2021-22 Rookie Thread

[God Squad]

While I have been disappointed with Suggs, you have to take in to perspective what is going on around him. The Magic had the youngest starting line up on opening night in NBA HISTORY with a first year head coach. Whereas other rookies like barnes are in a well oiled system already.

Suggs clearly isnt a PG and is more of a SG, but he needs to work on his dribbling and stay under control. His issue right now is he dribbles into the paint without knowing what he is going to do and either throws up a wild shot or gets the ball knocked away from him. It doesnt help that he plays with another non PG in Cole Anthony.

I think once Fultz is back it will benefit Suggs a lot having an actual PG on the floor with him. Suggs has the talent, he just needs direction on how to best use that talent.

Oh I totally agree about Barnes being in the perfect system. But also remember he was deemed as project, especially on the offensive end. But yet he's shooting a .560 from the floor while providing amazing defense, while Suggs is shooting .288. But Suggs himself looks to be a good defender so hopefully he figures the efficiency out.

Eh, scottie is hardly playing on a "well-oiled" squad right now. Only 2 established raps rotation guys have played so far (FVV and OG), and they were only #3/4 options prior. Scottish been playing alongside two new fresh faced 22yr olds in the starting lineup in Precious and Trent, and the bench has been all new players as well.

Siakam coming back should help, tho - but even then, there's been far too much roster turnover for this squad to be well oiled in any sense at this point.

While I agree, Orlando is a dumpster compared.

[basketballRob]

Oh I totally agree about Barnes being in the perfect system. But also remember he was deemed as project, especially on the offensive end. But yet he's shooting a .560 from the floor while providing amazing defense, while Suggs is shooting .288. But Suggs himself looks to be a good defender so hopefully he figures the efficiency out.

Eh, scottie is hardly playing on a "well-oiled" squad right now. Only 2 established raps rotation guys have played so far (FVV and OG), and they were only #3/4 options prior. Scottish been playing alongside two new fresh faced 22yr olds in the starting lineup in Precious and Trent, and the bench has been all new players as well.

Siakam coming back should help, tho - but even then, there's been far too much roster turnover for this squad to be well oiled in any sense at this point.

While I agree, Orlando is a dumpster compared.

The Raptors are paying over 30m more for their lineup and are much healthier. Actually I think the Magic are purposely holding players out longer then they should.

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[BigGargamel]

Dang, Chris Duarte is balling. I guess it's easy to play right away when you're already one of the oldest players in the league.

[timO]

1 Mobley
2 Giddey
3 Barnes

Duarte is 4-5 years older than them, a unidimensional shooter, a Duncan robinson who is hot now, but gonna get cold.

[OrlMagic05]

This isnt a commentary on Suggs season thus far, this is how ive felt about him for a while, and more importantly, a philosophy i have about guard play. You cant be a star offensive guard if you cant either explode past people and dont have a special skillset, and thats Suggs. Now i expect him to improve, but you rarely see guys develop top tier handles/creativity/creation skills once in the league. They refine those skills, but they come in with them

Eh i don't agree with this. The term "special skillset" is so vague. Jalen just needs to let the game come to him. He tends to rush a lot right now and is missing shots that I think he will eventually start knocking down.

You can't say that guys dont develop top tier handles/creativity/creation skills once in the league, because if that were the case we wouldnt see drastic improvement from players. Oladipo (before injury) is a great example of someone who did develop all the above after being in the league for a few years. I am sure there are many more, but too lazy to look up more players.

Oladipo has never been a guy who used elite skillset (handles/shooting) for his game. He's developed a solid skillset, for sure, and ive said guys can do that, but i have yet to see a player come in without elite handles (creativity, creation with them) and develop them. I had this convo on the raps board for a while during the draft time, and believe me, it was like 95% wanted Suggs. I cant believe in a guard who cant create in the halfcourt. A guy like Suggs certainly has use with his intangibles/size/open court athleticism and defensive tenacity, but i never saw him as a star offensive player. If im wrong on it, ill eat crow, but i just cant see it.

Oladipo developed his ball handling from his rookie days in Orlando. He didnt need them to be elite but he improved which helped him tremendously. I see Suggs in a very similar way to Oladipo, hopefully he doesnt get injured that derails his career like Oladipo. I think Suggs will figure it out.

