Thoughts in General, Rumors, etc 4.0

[shangrila]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2948953-brian-windhorst-pacers-a-sleeper-team-in-ben-simmons-trade-sweepstakes

Bleacher Report continues with the poor Simmons takes today, this time through Windhorst. I will be absolutely floored if Indy even made a real offer. He's a poor fit for the roster, for the new coaching staff, and for the organization, beyond being too expensive unless several major pieces are involved.

We have a ton of posters here who would be better journalists than what they've got over there. All it takes apparently is stretching baseless speculation into an article. I half expect their next article to be verbatim someone's 1/4 season fake headline.

The Pacers already reportedly made an offer earlier. It's not absurd to think they're still interested.

[Texas Chuck]

I know how people feel about Simmons so I won't speak to any specific teams, but I think way more teams are probably exploring the idea particularly if they believe Philly will ultimately cave on value.

Simmons is a unique player, but he's also a very good one. He fits as poorly in Dallas as probably anywhere considering the Mavs franchise player is as ball-dominant as they come and isn't a great shooter to move off-ball some, but if his price is really as low as most people on this board think, Dallas better be doing everything they can to be a bidder.

[pacers33granger]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2948953-brian-windhorst-pacers-a-sleeper-team-in-ben-simmons-trade-sweepstakes

Bleacher Report continues with the poor Simmons takes today, this time through Windhorst. I will be absolutely floored if Indy even made a real offer. He's a poor fit for the roster, for the new coaching staff, and for the organization, beyond being too expensive unless several major pieces are involved.

We have a ton of posters here who would be better journalists than what they've got over there. All it takes apparently is stretching baseless speculation into an article. I half expect their next article to be verbatim someone's 1/4 season fake headline.

The Pacers already reportedly made an offer earlier. It's not absurd to think they're still interested.

That came from a single report by Dumas, who has had some iffy reporting on the situation overall. I don't believe anyone else had that other than lesser reporters reporting what he was reporting. Even then, that was prior to the draft and circumstances have changed. TJ Warren was supposedly another piece in the deal and he had a setback in his rehab. LeVert has a minor injury now too. We also have less options at this point to hedge against the luxury tax than we would have then given the roster being set and the draft having passed.

It just doesn't make sense, is completely against the team's MO, and is baseless speculation that only takes into account that Indy has pieces that could interest Philly. I'd love him on the Pacers as we never get the opportunity to get that type of known talent at the likely price. But the fit is all off unfortunately.

[shangrila]

I think there's plenty of evidence to suggest a team could get more out of Simmons if they used him differently as well.

I thought it was interesting watching a video, I think from BBall Breakdown, that showed the plays the Sixers ran that had Simmons sitting in that dunkers spot in the playoffs. The one people like to criticise him for, as in that's all they can do with him. But the fascinating part was that they kept running those same plays, even with Simmons on the bench, just substituting Harris or whoever into the dunkers spot and causing all of the same issues.

We can probably all agree that neither Brown or Rivers are exactly offensive savants when it comes to coaching so I have to imagine there's a bunch of teams and coaches that would be interested in using Simmons in different ways.

[SO_MONEY]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2948953-brian-windhorst-pacers-a-sleeper-team-in-ben-simmons-trade-sweepstakes

Bleacher Report continues with the poor Simmons takes today, this time through Windhorst. I will be absolutely floored if Indy even made a real offer. He's a poor fit for the roster, for the new coaching staff, and for the organization, beyond being too expensive unless several major pieces are involved.

We have a ton of posters here who would be better journalists than what they've got over there. All it takes apparently is stretching baseless speculation into an article. I half expect their next article to be verbatim someone's 1/4 season fake headline.

The Pacers already reportedly made an offer earlier. It's not absurd to think they're still interested.

I am skeptical the first offer was even made.

[shangrila]

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2948953-brian-windhorst-pacers-a-sleeper-team-in-ben-simmons-trade-sweepstakes

Bleacher Report continues with the poor Simmons takes today, this time through Windhorst. I will be absolutely floored if Indy even made a real offer. He's a poor fit for the roster, for the new coaching staff, and for the organization, beyond being too expensive unless several major pieces are involved.

