ShootersShoot wrote: Herro, Oladipo, morris, tucker, dedmon is not a terrible bench on paper. Oladipo is a wild card. Front court depth needs some work though.
Tucker is starting, Markieff Morris was terrible for the Lakers and Oladipo is out until the playoffs. They are relying on givinng Max Strus, Kz Okpala and Gabe Vincent major minutes. That’s a recipe for disaster
Oh wow, didnt realize Dipo was out that long
He's not. Last I heard, they were expecting him to be cleared in November.
Miami's bench probably doesn't belong in the top 5 right now. Of course, that changes if Herro, Morris, and Oladipo play well. As for the frontcourt, Dedmon is our backup center and he's pretty good. Not a world beater by any means, but decent. Those for players, if healthy and in rhythm, do give Miami a potential advantage off of the bench, but Oladipo is such a huge IF right now that I wouldn't count on that happening.
The sleeper pick for Miami here is Max Strus. He's got a real chance to get a foothold in the rotation, but we're also working with a couple of summer league guys we like who could take minutes from him should he falter. Guys like Gabe Vincent, Omër Yurtseven, Caleb Martin, and Marcus Garrett could all challenge for playing time if they show enough.
In the meantime, I'd bump Miami down to like 10ish until Oladipo shows what he has left...
beantownski wrote: Guys starting because the real starter is injured doesn't make them starting material.
Speaking of depth...Care to put any depth in your post instead of uninformed 1 liners with no substance?
Speaking of depth, want to explain how a player who started for a good Knicks team last year and who is scheduled to come off Dallas' bench isn't a positive towards their depth?
I asked earlier and you either somehow missed it which seems surprising considering you are responding to a bunch of posts or maybe you just don't have a good answer?
But guys who clearly played behind him last year are being sold as "starters on other teams" but he's not even noted as a good depth piece. Do players lose all their powers when they leave the Knicks?
Maybe he's lumped in with those respectable guys who should be bench players which would be fine I suppose but then I look at clearly worse players on the Knicks being sold as starters across the league so that can't possibly be it. Confusing.
I had like 20 notifications and tried to respond to most of them but must have missed that one, sorry.
Porzingis/WCS/Boban/M.Brown Powell/Kleber DFS/THj/ Bullock/THj/S.Brown Doncic/Brunson obviously theres some positional switchability but does that depth chart seem right more or less?
I think Bullock is a great piece to the puzzle. He's a knockdown shooter that plays confident D and can/will guard the opposing teams best swingman and can even guard point guards. I think the problem with Bullock in terms of his fit with the Mavs as that he is on the same tier as most of the other guys on the roster. I don't see much separation between him, DFS, THj, Brunson, Kleber, Powell, who are projected to be their 3-8 guys. The issue is, this should really be the 5-10 guys on the roster, KP should be the 3rd guy and then they are missing a legit 2nd option and another good 3/4 option.
In such a Luka-centric offense that should be fine, as all of those guys can do the little things and knock down open shots. They'll be able to get away with some stuff offensively, but it just seems like they have a ton of repetitive depth pieces and noone really stands out from eachother.
Scalabrine wrote: Porzingis/WCS/Boban/M.Brown Powell/Kleber DFS/THj/ Bullock/THj/S.Brown Doncic/Brunson obviously theres some positional switchability but does that depth chart seem right more or less?
I think Bullock is a great piece to the puzzle. He's a knockdown shooter that plays confident D and can/will guard the opposing teams best swingman and can even guard point guards. I think the problem with Bullock in terms of his fit with the Mavs as that he is on the same tier as most of the other guys on the roster. I don't see much separation between him, DFS, THj, Brunson, Kleber, Powell, who are projected to be their 3-8 guys. The issue is, this should really be the 5-10 guys on the roster, KP should be the 3rd guy and then they are missing a legit 2nd option and another good 3/4 option.
In such a Luka-centric offense that should be fine, as all of those guys can do the little things and knock down open shots. They'll be able to get away with some stuff offensively, but it just seems like they have a ton of repetitive depth pieces and noone really stands out from eachother.
Is that fair?
Oh I have zero issues with your classification of Dallas. Luka is a 2nd tier franchise player. He's not Jokic, Giannis, Lebron but basically right there with everyone else. Then there is no number legit number 2 guy with KP forced up into a bigger role. He should be a number 3. Then I agree DFS and THJ are solid players but yeah as your 3rd and 4th most important players that's not good enough.