[OrlMagic05]

What ive been saying for a while. If youre athleticism isnt great, if youre not explosive and cant get a step on guys, then youre skillset has to be special. I dont see that in Suggs and while i somewhat see it in Cade, i dont see it to the level of superstar. If Cade was bigger like 6'8 or 6'9 and could rely on his size like a Luka Doncic, i'd feel different. I feel Cade will be very good and an all-star level player, just not a franchise guy. I dont see Suggs being more than just a solid starter

While I have been disappointed with Suggs, you have to take in to perspective what is going on around him. The Magic had the youngest starting line up on opening night in NBA HISTORY with a first year head coach. Whereas other rookies like barnes are in a well oiled system already.

Suggs clearly isnt a PG and is more of a SG, but he needs to work on his dribbling and stay under control. His issue right now is he dribbles into the paint without knowing what he is going to do and either throws up a wild shot or gets the ball knocked away from him. It doesnt help that he plays with another non PG in Cole Anthony.

I think once Fultz is back it will benefit Suggs a lot having an actual PG on the floor with him. Suggs has the talent, he just needs direction on how to best use that talent.

Oh I totally agree about Barnes being in the perfect system. But also remember he was deemed as project, especially on the offensive end. But yet he's shooting a .560 from the floor while providing amazing defense, while Suggs is shooting .288. But Suggs himself looks to be a good defender so hopefully he figures the efficiency out.

Barnes doing so well also has to do with that system and great coaching. Toronto is known for their development whereas Orlando isnt. I really think if Suggs was in Toronto he would not be shooting 28%. Rookie coach with the youngest starting lineup in NBA History is causing a lot of these struggles. Not sure if you've watched a Magic game, but they looks SOOOO unorganized at times which does not help a 20 year old rookie.

[OrlMagic05]

While I have been disappointed with Suggs, you have to take in to perspective what is going on around him. The Magic had the youngest starting line up on opening night in NBA HISTORY with a first year head coach. Whereas other rookies like barnes are in a well oiled system already.

Suggs clearly isnt a PG and is more of a SG, but he needs to work on his dribbling and stay under control. His issue right now is he dribbles into the paint without knowing what he is going to do and either throws up a wild shot or gets the ball knocked away from him. It doesnt help that he plays with another non PG in Cole Anthony.

I think once Fultz is back it will benefit Suggs a lot having an actual PG on the floor with him. Suggs has the talent, he just needs direction on how to best use that talent.

Oh I totally agree about Barnes being in the perfect system. But also remember he was deemed as project, especially on the offensive end. But yet he's shooting a .560 from the floor while providing amazing defense, while Suggs is shooting .288. But Suggs himself looks to be a good defender so hopefully he figures the efficiency out.

Eh, scottie is hardly playing on a "well-oiled" squad right now. Only 2 established raps rotation guys have played so far (FVV and OG), and they were only #3/4 options prior. Scottish been playing alongside two new fresh faced 22yr olds in the starting lineup in Precious and Trent, and the bench has been all new players as well.

Siakam coming back should help, tho - but even then, there's been far too much roster turnover for this squad to be well oiled in any sense at this point.

Compared to the dumpster fire in Orlando its an extremely well oiled team! I think you will see an improvement in Suggs once Fultz and JI get back which are equivalent to FVV and OG to an extent.

[Madhouse]

Mobley is the ROY through 4 games. He has been really impressive.

Read on Twitter

Barnes will rise because his assists, steals and blocks will go up. Suggs will rise because nobody is shooting 28% for long. Jalen Green will rise because he should become more consistent as the year goes on. But Mobley has been the best so far.

[LivingLegend]

Mobley is the ROY through 4 games. He has been really impressive.

Read on Twitter

Barnes will rise because his assists, steals and blocks will go up. Suggs will rise because nobody is shooting 28% for long. Jalen Green will rise because he should become more consistent as the year goes on. But Mobley has been the best so far.

Yeet

Read on Twitter

[Roger Murdock]

Cavs opponents have taken 376 FGs

Mobley has averaged 33 MPG

33/48 x 376 = 258 FGA when Mobley is on court (estimate)

72 shot contests/258 FGA from Mobley = 29% of shots contested by Mobley

Insane

[gumbercules]

1 Mobley
2 Giddey
3 Barnes

Duarte is 4-5 years older than them, a unidimensional shooter, a Duncan robinson who is hot now, but gonna get cold.