We have a ton of posters here who would be better journalists than what they've got over there. All it takes apparently is stretching baseless speculation into an article. I half expect their next article to be verbatim someone's 1/4 season fake headline.

The Pacers already reportedly made an offer earlier. It's not absurd to think they're still interested.

That came from a single report by Dumas, who has had some iffy reporting on the situation overall. I don't believe anyone else had that other than lesser reporters reporting what he was reporting. Even then, that was prior to the draft and circumstances have changed. TJ Warren was supposedly another piece in the deal and he had a setback in his rehab. LeVert has a minor injury now too. We also have less options at this point to hedge against the luxury tax than we would have then given the roster being set and the draft having passed.

It just doesn't make sense, is completely against the team's MO, and is baseless speculation that only takes into account that Indy has pieces that could interest Philly. I'd love him on the Pacers as we never get the opportunity to get that type of known talent at the likely price. But the fit is all off unfortunately.

Fit hasn't stopped teams going after talent in the past, nor should it, so that's a moot point.

Besides, you're arguing against the idea like its been presented as a fact. Its speculation, as far as I can see, with enough plausibility to back it up.

You might not like the idea or even think it makes sense but, again, its not absurd to think the Pacers are interested.

[pacers33granger]

The Pacers already reportedly made an offer earlier. It's not absurd to think they're still interested.

That came from a single report by Dumas, who has had some iffy reporting on the situation overall. I don't believe anyone else had that other than lesser reporters reporting what he was reporting. Even then, that was prior to the draft and circumstances have changed. TJ Warren was supposedly another piece in the deal and he had a setback in his rehab. LeVert has a minor injury now too. We also have less options at this point to hedge against the luxury tax than we would have then given the roster being set and the draft having passed.

It just doesn't make sense, is completely against the team's MO, and is baseless speculation that only takes into account that Indy has pieces that could interest Philly. I'd love him on the Pacers as we never get the opportunity to get that type of known talent at the likely price. But the fit is all off unfortunately.

Fit hasn't stopped teams going after talent in the past, nor should it, so that's a moot point.

Besides, you're arguing against the idea like its been presented as a fact. Its speculation, as far as I can see, with enough plausibility to back it up.

You might not like the idea or even think it makes sense but, again, its not absurd to think the Pacers are interested.

Fit stops teams plenty of times. Especially when it's a potential issue on and off the court. Timing also stops teams.

My issue is that it's baseless speculation. It is literally "well they have the pieces." It is exactly the same as someone on this board proposing a trade. I get it because anything with the teams who have been actively talking has been done to death and there's nothing to report on. Doesn't mean this isn't a poor, not thought out take.

[jayu70]

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[Scoot McGroot]

The Pacers already reportedly made an offer earlier. It's not absurd to think they're still interested.

That came from a single report by Dumas, who has had some iffy reporting on the situation overall. I don't believe anyone else had that other than lesser reporters reporting what he was reporting. Even then, that was prior to the draft and circumstances have changed. TJ Warren was supposedly another piece in the deal and he had a setback in his rehab. LeVert has a minor injury now too. We also have less options at this point to hedge against the luxury tax than we would have then given the roster being set and the draft having passed.

It just doesn't make sense, is completely against the team's MO, and is baseless speculation that only takes into account that Indy has pieces that could interest Philly. I'd love him on the Pacers as we never get the opportunity to get that type of known talent at the likely price. But the fit is all off unfortunately.

Fit hasn't stopped teams going after talent in the past, nor should it, so that's a moot point.

Besides, you're arguing against the idea like its been presented as a fact. Its speculation, as far as I can see, with enough plausibility to back it up.

You might not like the idea or even think it makes sense but, again, its not absurd to think the Pacers are interested.

Fit has often stopped teams from trading for a guy. And sometimes it hasn’t. It’s literally either way. And both make sense.

I have no doubt the Pacers are keeping their ears open. Pritchard and Buchanan are widely known as willing to communicate and listen on anything. It’s how we got Warren and Levert. But I don’t honk they’re actively or heavily lobbying Philly in negotiations. If the price comes to an affordable level, I imagine he’d make a serious offer. I doubt they’ve made any real or serious offers, yet, though, for just that reason. Pritchard has mentioned not getting into these type of things early when the price is inflated.

