Shams: Morey wants CJ + 3 FRP + 3 Pick Swaps for Simmons

[dunlop212]

It looks like Simmons and his agent are intentionally destroying his trade value, which is a good thing for Simmons, because it means that the team he goes to doesn't have to give up significant assets to acquire him.

[DusterBuster]

Morey is out there now in the media sounding off. He publicly said they can't get anything but "role players" for him current and they will absolutely not trade him for anything other than a star. Says he would rather the team deal with the perceived distraction this causes so the team can have better playoff odds either with Ben back or with a better trade offer rather than trade him to be rid of the distraction... He then went on to say this could literally last for 4 years (his whole contract)... he's clearly sending a message to Ben that this is going to be his new norm if he doesn't show up and honor his contract.

[BNM]

Morey is out there now in the media sounding off. He publicly said they can't get anything but "role players" for him current and they will absolutely not trade him for anything other than a star. Says he would rather the team deal with the perceived distraction this causes so the team can have better playoff odds either with Ben back or with a better trade offer rather than trade him to be rid of the distraction... He then went on to say this could literally last for 4 years (his whole contract)... he's clearly sending a message to Ben that this is going to be his new norm if he doesn't show up and honor his contract.

Morey is bluffing and WAY overstating his case. Yes, he wants more than a role player for Simmons, but he's not getting a bona fide star now, or ever. The mere suggestion of dragging this out for four years is ludicrous. Yeah Morey, you're going to piss away the best four years of Joel Embiid's career just to teach Simmons a lesson. At some point, sooner rather than later, Morey needs to take the best offer available and move on.

Simmons isn't just a distraction (he is, a huge one). He's also tying up $32 - $38 million per year of PHI's salary cap over each of the next four seasons. Without Simmons playing that is the equivalent of about $35 million a year in dead cap space. Until they move Simmons, they can't sign or trade for anyone to replace that significant chunk of salary. PHI would be much better off with a couple role players, or solid starter (CJ) using up that cap space than a guy who refuses to play.

[DusterBuster]

Morey is out there now in the media sounding off. He publicly said they can't get anything but "role players" for him current and they will absolutely not trade him for anything other than a star. Says he would rather the team deal with the perceived distraction this causes so the team can have better playoff odds either with Ben back or with a better trade offer rather than trade him to be rid of the distraction... He then went on to say this could literally last for 4 years (his whole contract)... he's clearly sending a message to Ben that this is going to be his new norm if he doesn't show up and honor his contract.

Morey is bluffing and WAY overstating his case. Yes, he wants more than a role player for Simmons, but he's not getting a bona fide star now, or ever. The mere suggestion of dragging this out for four years is ludicrous. Yeah Morey, you're going to piss away the best four years of Joel Embiid's career just to teach Simmons a lesson. At some point, sooner rather than later, Morey needs to take the best offer available and move on.

Simmons isn't just a distraction (he is, a huge one). He's also tying up $32 - $38 million per year of PHI's salary cap over each of the next four seasons. Without Simmons playing that is the equivalent of about $35 million a year in dead cap space. Until they move Simmons, they can't sign or trade for anyone to replace that significant chunk of salary. PHI would be much better off with a couple role players, or solid starter (CJ) using up that cap space than a guy who refuses to play.

Totally. And as others are pointing out on the GB, it's an absolutely insane stance for Morey to take, even on merit alone. Simmons is not the franchise player for the Sixers, Embiid is. So it's laughable he should expect another teams franchise player for the second best player on his team.

I will say though, he's bluffing with a decent hand. He has the backing of his franchise and the league offices as well. It would set terrible precedent for the league if players can now get max extensions off their rookie contract, then immediately demand a trade of the team that signed him to that deal, and then sit out until it happens. The league and the CBA can't afford to have that happen, so Morey can - to an extent - hold out longer than Ben with this standoff.

[soobias]

imo PHILI played this all wrong.
not letting simmons off the hook but, he was having a bad series, phili fans got on him bad(every right to do so), then coach publicly threw him under the bus,he quietly asked for a trade, they (phili)were to it, but the GM wanted too much so they publicly put out their and his business.
simmons was advised by nba players and his agent to show up to not lose his money( so fake a injury)they do that all the time.

if im portland yes i trade him for cj+ little + 1st.
monitor him, see if he likes it here, if not tell him to play nice and get his trade value up and move him in the off season.
it would be more then we could get for cj by all means.