For me the issue would be less about depth, though I think they are missing at least more solid veteran and more about the lack of top end talent. But obviously that lack of top end talent forces guys up hurting the depth.
No my issue is really more about New York being sold as so much stronger than Dallas. New York has an ever bigger lack of top end talent than Dallas. Randle is one of the worst franchise players in the league and as inconsistent as KP is, New York doesn't have a 2 as good as him.
Then Robinson and Noel are both good players. But neither is even an average starting center. So quite similar to Dallas in that they have good players, but ideally you'd upgrade.
Toppin is not remotely a starter on a good team. Nor is Burks. Nor is Rose or IQ. It's not that they couldn't start, but those teams would be desperately looking to upgrade them just like Dallas wants to upgrade their starters.
I think you are being too generous with how good those Knicks players are.
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JN61 wrote:Honestly I'm not that sure if Wizards are that deep. Certainly way deeper than last year but still that roster is very suspect in terms of talent a lot of 5th option type of players or one way players who have either absolutely no offensive game or no defensive game.
How are you going to find minutes for Rui, Bertans and Harrell (and Kuzma) in the same roster? None of them play any defense and more or less plays the same position.
Rui is an exceptional one-on-one defender. He led the league last year in iso defense. To be fair, he is a sub-par team defender, but it's wrong to label him as a guy who doesn't play any defense. He guards the opposition's best forward every night. There's a reason why he averaged a lot more minutes than anyone else on the roster not named Beal or Westbrook. And it wasn't because of his rather pedestrian offensive numbers.
Bertans may be a poor defender, but he is a top 5 shooter in the league. Acting like he isn't quality depth is just ignorant.
And Harrell was 6th man of the year 2 years ago.
If your complaint is that they can't find minutes for all these guys, well, isn't that the definition of a deep roster?
Scalabrine wrote: Porzingis/WCS/Boban/M.Brown Powell/Kleber DFS/THj/ Bullock/THj/S.Brown Doncic/Brunson obviously theres some positional switchability but does that depth chart seem right more or less?
I think Bullock is a great piece to the puzzle. He's a knockdown shooter that plays confident D and can/will guard the opposing teams best swingman and can even guard point guards. I think the problem with Bullock in terms of his fit with the Mavs as that he is on the same tier as most of the other guys on the roster. I don't see much separation between him, DFS, THj, Brunson, Kleber, Powell, who are projected to be their 3-8 guys. The issue is, this should really be the 5-10 guys on the roster, KP should be the 3rd guy and then they are missing a legit 2nd option and another good 3/4 option.
In such a Luka-centric offense that should be fine, as all of those guys can do the little things and knock down open shots. They'll be able to get away with some stuff offensively, but it just seems like they have a ton of repetitive depth pieces and noone really stands out from eachother.
Is that fair?
Oh I have zero issues with your classification of Dallas. Luka is a 2nd tier franchise player. He's not Jokic, Giannis, Lebron but basically right there with everyone else. Then there is no number legit number 2 guy with KP forced up into a bigger role. He should be a number 3. Then I agree DFS and THJ are solid players but yeah as your 3rd and 4th most important players that's not good enough.
For me the issue would be less about depth, though I think they are missing at least more solid veteran and more about the lack of top end talent. But obviously that lack of top end talent forces guys up hurting the depth.
No my issue is really more about New York being sold as so much stronger than Dallas. New York has an ever bigger lack of top end talent than Dallas. Randle is one of the worst franchise players in the league and as inconsistent as KP is, New York doesn't have a 2 as good as him.
Then Robinson and Noel are both good players. But neither is even an average starting center. So quite similar to Dallas in that they have good players, but ideally you'd upgrade.
Toppin is not remotely a starter on a good team. Nor is Burks. Nor is Rose or IQ. It's not that they couldn't start, but those teams would be desperately looking to upgrade them just like Dallas wants to upgrade their starters.
I think you are being too generous with how good those Knicks players are.
Fair points* but I think the difference between the two teams is that the Knicks are 10-12 deep of guys who can all play a productive 20 minutes per game, where the Mavs are 9. Those 2-3 guys make a difference in a conversation about depth.
* I disagree with your assessment on Randle... and the NBA does too. He made 2nd Team All-NBA last season averaging 24/10/6 on 46/41/81 slash line. He was also a great defensive player on one of the best defensive teams in the league. He was the head of the snake on offense while covering LeBron, Durant, Giannis, Sabonis, Tatum on defense. From an advanced stats standpoint, Randle was ranked as one of the best defensive players in the entire league. He not a guy thats gonna anchor a defense in the paint but he can defend pretty much anyone on a switch with his combination of size and quickness.