But just because a guy may have leaked a fake report as a favor to the Philly front office doesn’t mean that Indy has really been heavily lobbying here. Listening? Of course. But actively part of negotiations or actually having made an offer? Probably not at this time. The type of cost was just WAAAY out of Indy’s a ability to pay.

[pacers33granger]

But just because a guy may have leaked a fake report as a favor to the Philly front office doesn’t mean that Indy has really been heavily lobbying here. Listening? Of course. But actively part of negotiations or actually having made an offer? Probably not at this time. The type of cost was just WAAAY out of Indy’s a ability to pay.

Yup. And to add to this, J Michael said recently that he knows McConnell isn't really Rick's ideal choice for a PG given his shooting issues and that Rick had his sights set on another guy. Rick would make it work, but I doubt he really wants Simmons for the same reasons especially mid training camp. The potential lower than market price is the only selling point for Indy, but that can be said about any teams.

[K_chile22]

They're probably way too attached to him to do this (and wrongly so imo) but I really think something around Sabonis for Simmons would actually make a lot of sense for Indy. Don't see what he does for Philly tho so may need to find a third team

[shangrila]

That came from a single report by Dumas, who has had some iffy reporting on the situation overall. I don't believe anyone else had that other than lesser reporters reporting what he was reporting. Even then, that was prior to the draft and circumstances have changed. TJ Warren was supposedly another piece in the deal and he had a setback in his rehab. LeVert has a minor injury now too. We also have less options at this point to hedge against the luxury tax than we would have then given the roster being set and the draft having passed.

It just doesn't make sense, is completely against the team's MO, and is baseless speculation that only takes into account that Indy has pieces that could interest Philly. I'd love him on the Pacers as we never get the opportunity to get that type of known talent at the likely price. But the fit is all off unfortunately.

Fit hasn't stopped teams going after talent in the past, nor should it, so that's a moot point.

Besides, you're arguing against the idea like its been presented as a fact. Its speculation, as far as I can see, with enough plausibility to back it up.

You might not like the idea or even think it makes sense but, again, its not absurd to think the Pacers are interested.

Fit has often stopped teams from trading for a guy. And sometimes it hasn’t. It’s literally either way. And both make sense.

I have no doubt the Pacers are keeping their ears open. Pritchard and Buchanan are widely known as willing to communicate and listen on anything. It’s how we got Warren and Levert. But I don’t honk they’re actively or heavily lobbying Philly in negotiations. If the price comes to an affordable level, I imagine he’d make a serious offer. I doubt they’ve made any real or serious offers, yet, though, for just that reason. Pritchard has mentioned not getting into these type of things early when the price is inflated.

But just because a guy may have leaked a fake report as a favor to the Philly front office doesn’t mean that Indy has really been heavily lobbying here. Listening? Of course. But actively part of negotiations or actually having made an offer? Probably not at this time. The type of cost was just WAAAY out of Indy’s a ability to pay.

Yeah, ok, I'm not going to continue to repeat the same thing with a different poster now.

You win. You're both right. It's completely absurd to even suggest the Pacers might be interested in Ben Simmons. There is no history to back up even that mild suggestion and anything that does is from an "iffy" source at best and is just an outright fabrication at worst. Thank the Buddha we got that cleared up.

[jbk1234]

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I"m 100% for this, but it will be interesting to see whether this is like the annual moving screen point of emphasis where they make a point to call it for the first three weeks and then everything kind of goes back to normal.

[Scoot McGroot]

Fit hasn't stopped teams going after talent in the past, nor should it, so that's a moot point.

Besides, you're arguing against the idea like its been presented as a fact. Its speculation, as far as I can see, with enough plausibility to back it up.

You might not like the idea or even think it makes sense but, again, its not absurd to think the Pacers are interested.

Fit has often stopped teams from trading for a guy. And sometimes it hasn’t. It’s literally either way. And both make sense.

I have no doubt the Pacers are keeping their ears open. Pritchard and Buchanan are widely known as willing to communicate and listen on anything. It’s how we got Warren and Levert. But I don’t honk they’re actively or heavily lobbying Philly in negotiations. If the price comes to an affordable level, I imagine he’d make a serious offer. I doubt they’ve made any real or serious offers, yet, though, for just that reason. Pritchard has mentioned not getting into these type of things early when the price is inflated.