[Wizenheimer]

Morey is way too full of himself and he sure seems to be more interested in 'teaching Simmons who's boss' than in doing best for the franchise

he just explicitly said that he won't trade Simmons for his actual trade value because Embiid is in his prime and he needs an all-star to pair with Embiid. But the 4 years of the Simmons contract will essentially burn thru the prime of 28 year old Embiid anyway. Is he dumb enough to believe that Simmons will give up his wish to be traded and start playing like an all-star again for Doc, and with Embiid, 2 guys that have trashed Simmons pretty substantially?

it makes no sense, but it sure looks like Morey has strapped his ego out front like a big shiny bumper and that is what is in charge of the mess. He's been playing this wrong right from the start

[JRoy]

Morey is way too full of himself and he sure seems to be more interested in 'teaching Simmons who's boss' than in doing best for the franchise

he just explicitly said that he won't trade Simmons for his actual trade value because Embiid is in his prime and he needs an all-star to pair with Embiid. But the 4 years of the Simmons contract will essentially burn thru the prime of 28 year old Embiid anyway. Is he dumb enough to believe that Simmons will give up his wish to be traded and start playing like an all-star again for Doc, and with Embiid, 2 guys that have trashed Simmons pretty substantially?

it makes no sense, but it sure looks like Morey has strapped his ego out front like a big shiny bumper and that is what is in charge of the mess. He's been playing this wrong right from the start

Morey has put he and PHI into a very difficult position.

He can’t capitulate but no team is looking to bail them out of this sticky wicket.

[DusterBuster]

Morey is way too full of himself and he sure seems to be more interested in 'teaching Simmons who's boss' than in doing best for the franchise

he just explicitly said that he won't trade Simmons for his actual trade value because Embiid is in his prime and he needs an all-star to pair with Embiid. But the 4 years of the Simmons contract will essentially burn thru the prime of 28 year old Embiid anyway. Is he dumb enough to believe that Simmons will give up his wish to be traded and start playing like an all-star again for Doc, and with Embiid, 2 guys that have trashed Simmons pretty substantially?

it makes no sense, but it sure looks like Morey has strapped his ego out front like a big shiny bumper and that is what is in charge of the mess. He's been playing this wrong right from the start

Yep, unquestionably at this point he's in a dick measuring contest with Simmons + Klutch to prove they can't push him around. I definitely think some of the league front office could be at play here. It would seem logical that Silver wants Morey to hold the line here so that there isn't a bad precedent set of players getting they max deals from the team that drafted them, then immediate pull this same crap because their agent wants them in a bigger market. But at the same time, this isn't really anything new, what's new is the lengths both sides are going to one-up each other.

All that said, even if Morey has the backing of the league here, it's still largely his fault that this situation has spiraled so wildly out of control and turned into a circus. By all accounts, Morey was getting fair market trade offers for Simmons over the summer, but he was so intent on getting a star level player that he blew the chance at resolving this issue amicably for all sides. He was demanding teams best player or best assets for his second best player/asset. That's nothing but pure ego. It's long been known Morey is someone who thinks he can out-smart the room. That's been his MO ever since Houston. Now he's played himself into a bit of a corner and I'm enjoying watching the mess he created.

And to be fair, I can't partially see why he would want to push back, Simmons is being absolutely in the wrong himself. It sure feels at this point that Klutch and Simmons are looking for any loophole they can to get paid while not playing. So like, Morey should to a certain extent be pushing back pretty hard. But the public chest pounding while also not negotiation with other franchises in good faith is equally as childish as what the other side is doing.

Like I said on the GB, this is basically the NBA equivalent of South Park's debate between a Giant Douche and a Turd Sandwich.

[DusterBuster]

I wonder if a 3 team deal of CJ and some other pieces to Philly, Simmons to Minnesota and KAT to Portland could make sense.

[monopoman]

Only a moron would think that a disgruntled Simmons is better than just having a good player that actually wants to be a Sixer.

If Morey thinks offers will increase as time goes on he is one of the dumbest GM's of all time.

[BlazersBroncos]

I wonder if a 3 team deal of CJ and some other pieces to Philly, Simmons to Minnesota and KAT to Portland could make sense.

I am no KAT stan, but I would certainly move CJ, Nurkic and 1-2 FRP for him. It really balances this team.

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Dennis Smith Jr (14)
G - Norman Powell (24) / Anfernee Simons (24)
F - Robert Covington (20) / Nassir Little (22) / Norman Powell (6)
F - Larry Nance Jr (24) / Robert Covington (8) / ???? (16)
C - Karl Anthony Towns (32) / Cody Zeller (16)

Thats 3 solid defenders in-between the two primary scorers, I really like that. But it could fall apart due to depth issues. And we would need to find another rotation worthy forward (Maybe Layman in this scenario?)

