The Athletic: Westbrook reportedly tried to convince Beal to get out of DC too

[CobraCommander]

Bingo. My read as well.

And by the way, Payit, because you expressed surprise at the vitriol on here, and because I am not a little source of that vitriol — Whether we got a good haul (we did! maybe even a great-ish one, relative to the market and the moment!) or whether Tommy Shepp was nimble and shrewd in his maneuvering (he was, as usual!) is immaterial to this discussion.

This is about what Weaselbrook did.

And even more about what he tried to do.

And what he tried to do was to f*ck us.

To f*ck us, by pulling Beal into his selfish and malevolent scheme and greasing his path out of town.

To f*ck us, by showing no regard, none … no loyalty, none … for the team that saved his axx, rehabilitating his tarnished image and allowing his game to backburner his shenanigans.

Now, do I think he was holding us back in key ways? I do. Do I think we could have won big with him? I don’t.

But as I said — immaterial in this particular discussion.

He tried to fxck us.

And to get even more Glengarry Glen Ross — when a player tries to fxck us, whether on the court or off, we’re gonna get a little hot.

We’re gonna say, fxck you — loudly, and often.

We’re gonna hope you flame out wherever you go.

If we can’t win — and obviously we can’t — then we’re gonna hope that you lose, too. And lose big. Lose disastrously. Embarrassingly. Humiliatingly. Bringing shame to your team and your city.

Buh-bye, Weaselbrook. You are dead to us.

Damn I was 100000% team Westbrook till I read this article now I feel exactly like this....

Hope Beal gives the Lakers an agent 0 in LA, Rui dunks on AD and Kuzma has a career game....and the wiz win by 20 next time we play them.

Wiz and DC were good to him and he tried to undercut us with Beal...bad business bro

[Ruzious]

“I really have to make sure the record is straight on that,” Sheppard said in an interview with NBC Sports Washington’s Chris Miller. “Russell actually never asked to move on. He just said, ‘If I can get to the Lakers, that’d be something I would love to do. If not, I’ll be back here.’ I said, ‘What about the Clippers?’ He said, ‘Hell no.’ So Russell was happy being here and we were very grateful for him being here.”

Lol, Tommy using GM speak trying to convince us that Westbrook never asked for a trade.

[payitforward]

Not sure I follow the "LOL," Ruz.... That seems pretty straightforward. & businesslike. Which, far as I can tell, is pretty consistent with how Russell behaves. It's a business to him -- just as it is to management & ownership.

[Ruzious]

Not sure I follow the "LOL," Ruz.... That seems pretty straightforward. & businesslike. Which, far as I can tell, is pretty consistent with how Russell behaves. It's a business to him -- just as it is to management & ownership.

I think you have to be blind to not see through the lines there, but whatevs.

[payitforward]

We'll have to agree to disagree -- & I accept the fact that I am in a small minority here (possibly a minority of 1 -- ), but I don't see it.

Obviously, Russ wanted to be traded to the Lakers -- was eager to be traded to the Lakers -- which nobody is trying to hide. No reason to hide it. Surely, you don't see anything wrong with that, as far as it goes. Am I correct about that?

What if the Lakers had offered a crappy package in return for Russ? A deal we didn't want, because we couldn't see how it did us any good? Are you thinking Tommy wouldn't have been able to say no to such a deal? Is that where the problem starts for you?

If so, then sure that would be a problem. But, I don't see much to indicate that it's the case.

Or, do you think we didn't get enough for Russ? Is that it? It would be a sensible objection if true. &, obviously, it's something people can have different opinions about. But, IMO, we did get enough value back for him: two good players, a promising player, & a same-year R1 pick in a deep draft.

If it's none of the above, then where's the problem? That Russ & Brad talked?

If that's it, then I guess it's back to agreeing to disagree. Because, I feel certain that these guys talk about that kind of stuff all of the time. Doesn't bother me.

[Ruzious]

He was obviously asking to be traded. I mean... it's impossible not to see that unless you choose not to see it. That's the whole point - nothing else. It's not a value judgment or anything else.

[FAH1223]

“I really have to make sure the record is straight on that,” Sheppard said in an interview with NBC Sports Washington’s Chris Miller. “Russell actually never asked to move on. He just said, ‘If I can get to the Lakers, that’d be something I would love to do. If not, I’ll be back here.’ I said, ‘What about the Clippers?’ He said, ‘Hell no.’ So Russell was happy being here and we were very grateful for him being here.”

Lol, Tommy using GM speak trying to convince us that Westbrook never asked for a trade.

Read on Twitter

Tommy is funny

[payitforward]

He was obviously asking to be traded. I mean... it's impossible not to see that unless you choose not to see it. That's the whole point - nothing else. It's not a value judgment or anything else.

"If I can get to the Lakers, that’d be something I would love to do. If not, I’ll be back here."