Also, consistency was absolutely not the issue for him this past season. The bigger issue was teams knowing that they could just load up on force the ball out of his hands and all they had was 20 year old RJ Barrett and Alec Burks as the secondary scorers. Bringing in Derrick Rose was a huge help for that too. Now we've alleviated that issue by replacing two guys who can't do anything offensively (Payton and Bullock) with two guys who are multi dimensional offensive threats (Walker and Fournier). This should make it much harder for teams to just load up on Randle, because if they do, their are gonna be at least 3 other guys on the court that can not only knock down an open jumper, but put the ball on the floor and make a play.
If I had to rank the Mavs/Knicks rotation players it would be like this: 1. Doncic
2. Randle
3. KP 4. Walker
5. Barrett 6. Robinson 7. Fournier 8. Hardaway 9. Rose
Knicks have 11 of the Top 20 and 6 of the Top 9. Doncic is clearly better than the rest, and I think both teams will finish with similar records (as they did last year) but this is a conversation about depth not top end talent and the Knicks have 2-3 more players that are worthy of solid minutes than the Mavs do.
BugginOut wrote:Tucker is starting, Markieff Morris was terrible for the Lakers and Oladipo is out until the playoffs. They are relying on givinng Max Strus, Kz Okpala and Gabe Vincent major minutes. That’s a recipe for disaster
Oh wow, didnt realize Dipo was out that long
He's not. Last I heard, they were expecting him to be cleared in November.
Miami's bench probably doesn't belong in the top 5 right now. Of course, that changes if Herro, Morris, and Oladipo play well. As for the frontcourt, Dedmon is our backup center and he's pretty good. Not a world beater by any means, but decent. Those for players, if healthy and in rhythm, do give Miami a potential advantage off of the bench, but Oladipo is such a huge IF right now that I wouldn't count on that happening.
The sleeper pick for Miami here is Max Strus. He's got a real chance to get a foothold in the rotation, but we're also working with a couple of summer league guys we like who could take minutes from him should he falter. Guys like Gabe Vincent, Omër Yurtseven, Caleb Martin, and Marcus Garrett could all challenge for playing time if they show enough.
In the meantime, I'd bump Miami down to like 10ish until Oladipo shows what he has left...
I guess my reasoning for putting them in there is because I am so confident in the Miami coaching stuff to turn guys like Struss, Okpala, Vincent into guys that are actually capable rotation players. I kind of just give them the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn't leave that hole in the lineup if they didn't know what they had in 2 or 3 of those guys. I guess that's assuming too much, but I feel like it's a more fair assumption than any other team in the league.
Fair points* but I think the difference between the two teams is that the Knicks are 10-12 deep of guys who can all play a productive 20 minutes per game, where the Mavs are 9. Those 2-3 guys make a difference in a conversation about depth.
* I disagree with your assessment on Randle... and the NBA does too. He made 2nd Team All-NBA last season averaging 24/10/6 on 46/41/81 slash line. He was also a great defensive player on one of the best defensive teams in the league. He was the head of the snake on offense while covering LeBron, Durant, Giannis, Sabonis, Tatum on defense. From an advanced stats standpoint, Randle was ranked as one of the best defensive players in the entire league. He not a guy thats gonna anchor a defense in the paint but he can defend pretty much anyone on a switch with his combination of size and quickness.
Also, consistency was absolutely not the issue for him this past season. The bigger issue was teams knowing that they could just load up on force the ball out of his hands and all they had was 20 year old RJ Barrett and Alec Burks as the secondary scorers. Bringing in Derrick Rose was a huge help for that too. Now we've alleviated that issue by replacing two guys who can't do anything offensively (Payton and Bullock) with two guys who are multi dimensional offensive threats (Walker and Fournier). This should make it much harder for teams to just load up on Randle, because if they do, their are gonna be at least 3 other guys on the court that can not only knock down an open jumper, but put the ball on the floor and make a play.
If I had to rank the Mavs/Knicks rotation players it would be like this: 1. Doncic
2. Randle
3. KP 4. Walker
5. Barrett 6. Robinson 7. Fournier 8. Hardaway 9. Rose
Knicks have 11 of the Top 20 and 6 of the Top 9. Doncic is clearly better than the rest, and I think both teams will finish with similar records (as they did last year) but this is a conversation about depth not top end talent and the Knicks have 2-3 more players that are worthy of solid minutes than the Mavs do.