[Wizenheimer]

I wonder if a 3 team deal of CJ and some other pieces to Philly, Simmons to Minnesota and KAT to Portland could make sense.

I am no KAT stan, but I would certainly move CJ, Nurkic and 1-2 FRP for him. It really balances this team.

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Dennis Smith Jr (14)
G - Norman Powell (24) / Anfernee Simons (24)
F - Robert Covington (20) / Nassir Little (22) / Norman Powell (6)
F - Larry Nance Jr (24) / Robert Covington (8) / ???? (16)
C - Karl Anthony Towns (32) / Cody Zeller (16)

Thats 3 solid defenders in-between the two primary scorers, I really like that. But it could fall apart due to depth issues. And we would need to find another rotation worthy forward (Maybe Layman in this scenario?)

I really don't see any depth issues

And a Dame/KAT PnR could be awesome. I just don't see any reason for Minny to make that trade; and I think they could do better if they were shopping KAT

[Wizenheimer]

Jason Quick is hinting there's not much 'there' there in the Olshey investigation

https://theathletic.com/live-rooms/trail-blazers-conversation/MHhQa0l1lr5F/

I'm not sure if the 'there' he speaks of is the level of 'firing with cause'. That has always fit best under tin-foil

if the Blazers were looking for a reason to fire Olshey, there are 10 years worth of reasons. And, they wouldn't need any reason in the first place. Unfortunately, that might explain why he's still there

[BNM]

I wonder if a 3 team deal of CJ and some other pieces to Philly, Simmons to Minnesota and KAT to Portland could make sense.

I am no KAT stan, but I would certainly move CJ, Nurkic and 1-2 FRP for him. It really balances this team.

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Dennis Smith Jr (14)
G - Norman Powell (24) / Anfernee Simons (24)
F - Robert Covington (20) / Nassir Little (22) / Norman Powell (6)
F - Larry Nance Jr (24) / Robert Covington (8) / ???? (16)
C - Karl Anthony Towns (32) / Cody Zeller (16)

Thats 3 solid defenders in-between the two primary scorers, I really like that. But it could fall apart due to depth issues. And we would need to find another rotation worthy forward (Maybe Layman in this scenario?)

I really don't see any depth issues

And a Dame/KAT PnR could be awesome. I just don't see any reason for Minny to make that trade; and I think they could do better if they were shopping KAT

I don't see any depth issues either. With Norm (SG, SF), RoCo (PF, SF), Little (SF, PF) and Nance (PF, small ball C) all capable of playing multiple positions, I think the depth is covered.

Agreed though, getting KAT is a pipe dream. MIN supposedly covets Simmons, but a big part of that would be pairing him with KAT. They perfectly compliment each other. KAT is one of the best stretch 5s in the league. This spreads the floor for Simmons and helps negate his shooting woes, and Simmons helps cover for KAT's weaknesses on the defensive end.

I do think MIN will continue to go hard after Simmons, but with the goal of also keeping KAT and PHI may actually prefer the younger, more PGish Russell over CJ. With Seth Curry playing so well, PHI doesn't need another defensively challenged, undersized SG, especially when Seth is much more efficient on the offensive end than CJ (and at 1/4 the cost). Plus, I think MIN can offer a better package of picks/swaps than POR.

[Wizenheimer]

I do think MIN will continue to go hard after Simmons, but with the goal of also keeping KAT and PHI may actually prefer the younger, more PGish Russell over CJ. With Seth Curry playing so well, PHI doesn't need another defensively challenged, undersized SG, especially when Seth is much more efficient on the offensive end than CJ (and at 1/4 the cost). Plus, I think MIN can offer a better package of picks/swaps than POR.

I agree with that

but from what Morey has done so far, or at least what the rumors are of what Morey has asked for, he'd likely ask for Edwards + Russell + 3 or 4 picks

I think he either wants to completely slam-dunk win a Simmons trade or make Simmons and his agent 'cry-uncle'. I'd say Morey's out-of-control ego is running the show. I wonder if Morey's #1 priority is to force Simmons to play in a home game so Simmons can be humiliated by Philly fans

[BNM]

I do think MIN will continue to go hard after Simmons, but with the goal of also keeping KAT and PHI may actually prefer the younger, more PGish Russell over CJ. With Seth Curry playing so well, PHI doesn't need another defensively challenged, undersized SG, especially when Seth is much more efficient on the offensive end than CJ (and at 1/4 the cost). Plus, I think MIN can offer a better package of picks/swaps than POR.