Of course that's "asking to be traded." But, it's not a demand. There's nothing at all wrong with it. & if as you say it's "not a value judgment" then I have no problem with it at all. Anyway, Russ had already said that he called Ted & asked to be traded to the Lakers. So I don't think that's at issue.

But, what we were getting the last day or so was all kind of extreme Russ-bashing, name-calling, etc. In fact, his desire to go to the Lakers was absolutely great for us. & he got us a sizable haul. Again, this is a guy whom we were all saying would be impossible to trade only a few months ago.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I’m with PIF on this. Westbrook may have told Beal that in his opinion he should look to play elsewhere but I question whether Russ tried to “convince” Brad to demand a trade.

I agree. This story is Much Ado About Nothing. Minus the capital lettters.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Right, I never doubted that they'd talked. How not? & that "Russ encouraged him to look elsewhere" makes perfect sense! Widen your scope -- that's the right thing to do, hence it's the right thing to encourage one of your peers to do.

& if "I'm going over to X; it'd be great to have you there" is part of that conversation, it's perfectly natural & to be expected -- there is nothing wrong with it in the slightest. Certainly it has nothing whatever to do with "...he tried to ...f*ck us, by pulling Beal into his selfish and malevolent scheme...."

I'm not trying to hook anybody on something he typed in quickly in frustration & anger, it's just not where to stay.

The Wizards gave Westbrook a better platform from which to showcase his remaining skills. They gave him a much better image than he had in Houston. That Westbrook might have believed Brad leaving might improve his chances to land with LAL is not the same as saying he wanted Beal to screw the Wizards over by demanding a forced trade.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Not sure I follow the "LOL," Ruz.... That seems pretty straightforward. & businesslike. Which, far as I can tell, is pretty consistent with how Russell behaves. It's a business to him -- just as it is to management & ownership.

Agreed, it is a business.

Why are people angry? The Washington Wizards got plenty assets for Westbrook. He is in a better place for him. The team is better off without him.

[Ruzious]

The last thing the Wiz need is a future HOFer messing up the team. Wait what?

[Ruzious]

He was obviously asking to be traded. I mean... it's impossible not to see that unless you choose not to see it. That's the whole point - nothing else. It's not a value judgment or anything else.

"If I can get to the Lakers, that’d be something I would love to do. If not, I’ll be back here."

Of course that's "asking to be traded." But, it's not a demand. There's nothing at all wrong with it. & if as you say it's "not a value judgment" then I have no problem with it at all. Anyway, Russ had already said that he called Ted & asked to be traded to the Lakers. So I don't think that's at issue.

But, what we were getting the last day or so was all kind of extreme Russ-bashing, name-calling, etc. In fact, his desire to go to the Lakers was absolutely great for us. & he got us a sizable haul. Again, this is a guy whom we were all saying would be impossible to trade only a few months ago.

I never said or implied that it was a demand. You keep trying to make something more out of what I said than what I said. I lol'd because Tommy said it wasn't a trade request. That was a silly comment by him, imo.

[payitforward]

Fair enough, Ruz. It's not you writing strange stuff about the Westbrook deal. As you wrote, you weren't making "a value judgment."

Obviously, yes, Russell asked to be traded to the Lakers if a trade was possible. & a trade was indeed possible -- an outstanding trade. A transaction which, in the end, got us 1/3 of our entire roster! & made it possible for Dinwiddie to join the team -- so make that 6 of our 15 players.

In fact, if a person had to choose, for this team, between the 33 year old Westbrook at $44m guaranteed this year & $47m guaranteed next year vs. the 28 year old Spencer Dinwiddie for 3 years of his prime at a total $56m+, wouldn't it be sensible for him to prefer Dinwiddie?

What if the decision also brought back a young, defensive-minded back up PG? Plus Isaiah Todd, still only 19 & one of the very highest rated kids out of his high school class? Wouldn't that make it even better? Dinwiddie, Holiday & Todd? Instead of Russell at this point in his career & at his price.

If Tommy had announced that transaction alone -- "the Wizards have traded Russell Westbrook to the Lakers in return for Spencer Dinwiddie, Aaron Holiday, & Isaiah Todd" -- there would have been joy in Wiz-land. That deal alone would have been tremendous. & all the more if he'd gone on to point out that in the same transaction, we also deleted a $4m guaranteed contract for a player who wasn't in our plans (Hutch).

Only, we also got Montrezl Harrell. We got Kentavious Caldwell-Pope. & we got Kyle Kuzma.

All for a guy whom, few months ago, we thought we wouldn't be able to trade at all b/c of his contract.

Far from doing us dirt, the fact that Russ wanted to end his career playing for his home town team was the best thing that's happened to the Washington Wizards in many many years! Russ just enabled us to transform our team.

[doclinkin]

Far from doing us dirt, the fact that Russ wanted to end his career playing for his home town team was the best thing that's happened to the Washington Wizards in many many years! Russ just enabled us to transform our team.

