our backups. If we're missing anything, it will be the potential to give him a bigger offensive roll alongside bench guys.

Sure, it's a shame he's missing camp and the chemistry lift, but if he comes back in late Oct healthy, I'm fine.

[WindyCityBorn]

He's your 5th best starter and probably even lower on the pecking order presently in terms of his impact on the game. His recovery timetable is such that he may not even miss a single regular season game.

If you want to think it's a big deal then be my guest. Based on his role, if he were to miss 30 games then I'd probably be there with you, but he may literally miss zero at this point. The 6 week timeframe has him missing four games. Until we see this drag into significant real time missed, it isn't that big a deal. Even if he does miss significant time, at best he's the 5th most important guy on the team. Teams lose guys like that and manage.

Ironic to say the least: people telling in the appreciation thread good riddance to Markkanen for being injury prone and now his replacement injures himself even without any contact.

Who will replace Williams?

Fortunately not Lauri. Probably DDR for 4 games.

No way we start Derozan at 4. That might actually be enough to be worst defense in the league. Not signing a real backup PF is already looking like a massive mistake.

[Chi town]

Imo, they are going to tape the hell out of his ankle and have him on the floor for walkthroughs and shooting. What he misses in camp won’t be too terrible. Its not like he is in a coma.

From his interview today it sounded minor. He walked off court and thought it was fine and then it swelled up. He's not doing any on court work right now but it getting treatment and still doing work.

I think docs are taking super conservative approach with him to prevent anything. I see him back for 1st game.

[StunnerKO]

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[madvillian]

Huh, I figured it was amputated by now.

[d boy gentleman]

Huh, I figured it was amputated by now.

That would have been with the old medical staff

[sco]

Huh, I figured it was amputated by now.

That would have been with the old medical staff

They would have amputated his arm for a sprained ankle