I agree with that

but from what Morey has done so far, or at least what the rumors are of what Morey has asked for, he'd likely ask for Edwards + Russell + 3 or 4 picks

I think he either wants to completely slam-dunk win a Simmons trade or make Simmons and his agent 'cry-uncle'. I'd say Morey's out-of-control ego is running the show. I wonder if Morey's #1 priority is to force Simmons to play in a home game so Simmons can be humiliated by Philly fans

Sounds like the definition of "creating a hostile workplace environment" to me!

[DusterBuster]

I wonder if a 3 team deal of CJ and some other pieces to Philly, Simmons to Minnesota and KAT to Portland could make sense.

I am no KAT stan, but I would certainly move CJ, Nurkic and 1-2 FRP for him. It really balances this team.

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Dennis Smith Jr (14)
G - Norman Powell (24) / Anfernee Simons (24)
F - Robert Covington (20) / Nassir Little (22) / Norman Powell (6)
F - Larry Nance Jr (24) / Robert Covington (8) / ???? (16)
C - Karl Anthony Towns (32) / Cody Zeller (16)

Thats 3 solid defenders in-between the two primary scorers, I really like that. But it could fall apart due to depth issues. And we would need to find another rotation worthy forward (Maybe Layman in this scenario?)

I really don't see any depth issues

And a Dame/KAT PnR could be awesome. I just don't see any reason for Minny to make that trade; and I think they could do better if they were shopping KAT

What about something along the lines of...

McCollum and picks to Philly
Simmons and Nurkic to Minnesota
Towns and Price to Portland

Philly finally accepts the fact they would be better off with someone who's going to actually play for them rather than dealing with this headache any longer.

Minnesota moves a player who's pretty openly unhappy with his current situation (KAT), gets a player they're clearly interested in with Simmons and gets a replacement C on top of that to rebuild around Edwards with.

Portland gets a true All Star pairing and an expiring contact in Price.

Philly:
McCollum
Curry
Maxey
Harris
Embiid

Minnesota:
Beverly
Russell
Edwards
Simmons
Nurkic

Portland:
Dame
Powell
RoCo
Nance Jr
Towns

Minny would be hard pressed to get better than Nurk and Simmons for KAT imo. Outside shooting would be a problem for them, they would have to rely heavily on Russell and Edwards, but defensively that's a pretty intimidating lineup.

[BlazersBroncos]

I am no KAT stan, but I would certainly move CJ, Nurkic and 1-2 FRP for him. It really balances this team.

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Dennis Smith Jr (14)
G - Norman Powell (24) / Anfernee Simons (24)
F - Robert Covington (20) / Nassir Little (22) / Norman Powell (6)
F - Larry Nance Jr (24) / Robert Covington (8) / ???? (16)
C - Karl Anthony Towns (32) / Cody Zeller (16)

Thats 3 solid defenders in-between the two primary scorers, I really like that. But it could fall apart due to depth issues. And we would need to find another rotation worthy forward (Maybe Layman in this scenario?)

I really don't see any depth issues

And a Dame/KAT PnR could be awesome. I just don't see any reason for Minny to make that trade; and I think they could do better if they were shopping KAT

What about something along the lines of...

McCollum and picks to Philly
Simmons and Nurkic to Minnesota
Towns and Price to Portland

Philly finally accepts the fact they would be better off with someone who's going to actually play for them rather than dealing with this headache any longer.

Minnesota moves a player who's pretty openly unhappy with his current situation (KAT), gets a player they're clearly interested in with Simmons and gets a replacement C on top of that to rebuild around Edwards with.

Portland gets a true All Star pairing and an expiring contact in Price.

Philly:
McCollum
Curry
Maxey
Harris
Embiid

Minnesota:
Beverly
Russell
Edwards
Simmons
Nurkic

Portland:
Dame
Powell
RoCo
Nance Jr
Towns

Minny would be hard pressed to get better than Nurk and Simmons for KAT imo. Outside shooting would be a problem for them, they would have to rely heavily on Russell and Edwards, but defensively that's a pretty intimidating lineup.

This come down to picks for PHI. I said 1-2 from PDX, but it likely takes 2-3 IMO.

I do agree that Simons and Nurkic is a quality return for KAT.