But just because a guy may have leaked a fake report as a favor to the Philly front office doesn’t mean that Indy has really been heavily lobbying here. Listening? Of course. But actively part of negotiations or actually having made an offer? Probably not at this time. The type of cost was just WAAAY out of Indy’s a ability to pay.

Yeah, ok, I'm not going to continue to repeat the same thing with a different poster now.

You win. You're both right. It's completely absurd to even suggest the Pacers might be interested in Ben Simmons. There is no history to back up even that mild suggestion and anything that does is from an "iffy" source at best and is just an outright fabrication at worst. Thank the Buddha we got that cleared up.

What? I agreed with you. The Pacers probably have interest in Simmons. I just pointed out that teams often do skip out on acquiring guys based on fit. There’s no hard and fast rule towards either side. Sometimes they say “damn the fit”, and sometimes they say “it just wasn’t a good fit”.

And we’re not the only ones to point out that Dumas has been a very iffy source this offseason, and many others past. Philly posters were first to point that out.

It can both be true that Dumas is a bad source AND that Indy might have interest in Simmons. Just, knowing how Indy operates, they probably made inquiries, and probably keep in touch just in case. Last time we were heavily interested in a guy, it was widely known, in the Gordon Hayward case.

[Texas Chuck]

Seems worth mentioning since 1/2 of every trade thread or more for a couple days involved him, but Wiggins got the vaccine in the end.

[K_chile22]

Matters a little less since Wiggins got vaccinated after all, but turns out he would have still counted as his full salary for tax purposes

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[toooskies]

Matters a little less since Wiggins got vaccinated after all, but turns out he would have still counted as his full salary for tax purposes

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Still matters for Kyrie!

Ben Simmons's situation is different, but is it the case that if he holds out until he gets a sufficient amount of fines, Philly can get under the tax?

[HartfordWhalers]

And the reporting was that he slipped to 53 because he had 2(+?) years gtd if he went undrafted, and teams didn't want to gtd that much... which could all be spin..

I actually hadn't heard that anywhere, would see how he would be upset with them if that were true, but I always saw him going late 2nd round so didn't think anything was off there

Quick googling found it mentioned here, as well as being behind the athletic's paywall:

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2021/09/13/report-76ers-offering-second-rounder-charles-bassey-smaller-guarantee-than-he-couldve-gotten-as-undrafted-free-agent/

As to whether it was indeed true....

I'm laughing: https://www.spotrac.com/nba/philadelphia-76ers/charles-bassey-74160/

That we both win a partial gtd on year 2 is of under 75k.

[Soulyss]

I know how people feel about Simmons so I won't speak to any specific teams, but I think way more teams are probably exploring the idea particularly if they believe Philly will ultimately cave on value.

Simmons is a unique player, but he's also a very good one. He fits as poorly in Dallas as probably anywhere considering the Mavs franchise player is as ball-dominant as they come and isn't a great shooter to move off-ball some, but if his price is really as low as most people on this board think, Dallas better be doing everything they can to be a bidder.

This is why I still come back to a Portland and 76'rs deal centered around a McCollum for Simmons swap. I don't see another player that would be available that they will be able to get back that maximizes Embiid as much as CJ would.

IF SAC would cave and offer Fox, that would be the best option for the 76'rs... but I don't think they will do it.

[toooskies]

I know how people feel about Simmons so I won't speak to any specific teams, but I think way more teams are probably exploring the idea particularly if they believe Philly will ultimately cave on value.

Simmons is a unique player, but he's also a very good one. He fits as poorly in Dallas as probably anywhere considering the Mavs franchise player is as ball-dominant as they come and isn't a great shooter to move off-ball some, but if his price is really as low as most people on this board think, Dallas better be doing everything they can to be a bidder.

This is why I still come back to a Portland and 76'rs deal centered around a McCollum for Simmons swap. I don't see another player that would be available that they will be able to get back that maximizes Embiid as much as CJ would.

IF SAC would cave and offer Fox, that would be the best option for the 76'rs... but I don't think they will do it.

The fact that a deal hasn't been made may mean that McCollum isn't available either.