The results were fine, and credit due to Tommy. The action of trying to induce another player to jump teams and join another star filled squad is dislikable. Yes, it's how the league works nowadays, stars who are playing for a team have the power to blow the team up to re-shuffle the deck instead of staying with the franchise who owns the contract. It does make mockery of the attempts to ensure parity so big market teams don't constantly rule the landscape. It means Ted may be right to punt on winning championships in favor of being "competitive", since the big players tend to be the same year after year. We are begging one semi-star to stay with us, while LeBJ and the Lake Show can wave one come hither finger and players rush to join him, often on a discount.

We can appreciate the results while still seeing it as a douchey move. It still doesn't mean hometown fans have to like it when one of their players tries to recruit another on our roster to leave with him. And surely we would hate it all the more if Beal takes him up on the suggestion after he earns the supermax. The league where superstars group together in their buddybuddy secret clubs is less fun to watch, for me. If all the starpower is concentrated on a few teams, the product is more humdrum most of the nights of the year.

I hope our team plays well, I hope the chemistry catalyzes to a surprisingly successful compound that is more powerful than the ingredients. It would be satisfying if the results mean our lesser talents win against shallower but more talented teams. It is a nice pivot from the usual lack of depth where a single injury puts us in the lottery every 3rd year or so. Maybe it works. Maybe there is a new model there. Still, one star asked our other star to leave with him when he switched teams. Why should DC fans thank him for that? The worst part of it is having to scowl and say hey, Ted may have been right. He shouldn't have said it out loud, let Tommy be more diplomatic, but yeah, stars nowadays tend to have the ability to throw a tantrum and get what they want. In the millionaires vs billionaires squabble, it is still generally the fans who lose out, and the rich as always get richer.

[badinage]

That quote from Tommy Shepp — it’s freakin’ hilarious.

It’s out of Merchant & Ivory, and only a little different from this:

“So, Russell said to me, ‘You know, Thomas, if you should be so kind as to find a path for me to play with the Lakers of Los Angeles — well, I should be most grateful. Most grateful. Yes, that would be a delight. And if your efforts prove to be in vain — well, I would not mind returning here. If of course you will have me.’”

What this is, is spin — CYA, former-PR-man spin.

The uproar, here, at least for me, is that this was engineered. By players (plural; not just Westcrook). And he tried to pull Beal in. And he and his agent dirtied the waters of the media to turn things his way. And he went to Teddy. His intent was surely not to enhance the present or future of this team or franchise — it was only to advance his own aims, by whatever means necessary.

You can say “douchey,” and it is, but it’s more than douchey and it’s only this acceptance of the way sports is now that keeps anyone from saying: who the fxck do these guys think they are? All these guys. The players, the owners, the whole universe of grubby, arrogant men.

It’s a good thing I like the games, mostly. Otherwise I’d be done. And probably should have been done a long time ago.

[payitforward]

1. badinage -- first off, I don't want us to have an argument. I apologize for challenging you on something that feel important to you in the way this does. For better or worse, it doesn't feel that way to me. But, I'm not the last word on what is or isn't important! I should have seen that a little more clearly.

2. "...I like the games..." That seems like a sensible bottom line; in the end it must be more or less the same for all of us -- love of basketball. But, doesn't it seem to you that there'll be more reason to like the games this year than in the recent past? It sure does to me. &, if so, well then at least one bottom line has been well served.

3. What makes you think Russell "he tried to pull Beal in?" I've seen nothing to make me think that. The fact that he talked w/ Brad about what he was trying to make happen for himself doesn't seem that way to me. I don't know why it should, since these guys would seem likely to talk to one another about anything of that sort.

4. Even if he said something like "...& you should think about what you're doing too..." I find it hard to think that's somehow a "bad" thing for him to do. That it's "grubby." Seems normal to me -- normal conversation between peers.

But, people have different takes, of course -- I just

5. ...don't see anything to suggest that Russ would imagine he could exert influence over Brad. Get him to do something. & especially not that he would think he could or should do something to "pull Beal in." Especially, I don't see how that would enable him to go "to Teddy."

Perfectly possible that I'm missing something important in the situation. Wouldn't be the first time. Yet, I think what I do see is quite important: we are a much better team.

[payitforward]

...The action of trying to induce another player to jump teams and join another star filled squad is dislikable....

It would be. Although not too long ago we were talking about who Brad & Russ should recruit to come here! (but that's us talking...)

But, forget that for the moment. I just don't see the evidence anywhere of Russell "...trying to induce (Brad) to jump teams and join another star filled squad..." where he, Russ, wanted to go. For starters, would doing that have made it more likely Tommy would trade Russ to the Lakers? Doesn't seem likely to me.

But, two great minds can see things differently... & so can the two of us! Personally, I couldn't be happier about what went down.