[BNM]

I am no KAT stan, but I would certainly move CJ, Nurkic and 1-2 FRP for him. It really balances this team.

G - Damian Lillard (34) / Dennis Smith Jr (14)
G - Norman Powell (24) / Anfernee Simons (24)
F - Robert Covington (20) / Nassir Little (22) / Norman Powell (6)
F - Larry Nance Jr (24) / Robert Covington (8) / ???? (16)
C - Karl Anthony Towns (32) / Cody Zeller (16)

Thats 3 solid defenders in-between the two primary scorers, I really like that. But it could fall apart due to depth issues. And we would need to find another rotation worthy forward (Maybe Layman in this scenario?)

I really don't see any depth issues

And a Dame/KAT PnR could be awesome. I just don't see any reason for Minny to make that trade; and I think they could do better if they were shopping KAT

What about something along the lines of...

McCollum and picks to Philly
Simmons and Nurkic to Minnesota
Towns and Price to Portland

Philly finally accepts the fact they would be better off with someone who's going to actually play for them rather than dealing with this headache any longer.

Minnesota moves a player who's pretty openly unhappy with his current situation (KAT), gets a player they're clearly interested in with Simmons and gets a replacement C on top of that to rebuild around Edwards with.

Portland gets a true All Star pairing and an expiring contact in Price.

Philly:
McCollum
Curry
Maxey
Harris
Embiid

Minnesota:
Beverly
Russell
Edwards
Simmons
Nurkic

Portland:
Dame
Powell
RoCo
Nance Jr
Towns

Minny would be hard pressed to get better than Nurk and Simmons for KAT imo. Outside shooting would be a problem for them, they would have to rely heavily on Russell and Edwards, but defensively that's a pretty intimidating lineup.

Interesting proposal, but I see two problems.

1) Morey's greed (see thread title). He still seems unwilling to settle for anything less than a Harden-like haul. In the dick measuring contest between Morey and Simmons/Klutch, neither side seems willing to give an inch. Morey seems bound and determined to piss away a year of Embiid's prime rather than accept a reasonable offer for Simmons.

2) Spacing for MIN. Nurk and Simmons would be a terrible fit together. Last season Simmons had an average FGA distance of 4.3 feet. Nurk currently has an average FGA distance of 5 feet. Those two would constantly be in each other's way. Combine that with the fact that none of Edwards, Russell and Beverly are good/prolific 3-point shooters and MIN would have horrible floor spacing, probably the worst in the league. KAT is their best 3-point threat, by far, and they would be losing him. While the incoming talent for MIN would not be bad, the fit would be terrible.

It's not just the lack of outside shooting, this trade brings in two players who occupy the same space on the floor. If PHI couldn't make it work with Simons/Embiid (and a much better supporting cast), I don't see why MIN would want to try it with Simmons/Nurk.

[DusterBuster]

I really don't see any depth issues

And a Dame/KAT PnR could be awesome. I just don't see any reason for Minny to make that trade; and I think they could do better if they were shopping KAT

What about something along the lines of...

McCollum and picks to Philly
Simmons and Nurkic to Minnesota
Towns and Price to Portland

Philly finally accepts the fact they would be better off with someone who's going to actually play for them rather than dealing with this headache any longer.

Minnesota moves a player who's pretty openly unhappy with his current situation (KAT), gets a player they're clearly interested in with Simmons and gets a replacement C on top of that to rebuild around Edwards with.

Portland gets a true All Star pairing and an expiring contact in Price.

Philly:
McCollum
Curry
Maxey
Harris
Embiid

Minnesota:
Beverly
Russell
Edwards
Simmons
Nurkic

Portland:
Dame
Powell
RoCo
Nance Jr
Towns

Minny would be hard pressed to get better than Nurk and Simmons for KAT imo. Outside shooting would be a problem for them, they would have to rely heavily on Russell and Edwards, but defensively that's a pretty intimidating lineup.

This come down to picks for PHI. I said 1-2 from PDX, but it likely takes 2-3 IMO.

I do agree that Simons and Nurkic is a quality return for KAT.

Maybe a heavily protected 1st rounder could be pulled from Minny since that is pretty high return for KAT?... He's good, but that's REALLY good return when it's arguable KAT for Simmons could be considered a fair swap, and then they're also getting Nurkic for a totally useless player in Price.

Portland would have to be sending out 2 picks... but then that starts to make the deal slightly unbalanced... is CJ, Nurk and 2 1st too much for KAT? I personally don't think so, but I could see the argument.