Where am I wrong?
First, I want to say again how much I always enjoy conversations with you. We disagree on some things, but you are open to critique without taking it personally and defend your positions well. It's really refreshing.
I don't know that I disagree that the Knicks have more 20 mpg guys, but let me run through them and see what I come up with to be sure.
Dallas -- Luka, KP, Kleber, DFS, THJ, Bullock, Brunson would be my list. So that's 7. Less than half the roster. Not very good. NY --Robinson, Noel, Randle, Barrett, Burks, Fournier, Rose, Kemba. That's 8. Maybe IQ bumps that to 9 if he takes a step.
So New York marginally deeper on 20 mpg players.
On Randle--he had a great year last year no doubt. Then in the playoffs a mediocre defensive team made him look helpless. Is this simply a sample size issue and an aberration? Is this about the lack of high end talent around him allowing a team in the playoffs to focus on him? Maybe. But still should be concerning. Other franchise guys have limited help and still deliver.
But let's just look across the league at which players we'd rather have than Randle as our franchise guy:
And I left off a number of better players who were too old or too young but who teams would clearly choose over him(Ja, Zion, Limelo, etc..) or some guys where its arguably very close and left out Kyrie because of his drama but who clearly would be ahead of him as a player. He had a great year, but he's way down the list of franchise players.
As far as your rankings go, the gap between Luka and Randle is far greater than the gap between Randle and everyone else. Not sure if those gaps are meant to be equal or just acknowledging a big difference but wanted to make sure that was clear.
Won't go through the whole list other than I think Kleber is too low. Even if I gave you all the Knicks ahead of him(I don't), Powell isn't better than him for instance. And Robinson feels quite high for a guy whose never established himself so much as an NBA starter and has never been a positive plus/minus guy. Tons of talent, but as far as an actualized player not close to this yet. Noel is a better player today than he is.
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Fair points* but I think the difference between the two teams is that the Knicks are 10-12 deep of guys who can all play a productive 20 minutes per game, where the Mavs are 9. Those 2-3 guys make a difference in a conversation about depth.
* I disagree with your assessment on Randle... and the NBA does too. He made 2nd Team All-NBA last season averaging 24/10/6 on 46/41/81 slash line. He was also a great defensive player on one of the best defensive teams in the league. He was the head of the snake on offense while covering LeBron, Durant, Giannis, Sabonis, Tatum on defense. From an advanced stats standpoint, Randle was ranked as one of the best defensive players in the entire league. He not a guy thats gonna anchor a defense in the paint but he can defend pretty much anyone on a switch with his combination of size and quickness.
Also, consistency was absolutely not the issue for him this past season. The bigger issue was teams knowing that they could just load up on force the ball out of his hands and all they had was 20 year old RJ Barrett and Alec Burks as the secondary scorers. Bringing in Derrick Rose was a huge help for that too. Now we've alleviated that issue by replacing two guys who can't do anything offensively (Payton and Bullock) with two guys who are multi dimensional offensive threats (Walker and Fournier). This should make it much harder for teams to just load up on Randle, because if they do, their are gonna be at least 3 other guys on the court that can not only knock down an open jumper, but put the ball on the floor and make a play.
If I had to rank the Mavs/Knicks rotation players it would be like this: 1. Doncic
2. Randle
3. KP 4. Walker
5. Barrett 6. Robinson 7. Fournier 8. Hardaway 9. Rose
Knicks have 11 of the Top 20 and 6 of the Top 9. Doncic is clearly better than the rest, and I think both teams will finish with similar records (as they did last year) but this is a conversation about depth not top end talent and the Knicks have 2-3 more players that are worthy of solid minutes than the Mavs do.
Where am I wrong?
First, I want to say again how much I always enjoy conversations with you. We disagree on some things, but you are open to critique without taking it personally and defend your positions well. It's really refreshing.
I don't know that I disagree that the Knicks have more 20 mpg guys, but let me run through them and see what I come up with to be sure.
Dallas -- Luka, KP, Kleber, DFS, THJ, Bullock, Brunson would be my list. So that's 7. Less than half the roster. Not very good. NY --Robinson, Noel, Randle, Barrett, Burks, Fournier, Rose, Kemba. That's 8. Maybe IQ bumps that to 9 if he takes a step.
So New York marginally deeper on 20 mpg players.