Not quite right with the Duncan Robinson comparison. Duarte is more of a scorer than just a spot up shooter like Robinson. A lot of his points have been unassisted shots that he created for himself. I feel like, if anything, he'll start picking up more assist soon as he obtains more gravity. He is a willing and able passer.

Edit - also expect his efficiency to go up once Chris Levert is back in the lineup. Having someone else who can create a shot in the half court will take that pressure off of him, as he has been the only one on the team able to create a look out of nothing in the half court.

[DCasey91]

Love Mobley. He’s like a spider’s web, everything for the opponent is going good breaking down the defense, then boom out of nowhere you’re stuck in cobwebs, you sh*t yourself and the ball gets heavily contested.

He has an albatross wingspan out there. Brings the opponents especially guards into a false sense of security because he lags off on purpose, dudes positional skills/awareness are already among the best in the league.

There was AD, Garnett, Duncan but man Mobley seems to have no preference on which hand is his dominant one. Seen him block it with the left then literally the next second he puts his right hand up to defend with perfect verticality into a contested missed jumper. Stats don’t pick up the little things. Seems equally adapt at either

And Mobley’s little things on each side of the court is out of control. Did anyone see a game ago the little pinkie nudge steal when a center caught it at the wing ready to initiate the pnr/screen play? The big held it up high and Mobs just sort of casually dislodged the ball like he was popping a bubble lmao

Special talent.

Next step is ball security, the shot will be a work in progress once strength comes along. His shot is not too dissimilar to AD’s. But those two things are gravy stuff this year.

Bigs coming up should take a leaf out of his book because the triangular defensive rotation is something that should be taught to all bigs before anything else in basketball also slide and slide well. Keeps them on the court at all times.

[Vampirate]

1 Mobley
2 Giddey
3 Barnes

Duarte is 4-5 years older than them, a unidimensional shooter, a Duncan robinson who is hot now, but gonna get cold.

OKC fans, Raptor fans, Houston fans and Detroit fans will argue till the cows come home spots 2-5 for the year but I think everyone agrees Mobley is the consensus #1 spot thus far, and likely will be for the season.

[everdiso]

Per36

Barnes 34.3min (20.6usg%), 17.7pts (59.7ts%), 1.3ast (3.4to), 9.0rb (3.7off), 0.5st, 1.3bk
Mobley 33.0min (17.6usg%), 15.5pts (61.7ts%), 3.0ast (2.2to), 9.0rb (1.6off), 1.4st, 2.2bk
Duarte 38.2min (21.4usg%), 18.6pts (54.6ts%), 1.9ast (1.2to), 4.5rb (0.2off), 0.7st, 0.0bk
Green 32.5min (21.0usg%), 16.1pts (49.2ts%), 2.8ast (1.9to), 4.4rb (0.3off), 1.1st, 0.8bk
Wagner 32.9min (16.6usg%), 14.5pts (56.7ts%), 2.2ast (1.1to), 4.6rb (1.1off), 1.1st, 0.8bk
Giddey 27.3min (17.5usg%), 11.9pts (47.1ts%), 5.9ast (2.0to), 9.6rb (2.0off), 2.0st, 0.7bk
Suggs 28.5min (27.3usg%), 15.8pts (42.3ts%), 4.4ast (4.4to), 4.1rb (1.3off), 1.6st, 0.0bk
Mitchell 29.3min (15.1usg%), 11.0pts (42.5ts%), 4.5ast (0.8to), 2.0rb (0.0off), 1.6st, 0.0bk
Cunningham 0min

[HumbleRen]

Mobley is the ROY through 4 games. He has been really impressive.

Read on Twitter

Barnes will rise because his assists, steals and blocks will go up. Suggs will rise because nobody is shooting 28% for long. Jalen Green will rise because he should become more consistent as the year goes on. But Mobley has been the best so far.

Sheesh, Suggs. He was supposed to be the most NBA ready guy lol. His lack of handles is really hurting him.