On Randle--he had a great year last year no doubt. Then in the playoffs a mediocre defensive team made him look helpless. Is this simply a sample size issue and an aberration? Is this about the lack of high end talent around him allowing a team in the playoffs to focus on him? Maybe. But still should be concerning. Other franchise guys have limited help and still deliver.
But let's just look across the league at which players we'd rather have than Randle as our franchise guy:
And I left off a number of better players who were too old or too young but who teams would clearly choose over him(Ja, Zion, Limelo, etc..) or some guys where its arguably very close and left out Kyrie because of his drama but who clearly would be ahead of him as a player. He had a great year, but he's way down the list of franchise players.
As far as your rankings go, the gap between Luka and Randle is far greater than the gap between Randle and everyone else. Not sure if those gaps are meant to be equal or just acknowledging a big difference but wanted to make sure that was clear.
Won't go through the whole list other than I think Kleber is too low. Even if I gave you all the Knicks ahead of him(I don't), Powell isn't better than him for instance. And Robinson feels quite high for a guy whose never established himself so much as an NBA starter and has never been a positive plus/minus guy. Tons of talent, but as far as an actualized player not close to this yet. Noel is a better player today than he is.
I agree in terms of basketball conversation, Thats why were on here, right? It's far too much one liners and tantrums and dismissing on here now a days so I definitely appreciate getting into it with you and a few others who seem to genuinely enjoy analyzing and discussing the game.
I'll definitely succeed your knowledge of the Mavs role players, in terms of Kleber being better than Powell, I just figured since they were starting Powell that he probably has the edge. It seems close though.
In the same fairness, you should listen to me when it comes to Knicks guys. Robinson is a much better player than Noel. They are both great and even elite as rim protectors by most metrics, but where Robinson is a total game changer is his threat as an offensive player. I dont know if there is a stat around for this, but as someone who watches a ton of basketball, Mitchell Robinson has one of the best catch radius' in the entire league. Compare that to stone hands Noel, who pretty much needs the ball handed to him in the paint, and it changes our offense entirely. When Robinson is in, you can't come off of him until the very last second, and if you do, he's either catching the lob or finishing the miss. Theres a reason he had the highest FG% in NBA history after all. I'd also say the I'd be comfortable with Quickley being our starting point guard this year if we didn't bring Kemba in, so he definitely belongs in the 20 MPG guy. He averaged 19 last year as a rookie and looks to have made some major improvements going into this year. I can get into the more if you'd like but I think he will prove that he certainly belongs on that list.
matt6715 wrote:This guy just said the Knicks have 12 starters and called Tim Hardaway Jr a 6th man
Knicks have a bench that could be better than 3 teams starting 5 (Houston, OKC, Detroit)
Hate that I have to come here and tell casuals to watch games. Our bench carried us last year and we added Fournier, Kemba and getting Mitchell Robinson back to the starters.
1. Brooklyn Nets - Team has a ton of versatility and flexibility built around 2 Top 10 players and 1 Top 30. As of now, it's looking like Irving isn't gonna play, yet they still look like the best team in the East. They have a ton of proven vets that they can rely on at different roles and they should be able to rest guys or deal with injuries and still be fine.
I have a lot of trouble accepting the Nets as a deep team, let alone the #1 deepest team.
If Durant and Harden get injured for the season, they're not making the playoffs, let alone going on a run. That isn't depth.
They've got a GREAT top end, and the top end is probably good enough that they can cover for each other from time to time. But depth is about the drop off from the starters to the reserves. The Nets absolutely don't have a 'next man up' that's anywhere near the same level.
A team of Patty Mills, Joe Harris, Bruce Brown, Blake Griffin, Paul Milsap, LaMarcus Aldridge, and their youngins Nic Claxton and Cam Thomas, definitely make the playoffs. You add 3 of some of the best scorers in the league, and that makes up a stacked team.
The Nets for sure are the deepest team. Kyrie is a legit philosopher and just by himself makes the whole team a deep, profound group. Then there's KD constantly dropping thought-provoking tweets. Harden is a pretty shallow guy, admittedly.
3. New York Knicks - Robinson/Noel/Gibson Randle/Toppin/Knox Barrett/Burks/Grimes Fournier/Rose/Bacon Walker/Quickley/McBride
Thats 12 deep with players that could start on teams. A mix of veterans and young guys that play two way basketball and should be able to take an injury or two and still keep rolling, especially with Thibs sometimes preferring to play a short rotation if he can.
.
12 is optimistic. That last column isn't starting for any team in the league.