[Vampirate]

Per36

Barnes 34.3min (20.6usg%), 17.7pts (59.7ts%), 1.3ast (3.4to), 9.0rb (3.7off), 0.5st, 1.3bk
Mobley 33.0min (17.6usg%), 15.5pts (61.7ts%), 3.0ast (2.2to), 9.0rb (1.6off), 1.4st, 2.2bk
Duarte 38.2min (21.4usg%), 18.6pts (54.6ts%), 1.9ast (1.2to), 4.5rb (0.2off), 0.7st, 0.0bk
Green 32.5min (21.0usg%), 16.1pts (49.2ts%), 2.8ast (1.9to), 4.4rb (0.3off), 1.1st, 0.8bk
Wagner 32.9min (16.6usg%), 14.5pts (56.7ts%), 2.2ast (1.1to), 4.6rb (1.1off), 1.1st, 0.8bk
Giddey 27.3min (17.5usg%), 11.9pts (47.1ts%), 5.9ast (2.0to), 9.6rb (2.0off), 2.0st, 0.7bk
Suggs 28.5min (27.3usg%), 15.8pts (42.3ts%), 4.4ast (4.4to), 4.1rb (1.3off), 1.6st, 0.0bk
Mitchell 29.3min (15.1usg%), 11.0pts (42.5ts%), 4.5ast (0.8to), 2.0rb (0.0off), 1.6st, 0.0bk
Cunningham 0min

If you didn't know any better, just by the numbers, you'd think one of Barnes main strengths was scoring and his main weakness is passing.

Which is polar opposite of the scouting report on him lol.

[JonFromVA]

A good goal for Mobley as a rookie would be making all D 2nd team. I think he can.

I'll repeat what I said before, in order to score on him effectively you basically need to be a Superstar offensively already or just have the right height, arm length, speed and strength.

He's a tree and his reach with his arms can cover ground even if smaller guards blow by him.

You need to straight up overpower him, or shoot well outside the 3 point line, layups are going to be gobbled up by him.

I suspect there will be some moves (even from non-Superstars) he simply hasn't seen or figured out how to deal with yet. Sometimes it's simple stuff like he was a step away from where the offensive player pulled up for a jumper, so he got a clean look over Evan.

otoh, if he just keeps bringing effort on the defensive end - that goes a long way in the regular season - and it never really looks like he has to work all that hard because of how he glides around the floor.

[Statlanta]

Question is Mobleys stats artificially inflated because of the big ball lineup. Like if Markannens man is blowing past him every possession it's basically open season in the paint.

[JonFromVA]

Question is Mobleys stats artificially inflated because of the big ball lineup. Like if Markannens man is blowing past him every possession it's basically open season in the paint.

All bigs have the pleasure of cleaning up after others because offenses will always attack the weak link. At some point his stats will go down because ball handlers will be afraid to test him.

We're seeing something very special out of a one and done rookie. He's clearly the son of a coach. For instance, the way he blocks shots and deflects passes and keeps them in bound is straight out of the Bill Russell handbook that most AAU big men stopped reading long ago.

Currently the Cavs are +1.8 pp100 better with Mobley on the floor than off ... the Pelicans were -1.2 worse with rookie Anthony Davis on the floor. It's just 4 games ... but this is very atypical stuff from such a young player.

[basketballRob]

Per36

Barnes 34.3min (20.6usg%), 17.7pts (59.7ts%), 1.3ast (3.4to), 9.0rb (3.7off), 0.5st, 1.3bk
Mobley 33.0min (17.6usg%), 15.5pts (61.7ts%), 3.0ast (2.2to), 9.0rb (1.6off), 1.4st, 2.2bk
Duarte 38.2min (21.4usg%), 18.6pts (54.6ts%), 1.9ast (1.2to), 4.5rb (0.2off), 0.7st, 0.0bk
Green 32.5min (21.0usg%), 16.1pts (49.2ts%), 2.8ast (1.9to), 4.4rb (0.3off), 1.1st, 0.8bk
Wagner 32.9min (16.6usg%), 14.5pts (56.7ts%), 2.2ast (1.1to), 4.6rb (1.1off), 1.1st, 0.8bk
Giddey 27.3min (17.5usg%), 11.9pts (47.1ts%), 5.9ast (2.0to), 9.6rb (2.0off), 2.0st, 0.7bk
Suggs 28.5min (27.3usg%), 15.8pts (42.3ts%), 4.4ast (4.4to), 4.1rb (1.3off), 1.6st, 0.0bk
Mitchell 29.3min (15.1usg%), 11.0pts (42.5ts%), 4.5ast (0.8to), 2.0rb (0.0off), 1.6st, 0.0bk
Cunningham 0min

If you didn't know any better, just by the numbers, you'd think one of Barnes main strengths was scoring and his main weakness is passing.

Which is polar opposite of the scouting report on him lol.

Barnes per 36 BK are actually .3 not 1.3. That's surprising his blocks and steals have been low also.

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