Don't see a point in putting non playoff expected teams on there
I don't see Portland having a bottom 5 bench. Bottom half, probably. Bottom 10 possibly. But not bottom 5.
None of these guys are world beaters (if they were, they'd be starting), but Tony Snell, Larry Nance Jr., Patrick Patterson, Ben McLemore and Cody Zeller are all veterans who have started or played significant minutes off the bench over the past two seasons. Larry Nance Jr. was rated as the most underrated acquisition by NBA general managers.
Portland also has a couple young guys who may take a significant step this season in Anfernee Simons and Nassir Little. If not, their minutes will be cut in favor of the veteran bench players. If nothing else, POR's bench should be much better defensively and have better ball movement this season.
Got the 6th man of the year in Clarkson 7th man of the year in Ingles Gay and Whiteside are pretty good for 8th and 9th men. Maybe your 10th man is better than Butler, but I wouldn't bet on it
Is it just our starting 5 is trash?
"Thibs called back and wanted more picks," said Jorge Sedano. "And Pat Riley, literally, I was told, called him a mother-bleeper and hung up the phone."
1. Brooklyn Nets - Team has a ton of versatility and flexibility built around 2 Top 10 players and 1 Top 30. As of now, it's looking like Irving isn't gonna play, yet they still look like the best team in the East. They have a ton of proven vets that they can rely on at different roles and they should be able to rest guys or deal with injuries and still be fine.
I have a lot of trouble accepting the Nets as a deep team, let alone the #1 deepest team.
If Durant and Harden get injured for the season, they're not making the playoffs, let alone going on a run. That isn't depth.
They've got a GREAT top end, and the top end is probably good enough that they can cover for each other from time to time. But depth is about the drop off from the starters to the reserves. The Nets absolutely don't have a 'next man up' that's anywhere near the same level.
A team of Patty Mills, Joe Harris, Bruce Brown, Blake Griffin, Paul Milsap, LaMarcus Aldridge, and their youngins Nic Claxton and Cam Thomas, definitely make the playoffs. You add 3 of some of the best scorers in the league, and that makes up a stacked team.
Brooklyn's depth looks very good on paper when fully healthy because their top 3 is so strong, but the idea that a team made up of the guys you mentioned would make the playoffs is absurd.
Everything related to Mitchell Robinson on this list.
Noel > Robinson Hardaway better than Fournier/Barrett/Robinson
The Greatest of All Time debate in basketball is essentially who has the greatest basketball resume of the player who has the best highlights instead of who is the best player
ShootersShoot wrote: Oh wow, didnt realize Dipo was out that long
He's not. Last I heard, they were expecting him to be cleared in November.
Miami's bench probably doesn't belong in the top 5 right now. Of course, that changes if Herro, Morris, and Oladipo play well. As for the frontcourt, Dedmon is our backup center and he's pretty good. Not a world beater by any means, but decent. Those for players, if healthy and in rhythm, do give Miami a potential advantage off of the bench, but Oladipo is such a huge IF right now that I wouldn't count on that happening.
The sleeper pick for Miami here is Max Strus. He's got a real chance to get a foothold in the rotation, but we're also working with a couple of summer league guys we like who could take minutes from him should he falter. Guys like Gabe Vincent, Omër Yurtseven, Caleb Martin, and Marcus Garrett could all challenge for playing time if they show enough.
In the meantime, I'd bump Miami down to like 10ish until Oladipo shows what he has left...
I guess my reasoning for putting them in there is because I am so confident in the Miami coaching stuff to turn guys like Struss, Okpala, Vincent into guys that are actually capable rotation players. I kind of just give them the benefit of the doubt that they wouldn't leave that hole in the lineup if they didn't know what they had in 2 or 3 of those guys. I guess that's assuming too much, but I feel like it's a more fair assumption than any other team in the league.
I tried to edit my post earlier to add that Miami's development seemingly always makes them a relatively deep team. I agree that they could be much deeper than I'm giving them credit for. My hope is that Oladipo is healthy, Strus continues to show what he showed last year (and he's really someone to pay attention to - I'm calling it - he's our next guy), and Yurtseven emerges into a starting-caliber power player. I don't have a lot of hope for Vincent as his offense is too inconsistent and he's not a creator, but he's a good defensive player...
I'll preface this by saying deepest imho means which team can sub their whole 2nd unit and their 2nd unit is beating other team's 2nd unit. Some teams have really good 2nd units that aren't far off their starters but that's an indictment on their starters really.
